Army Ranger Wing

Yixian

Hey guys,

I'm a doctor, interested at some point in the next few years joining the defence forces medical corps but primarily as a means to apply for the Ranger Wing. I understand the Ranger Wing is highly competitive and the recruitment process difficult, and I have to admit that I am not looking for a future career based exclusively in the IDF, however I am very interested in doing it for a number of years and getting that experience and training. Might as well be honest!

Based on that would it be unreasonable for me to aim for the ARW in the future?

Also, I would not say I am unfit, I train Muay Thai and hit the gym regularly, but I am sure that your typical Ranger would make me look like a slob in comparison. I am wondering what level of fitness is required to have any hope of passing the selection process?

I read that something like 85% of applicants are not accepted, I want to know what I can do to avoid being in that 85%..

Finally, how regular are overseas deployments and are the usually with the Peacekeepers?

DISCLAIMER: Please forgive any ignorance!

ex_infantry man

Yixian wrote: »

Hey guys,

I'm a doctor, interested at some point in the next few years joining the defence forces medical corps but primarily as a means to apply for the Ranger Wing. I understand the Ranger Wing is highly competitive and the recruitment process difficult, and I have to admit that I am not looking for a future career based exclusively in the IDF, however I am very interested in doing it for a number of years and getting that experience and training. Might as well be honest!

Based on that would it be unreasonable for me to aim for the ARW in the future?

Also, I would not say I am unfit, I train Muay Thai and hit the gym regularly, but I am sure that your typical Ranger would make me look like a slob in comparison. I am wondering what level of fitness is required to have any hope of passing the selection process?

I read that something like 85% of applicants are not accepted, I want to know what I can do to avoid being in that 85%..

Finally, how regular are overseas deployments and are the usually with the Peacekeepers?

DISCLAIMER: Please forgive any ignorance!

if i were you i,d concentrate on getting into basic training first or cadetship and then see if ya actually like the defence forces life first!!!!

harmoniums

Yixian wrote: »

Hey guys,

I'm a doctor, interested at some point in the next few years joining the defence forces medical corps but primarily as a means to apply for the Ranger Wing. I understand the Ranger Wing is highly competitive and the recruitment process difficult, and I have to admit that I am not looking for a future career based exclusively in the IDF, however I am very interested in doing it for a number of years and getting that experience and training. Might as well be honest!

Based on that would it be unreasonable for me to aim for the ARW in the future?

Also, I would not say I am unfit, I train Muay Thai and hit the gym regularly, but I am sure that your typical Ranger would make me look like a slob in comparison. I am wondering what level of fitness is required to have any hope of passing the selection process?

I read that something like 85% of applicants are not accepted, I want to know what I can do to avoid being in that 85%..

Finally, how regular are overseas deployments and are the usually with the Peacekeepers?

DISCLAIMER: Please forgive any ignorance!

As a doctor, you should know this by now.
85% of the population are retarded.
You had the discipline to get into med school and get through it.
You're already to the far right of the abilities bell curve.

Owryan

As was said before work on getting in first, its a long road to the point where you can even apply for selection.

Just curious as a doctor are you looking to do apply for a position in the medical corps as a direct entry officer or work your way up from recruit/cadet as they are very different means of getting in ?

Jaafa

OP you say your interested in joining the ARW for the training and experience but something you have to consider is the fact that they are usually the first to be sent in warzones when peacekeeping missions come up (and I'm sure other missions we probably don't hear about). You will likely have to serve abroad for some time.

marketty

I'm not certain on this but I think if you joined as a direct entry medical officer you would not be eligible to apply for selection as you would not have the tactical training that someone of equivalent rank from the cadet school would have. But I can't say that for definite. I do know that officers who have completed a cadetship can go for and pass selection, however they will not always make it onto the skills course and into the unit, as there are limited officer vacancies in the ARW. Therefore chances of actually becoming a fully fledged Ranger are best for a very fit, determined and tactically skilled enlisted man (private/NCO). Now whether you wish to give up a hard earned and potentially lucrative position in the career of medicine to become an enlisted man (on pretty poor pay at the moment despite what the papers say about public servants) who MIGHT eventually get into the ARW after a lot of hardship...well that's your own call. If you want it bad enough to do that, fair play and best of luck with it, your intelligence and determination will get you far

Kat1170

The ARW, as with all Special Forces have specialists attached to them that have not needed to go the direct route via selection course.

Yixian

Thanks for the great replies guys!

In response, I would hope to join as an officer in the medical corps and apply that route.

