Luas in Kilkenny?

DavidShivers

Iv'e seen the fourm about a luas in Waterford but what about here? I heard that Bus Eireann is thinking about running BRTs or bus trams in Waterford Galway and maybey Kilkenny.

I think it would be a good idea; Anybody have any ideas on where it will go, lines stops depots etc.

Rega

Kilkenny is tiny. No need for it in my opinion.

Plug

We don't even need a bus service never mind a Luas. Cork could maybe do with one but no where else.

Cabaal

Luas wouldn't work but I think Kilkenny Bikes might not be a bad idea, wouldn't take many to do the job either

Captain Havoc

Cabaal wrote: »

Luas wouldn't work but I think Kilkenny Bikes might not be a bad idea, wouldn't take many to do the job either

absolutely with all those shared space lanes making Kilkenny a safer place for cyclists.

PaulKK

Plug wrote: »

We don't even need a bus service never mind a Luas. Cork could maybe do with one but no where else.

I don't think Cork even needs one tbh, the buses are pretty decent down there. If we had a few more buses or proper routes it'd be grand I'd say.

Something like how Waterford/Galway buses run around those cities.

Plug

Maybe get buses when they have the ring road complete and the inner city relief thingy done, I going to guess maybe another 110 million years?

Dozen Wicked Words

We already have the luas:

Cabaal

Captain Havoc wrote: »

absolutely with all those shared space lanes making Kilkenny a safer place for cyclists.

ha

Ah yes the fantastic forward thinking of a bunch of designers and council people who likely haven't cycled for many many years.

No hope of Kilkenny bikes or decent cycle lanes/or just no cycle lanes
:mad:

Captain Havoc

Cabaal wrote: »

No hope of Kilkenny bikes or decent cycle lanes/or just no cycle lanes
:mad:

I think they have to do something there, some class of government initiative. Link here to the smarter travel proposal. One of the people involved is a decent tri-athlete.

PhilipMarlowe

How did this picture of our mod get here???

Captain Havoc

PhilipMarlowe wrote: »

How did this picture of our mod get here???

I think I look more like this guy than that guy:

foxcoverteddy

luas in Kilkenny? We don't even need a bus service. The place is too small.
Kilkenny Cycles
All fair comments, obvious none of you are old, infirmed or suffering the effects of traumatic ops etc.
Apart from using a taxi, which I reckon do a great job, but cost of such service is not cheap, not taxi drivers fault.
How do you all suggest one gets from the centre of town to St Lukes, or Supervalu in Loughboy?
Do I hang the shopping on the handlebars?
I reckon you should be on the council, you are talking like the people we elected.
We can do it, so hard luck if you can't. Lets spend money on cycle lanes, how many cyclists we talking about.
No further comment at this stage, just don't stand for election.

Cabaal

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

luas in Kilkenny? We don't even need a bus service. The place is too small.
Kilkenny Cycles
All fair comments, obvious none of you are old, infirmed or suffering the effects of traumatic ops etc.
Apart from using a taxi, which I reckon do a great job, but cost of such service is not cheap, not taxi drivers fault.
How do you all suggest one gets from the centre of town to St Lukes, or Supervalu in Loughboy?
Do I hang the shopping on the handlebars?
I reckon you should be on the council, you are talking like the people we elected.
We can do it, so hard luck if you can't. Lets spend money on cycle lanes, how many cyclists we talking about.
No further comment at this stage, just don't stand for election.

If that was the view people took in Dublin we wouldn't have Dublin Bikes and soon to be the likes of Waterford Bikes.

Clearly it won't suit everyone but its been proven to work and it reduces traffic as people won't get Taxi's, this in turn saves money and is good for people's health too.

Just because it won't suit 100% of people doesn't mean we shouldn't have it, the benefits and numerous so for that alone its worth having.

