Teenager attacked by teen in custody of HSE

Frank Black

kfallon wrote: »

How long does it take Gardai to respond to 999 calls btw? I mean he was 5 mins at it, surely somebody in the petrol station rang the Guards and told them there was a serious assault taking place. I don't know the area but I would have expected somebody there within a couple of minutes, no? I'm not bashing the Gardai here btw, just wondering!

A truly awful story, made me :mad: and at the same time! A young lads life has been ruined.

I hope the offender is beaten to within an inch of his life every day for the duration of his sentence!

You honestly expect a squad car to arrive with 2 minutes of a 999 call?

You've obviously been watching too much 24.

It would take the guts of 2 minutes to explain the situations, give the address etc.

monica22

obviously a lot of people commenting here don't even understand about the irish care system! it wasn't 2 social workers on shift they are the people who deal indirectly with people while SOCIAL CARE WORKERS are the people who work directly with the people. first of all let me explain about teenage residential at the end of the day the workers who work with them are normal people not trained in restraining a young person in public there is whats known as tci therauptic crisis intervention which is limited to the restraints used on the child workers CANNOT restrain a child in public if the staff had of got out the car the young lad would of escalated also they were more then likely in the car ringing the gardai obviously they also didnt no the young if they had just picked him up to bring him to the residential meaning they had no details of what his personality or nature was at the end of the day social workers aint gardai! people should also not comment unless they work in the field!

monica22

obviously u havent worked with kids in care dont matter there age

BeerWolf

**** him being young for his sentence, leave him to rot in prison for the rest of his life...

challengemaster

kfallon wrote: »

How long does it take Gardai to respond to 999 calls btw?

I'd say the average time would be 3-4 days to respond.

the 11 bystanders should be charged as accessorys for doing nothing.

monica22

the_syco wrote: »

Kristopherus wrote: »

Its very likely he would have turned on the Social Workers had they tried to intervene. If he had hurt any of them, the taxpayer would be picking up the tab when she sues:(

I'm trying to figure out why he was with women who could not handle him if he got violent?

Oh, sorry, do you think it's sexist saying that the two women couldn't handle the one guy? It isn't; it's fact. He demanded they stop, so they stopped. He attacked someone, and they didn't do jack sh|t.

MagicSean wrote: »

Maybe you should also keep in mind that the kids aren't prisoners.

Maybe not, but handling them with kid gloves doesn't work.

U obviously dont work in residentail two men wouldnt got out the car

monica22

It's really annoying that people r commenting about the two female workers unless u work in the area u can't understand

monica22

monica22 wrote: »

the_syco wrote: »

Kristopherus wrote: »

Its very likely he would have turned on the Social Workers had they tried to intervene. If he had hurt any of them, the taxpayer would be picking up the tab when she sues:(

I'm trying to figure out why he was with women who could not handle him if he got violent?

Oh, sorry, do you think it's sexist saying that the two women couldn't handle the one guy? It isn't; it's fact. He demanded they stop, so they stopped. He attacked someone, and they didn't do jack sh|t.

MagicSean wrote: »

Maybe you should also keep in mind that the kids aren't prisoners.

Maybe not, but handling them with kid gloves doesn't work.

U obviously dont work in residentail two men wouldnt got out the car

And he didn't demand they stop

Bullseye1

investment wrote: »

Bystander effect
The bystander effect refers to the phenomenon in which the greater the number of people present, the less likely people are to help a person in distress. When an emergency situation occurs, observers are more likely to take action if there are few or no other witnesses.

Just standing there doing nothing should be unlawful.

Cavehill Red

monica22 wrote: »

It's really annoying that people r commenting about the two female workers unless u work in the area u can't understand

Not half as annoying as it is for the lad left brain damaged as a result of their negligence.

monica22

monica22 wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

the_syco wrote: »

Kristopherus wrote: »

Its very likely he would have turned on the Social Workers had they tried to intervene. If he had hurt any of them, the taxpayer would be picking up the tab when she sues:(

I'm trying to figure out why he was with women who could not handle him if he got violent?

Oh, sorry, do you think it's sexist saying that the two women couldn't handle the one guy? It isn't; it's fact. He demanded they stop, so they stopped. He attacked someone, and they didn't do jack sh|t.

MagicSean wrote: »

Maybe you should also keep in mind that the kids aren't prisoners.

Maybe not, but handling them with kid gloves doesn't work.

U obviously dont work in residentail two men wouldnt got out the car

And he didn't demand they stop

U clearly didn't read my post about social care workers and how they can't physically restrain kids in public that's the gardai job

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

It's really annoying that people r commenting about the two female workers unless u work in the area u can't understand

Not half as annoying as it is for the lad left brain damaged as a result of their negligence.

