The new trafic mess on the Quay.

wmpdd3

Oh no!


Still trying positive....

what's the bet there will be a bus lane that starts at the Bridge, merges at each roundabout and then disappears at the plaza.

Just what we need, busses dancing a waltz on the quay.

dougal

wmpdd3 wrote: »

Oh no!


Still trying positive....

what's the bet there will be a bus lane that starts at the Bridge, merges at each roundabout and then disappears at the plaza.

Just what we need, busses dancing a waltz on the quay.

You can see the full plans for the quay at this link Green Route.

Jamie2k9

I'm happy that there is going to be a bus lane of sorts, public transport would be pointless otherwise. It's needed and other sports in the city could do with them to.

wmpdd3

Anytime I'm on the bus it never gets delayed on the quay, it gets delayed from the plaza to the Ardkeen roundabout, so we should ban traffic from traveling from the Tower to the Ardkeen roundabout, make that lane a contraflow bus only lane, and divert traffic from waterford to the Ardkeen roundabout the other way?

The way the quay was, the bus moved unimpeded from the Bridge to the Tower.

Does the bus lane coming in the Dunmore Rd make any difference to the bus journey at rush hour?

Ger6219

Like me, anyone who's been driving through Waterford for the last few years must see the extra delays the revamped Quay have made. And we're not there yet. It will get worse! A lot worse, short term and long term. If you look at the drawings (http://www.waterfordcity.ie/documents/misc/Greenroutes.pdf) you can see what lies ahead. And if you remember how long the roadworks took to come to this point, you'd be afraid to think of all the delays and mess the next fase of roadworks will bring.

Have a look at what Waterford City says about this new 'Green Route' on their own website (http://www.waterfordcity.ie/green-route.htm). It mentions "improvements to the visual amenity of the area". Really? Was that really necessary? And can we afford it? It mentions time limits for roadworks that make no sense. In Europe they can build a motorway in the time it took Waterford City Council to have one roundabout made. Pavements that are put down, taken up and put down again, sometimes several times. Who is in control of all this?

But it does mention one of the most likely reasons for all this traffic catastrophe: "encourage some traffic users to use alternatives such as the Bypass – for example we still have several hundred HGVs transiting through the city centre every day of the week". They basically want cars and trucks going in the Cork direction (and vice versa) to use the hugely expensive Waterford Bypass, because it's not making as much toll money as was hoped. If that's an important consideration, why didn't they just put up traffic signs stopping trucks using The Quay say between 9 am and 5 pm? They do that in so many other European countries and it works there! It would have been simpler, cheaper, quicker, caused less stress to the local retailers and would have been so much better for local traffic such as drivers who are trying to get to and from work. You know, drivers that work, make money and pay taxes to fund local councils so they can waste it on poor traffic management decisions.

Why, for instance, is it impossible to create a real 'green route' by making sure all the traffic lights from the bridge to Parnell Street/John's Street junction are green when driving at a steady 30-40 km/h? It works in other European countries, where they call it 'green waves'. Pedestrians have always been able to cross from one side of The Quay to the other and I've never heard a local asking for drastic road works because they couldn't cross the road. Let's hope for the next local elections voters will think deep on who to vote for. We need people in the council who can come up with ideas for real traffic management improvements, not just changes.

Cabaal

Its funny, all these comparisons to Europe and yet we miss a few important factors.

Cycle use is far higher in mainland Europe which means less cars, Europeans are better at following rules...especially the Germans.

So this translates to not needing to waste money on traffic calming measures because people are obeying the speed limits and parking restrictions, which in turn means traffic flows better.

If people didn't park arse ways and double park from the grandville to the bridge for decades traffic always would have flowed better on the quays,

7upfree

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

I'm happy that there is going to be a bus lane of sorts, public transport would be pointless otherwise. It's needed and other sports in the city could do with them to.

100 yards long?

7upfree

Cabaal wrote: »

Its funny, all these comparisons to Europe and yet we miss a few important factors.

Cycle use is far higher in mainland Europe which means less cars, Europeans are better at following rules...especially the Germans.

So this translates to not needing to waste money on traffic calming measures because people are obeying the speed limits and parking restrictions, which in turn means traffic flows better.