As I understood it, anyone enployed by the IDF is eligible to turn up for selection?

In response to being right of the abilities curve, yes I'm used to achieving what I put my mind to and I am hoping this will apply to the ARW also.

I am fine with the idea of being deployed for a couple of years but less keen on hanging around back home when I could be off with MSF etc. otherwise.

discus

This is ridiculous. Yixian, you've posted on this forum before about the same tosh.

Being a ranger isn't about turning up and running a few marathons. It's soldiering. You can't expect to turn up and do a few weeks basic training to be a medical officer, and then expect to rock onto Ranger selection with the physical and mental robustness or the infantry skills needed to survive day 1.

cruasder777

discus wrote: »

This is ridiculous. Yixian, you've posted on this forum before about the same tosh.

Being a ranger isn't about turning up and running a few marathons. It's soldiering. You can't expect to turn up and do a few weeks basic training to be a medical officer, and then expect to rock onto Ranger selection with the physical and mental robustness or the infantry skills needed to survive day 1.

Why not ? Civilian Dr's and male nurses have joined both 21 and 23 TA SAS units in the UK and gone on to serve in Afghianistan as SAS combat medics. The training and selection takes about a yr. In fact one was KIA a couple of yrs ago

If civilians can do with UK special forces, whos selection and training and operations are far more demanding, why should they not be able to do so with the ARW?

discus

cruasder777 wrote: »

Why not ? Civilian Dr's and male nurses have joined both 21 and 23 SAS units in the UK and gone on to serve in Afghianistan as SAS combat medics. The training and selection takes about a yr. In fact one was KIA a couple of yrs ago

If civilians can do with UK special forces, whos selection and training and operations are far more demanding, why should they not be able to do so with the ARW?

Sorry mate, but you can't compare the ARW to the 21/23 SAS. The UK special forces have huge investment in their medical and support infrastructure. The Irish Army (to their chagrin, thank you Government) don't have that for the regular army, let alone for small specialised units.

cruasder777

discus wrote: »

Sorry mate, but you can't compare the ARW to the 21/23 SAS. The UK special forces have huge investment in their medical and support infrastructure. The Irish Army (to their chagrin, thank you Government) don't have that for the regular army, let alone for small specialised units.

What Im saying is there maybe should be an opening for Dr's, nurses etc to do selection and to serve part time in the ARW as combat medics, especially on overseas tours.

Thats their speciality, I dont know how much investment it would take.

discus

I'm not denying that. It's just Yixians whole approach to things that baffles me.

Wants to be a doctor on a UN peacekeeping mission. Thought that that'd be best achieved joining the RDF. Only wanted a year originally, but wanted to see what life is like in some of the corps and in logistics. Will serve peacekeeping but won't go everywhere that the Army try to send him, will only go if he agrees with the mission. Now expects to come in, do a basic "welcome to the army" course and become a Ranger. He imagines that he'd rather be deployed for a couple of years than be sat back home - does he even know what Doctors do day-to-day in any army? I'd love to know what army deploys individuals in units of years. Also, mentioned MSF - which sees far more frontline work than an army doctor.

Someone mentioned that they think that this guy is ahead of the bell curve. My ****ing arse he is. He's been watching too much M*A*S*H and Discovery Channel

Yixian

cruasder777 wrote: »

discus wrote: »

Sorry mate, but you can't compare the ARW to the 21/23 SAS. The UK special forces have huge investment in their medical and support infrastructure. The Irish Army (to their chagrin, thank you Government) don't have that for the regular army, let alone for small specialised units.

What Im saying is there maybe should be an opening for Dr's, nurses etc to do selection and to serve part time in the ARW as combat medics, especially on overseas tours.

Thats their speciality, I dont know how much investment it would take.

Because that wouldn't allow him to be condescending.

At no point in my post did I underestimate the difficulty of training, in fact I made it quite clear of the opposite. His posts are just pointless white noise.

discus

Good manouevre... Avoid and ignore everything I've said. If people wish to placate you further after reading my posts, then so be it. This isn't yet but will soon become a thread for Walter Mitty.

Sid_Justice

i heard nasa are recruiting would you like to be astronaut instead?

Poccington

Just as a note, I'm trying to answer your questions but I've never served in the ARW and have yet to attempt Selection. So I certainly don't have all the answers.

