Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

Al Capwned

Trilla wrote: »

and replaced with "quare bad" & "quare stoopid"

Let's not be hasty - used properly, that word is quare effective!

Orando Broom

keane2097 wrote: »

Oh for fuck sake.

Listen, it's simple, people still questioning Lucas' quality don't know shit about soccer, end of. Move on.

I think Lucas got better as Gerrard declined. I think he benefits by comparison to his peers. He's an ok footballer but not one I'd say would even be close to United's standards to be honest. He puts in a shift and he's an honest pro. He is a Brazilian international by virtue of thier utilitarian composition of recent years. I'd wager when the World Cup hype starts to ramp up in Brazil the likes of Lucas won't be within a mile of the squad. That will be a squad of flair players. The recent functional trends with Brazil will be discarded.

keane2097

Orando Broom wrote: »

Yep. Also there should be an automatic two week ban on the soccer forum for decrying one person's OPINION without backing up your counter opinion.

It is easy for me or anyone to troll around saying this point is 'bollocks' or 'retarded' and not provide a counter point. The fact remains that the people who do this are themselves, in fact, the 'retards'.

There is loads of stuff I disagree with here on certain points but I'll always doff the cap to a point that was considered and though out regardless of how 'out there' it may be. It is quite sad that there are a few warriors on the soccer board who think they can just shout down points ad hoc whilst providing no alternative.

Every random opinion is not entitled to a complete logical dissection and retort via thesis.

Alex Ferguson is a terrible manager by the way, and Rooney is a mid-table player at best.

Orando Broom

keane2097 wrote: »

Orando Broom wrote: »

Yep. Also there should be an automatic two week ban on the soccer forum for decrying one person's OPINION without backing up your counter opinion.

It is easy for me or anyone to troll around saying this point is 'bollocks' or 'retarded' and not provide a counter point. The fact remains that the people who do this are themselves, in fact, the 'retards'.

There is loads of stuff I disagree with here on certain points but I'll always doff the cap to a point that was considered and though out regardless of how 'out there' it may be. It is quite sad that there are a few warriors on the soccer board who think they can just shout down points ad hoc whilst providing no alternative.

Every random opinion is not entitled to a complete logical dissection and retort via thesis.

Alex Ferguson is a terrible manager by the way, and Rooney is a mid-table player at best.

Epic fail. You never cited reasons to either. Jaysus. Re-read my post. You are doing exactly what I said was wrong with the forum. No thought or consideration in your post, you just mashed the keyboard to react.

Thanks for proving my point.

keane2097

Orando Broom wrote: »

Epic fail. You never cited reasons to either. Jaysus. Re-read my post. You are doing exactly what I said was wrong with the forum. No thought or consideration in your post, you just mashed the keyboard to react.

Thanks for proving my point.

lol @ you dismissing my opinions out of hand.

counterlock

keane2097 wrote: »

Every random opinion is not entitled to a complete logical dissection and retort via thesis.

Nor are you entitled to deride peoples opinions and dismiss it as someone who doesn't know sh1t about soccer.

The general consensus up to the beginning of last year was that he was finished, they were listening to offers and booed him off the field. He was great last year but if you want to judge someone on one good year, go ahead, it only adds weight to your previous insults.

Now, I'm done talking about other clubs on the United thread

keane2097

counterlock wrote: »

Nor are you entitled to deride peoples opinions and dismiss it as someone who doesn't know sh1t about soccer.

The general consensus up to the beginning of last year was that he was finished, they were listening to offers and booed him off the field. He was great last year but if you want to judge someone on one good year, go ahead, it only adds weight to your previous insults.

Now, I'm done talking about other clubs on the United thread

Good luck on your voyage of discovery in the world of soccer.

stesaurus

counterlock wrote: »

I'm not deluded thankfully .

He had a good second half of the year last season, prior that he has been average. Him missing this year has been exagerrated by Gerrards injuries. Give me Scott Parker any day of the week.

