i will not be paying the property tax

Jumpy

subz3r0 wrote: »

I doubt they will bring ya to court if you don't pay, it would cost them more than the tax itself. Might as well not pay

How did that go with your TV Licence?

dayshah

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Can you not see that this is technically speaking cutting pay? It's more money out of your pocket, therefore less money to take home to put into your household essentials such as bills, groceries and upkeep of your home.

Aside from that, I'm not the one being paid thousands to come up with these foolproof ideas and be hated by the nation. The government should be able to propose a number of options and show us how each of these options will benefit us over a reasonable period of time and then make a decision based on public feedback. They are not being reasonable with their take, take, take attitude and just expecting the nation to sit back and be silent. I for one would feel a lot happier if I had some sort of involvement (bar ticking a box on polling day) into the decisions made about my future. I am sick of the government on budget day saying "we are charging you €x and it will amount to €x,xxx,xxx" but they never tell you where it's going and you never see where it's going. Can you honestly say you are happy to pay your taxes and whatever else the government have been throwing at us for years and seeing nothing in return?

What are the local authority providing for the likes of people who built their own homes, and I mean built it brick by brick themselves, never took out a loan or a stupid mortgage and own their own home in a rural area?

I do like the idea of the government offering a menu and we all vote on it, the sort of participatory democracy they have in Switzerland.

That said, even if we had loads of money, I'd still think taxing wealth and property is the fairest way to tax (though I am against a flat rate of €100), and I think this will rise on average to over €500.

People who live in the countryside made that choice. It is a lot more expensive to provide services (like roads) to rural areas than the city, so even if they provide their own water they still cost the council for other things.

Hopefully this money will all be passed onto local authorities, and they will set the rate. So in that way people will see the money spent in their own areas.

What I find funny is that people are worked up about this, but the VAT increase will cost us all a lot more.

wellboytoo

I do not have a problem with the proposed property tax, even if it does go to €1000.00 for my house(on a well and septic tank).
What I strongly object to is it going to central coffers, bring it in to the local Councils, and we will start to have a real country again, and let our Dáil do the national stuff and stop all the clientism that goes on there at the moment.

TheChizler

dayshah wrote: »

What I find funny is that people are worked up about this, but the VAT increase will cost us all a lot more.

I wouldn't say a whole lot more. If you spend €15,000 a year on VAT items you'll only be spending less than €250 more due to the increase.

I say 'only'...

daenerysstormborn3

dayshah wrote: »

I do like the idea of the government offering a menu and we all vote on it, the sort of participatory democracy they have in Switzerland.

That said, even if we had loads of money, I'd still think taxing wealth and property is the fairest way to tax (though I am against a flat rate of €100), and I think this will rise on average to over €500.

People who live in the countryside made that choice. It is a lot more expensive to provide services (like roads) to rural areas than the city, so even if they provide their own water they still cost the council for other things.

Hopefully this money will all be passed onto local authorities, and they will set the rate. So in that way people will see the money spent in their own areas.

What I find funny is that people are worked up about this, but the VAT increase will cost us all a lot more.

Wealth? Who do you know that is wealthy anymore? I certainly am not wealthy. I earn enough to just about get by, as I'm sure a lot of people just about do too. Wealth is defined as an abundance of valuable materials or resources, again, I certainly do not have an abundance of either.

"Services like roads" - this additional charge is not being ear-marked to provide roads, it's being ear-marked to provide "libraries" and "fire services" according to Enda Kenny, which brings me back to the points I made in an earlier post. Secondly, we already pay for the roads through road/motor tax which has also increased in this budget.

Smiley Burnett

What Govt ABOLISHED water charges AND college fees??
ANSWER--The Rainbow Govt
What happened The Rainbow Govt in 1997 election???
They were voted out of office.
Who replaced the Rainbow Govt?
FF/PD/Jackie Healy Rae
How did they manage the economy?????????????????

Tis time now that all of ye that went out and voted out of office THE FIRTS GOVT IN OUR HISTORY TO RETURN A BUDGET SURPLUS and replaced them with Bertie and FF, to take a long hard look in the mirror. It really was a case of "eaten bread is soon forgotten".
It isnt all that long ago since Bertie Ahern was mobbed by crowds of people wherever he went, yet you never hear anyone talk about that anymore??

Even Sinn Fein asked their supporters to vote for Bertie back in 1997. (they dont like to be reminded of this!!)


Funny that. isnt it???

Siamsa Sessions

It's the manner in which the charge is being introduced that is the problem, as much as the actual money itself.

Our whole democratic system is a mess. It might have worked well in creating political stability post-Independence, but it has done nothing to advance Ireland in terms of economic, social or even cultural progress. In fact, the clientelism and localism-on-a-national scale that is central to the current system holds back any progress that might be made.

The household charge, in theory, is a good idea. But the Government doesn't have the moral authority to implement it; not when it's paying itself over-inflated salaries and breaking its own guidelines to pay their "expert" advisers similarly over-inflated salaries - to pick just one recent example.