Yixian wrote: »

Hey guys,

I'm a doctor, interested at some point in the next few years joining the defence forces medical corps but primarily as a means to apply for the Ranger Wing. I understand the Ranger Wing is highly competitive and the recruitment process difficult, and I have to admit that I am not looking for a future career based exclusively in the IDF, however I am very interested in doing it for a number of years and getting that experience and training. Might as well be honest!

As I've said below, Direct Entry Officers aren't eligible from what I know.

Also, I would not say I am unfit, I train Muay Thai and hit the gym regularly, but I am sure that your typical Ranger would make me look like a slob in comparison. I am wondering what level of fitness is required to have any hope of passing the selection process?

I read that something like 85% of applicants are not accepted, I want to know what I can do to avoid being in that 85%..

You've to be quite fit. Especially when it comes to pack work. In terms of training, you'd be able to focus on specifics once you're in the DF and training specifically for Selection.

Finally, how regular are overseas deployments and are the usually with the Peacekeepers?

Depends completely on the mission.

As I understood it, anyone enployed by the IDF is eligible to turn up for selection?

AFAIK, Direct Entry Officers, which Doctors in the DF are, aren't eligible. After all, they only do a "Saluting" course before being commissioned.

I am fine with the idea of being deployed for a couple of years but less keen on hanging around back home when I could be off with MSF etc. otherwise.

You would be busy whether at home or overseas.

ChunkyLover_53

Hmm...

There was a Direct Entry Officer from Engineers in the East who went for selection a couple of years ago, he trained like mad for it but I'm not sure of the outcome,

AFAIK anyone is encouraged by the ARW to attempt selection, however wheter or not they have the room to accept your rank or skill set if you're successful is another story.

The Master of Disaster

Surely if you joined the Defence Forces as a doctor they'd be keen on utilising the skill set they've just recruited rather than letting you go off and play elite soldier?

If that's what you want to do then join as a soldier or officer, undergo the relevant training and then attempt selection.

cruasder777

Yixian wrote: »

Thanks for the great replies guys!

In response, I would hope to join as an officer in the medical corps and apply that route.

As I understood it, anyone enployed by the IDF is eligible to turn up for selection?

In response to being right of the abilities curve, yes I'm used to achieving what I put my mind to and I am hoping this will apply to the ARW also.

I am fine with the idea of being deployed for a couple of years but less keen on hanging around back home when I could be off with MSF etc. otherwise.

I recon the only realistic route would be move to England, get a job as a doctor or in the medical field and apply to join 21 or 23 SAS TA.



I cant see any other realistic option if you want to serve in a SOF unit and work as a Dr.

There are quite a few soldiers in both those units who work in the medical field.

Lemming

Not sure how realistic the option but on note of moving to the UK & attempting entry into 21 or 23 SAS, there is also the RAF MERT teams, although it would involve the OP in a medical capacity rather than any degree of soldiering (leaving that to the couple of soldiers tasked with protection in the Chinook if need be). From what I'm led to believe, the MERT teams do not do quiet, sedate helicopter trips.

On foot of mentioning the option of moving to the UK, if the OP can sort a green-card & emigrate to the US, there is also the USAF Para-Rescue (or PJs) who have a strong emphasis on medical abilities alongside soldiering.

twinytwo

cruasder777 wrote: »

Why not ? Civilian Dr's and male nurses have joined both 21 and 23 TA SAS units in the UK and gone on to serve in Afghianistan as SAS combat medics. The training and selection takes about a yr. In fact one was KIA a couple of yrs ago

If civilians can do with UK special forces, whos selection and training and operations are far more demanding, why should they not be able to do so with the ARW?

And you know all this from your vast experience of being a member of both i take it :rolleyes:

Yitzhak Rabin

Poccington wrote: »

As I've said below, Direct Entry Officers aren't eligible from what I know.


AFAIK, Direct Entry Officers, which Doctors in the DF are, aren't eligible. After all, they only do a "Saluting" course before being commissioned.

Just on this point. I'm pretty certain that DE's are eligible to apply for selection. The chances of them passing are very unlikely, and the chances of being accepted in the wing even if they passed selection are pretty much zero given they would lack the relevant skills and knowledge.

cruasder777

twinytwo wrote: »

And you know all this from your vast experience of being a member of both i take it :rolleyes:

I know people with connections to both units.

There was a male nurse KIA serving with 23 SAS a couple of years ago.

Whats your problem ?

twinytwo

cruasder777 wrote: »

I know people with connections to both units.

There was a male nurse KIA serving with 23 SAS a couple of years ago.

Whats your problem ?