At least we can agree on Henderson and Downing

Just because Scottie Parker is a 'wears his heart on his sleeve' type footballer that the English media love and he gets a few highlights on Match of the Day does not mean he's a top level footballer. Lucas is a far better player.

Lucas is vital for Liverpool, particularly against the big teams. He's a really good player and anyone that can't see that doesn't actually watch football.
Just look at Liverpool before and after his injury.
Before, beat Arsenal away, Everton away, Chelsea away, Drew Utd and City at home.
After, lost City away, Utd away, Arsenal home

Chucky the tree

s.welstead wrote: »

Just because Scottie Parker is a 'wears his heart on his sleeve' type footballer that the English media love and he gets a few highlights on Match of the Day does not mean he's a top level footballer. Lucas is a far better player.

Lucas is vital for Liverpool, particularly against the big teams. He's a really good player and anyone that can't see that doesn't actually watch football.
Just look at Liverpool before and after his injury.
Before, beat Arsenal away, Everton away, Chelsea away, Drew Utd and City at home.
After, lost City away, Utd away, Arsenal home

Just to expand on this. We earned 1.83 points per game this season with Lucas, since he's been out it's been 1.25.

Will I Amnt

s.welstead wrote: »

Before, beat Arsenal away, Everton away, Chelsea away, Drew Utd and City at home.
After, lost City away, Utd away, Arsenal home

While I agree he's an excellent player,that's not the way to show it.
Losing to City and United away would be expected even with him in the team in all fairness.
Arsenal at home wouldn't exactly be beyond the realms of possibility either.

Paul Tergat

United thread??

stesaurus

cambo2008 wrote: »

While I agree he's an excellent player,that's not the way to show it.
Losing to City and United away would be expected even with him in the team in all fairness.
Arsenal at home wouldn't exactly be beyond the realms of possibility either.

I agree, but he made a difference in those games. It's very difficult to show someone is an excellent footballer, you either see it or you don't, so I thought highlighting something like that would help.
I really feel he would have pushed Liverpool higher up the table but for his injury.

Paul Tergat wrote: »

United thread??

Yeah we're signing Lucas

bullvine

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Just to expand on this. We earned 1.83 points per game this season with Lucas, since he's been out it's been 1.25.

Stats.... should not be allowed in discussions, wasnt there one about Gerrard last week, not having been on the winning team for Liverpool this season prior to Everton match of course.

Chucky the tree

bullvine wrote: »

Stats.... should not be allowed in discussions, wasnt there one about Gerrard last week, not having been on the winning team for Liverpool this season prior to Everton match of course.

Yea stats, useless things alright. As for the Gerrard one, I take it you mean in the 5 games he's started in the league Liverpool hadn't won them? Not sure what relevance that has either.

keane2097

bullvine wrote: »

Stats.... should not be allowed in discussions

Christ almighty, give me cold hard stats any day of the week over some fool's "considered opinion".

Al Capwned

keane2097 wrote: »

Christ almighty, give me cold hard stats any day of the week over some fool's "considered opinion".

Do you not realise that 66.354759376% of all statistics are made up on the spot?

:cool:

bullvine

Chucky the tree wrote: »

Yea stats, useless things alright. As for the Gerrard one, I take it you mean in the 5 games he's started in the league Liverpool hadn't won them? Not sure what relevance that has either.

Cause your trying to prove how good a player he is by quoting stats, look at Gerrards influence this season yet you'd still have him in the team even though his stats this year prove hes been bad for results. Stats don't lie..

Weren't Downing, Adam and Henderson all meant to be bought last summer based on their stats from the previous season..

keane2097

Somewhere out there Billy Beane just lol'd and took it to the bank.

Chucky the tree

bullvine wrote: »

Cause your trying to prove how good a player he is by quoting stats, look at Gerrards influence this season yet you'd still have him in the team even though his stats this year prove hes been bad for results. Stats don't lie..

Weren't Downing, Adam and Henderson all meant to be bought last summer based on their stats from the previous season..