No it's terrible about the guy but as a social care worked u have no idea what the job entails so u can't really comment

Leftist

This thread is a great example of how thick irish people are.

Every news story that is posted here is met with people who jump to assumptions on every factor possible in a situation that they are only familiar with through a few vague paragraphs.

Everyone gets the blame.
the Garda are expected to be within 4 minutes of every possible crime scene at all times.
nurses are expected to assume one patient out of hundreds can snap at a moment
People are assuming this patient has a history of violence
Everything from newspapers is taken as gospel
And the best of all, the would have a go if I was there heros.

Thick as a sack of potatoes.

MagicMarker

monica22 wrote: »

U clearly didn't read my post about social care workers and how they can't physically restrain kids in public that's the gardai job

Are you shítting me?

''Oh looks he's stamping on that unconscious man's head, I'm not going to do anything about it though because it's not my job.''

monica22

monica22 wrote: »

Cavehill Red wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

It's really annoying that people r commenting about the two female workers unless u work in the area u can't understand

Not half as annoying as it is for the lad left brain damaged as a result of their negligence.

No it's terrible about the guy but as a social care worked u have no idea what the job entails so u can't really comment

U clearly didn't read earlier of y they didn't intervene

LETHAL LADY

I doubt that any person would be punished for trying to restrain a violent thug who was attempting to kill someone.:rolleyes:

monica22

MagicMarker wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

U clearly didn't read my post about social care workers and how they can't physically restrain kids in public that's the gardai job

Are you shítting me?

''Oh looks he's stamping on that unconscious man's head, I'm not going to do anything about it though because it's not my job.''

No they obviously rang the gardai lik I said they don't have the authority to do it I feel sorry for the young lad all I'm saying is ye dont no the job and what the policies and procedures r so cant give ur opinion on it but not as black and white if the care worker went over and put there hands on him be done for assualt the child care law gone to much do that the child in care can do what they want all I'm saying

Bullseye1

Leftist wrote: »

This thread is a great example of how thick irish people are.

Every news story that is posted here is met with people who jump to assumptions on every factor possible in a situation that they are only familiar with through a few vague paragraphs.

Everyone gets the blame.
the Garda are expected to be within 4 minutes of every possible crime scene at all times.
nurses are expected to assume one patient out of hundreds can snap at a moment
People are assuming this patient has a history of violence
Everything from newspapers is taken as gospel
And the best of all, the would have a go if I was there heros.

Thick as a sack of potatoes.

As opposed to reading your drivel.

monica22

LETHAL LADY wrote: »

I doubt that any person would be punished for trying to restrain a violent thug who was attempting to kill someone.:rolleyes:

that's where ur wrong he was a 17 child at the time

monica22

monica22 wrote: »

LETHAL LADY wrote: »

I doubt that any person would be punished for trying to restrain a violent thug who was attempting to kill someone.:rolleyes:

that's where ur wrong he was a 17 child at the time

Only reason this case was made public cause the guy was 18 I can tell u kids care do alot worse things and cause they under can't be touched its frustrating all I'm saying is unless ur in the situations it's hard to say

Bullseye1

monica22 wrote: »

No they obviously rang the gardai lik I said they don't have the authority to do it I feel sorry for the young lad all I'm saying is ye dont no the job and what the policies and procedures r so cant give ur opinion on it but not as black and white if the care worker went over and put there hands on him be done for assualt the child care law gone to much do that the child in care can do what they want all I'm saying

So your excuse for them is that they do not have the authority to intervene and try and save the young boy? I understand that they have a difficult job but that is no excuse.

Cavehill Red

monica22 wrote: »

No it's terrible about the guy but as a social care worked u have no idea what the job entails so u can't really comment

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

monica22

Bullseye1 wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

No they obviously rang the gardai lik I said they don't have the authority to do it I feel sorry for the young lad all I'm saying is ye dont no the job and what the policies and procedures r so cant give ur opinion on it but not as black and white if the care worker went over and put there hands on him be done for assualt the child care law gone to much do that the child in care can do what they want all I'm saying

So your excuse for them is that they do not have the authority to intervene and try and save the young boy? I understand that they have a difficult job but that is no excuse.

As a social care worker simply given my opinion on it I work in the job doing it 8 years! No what I'm talking about! They obviously rang the Gardas also the car might not of been facing the shop front young lad also came into care that night they didn't no if he had a knife or anything on him social care workers didn't sign up to to Gardai we there to help children who for one reason or another cannot live at home. Like I said generally Irish people don't care about kids in care it's only when it's comes to light like this they want to have there say what about the other incidents that arent reported! While working I had my nose broke twice, assaulted numerous times and verbally abused on a daily basis! So yeah must social care workers didn't go to college for that! Everything is red taped can't be honest with the kids they live in a bubble get alot handed to them! Also want to point out that s not case with all the kids some want ur help and support however coming rare and few now! Look I only saying it as a person who works in the Job

Leftist

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

Was he a prisoner?