Captain Havoc

The bike thing isn't aimed at someone who needs to carry 48 bags of shopping but more at the person who drives to work every day from in and around the city, if I can cycle to work in Carlow from Kilkenny, I don't see why someone can't cycle into town from Glendine. If someone does need to carry a few small items, they can get a carrier and bag as modeled by me on my way Switzerland at Europes highest mountain pass, I don't see the problem in using one from Loughboy:


Another practical option for carrying stuff is a dutch work bike like this one.

foxcoverteddy

You are so right in all aspects of this, in fact you make a very good case.
However you are completely ignoring those who cannot for whatever reason ride a bike. You are blessed being able to do what you do, so have your bike lanes, share the pedestrian's refuge but for goodness sake don't knock the percentage that can't cycle.
Cycle from Glendine? Do you realise cycling back up John St would be more than a lot could manage, fine in a car.
Would you cycle from Loughboy to St Lukes and back?
I say again you are talking the same as the council, if it doesn't suit 100%
so what about the percentage that would like a bus service or Luas.
Dublin and Waterford are completely different situations, sorry your reasoning is floored.

ergonomics

foxcoverteddy wrote: »

You are so right in all aspects of this, in fact you make a very good case.
However you are completely ignoring those who cannot for whatever reason ride a bike. You are blessed being able to do what you do, so have your bike lanes, share the pedestrian's refuge but for goodness sake don't knock the percentage that can't cycle.
Cycle from Glendine? Do you realise cycling back up John St would be more than a lot could manage, fine in a car.
Would you cycle from Loughboy to St Lukes and back?
I say again you are talking the same as the council, if it doesn't suit 100%
so what about the percentage that would like a bus service or Luas.
Dublin and Waterford are completely different situations, sorry your reasoning is floored.

If a bike system was introduced in Kilkenny, no one would be forcing anyway to cycle everywhere. Cars and taxis will still be available as they are now. You seem to be working on an assumption that cars and taxis will be banned and everyone will be forced to cycle everywhere is a bike system is brought in.

If you can't cycle or don't want to for whatever reason then that's fine. Carry on as normal.

Captain Havoc

I'm not trying to encourage anyone who can't cycle to cycle, it's like trying to sell diamonds to homeless people. What I am saying is that, there are a certain amount of people who drive, for whom it would be more practical and economical to walk or cycle but come up with excuses not to. I used to smoke 30 fags a day and I got really unfit and fat but without a change of attitude, I'd still be like that.

foxcoverteddy

Perhaps it is the spirit of Christmas, but you've lost the plot.
I am saying that a Luas or decent Bus Service in the town would be a brilliant innovation for those who don't cycle.
Someone said the town was too small and cycles were the answer.
Yes, of course there would be savings cycling, I am a creature of comfort and cycling to work in the rain is not my idea of fun, but you need not cycle in the rain?
Tell the rain to keep away when I am about to depart for the office or when coming home.
I do not like the cold frosty mornings. I do not have much confidence in some of the motorists and certainly would not recommend the Callan Road from Cuffesgrange, a disaster area.
Well Happy New Year to all.

Keyzer

No chance of this happening...

I'd be highly surprised if any new Luas projects are announced for Dublin let alone a new instance anywhere else in the country for many years to come...

booboo88

PaulKK wrote: »

I don't think Cork even needs one tbh, the buses are pretty decent down there. If we had a few more buses or proper routes it'd be grand I'd say.

Something like how Waterford/Galway buses run around those cities.

Kilkenny is tiny, itd be far to costly, and the roads too small.
Even cork doesnt have one

Solair

Cork could do with something better than the current bus network that's for sure. Most of the problems are down to bad planning by Bus Eireann and lack of local autonomous management of the system.

I'd say Cork and maybe Galway would be the only places you could argue would need those kinds of mass transit systems.

Although, in Cork it would be quite likely that any such system would be guided busses rather than trams as the hilly nature of the city on one side makes trams rather impractical.

Guided-bus systems are common enough in cities of Cork's scale.

E.g.
Nancy, France which is very comparable to Cork in terms of scale. (Roughly 102,000 + metropolitan area similarly spread out of about 400,000)

Smaller urban centres like Kilkenny would probably benefit from local autonomous management of the local bus network and freeing up from the Bus Eireann bureaucracy. There's no reason why this could not be done as it's quite normal for small centres to have their own bus systems elsewhere.
Normally, running the local bus network's something that is in the remit of a city or town council and contracted out to a commercial operator.

booboo88

Solair wrote: »

Cork could do with something better than the current bus network that's for sure. Most of the problems are down to bad planning by Bus Eireann and lack of local autonomous management of the system.

I'd say Cork and maybe Galway would be the only places you could argue would need those kinds of mass transit systems.