Armchair general much???

cruasder777

twinytwo wrote: »

Armchair general much???

A mate of Paddy Doyles actually,but I doubt youve heard of him.

Poccington

yekahS wrote: »

Just on this point. I'm pretty certain that DE's are eligible to apply for selection. The chances of them passing are very unlikely, and the chances of being accepted in the wing even if they passed selection are pretty much zero given they would lack the relevant skills and knowledge.

Really? Genuinely didn't know that.

I was basing it on pretty much what you posted, they only do a "Saluting" course they'd be pissing in the wind really going down.

Yitzhak Rabin

Poccington wrote: »

Really? Genuinely didn't know that.

I was basing it on pretty much what you posted, they only do a "Saluting" course they'd be pissing in the wind really going down.

Yeah all they do is a basic shoot and salute course. 3 weeks. But the rules say it's still open to all DF members. Including air corps seahags and even DEs.

There was an engineer, some Walter Mitty type, that went for it a few years ago. Apparently it was one of the funniest 3 hrs ever.

twinytwo

cruasder777 wrote: »

A mate of Paddy Doyles actually,but I doubt youve heard of him.

Yawn..
Sure i play cards with Obama and Putin on a weekly basis:rolleyes:

Kat1170

yekahS wrote: »

There was an engineer, some Walter Mitty type, that went for it a few years ago. Apparently it was one of the funniest 3 hrs ever.

I've heard of lads lasting a lot less than 3 hrs

Michael O Toole

There was, in 2003, a doctor who worked with the ARW. I met him in Liberia in December of that year. I am struggling to remember the details, but from memory he was in the RDF and got involved in that way. But I think he was more attached to, rather than part of.

discus

Kat1170 wrote: »

I've heard of lads lasting a lot less than 3 hrs

hiyooooooo

swhyte027

In fairness who makes a statement like that.id like to join the army the join the ranger wing are you for real seriously.u don't even no what recruit training is like you have never walked from the glen to the curragh camp in full cemo.do some of that c how u get on.then maybe try serve over seas and c from there but don't disrespect any of them guys that have trained for years and trained hard that u think u can join up as a doctor then be in the percentage of people that don't fail selection seriously think about ur statement.

cruasder777

swhyte027 wrote: »

In fairness who makes a statement like that.id like to join the army the join the ranger wing are you for real seriously.u don't even no what recruit training is like you have never walked from the glen to the curragh camp in full cemo.do some of that c how u get on.then maybe try serve over seas and c from there but don't disrespect any of them guys that have trained for years and trained hard that u think u can join up as a doctor then be in the percentage of people that don't fail selection seriously think about ur statement.

With respect if the guy trains 3-4 times a week at Muay Thai, thats a serious fitness level and well beyond that of anything expected in the defence forces.

The circuit training aspect alone is often doing 250 press ups, 300 sit ups, 100 star jumps etc, rope climbing, pull ups, lots of running, followed by sparring etc.

The physical side of recruit training is a cake walk compared.

groundshaker

cruasder777 wrote: »

With respect if the guy trains 3-4 times a week at Muay Thai, thats a serious fitness level and well beyond that of anything expected in the defence forces.

The circuit training aspect alone is often doing 250 press ups, 300 sit ups, 100 star jumps etc, rope climbing, pull ups, lots of running, followed by sparring etc.

The physical side of recruit training is a cake walk compared.

In regards that statement I have to say I completely disagree. Recently went through recruit training myself with two individuals who competed at a good level, semi professional, of kickboxing and mma. And yes, while they were very good at exercises such as push-ups and sit ups, that counted very little in regards the main physical aspects of training, such as running and tabbing.

They were definitley amongst the worst performers when it came to pt, mainly because they weren't any good at running or tabbing. Just because they would have been considered as having an exceptional fitness level in the civvie world it didn't mean that they were army fit.

What I'm basically saying is that once you've a bit of weight on your back it's a different story, it's nowhere near as simple as saying that since you can do x amount of push ups and sit ups, that you must be fit. Such exercises have little to do with army fitness, well certainly in my experience anyway

cruasder777

groundshaker wrote: »

In regards that statement I have to say I completely disagree. Recently went through recruit training myself with two individuals who competed at a good level, semi professional, of kickboxing and mma. And yes, while they were very good at exercises such as push-ups and sit ups, that counted very little in regards the main physical aspects of training, such as running and tabbing.

They were definitley amongst the worst performers when it came to pt, mainly because they weren't any good at running or tabbing. Just because they would have been considered as having an exceptional fitness level in the civvie world it didn't mean that they were army fit.