If he was deemed a threat to society why would he be in the custody (as an adult) of two nurses?

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

No it's terrible about the guy but as a social care worked u have no idea what the job entails so u can't really comment

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

Get down off urself would u a child is allowed go to the shop while in care not prisoners they had no reason not to let him

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

No it's terrible about the guy but as a social care worked u have no idea what the job entails so u can't really comment

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

Get down off urself would u a child is allowed go to the shop while in care not prisoners they had no reason not to let him

monica22

Leftist wrote: »

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

Was he a prisoner?

If he was deemed a threat to society why would he be in the custody (as an adult) of two nurses?

No he wasn't a prisoner there not nurses

monica22

monica22 wrote: »

Leftist wrote: »

Cavehill Red wrote: »

You have no idea who I am or what I do. I can tell you this much - simply by letting the lad out of the car and leaving him unattended they acted negligently. I hope they are removed from their positions as soon as possible, as they clearly are not fit for the job.

Was he a prisoner?

If he was deemed a threat to society why would he be in the custody (as an adult) of two nurses?

No he wasn't a prisoner there not nurses

He also not an adult he a 17 yr old who put into care

Cavehill Red

Leftist wrote: »

Was he a prisoner?

If he was deemed a threat to society why would he be in the custody (as an adult) of two nurses?

If he was a free citizen, why was he being escorted by two social workers?

Leftist

monica22 wrote: »

No he wasn't a prisoner there not nurses

If he wasn't a prisoner then how have they the right to confine an adult to the car?

And they were both female? i wonder if the joe duffy callers here passing judgement on a matter they have no involvement or education in would ask their wifes, sisters or mothers to challenge an agressive 18yr old man who is quite obviously mental.

Bullseye1

Are you saying that social workers are transferring dangerous kids? Have they agreed to this practice? Why haven't they come out against this practice if they are unhappy?

Cavehill Red

monica22 wrote: »

Get down off urself would u a child is allowed go to the shop while in care not prisoners they had no reason not to let him

Their reason not to let him is patently clear - he tried to kill someone.

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Leftist wrote: »

Was he a prisoner?

If he was deemed a threat to society why would he be in the custody (as an adult) of two nurses?

If he was a free citizen, why was he being escorted by two social workers?

Not social workers social care workers difference he was taken
Off his parents can be for a number of reason

Cavehill Red

Leftist wrote: »

If he wasn't a prisoner then how have they the right to confine an adult to the car?

And they were both female? i wonder if the joe duffy callers here passing judgement on a matter they have no involvement or education in would ask their wifes, sisters or mothers to challenge an agressive 18yr old man who is quite obviously mental.

If he was quite obviously mental, as you suggest, then they were demonstrably negligent to let him out of the car, and should have done their jobs properly by escorting him directly to his destination.

Ellis Dee

I suspect the victim of this assault has a very strong case for substantial compensation from the HSE, which would appear to have been guilty of serious neglect.;););)

monica22

Leftist wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

No he wasn't a prisoner there not nurses

If he wasn't a prisoner then how have they the right to confine an adult to the car?

And they were both female? i wonder if the joe duffy callers here passing judgement on a matter they have no involvement or education in would ask their wifes, sisters or mothers to challenge an agressive 18yr old man who is quite obviously mental.

Thank s

Cavehill Red

monica22 wrote: »

Not social workers social care workers difference he was taken
Off his parents can be for a number of reason

Your English is not very clear. It would help if you punctuated and stopped using textspeak. It frankly makes no difference whether they were social workers or social care workers. Their job was to transfer him from one place to another, and they failed to do so. As a result, a lad is now brain damaged. They were demonstrably negligent in their task and should be sacked.

Leftist

Cavehill Red wrote: »

If he was a free citizen, why was he being escorted by two social workers?

Do you have any evidence that this man was under custody and deemed a threat?

If so do you have any evidence that the social carers were given special dispensation to put the man under arrest?

Do you have any experience in health care to suggest that only a threat to society is put under social care?

If you don't have any of this info you're going to look ridiculous.

Ellis Dee

monica22 wrote: »

Get down off urself would u a child is allowed go to the shop while in care not prisoners they had no reason not to let him

Here are a few full stops and a couple of commas that you might find useful:

........ ,,,,,,,,

:):):)

monica22

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Are you saying that social workers are transferring dangerous kids? Have they agreed to this practice? Why haven't they come out against this practice if they are unhappy?