Although, in Cork it would be quite likely that any such system would be guided busses rather than trams as the hilly nature of the city on one side makes trams rather impractical.

Guided-bus systems are common enough in cities of Cork's scale.

E.g.
Nancy, France which is very comparable to Cork in terms of scale. (Roughly 102,000 + metropolitan area similarly spread out of about 400,000)

Smaller urban centres like Kilkenny would probably benefit from local autonomous management of the local bus network and freeing up from the Bus Eireann bureaucracy. There's no reason why this could not be done as it's quite normal for small centres to have their own bus systems elsewhere.
Normally, running the local bus network's something that is in the remit of a city or town council and contracted out to a commercial operator.

San Francisco is some what "hilly" natured isnt it?
It would make alot more sense as it would reduce congestion if there was a somewhat reliable service as buses are unreliable, for example in my my own case, I live 15 minutes from work driving. It takes me 2 and a half hours to get home at night and to get in the morning.

Solair

booboo88 wrote: »

San Francisco is some what "hilly" natured isnt it?
It would make alot more sense as it would reduce congestion if there was a somewhat reliable service as buses are unreliable, for example in my my own case, I live 15 minutes from work driving. It takes me 2 and a half hours to get home at night and to get in the morning.

The lack of reliability is all about pathetically bad route planning and lack of clearways and bus lanes. The busses get snarled up at various bottle necks when there's even mild traffic.

booboo88

Solair wrote: »

The lack of reliability is all about pathetically bad route planning and lack of clearways and bus lanes. The busses get snarled up at various bottle necks when there's even mild traffic.

It also got to to with the lack of buses, buses breaking down, no drivers turning up and which all boils down to money, they offering voluntary redunancies to drivers but not taking on more. Like on the bus route I use, if theres no bus or driver available for one route they take it off my route as its seen as the least profitabilty.

foxcoverteddy

Okay we wil rule out Luas, buses could be viable if we had enough of them, and had a council that was capable of running a system.
We would probably need to ban cars from the central area, even those trying to get in to the council offices, not a chance mate.
Turn the mayors walk into a bus station with an adjacent cab rank. Make Kilkenny a transport hub.
The town route served by small buses, not the stupid long one seen sometimes.
Out of town parks for cars served by the town fleet from 7am to 7pm, also buses to meet trains at MacDonagh taking the passengers to the Central bus station.
Kilkenny could well set the trend for other similar sized towns, a dream perhaps?

Lord ButterSlip

Only place 2 bus routes could go in my opinion. No space for trams...

foxcoverteddy

Hang on, think-children, schools, watershed and residential area's.
What is the object of having a viable bus service? Get rid of cars, and who causes major disruption, parents taking and collecting children.
This needs a lot of thinking out, and to stop bus congestion, flat fare with turnstile, fast boarding.
The children we are targetting are those who do not qualify for a school bus, so it would need input by the schools.
We know we need to serve the shopping area's and hospital, also the train station.
A car ban at certain hours, and use only small compact buses.
How's that for starters?

PaulKK

Lord ButterSlip wrote: »

Only place 2 bus routes could go in my opinion. No space for trams...

I would be thinking you could have something like this:





Presuming of course some sort of bus terminus could be created at the market yard.. its central and there is some room there. Alternatives could be the parade etc.

foxcoverteddy

Dear PaulKK, looks like you have given the idea a lot of thought, well done.
Be interesting to see if any one else cares to input.
So it might be a thing for the future, however using buses, I would ask why.
An interesting site for garage/terminal, the old cash and carry in New St.
We must cwertainly keep this one going.
Happy New Year and many thanks Foxy:P

Lord ButterSlip

Well my thinking was to have the bare minimum to start with and go from there. I also tried to avoid the ring road and to avoid having the buses running on the same streets.

Just my thoughts on it

PaulKK wrote: »

Is this route number 3 or an alternative?

PaulKK wrote: »

Presuming of course some sort of bus terminus could be created at the market yard.. its central and there is some room there. Alternatives could be the parade etc.

I hadnt put much thought into that, id say the parade is out of the question as its fairly new and (insert abuse here) but the market yard could work but god forbid the taxi drivers lose any space to the buses! The site on new street would be really good except its a sharp turn from new street onto the top of Friary St for buses.