What I'm basically saying is that once you've a bit of weight on your back it's a different story, it's nowhere near as simple as saying that since you can do x amount of push ups and sit ups, that you must be fit. Such exercises have little to do with army fitness, well certainly in my experience anyway

MMA is the most physically demading of all martial arts training to compare running and tabbing to it are laughable.

Ive done the Paras 10, a couple of marathons and lots of other Tabs inc a 28 miler over mountains last Summer.

Fighting K1 or MMA is a different league, you are not just knackerd but someone is trying to knock you out.

Circuit training exercises are the basis of infantry fitness, like interval training they push your fitness beyond just running/jogging and also develop upper body power. Such circuits have everything to do with infantry fitness, if you had done such circuits you would know that.
But they obviously are done with running/Tabs.

If your friends had fought at K1 level in Muay Thai, their fitness would be well above infantry fitness.


I find it hard to believe that your semi pro Muay Thai/MMA fighter friends were the worst in the gym as recruits. Lol.

Someone fighting at that level would be training 5x a week, they would be running, doing very demanding circuits and sparring, training about 1.5/2 hours 5 x a week. There fitness level would even be beyond that even of Royal Marines and Paras. After all they are semi pro fighters.......your claim.


Tabbing is hard at first but after 3 or so goes you get used to it/get into the rhythm of it.

The only time I ever really struggled with it was in heat, its very easy to get heat exhaustion in full kit in 80 degrees.

groundshaker

cruasder777 wrote: »

MMA is the most physically demading of all martial arts training to compare running and tabbing to it are laughable.

Ive done the Paras 10, a couple of marathons and lots of other Tabs inc a 28 miler over mountains last Summer.

Fighting K1 or MMA is a different league, you are not just knackerd but someone is trying to knock you out.

Circuit training exercises are the basis of infantry fitness, like interval training they push your fitness beyond just running/jogging and also develop upper body power. Such circuits have everything to do with infantry fitness, if you had done such circuits you would know that.
But they obviously are done with running/Tabs.

If your friends had fought at K1 level in Muay Thai, their fitness would be well above infantry fitness.


I find it hard to believe that your semi pro Muay Thai/MMA fighter friends were the worst in the gym as recruits. Lol.

Someone fighting at that level would be training 5x a week, they would be running, doing very demanding circuits and sparring about 1.5/2 hours per day. There fitness level would even be beyond that even of Royal Marines.


Tabbing is hard at first but after 3 or so goes you get used to it/get into the rhythm of it.

I think you are misunderstanding what I was saying. What you were initially suggesting is that just because he does mma or whatever that he'd have a fitness level required to get into a sf unit, whereas I was saying is that it's a different sort of fitness, just beacause you're good at one doesn't mean you'll be able to attempt sf selection. i think very few possess the mental toughness to pass such courses hence that's why their so hard to get into.

In regards the individuals I was in training with who done mma I never said they were worst in the gym, oh they loved that pt, it was runs and tabs they struggled with, too muscle bound, I'd it say slowed them down.

Have to disagree that circuits are the 'basis of military fitness'. Running, tabs and battle pt are what infantry is all about. I can honestly say, well certainly in my unit, we do minial circuit training, if ya want to go the gym do it in your own time. Can't speak for Para's or Rm though, I'm sure they do alot more than my unit

cruasder777

groundshaker wrote: »

I think you are misunderstanding what I was saying. What you were initially suggesting is that just because he does mma or whatever that he'd have a fitness level required to get into a sf unit, whereas I was saying is that it's a different sort of fitness, just beacause you're good at one doesn't mean you'll be able to attempt sf selection. i think very few possess the mental toughness to pass such courses hence that's why their so hard to get into.

In regards the individuals I was in training with who done mma I never said they were worst in the gym, oh they loved that pt, it was runs and tabs they struggled with, too muscle bound, I'd it say slowed them down.

Have to disagree that circuits are the 'basis of military fitness'. Running, tabs and battle pt are what infantry is all about. I can honestly say, well certainly in my unit, we do minial circuit training, if ya want to go the gym do it in your own time. Can't speak for Para's or Rm though, I'm sure they do alot more than my unit

You said your friends were semi pro fighters, but worst at running fitness wise during basic training, I find that hard to believe.

Most MMA fighters are not muscle bound. All military units that have high levels of fitness use circuits as the building block of fitness, Royal Marine recruits do circuits 5 days a week, non stop press up, sit ups,box jumps, rope climbs, star jumps, squats, shuttle runs, along side running etc.