If people didn't park arse ways and double park from the grandville to the bridge for decades traffic always would have flowed better on the quays,

The reality is that the Quay is a cock-up of the highest order. No doubt it will be ripped up, squandering yet more money, in the years ahead.

7upfree

wmpdd3 wrote: »

Anytime I'm on the bus it never gets delayed on the quay, it gets delayed from the plaza to the Ardkeen roundabout, so we should ban traffic from traveling from the Tower to the Ardkeen roundabout, make that lane a contraflow bus only lane, and divert traffic from waterford to the Ardkeen roundabout the other way?

The way the quay was, the bus moved unimpeded from the Bridge to the Tower.

Does the bus lane coming in the Dunmore Rd make any difference to the bus journey at rush hour?

You mean the part-time bus lane? Because people kicked up? How very European........

Max Powers

7upfree wrote: »

The reality is that the Quay is a cock-up of the highest order. No doubt it will be ripped up, squandering yet more money, in the years ahead.

I disagree, I think it looks much better, more pedestrian friendly, safer crossing, bike lanes, a narrower road has meant traffic has reduced its speed including trucks (Trucks still there admittedly). I don't think there has been any noticeable difference in delays, you were liable to get delayed before this all started.

The way I see it, having a 2nd rate dual carriage way in the city centre was not good for safety, aesthetically and it done nothing for speed of movement through city centre as 9/10 one lane was blocked by a parked car who just nipped into Ulster Bank, fieldmaster, GPO, shop by Bus station etc etc so effectively the kerbside lane was useless.

I honestly think some people are being negative just to give out, constant negativity and they cant see something good when its right in front of them. As for the delays, some bad luck on that front but all in all we all admit it did go on too long. Looking forward to rest of it being done.

Sully

I assume those objecting now objected when this was on display to the general public?

The_Shotz

Max Powers wrote: »

I disagree, I think it looks much better, more pedestrian friendly, safer crossing, bike lanes,

Try cycling in them..... check the attachment!

kayaksurfbum

The_Shotz wrote: »

Try cycling in them..... check the attachment!

So?

Bike lane is great. Its much safer to cycle down the quay now.

shockwave

kayaksurfbum wrote: »

So?

Bike lane is great. Its much safer to cycle down the quay now.

You might see 1 or 2 cyclists a week using them if you're lucky.

kayaksurfbum

shockwave wrote: »

You might see 1 or 2 cyclists a week using them if you're lucky.

I saw 3 or 4 today. I must be super lucky.

Better do the lotto.

Cabaal

kayaksurfbum wrote: »

So?

Bike lane is great. Its much safer to cycle down the quay now.

Have you actually cycled down it or are you assuming it's better?

I cycled in Waterford for 10 years, never felt unsafe going down the quays towards the tower, only issues I ever had going the other way we're idiots parked arse ways and double parking.... Which are the exact same issues I experienced as a motorist.

kayaksurfbum

Yeah i cycle it loads. Cycling towards the bridge was always a bit mental with cars changing lanes and people just stopping in the left lane. At least with a cycle lane we have a dedicated space that cars "should" not be in.

I think overall the quay is better.

Stay positive folks :-)

JohnC.

People who think delays are now worse than they used to be must have short memories. Am I the only one who can recall traffic built up for most of the length of the quay at times? There were a few times I'd been heading for the bridge and the traffic was all the way back to the Mall. These days, pedestrian crossings permitting, I generally don't need to stop on the Quay until I get to the last or second last block before the bridge.

It's similar in the other direction too. May not be quite as dramatic an improvement, but it's a lot better.

The_Shotz

kayaksurfbum wrote: »

So?

Bike lane is great. Its much safer to cycle down the quay now.

Have you accidently hit one of those shores on a racer, or see it late, there's not much room to manoeuvre,

Your bonkers if you do not think its not dangerous to have a drain in the middle of a cycle lane with only a few inches either side...

I'm all for cycle lanes but only if they are designed and constructed properly

Chiparus

Actually talking of cycle lanes , have you seen the effort outside the Whitfield clinic, there used to be a hard shoulder but they have pushed to footpath out and forced cyclists into the main traffic stream. Further along there is a joint footpath/cyclepath, which no cyclist will use.

kayaksurfbum

The_Shotz wrote: »

Have you accidently hit one of those shores on a racer, or see it late, there's not much room to manoeuvre,

Your bonkers if you do not think its not dangerous to have a drain in the middle of a cycle lane with only a few inches either side...