I was trying to prove how important Lucas is to Liverpool by using stats. Well actually I wouldn't have Gerrard in the team as a central midfielder. He's pretty poor as a central midfielder, something which the stats help confirm. Those players were bought based on stats with other teams which isn't very useful. Again if you look at their stats this season I'm sure you'll agree that none of those players have been very good, again hurrah for stats being accurate.

Vertigo100

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VLuMT5m8CP8&sns=em

Poznan support at an under 8 game!

Ordinary man

Lucas is a good player who will surely be remembered after he retires as one of the finest midfielders never to win a premiership title;)

Orando Broom

If Berbatov is sold in the summer who would you see as a possible replacement? I'd imagine Owen will be ran too, if he doesn't retire. You'd have Macheda and Joshua King on loan and then Will Keane in the reserves. Would United need to sign a striker or would they promote from within?

bullvine

Orando Broom wrote: »

If Berbatov is sold in the summer who would you see as a possible replacement? I'd imagine Owen will be ran too, if he doesn't retire. You'd have Macheda and Joshua King on loan and then Will Keane in the reserves. Would United need to sign a striker or would they promote from within?

Demba Ba?

MisterAnarchy

J. Marston wrote: »

Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah...

Woah...

Woah...

League is far from over.

Funny that,I recall so many people on here saying that it was over back in November.Man City were going to walk it,according to so many.:)
Did you not sense the irony in my post ?

Seriously though ,Utd will win the league, they have the experience and the easier run in .
City's goals have dried up ,they have a brutal run in and they will bottle it as I have been saying all season long.

Pro. F

bullvine wrote: »

Cause your trying to prove how good a player he is by quoting stats, look at Gerrards influence this season yet you'd still have him in the team even though his stats this year prove hes been bad for results. Stats don't lie..

The ''stat'' on Gerrard is based on five games. That is why it's invalid.

All the talk about statistics in football, the vast majority of the time, ignores the truth of what statistics actually are. Pulling a few numbers together and comparing them is not statistics!

keane2097 wrote: »

Somewhere out there Billy Beane just lol'd and took it to the bank.

Billy Beane doesn't know shìt in football. There still hasn't been any sort of reliable use of stats as predictors of player quality in football.

Liam O

That and they weren't Billy Beane's stats in the first place, he just gets the credit for it

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

If Berbatov is sold in the summer who would you see as a possible replacement? I'd imagine Owen will be ran too, if he doesn't retire. You'd have Macheda and Joshua King on loan and then Will Keane in the reserves. Would United need to sign a striker or would they promote from within?

If (when) Berbatov is sold in the summer, I don't think we will sign a striker to replace him.

Much like I thought he would be sold last year if Sneijder was signed, I think we will look to replace him with a creative midfielder - with Gaitan and Hazaard the two main ones linked, Eriksen another. I think we will sign someone to play as the creative link man between midfield and attack, where Rooney currently plays as apart from Rooney we don't seem to have an option for there (that SAF is happy to use) It would, in part, be a security against a Rooney injury and secondly allow us to play Rooney as the leading player in big games or simply provide him with more support in games where we don't need two 'holding' midfielders. I think a player like Gaitan or Hazard - one who can play on the wing or in the hole would be an ideal signing for the team in this respect, as it gives us a few options.

Basically, i think we will replace Berbatov with a player like David Silva (oh how we missed out there - so annoying)

Nalz

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

City's goals have dried up ,they have a brutal run in and they will bottle it as I have been saying all season long.

Silva, Nasri and Aguero need to pull the finger out when away from home. If they don't I can see United win the league by 7+ points.

Orando Broom

Mitch Connor wrote: »

If (when) Berbatov is sold in the summer, I don't think we will sign a striker to replace him.