As for Special forces selection, if you can withstand boredom, are very good with a map and compass, dont mind the boredom of long tabs, dont mind rain, cold, intense boredom, are fairly intelligent and pick things up fairly quickly, even better if you have lots of orienteering and hill walking experience theres a good chance you will pass it.

The superman thing is media hype. The biggest thing is to stay motivated during the mind numbing boredom of it.

DipStick McSwindler

This post has been deleted.

Yixian

yekahS wrote: »

Just on this point. I'm pretty certain that DE's are eligible to apply for selection. The chances of them passing are very unlikely, and the chances of being accepted in the wing even if they passed selection are pretty much zero given they would lack the relevant skills and knowledge.

Ok so this is my concern.

I can give or take using my medical skills, it's not a necessity, I am as interested in a military career as I am a medical one and with a medical degree you have substantial freedom to come and go so I'd like my chance to pursue military training and deployment for a number of years and then reassess.

But yes, I am not interested in joining the British Army despite living here, don't ask why, I don't care anyone's opinions on the matter, but it's probably obvious.

would lack the relevant skills and knowledge

That's fair enough, so what can I do to change that? what are the possible solutions? How long would it take to get up to speed and become acceptable for deployment as a Ranger.


Otherwise I'm pretty much left with the Foreign Legion..

Yixian

Oh and the last time I spoke to a recruitment officer, direct entry personnel don't just do a "salute course"... They do full basic training like everybody else.

I have to say, I have never seen so much disagreement and inaccuracy over basic facts regarding an armed service before. The IDF has simple, standard policies that seem to be debated in here like they are shades of grey or matters of opinion???

Poccington

Yixian wrote: »

Oh and the last time I spoke to a recruitment officer, direct entry personnel don't just do a "salute course"... They do full basic training like everybody else.

I have to say, I have never seen so much disagreement and inaccuracy over basic facts regarding an armed service before. The IDF has simple, standard policies that seem to be debated in here like they are shades of grey or matters of opinion???

The disagreement over DE Officers going on Selection was my fault, I thought they couldn't but as others pointed out, they can and have done so.

That Officer was, quite frankly, telling lies. They're called Direct Entry for a reason, they don't do a full Cadetship like other Officers. You just have to see some of the DE folk walking around to see that.

Yixian

Poccington wrote: »

The disagreement over DE Officers going on Selection was my fault, I thought they couldn't but as others pointed out, they can and have done so.

That Officer was, quite frankly, telling lies. They're called Direct Entry for a reason, they don't do a full Cadetship like other Officers. You just have to see some of the DE folk walking around to see that.

Do you know if it's possible to opt into doing a full cadetship?

I didn't mean to suggest I could just rock up to Ranger selection with no training and be accepted, I'm up for the whole shebang, whatever it takes (provided it can be done in a reasonable time period).

Yitzhak Rabin

Yixian wrote: »

Do you know if it's possible to opt into doing a full cadetship?

I didn't mean to suggest I could just rock up to Ranger selection with no training and be accepted, I'm up for the whole shebang, whatever it takes (provided it can be done in a reasonable time period).

Its quite simple. If you want to do a regular cadetship, then you apply whenever the next competition is on, and hope that you get selected like everyone else. Given you background having successfully completed a medical degree and being exceptionally fit, you would stand a decent chance of being selected, but the odds are still stacked against you. I think there were around 4-5k applicants for 35 places in the last competition.

If you get selected you would train for 15 months (I think that's how long it is now) and then would be eligible to go for selection upon receiving your commission. 2/Lt's have passed selection before, but they generally aren't taken into the wing due to their lack of experience.

The other option is to go Direct Entry which will have you commissioned after less than a month, and as a medical officer, you'll be straight in as the rank of captain. You can still technically go for selection, but as I said, chances of passing are extremely low, and chances of being taken into the wing are essentially nil.

My advice to you is not to join the army. If you are joining to be a fighting soldier, then the DF is going to disappoint you. You will become dissillusioned, and will have gained very little medical experience, other than handing out ED to sh1tbags. If you want to be a doctor, then pursue your career in the regular way. If you want to be a soldier, then join the brits/foreign legion.

Yixian

yekahS wrote: »

Its quite simple. If you want to do a regular cadetship, then you apply whenever the next competition is on, and hope that you get selected like everyone else. Given you background having successfully completed a medical degree and being exceptionally fit, you would stand a decent chance of being selected, but the odds are still stacked against you. I think there were around 4-5k applicants for 35 places in the last competition.