I'm all for cycle lanes but only if they are designed and constructed properly

Yeah I have actually, 22mm tyres on my carbon race bike. Just this morning in fact. The shores are fine, they are pretty much level with the tarmac, cause no problem. There is one big manhole opposite kellys near the taxis that is a bit deep, but its not in the middle of the cycle lane so its fine.

The biggest danger today was some guy swinging his door open into my path outside centra. No road design can account for an asshole not using his mirrors.

wmpdd3

Would you not be nervous where the parked cars are to reverse into the cycle lane?

7upfree

Max Powers wrote: »

I disagree, I think it looks much better, more pedestrian friendly, safer crossing, bike lanes, a narrower road has meant traffic has reduced its speed including trucks (Trucks still there admittedly). I don't think there has been any noticeable difference in delays, you were liable to get delayed before this all started.

The way I see it, having a 2nd rate dual carriage way in the city centre was not good for safety, aesthetically and it done nothing for speed of movement through city centre as 9/10 one lane was blocked by a parked car who just nipped into Ulster Bank, fieldmaster, GPO, shop by Bus station etc etc so effectively the kerbside lane was useless.

I honestly think some people are being negative just to give out, constant negativity and they cant see something good when its right in front of them. As for the delays, some bad luck on that front but all in all we all admit it did go on too long. Looking forward to rest of it being done.

And equally there are those who are too blind to acknowledge when mistakes have been made. And this is an enormous one. There is no doubt it will be ripped up in the years ahead.

"Some bad luck"? JHC it was an absolute scandal - sure to be repeated on the other half. Does anyone know how log it actually took from start to finish? Was it the bones of two years?

Sully

Quay is much nicer. Still not a fan of the roundabout, but the rest has improved IMO. It took ages, I believe, as the main company doing it originally went bust? Also don't believe for one second that the majority of people find the toll the only issue when deciding to hit the bypass or not. Be interesting if the state / council sponsored it for a couple of weeks to see if it would make a difference.

Chiparus

Tried the bypass a few times , it actually takes longer , costs more in petrol and you have to pay a toll.

Only reason to use it is if the traffic in the city is too heavy.

Hoffmans

50 yards of buslane now drawn on quay along by plaza mental , stupid , pointless
They must have a lot of that white road paint left over and are looking for places to scrawl it....

Potential-Monke

wmpdd3 wrote: »

Would you not be nervous where the parked cars are to reverse into the cycle lane?

I think this is a situation (which, admittedly should have been avoided, but c'est la vie) cyclists have to have the same mentality as motorists. They can see that car may need to reverse out, and should take the same care as motorists in this regard. If a car is edging out, and a cyclist/motorist can see this happening, they should slow or stop as necessary. It doesn't happen all the time with motorists, and cyclists will be the same, but it boils down to all road users having a bit of common sense and patience.

wmpdd3

I completely hold my hands up and say I didn't object to the green route plans. I remember hearing something about them and then the lanes changed on the Dunmore rd, it was to late then.

But I now pay attention to the planning notices I see. I know of a few retailers that see this as a mistake, but only time will tell.

I think e need an attraction to bring people back to the end of town, even just a little playground like railway square.

Relitives from limerick that haven't be here in 6 years remarked that they thought it made the town seem more regional like New Ross as apposed to cork.

Ledger

wmpdd3 wrote: »

I completely hold my hands up and say I didn't object to the green route plans. I remember hearing something about them and then the lanes changed on the Dunmore rd, it was to late then.

But I now pay attention to the planning notices I see. I know of a few retailers that see this as a mistake, but only time will tell.

I think e need an attraction to bring people back to the end of town, even just a little playground like railway square.

Relitives from limerick that haven't be here in 6 years remarked that they thought it made the town seem more regional like New Ross as apposed to cork.

The difference is that in Ross, the quay is way better than how it used to be :P

wmpdd3

That is really true, but I think its more that you used to be able to drive up or down every little lane going up town and the amount of traffic trying ot turn right held it all up.