Much like I thought he would be sold last year if Sneijder was signed, I think we will look to replace him with a creative midfielder - with Gaitan and Hazaard the two main ones linked, Eriksen another. I think we will sign someone to play as the creative link man between midfield and attack, where Rooney currently plays as apart from Rooney we don't seem to have an option for there (that SAF is happy to use) It would, in part, be a security against a Rooney injury and secondly allow us to play Rooney as the leading player in big games or simply provide him with more support in games where we don't need two 'holding' midfielders. I think a player like Gaitan or Hazard - one who can play on the wing or in the hole would be an ideal signing for the team in this respect, as it gives us a few options.

Basically, i think we will replace Berbatov with a player like David Silva (oh how we missed out there - so annoying)

Good read on the situation. I'd be inclined towards agreeing with you. I'd also like to see an all round midfielder come in too. I think you'd see an extremely strong United team.

counterlock

bullvine wrote: »

Demba Ba?

I don't think anyone is going to risk a big money move for Demba Ba if his knee is as bad as they make out. He was on pay as you play basis with west ham AFAIK. He is more valuable to Newcastle than the transfer fee clubs would be willing to pay.

bullvine

counterlock wrote: »

I don't think anyone is going to risk a big money move for Demba Ba if his knee is as bad as they make out. He was on pay as you play basis with west ham AFAIK. He is more valuable to Newcastle than the transfer fee clubs would be willing to pay.

Of course but if the rumours be true that hes available for very little, it could happen, I think United need a physical presence up top to compliment the pace and guile they already have.

Shane St.

Think we'll go down fighting tonight. Can see us winning it 2-1 or something. I just don't trust our defence at the moment to keep a clean sheet. Should be a good game anyway.

Orando Broom

bullvine wrote: »

Of course but if the rumours be true that hes available for very little, it could happen, I think United need a physical presence up top to compliment the pace and guile they already have.

Llorente would be the optimum forward for me. Technical, strong, two footed. Imagine him and Valencia!

I would say he'd cost less than Ba.

Paul Tergat

Orando Broom wrote: »

Llorente would be the optimum forward for me. Technical, strong, two footed. Imagine him and Valencia!

I would say he'd cost less than Ba.

Not a chance!

Mikeyt086

Orando Broom wrote: »

Llorente would be the optimum forward for me. Technical, strong, two footed. Imagine him and Valencia!

I would say he'd cost less than Ba.

The you would be spectacularly wrong.

Fernando Llorente didnt just pop up out of nowhere, he has been banging goals in La Liga for nearly 5 years now, in the Spain squads, and generally seen around Europe as a top young player. The only reason he hasnt moved to a bigger club is his fierce loyalty to Bilbao. Didnt Tottenham try to buy him last summer and they were told he would cost €40m?

Demba Ba on the other hand apparently has a £7m buy out clause. Even if he doesnt I dont think any club would pay more than £12m for a player who Stoke's medical team, who said it's ok to buy JOHNATHAN WOODGATE!!! said it was too risky to take him on a free.

counterlock

Exactly and Madrid were chasing him hard last year but he simply doesn't want to leave Bilbao. Have to admire that kind of dedication and its likely to see him as the leading striker for Spain in the Euros.

Bullvine is right though, a big guy with the technique of Ba would be a fantastic addition.

sReq | uTeK

Orando Broom wrote: »

Llorente would be the optimum forward for me. Technical, strong, two footed. Imagine him and Valencia!

I would say he'd cost less than Ba.

Nope, not a hope in hell, he's always linked with bigger teams just had a rediculous loyalty to Athletico.

I think you'd be looking at 14million or so to get him.

Orando Broom

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

The you would be spectacularly wrong.

Fernando Llorente didnt just pop up out of nowhere, he has been banging goals in La Liga for nearly 5 years now, in the Spain squads, and generally seen around Europe as a top young player. The only reason he hasnt moved to a bigger club is his fierce loyalty to Bilbao. Didnt Tottenham try to buy him last summer and they were told he would cost €40m?