If you get selected you would train for 15 months (I think that's how long it is now) and then would be eligible to go for selection upon receiving your commission. 2/Lt's have passed selection before, but they generally aren't taken into the wing due to their lack of experience.

The other option is to go Direct Entry which will have you commissioned after less than a month, and as a medical officer, you'll be straight in as the rank of captain. You can still technically go for selection, but as I said, chances of passing are extremely low, and chances of being taken into the wing are essentially nil.

My advice to you is not to join the army. If you are joining to be a fighting soldier, then the DF is going to disappoint you. You will become dissillusioned, and will have gained very little medical experience, other than handing out ED to sh1tbags. If you want to be a doctor, then pursue your career in the regular way. If you want to be a soldier, then join the brits/foreign legion.

Thanks for the reply.

Basically what I am looking for is to spend 4-6 years of my life in the military, either in a combat role or a mixed combat/medical role if such a thing is possible, but not simply as a military doctor. I want all the training I can get because my intention is for this experience to toughen me up, keep me fit, teach me about warfare & combat and for that to continue to benefit me in whatever I do subsequently.

I won't join the British Army.

If what you say is true that leaves me with the Foreign Legion. I suppose selection for this is a lot more likely than the Rangers and you're guaranteed overseas work, but I need to seriously improve my french and there is a certain air of... neo-colonialism about some of their work.

Do you have any opinions on the FL? How that experience would differ from the IDF, what kind of level of fitness and experience is expected of applicants etc.? Because you might be right and I might need to look into that route.

Yitzhak Rabin

Yixian wrote: »

Thanks for the reply.

Basically what I am looking for is to spend 4-6 years of my life in the military, either in a combat role or a mixed combat/medical role if such a thing is possible, but not simply as a military doctor. I want all the training I can get because my intention is for this experience to toughen me up, keep me fit, teach me about warfare & combat and for that to continue to benefit me in whatever I do subsequently.

I won't join the British Army.

If what you say is true that leaves me with the Foreign Legion. I suppose selection for this is a lot more likely than the Rangers and you're guaranteed overseas work, but I need to seriously improve my french and there is a certain air of... neo-colonialism about some of their work.

Do you have any opinions on the FL? How that experience would differ from the IDF, what kind of level of fitness and experience is expected of applicants etc.? Because you might be right and I might need to look into that route.

My only knowledge of the FFL comes from books, so I'm no authority to talk about them. But from what I can gather. Being able to speak French gives you a great advantage, but isn't necessary, as you can pick up a language fairly quickly when an angry frenchman is roaring at you.

You should read a few books on the legion to get a feel for what it is like. Legionnaire by Simon Murray is an excellent read. Possibly the best soldiers biography I've ever read. Another good one, and more recent is The making of a legionnaire by Bill Paris. There's also one by an Irish guy called Hidden soldier, he also joins a PMC and serves in Iraq and Haiti with them in it. Not a great read, but perhaps revelant given you are Irish too.

Legionnaire training is extremely tough, and they're lifestyle even when finished is spartan. I think there are a lot of eastern europeans, russians and other emigrants from further afield joining now. You'd want to be tough, and well able to handle yourself as a lot of the recruits will be extremely shady characters. You'd also want to be fully sure that it is for you before you sign up, because once you sign the dotted line you are in for 5 years, and if you try and desert you'll be thrown in prison. Physical abuse is common in the legion too, and some of the punishments for fcuking up are pretty extreme. Have a google of FFL punishments to see what I mean.

I think there is a thread on here about the aussie's trying to recruit Europeans and granting citizenship for those who join. They're serving in both Afghanistan and Iraq AFAIK, so they might be a good to look at.

Lastly, I mean absolutely no offence, but you sound awfully naive. You're on here asking the best way to join a special forces unit, and talking about joing the FFL on a whim, and seem to have done little or no research into it. I think you like the sound of being a soldier rather than actually being one. If you do join a fighting army, your medical degree will grant you no special privileges and you'll be just another recruit like everyone else. So like I said in the last post, if you want to be a soldier, then sign up,but if you want to be a doctor, then you're best to pursue that career along the regular way working in hospitals. You'd definitely be dealing with more gunshot and stab wounds in a london ER room than if you joined the DF.