Ok there not social workers there social care workers ha that's funny come put against the practice most kids in care are verbally and physically abusive the staff have bring them appointments school access who else will bring them? Also not saying all kids care but a lot

Leftist

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Their reason not to let him is patently clear - he tried to kill someone.

Did he try to kill someone before he left the car?

If I was up in court I would weep for joy if you were the prosecution.

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

Not social workers social care workers difference he was taken
Off his parents can be for a number of reason

Your English is not very clear. It would help if you punctuated and stopped using textspeak. It frankly makes no difference whether they were social workers or social care workers. Their job was to transfer him from one place to another, and they failed to do so. As a result, a lad is now brain damaged. They were demonstrably negligent in their task and should be sacked.

Well sorry about my English but I just finished a 12 Hour night shift in a residentail and I can tell u my English is normally perfect neway gave my opinion not to be attacked and there is a difference that's how ignorant u r to the social
Care world

Bullseye1

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Your English is not very clear. It would help if you punctuated and stopped using textspeak. It frankly makes no difference whether they were social workers or social care workers. Their job was to transfer him from one place to another, and they failed to do so. As a result, a lad is now brain damaged. They were demonstrably negligent in their task and should be sacked.

While i agree with the sentiment some of these people are obviously afraid to speak out against dangerous practices being persued by the HSE. Allowing two women to transfer a young man with issues is not best practice. There should be a better form of transferring such people.

There is neglect no doubt but the real neglect lies with management of the HSE.

monica22

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Your English is not very clear. It would help if you punctuated and stopped using textspeak. It frankly makes no difference whether they were social workers or social care workers. Their job was to transfer him from one place to another, and they failed to do so. As a result, a lad is now brain damaged. They were demonstrably negligent in their task and should be sacked.

While i agree with the sentiment some of these people are obviously afraid to speak out against dangerous practices being persued by the HSE. Allowing two women to transfer a young man with issues is not best practice. There should be a better form of transferring such people.

There is neglect no doubt but the real neglect lies with management of the HSE.

It's hard for people to speak out! They ll be breaking confidentiality! Also social care is a career that women mostly get involved in

monica22

Bullseye1 wrote: »

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Your English is not very clear. It would help if you punctuated and stopped using textspeak. It frankly makes no difference whether they were social workers or social care workers. Their job was to transfer him from one place to another, and they failed to do so. As a result, a lad is now brain damaged. They were demonstrably negligent in their task and should be sacked.

While i agree with the sentiment some of these people are obviously afraid to speak out against dangerous practices being persued by the HSE. Allowing two women to transfer a young man with issues is not best practice. There should be a better form of transferring such people.

There is neglect no doubt but the real neglect lies with management of the HSE.

It's hard for people to speak out! They ll be breaking confidentiality! Also social care is a career that women mostly get involved in

LETHAL LADY

monica22 wrote: »

that's where ur wrong he was a 17 child at the time

Are you really trying to tell me that even in extreme cases like this that a 17 year old cannot be restrained. I was under the impression that restraint can be used if the child is a danger to themselves or others.

Bullseye1

I can understand that people maybe scared to speak out but if they don't want to be attacked and abused while working (totally unacceptable BTW) they must speak out.

Cavehill Red

Leftist wrote: »

Did he try to kill someone before he left the car?

If I was up in court I would weep for joy if you were the prosecution.

Their job was to escort the aggressor from one location to another. They failed to do so. As a result, he sought to kill another boy and left him with brain damage. They failed in their duty of care and failed to carry out a perfectly simple task of driving a car directly from A to B. The consequences of their negligence have been devastating, and it doesn't matter whether those consequences could have been foreseen or not. They did not fulfil their task, which was entirely in their capabilities to do so, and therefore they should not be in the job.

monica22

LETHAL LADY wrote: »

monica22 wrote: »

that's where ur wrong he was a 17 child at the time

Are you really trying to tell me that even in extreme cases like this that a 17 year old cannot be restrained. I was under the impression that restraint can be used if the child is a danger to themselves or others.

Yes but the loop hole then been not in a public place! Sorry I'm so tired trying answer everyone and finished 12 hour might shift feel I'm been attacked lol

monica22

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Leftist wrote: »

Did he try to kill someone before he left the car?

If I was up in court I would weep for joy if you were the prosecution.

Their job was to escort the aggressor from one location to another. They failed to do so. As a result, he sought to kill another boy and left him with brain damage. They failed in their duty of care and failed to carry out a perfectly simple task of driving a car directly from A to B. The consequences of their negligence have been devastating, and it doesn't matter whether those consequences could have been foreseen or not. They did not fulfil their task, which was entirely in their capabilities to do so, and therefore they should not be in the job.

I do agree with that they should of escorted him to the shop! Me and you getting somewhere in agreement but I'm saying they shouldn't jumped out the car while he
Beating the guy