Demba Ba on the other hand apparently has a £7m buy out clause. Even if he doesnt I dont think any club would pay more than £12m for a player who Stoke's medical team, who said it's ok to buy JOHNATHAN WOODGATE!!! said it was too risky to take him on a free.

Those spanish buy-out clausesd are pure red herrings. David Silva's was something like €60m. He didn't cost near that. demba Ba, if he is touted will spark a bidding war and his price will be closer to £25m. I would wager Llorente, if he chose to leave Bilbao would move aborad rather than move to Madrid, above all clubs!! In that eventy he would be available for £20m or there abouts.

MisterAnarchy

counterlock wrote: »

Exactly and Madrid were chasing him hard last year but he simply doesn't want to leave Bilbao. Have to admire that kind of dedication and its likely to see him as the leading striker for Spain in the Euros.

Llorente is pure quality.
Speaking of loyalties Bilbao were playing Osasuna (from Pamplona) last weekend in La Liga.
Llorente scored for Bilbao against his home town,he was born in Pamplona.

bullvine

counterlock wrote: »

Exactly and Madrid were chasing him hard last year but he simply doesn't want to leave Bilbao. Have to admire that kind of dedication and its likely to see him as the leading striker for Spain in the Euros.

Bullvine is right though, a big guy with the technique of Ba would be a fantastic addition.

Just someone to mix it up a little, havent really had it since Saha left, to hold up the ball, especially if United play 5 in the middle.

adox

If Berba does go in the summer(which seems likely given Fergies recent comments) I`m praying if we do replace his place in the squad with another body, its with a midfielder, not a striker.

Even losing a striker, our midfield is still much more in need of strengthening than our strike force.

I still remain skeptical that we will sign a midfielder though.

SlickRic

just looking again at the amount of injuries at CB this season for you guys...

Evans should win your POTY, simply on the fact that he has managed to stay fit and be a mainstay in that defence for so long.

that, and he's playing well of course

The_Kew_Tour

I cant remember where read it think was one the Sunday newspapers, but I read somewhere that Everton have greater net spend over past 5 years then United.

If it's true then it rings alarm bells as to how basically Fergie cant spend a bob.

Mars Bar

I'm still finding it odd that De Gea likes metal music.

RT @samarchitects: rio I've heard that De Gea is into his metal!Can you confirm this Rio? » The guy is a MASSIVE metal head, decent tunes !

I actually think Rio likes anything with a sound in it. Is there music he doesn't like?!

Professey Chin

Mars Bar wrote: »

I'm still finding it odd that De Gea likes metal music.

I actually think Rio likes anything with a sound in it. Is there music he doesn't like?!

Give him a few years and he'll be in goal with a ponytail and a massive viking beard. No striker in the country will fcuk with him :pac:

shadowcomplex

Any streams for this , theres none on flashsport

counterlock

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I cant remember where read it think was one the Sunday newspapers, but I read somewhere that Everton have greater net spend over past 5 years then United.

If it's true then it rings alarm bells as to how basically Fergie cant spend a bob.

I read that in the star yesterday, I imagine the 80 million for ronaldo has a lot to do with it!

lordgoat

Mars Bar wrote: »

I actually think Rio likes anything with a sound in it. Is there music he doesn't like?!

The Eagles. Cos they're sh ite!

shadowcomplex wrote: »

Any streams for this , theres none on flashsport

nope, there are none, and you're not allowed ask for them either.

The_Kew_Tour

counterlock wrote: »

I read that in the star yesterday, I imagine the 80 million for ronaldo has a lot to do with it!

Star could been where seen it too. It's been such long couple days in work it seems like read it longer then yesterday:pac:

Mars Bar

lordgoat wrote: »

Mars Bar wrote: »

I actually think Rio likes anything with a sound in it. Is there music he doesn't like?!

The Eagles. Cos they're sh ite!

shadowcomplex wrote: »

Any streams for this , theres none on flashsport

nope, there are none, and you're not allowed ask for them either.

Eagles are decent!

It's on the 3e website so it's fine I think