Yixian

yekahS wrote: »

Lastly, I mean absolutely no offence, but you sound awfully naive. You're on here asking the best way to join a special forces unit, and talking about joing the FFL on a whim, and seem to have done little or no research into it. I think you like the sound of being a soldier rather than actually being one

No offense, but have you ever met a bunch of British Army recruits? That is exactly what they are, and I doubt it's very different from armed forces all over the world.

You're right, I don't know the ins and outs of the army and everything it entails, funny that. You'd almost think I hadn't joined yet or something.

It would be very easy for me to point my finger at a 17 year old interested in becoming a doctor and say, you've never been on an resus call, you don't know the structure of the FYP training programme, your anatomy isn't very good, I think you like the idea of being a doctor rather than actually being one. But that'd be stupid... who else do you think become doctors?

I guess in an ideal world babies would pop out the womb in white coats and 5 years worth of medical training but I don't recall ever seeing that during my obstetrics rotation.

Anyway I will, as previously specified, look further into the FL.

Yitzhak Rabin

Yixian wrote: »

No offense, but have you ever met a bunch of British Army recruits? That is exactly what they are, and I doubt it's very different from armed forces all over the world.

You're right, I don't know the ins and outs of the army and everything it entails, funny that. You'd almost think I hadn't joined yet or something.

It would be very easy for me to point my finger at a 17 year old interested in becoming a doctor and say, you've never been on an resus call, you don't know the structure of the FYP training programme, your anatomy isn't very good, I think you like the idea of being a doctor rather than actually being one. But that'd be stupid... who else do you think become doctors?

I guess in an ideal world babies would pop out the womb in white coats and 5 years worth of medical training but I don't recall ever seeing that during my obstetrics rotation.

Anyway I will, as previously specified, look further into the FL.

Like I said, I meant no offence. I was just giving my frank opinion to you. If you're serious then it should be water off a duck's back.

Have you considered joining Medicín san frontier/ doctors without borders? You would definitely get some great high tempo experience with them working in wartorn areas.

Lemming

IIRC, non-French nationals are not allowed to apply as officers in the FFL, so it's the enlisted ranks for you Yixian, unless you can claim French citizenship of course, and go off to become an officer first in France.

Also whilst your medical qualifications will go towards your enlistment application, you will begin life as a Legionnaire with no specialities, so you may conceivably end up not practising any medical skills for a while depending on what the Legion needs.

slum dog

op don't listen to half the posts on here. from what i gather, they're just a bunch of begrudging bastards.

the arw isn't that hard to get into. think about it op, it isn't much of a 'special forces' unit if half the guys signing up only have peace keeping experience. peace keeping is no comparison to full on combat experience and the likes you meet in the irish army are dopes who troll forums and say that the arw are the best special forces in the world :rolleyes:

if your serious about joining special forces join the royal marines or french foreign legion to give you that extra edge

Lemming wrote: »

IIRC, non-French nationals are not allowed to apply as officers in the FFL, so it's the enlisted ranks for you Yixian, unless you can claim French citizenship of course, and go off to become an officer first in France.

am yes you can. 25% of officers in the legion are foreign. you apply to become an officer in the legion if you have a degree, have 2 years experience, fluent french, and are under 30

if you don't have a degree, you can still become one but you need to be there longer

tac foley

Yixian wrote: »

No offense, but have you ever met a bunch of British Army recruits? ...Anyway I will, as previously specified, look further into the FL.

You continuously make the point that you want to be an officer, and officers are not recruits, they are cadets.

You seem to be oblivious to the advice offered to you about the FFL. On joining that organisation ALL your previous life is erased, good or bad, and you become a basic lump of meat that the FFL turns into a Legionnaire. The post above details what a non-French officer aspirant has to run through to become an officer in the FFL. Just an officer, not a medical officer.

IF you joined ANY military organisation as a doctor, then YOU know, and I know, and so does everybody else here know, that delivering babies or fixing up hangnails on saturday night drunks is not what military medicine is all about. Initially you would be as useful to a MERT team as tits on a frog - until you had had serious time in a major trauma unit used to dealing with 24/7 multiple amputations, burn treatment, real-time no-kidding triage of injured and dying as well as all the other injuries occasioned by standing on 50 pounds of explosives packed with nails.

In spite of your obvious distaste at having anything to do with the British Army, you are nevertheless living in a country that you apparently despise, but more than happy to be carted off to a free hospital for the best of treatment if, GF, anything should happen to you. If the place is such a hell-hole, why not return to Ireland and help out the ailing health service?

Or you could do what others have done, and join the TA.

Rant over.

tac