We have little enough ways to mass-protest in this country, given that there is no real left-wing political movement (a result of there being no large-scale industrialisation) behind which people can march. General and Local Elections offer candidates mostly from the Civil War parties, a few from Labour, and a thin smattering of Independents. So much changes, but so much stays the same.

Choosing not to pay the household charge is one of the few ways people can assert themselves. That Phil Hogan et al. couldn't see this, or choose to ignore it, says much about their judgement and/or arrogance.

In my opinion, Hogan has over-extended his reach. By installing himself and the Government as pseudo-landlords he may well have roused one of the few throbbing ribs that still irk the put-upon, tenant mindset of Irish people.

Only time will tell. But if I was a FG/FF/Labour TD or Councillor, I'd be getting worried at the resistance showed over the past few days by the plain people of Ireland.

Smiley Burnett

Siamsa Sessions wrote: »

It's the manner in which the charge is being introduced that is the problem, as much as the actual money itself.

Our whole democratic system is a mess. It might have worked well in creating political stability post-Independence, but it has done nothing to advance Ireland in terms of economic, social or even cultural progress. In fact, the clientelism and localism-on-a-national scale that is central to the current system holds back any progress that might be made.

The household charge, in theory, is a good idea. But the Government doesn't have the moral authority to implement it; not when it's paying itself over-inflated salaries and breaking its own guidelines to pay their "expert" advisers similarly over-inflated salaries - to pick just one recent example.

We have little enough ways to mass-protest in this country, given that there is no real left-wing political movement (a result of there being no large-scale industrialisation) behind which people can march. General and Local Elections offer candidates mostly from the Civil War parties, a few from Labour, and a thin smattering of Independents. So much changes, but so much stays the same.

Choosing not to pay the household charge is one of the few ways people can assert themselves. That Phil Hogan et al. couldn't see this, or choose to ignore it, says much about their judgement and/or arrogance.

In my opinion, Hogan has over-extended his reach. By installing himself and the Government as pseudo-landlords he may well have roused one of the few throbbing ribs that still irk the put-upon, tenant mindset of Irish people.

Only time will tell. But if I was a FG/FF/Labour TD or Councillor, I'd be getting worried at the resistance showed over the past few days by the plain people of Ireland.

The people i have heard giving out most about it WONT HAVE TO PAY IT!!

Siamsa Sessions

Smiley Burnett wrote: »

The people i have heard giving out most about it WONT HAVE TO PAY IT!!

Not sure exactly what you mean, but I can only guess that you think I'm exempt from paying this household charge (I'm not, by the way).

Either way, there's no point in playing the man and not the ball.

SillyMcCarthy

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0104/householdcharge.html

So, approx' 100 homes for every county have signed up for this!
No doubt that will be only the Dail membership who's paying it!
Talk about putting a positive spin on it!
We'll wait & see how this develops?

Nypd

SillyMcCarthy wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0104/householdcharge.html

So, approx' 100 homes for every county have signed up for this!
No doubt that will be only the Dail membership who's paying it!
Talk about putting a positive spin on it!
We'll wait & see how this develops?

Good Eire will roll over and have its belly scratched again.

Some people need their heads checked if they are paying this.

Smiley Burnett

i thought all ye lefties were in favour of taxes??? after all, when FG said that they would tackle the deficit by cutting public spending ye nearly went gaga!!!

make your minds up!! Do we tackle the deficit of approx 18 billion by increasing taxes or cutting spending?? There is no other debate or argument relevant right now!

wellboytoo

I paid mine this morning, and the site was clogged for an hour because of volume, might get lonely standing on that soapbox when theres no one else left?

Hoffmans

do the fg /labour lapdawgs realise who or what their 100€ soon to be over 500€ troica tax is going.....
http://www.golemxiv.co.uk/2010/10/who-are-the-bond-holders-we-are-bailing-out/

mikom

Talk about putting your hand out for a slap.
You are virtually signing a contract to pay a charge every year if you register up for this scam.

The penalties for a years non payment are approx 30 euro, so I'm gonna ride this one out for a while.

Sully

Its more than €30 penalty...

mikom

Sully wrote: »

Its more than €30 penalty...

This is my proof....... show me yours...

Quote:
The charge must be paid by the end of next March, and a late penalty of €10 will apply if paid within six months of the due date, €20 between six and 12 months and €30 if the payment is 12 months late.
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-2957826.html

Sully

mikom wrote: »

This is my proof....... show me yours...

Quote:
The charge must be paid by the end of next March, and a late penalty of €10 will apply if paid within six months of the due date, €20 between six and 12 months and €30 if the payment is 12 months late.
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-2957826.html

I see your proof and raise you..

HOMEOWNERS who repeatedly refuse to pay the new €100 household charge can be hit with fines of up to €2,500.

Mr Hogan said that after two years of failing to pay, the liability would rise to €280 when the charges, late-payment fees and late-payment interest were all taken into account.

Mr Hogan said: "I want the message to go out clearly to those who are liable to pay this necessary household charge on time, rather than incurring late-payment fees and penalties.

"Local authorities will also have power to take prosecutions against owners who fail to discharge their liability to pay.

"Prosecution will be by way of summary proceedings and a court may impose a class C fine under the Fines Act 2010, which ranges from €1,000 to €2,500."

Source: http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/latest-news/euro2500-fine-for-failure-to-pay-new-household-charge-2962898.html

Ride this baby out for a while if you don't mind paying an extra few quid. If you want to be a braveheart, face those strong gusty winds and pay €280. Easy peasy? Fight on brother, for we shall see you in court!

wellboytoo

mikom wrote: »

Talk about putting your hand out for a slap.
You are virtually signing a contract to pay a charge every year if you register up for this scam.

The penalties for a years non payment are approx 30 euro, so I'm gonna ride this one out for a while.

As I said here before i feel we should be paying rates, and always should have ,and I know this will rise to €500 per annum within three years, the only wish I have is that it will go directly to the local council not central coffers.

Sully

wellboytoo wrote: »

As I said here before i feel we should be paying rates, and always should have ,and I know this will rise to €500 per annum within three years, the only wish I have is that it will go directly to the local council not central coffers.

You have no objections to paying a tax on your home? Seems a bit mad to me tbh.

wellboytoo

I hate the idea, but why should paddy be any different from the whole developed world? it is the only way we can pay for the services we get locally , or should be getting in my case, or you go the UK route of a poll tax and everyone pays for living in an area not just the property owner.
One way or another we have to broaden the tax base in this country, and property tax is the most obvious followed by water charges.

mikom

Sully wrote: »

I see your proof and raise you..

Now show me the timeline of 1 year as I have shown in mine.

The penalties for a years non payment are approx 30 euro, so I'm gonna ride this one out for a while.

Great job at moving the goalposts

Sully wrote: »

face those strong gusty winds and pay €280. Easy peasy?

2 years.
You won't be much good to me in court if you haven't a concept of time.

Bards

here's the bit i hate from https://www.householdcharge.ie/

These services are essential to your community. They include: fire and emergency services; maintenance and cleaning of streets; planning and development; public parks; street lighting; libraries; open spaces and leisure amenities. These facilities benefit everyone....


..... and yet only the citizen who is not a burden on the state is expected to pay.

Why is it that Council Tenants or private tenants for that matter are not asked to pay.

what incentive is there going forward to own your own house and not be a burden on the state?

mickob16

How can anyone be expected to pay this if some of our politicians refuse to do so? I wouldn't mind paying up to €200 per year but if its a charge that's going to remain and increase yearly then surely people have a right to object and refuse to pay.

wellboytoo

Bards wrote: »

here's the bit i hate from https://www.householdcharge.ie/

These services are essential to your community. They include: fire
..... and yet only the citizen who is not a burden on the state is expected to pay.


what incentive is there going forward to own your own house and not be a burden on the state?

Everyone will pay, are people really naive enough to think landlords will not pass this on in rent eventually?

wmpdd3

I know one person who paid......as she is emigrating with her family. I wont be paying.

billythepig

anyone who pays this household tax is a tit.

ex_infantry man

if nobody pays then they,ll have no other choice but to scrap it!!!! i live in rented accomadation and i defo aint paying it on a property i don,t even own fcuk that

dayshah

SillyMcCarthy wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0104/householdcharge.html

So, approx' 100 homes for every county have signed up for this!
No doubt that will be only the Dail membership who's paying it!
Talk about putting a positive spin on it!
We'll wait & see how this develops?

I think there should be a tax on excessive use of the exclamation mark.

Bards wrote: »

here's the bit i hate from https://www.householdcharge.ie/

These services are essential to your community. They include: fire and emergency services; maintenance and cleaning of streets; planning and development; public parks; street lighting; libraries; open spaces and leisure amenities. These facilities benefit everyone....


..... and yet only the citizen who is not a burden on the state is expected to pay.

Why is it that Council Tenants or private tenants for that matter are not asked to pay.

what incentive is there going forward to own your own house and not be a burden on the state?

I think a tax on property is one of the fairest taxes we can have.

Council services, like road sweeping, maintaining green areas, street lights, maintaining local roads, litter wardens etc etc all increasethe value of your property. It should though go directly to local authorities, rather than through central government.

If people don't have the cash to hand (such as pensioners) the tax should accumulate until the house is sold. This is just like the 'fair deals' scheme for nursing homes.

I am unhappy with the flat rate charge, but at least this is only for one year.

The average tax will be about €500 to €1,000. I'm happy with this. Even if there was no crisis I'd be in favour of a property tax, and use the money to improve services or reduce VAT/income tax.

Its politically expedient that there be a temporary exemption for those who bought their home at the peak (and paid lots of VAT and stamp duty), so I'd be willing to go along with some write off for such people.

EDIT:
The plan is to raise €530 million per year, which averages about €300 per house (its a site value tax that is planned). My guess is that is will exceed the plan.

Look at page 98.
http://www.rte.ie/news/2010/1124/plan.pdf

Big Lar

Its a bummer but if it helps in the long term I don't mind paying