Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

Orando Broom

lordgoat wrote: »

I think he'll grow up eventually and will play at the top level and for England too. He's the best youth player i've seen play.

There is absolutely no foundation for making that statement. You might as well have said you think he'll be Prime Minister. The only place he'll succeed is at Manchester United under the tutelage of Alex Ferguson.

Whether he is the best young player or not is irrelevant, talent I'd not his problem. Application of that talent is. I can guarantee you there are 100's of players as good if not better than Morrison all playing in pub teams if at all because they never applied themselves.

homerjay2005

Blatter wrote: »

If Nani is out for an extended period, Young will be ahead of Park in the pecking order as the replacement.

i would like to think so, but fergie does all sorts of horribly twisted things lately and park is involved in alot of them..

kryogen

If its true that Morrison is leaving for a fee of 4million that is excellent business at this time tbh. If we could put a buy back clause in all the better but 4 million for a guy who has done nothing yet is not something to be scoffed at.

shadowcomplex

Who from Rooney, Nani and Carrick are definetly out on saturday

Johner

kryogen wrote: »

If its true that Morrison is leaving for a fee of 4million that is excellent business at this time tbh. If we could put a buy back clause in all the better but 4 million for a guy who has done nothing yet is not something to be scoffed at.

4 million is nothing really though is it?Players like him don't come around too often. From what I've seen of Morrison he is a special player. He pretty much destroyed us in the youth cup last year. Obviously he has had a lot of problems but why not loan him instead and see what happens?

kmart6

Johner wrote: »

4 million is nothing really though is it?Players like him don't come around too often. From what I've seen of Morrison he is a special player. He pretty much destroyed us in the youth cup last year. Obviously he has had a lot of problems but why not loan him instead and see what happens?

£4million for a player who destroyed you in the Youth Cup...surely you can see the problem with that!?

kryogen

Johner wrote: »

4 million is nothing really though is it? From what I've seen of Morrison he is a special player. He pretty much destroyed us in the youth cup last year. Obviously he has had a lot of problems but why not loan him instead and see what happens?

4 million is huge for unproven potential actually!

Especially with the baggage he comes with, I want him to stay, I want him to knuckle down, to cop the **** on and realise what a golden opportunity he has right in front of him.

He has the potential to be one hell of a player, but all he is right now is unproven potential.

How much would you expect to pay for an 18 year old with a couple of first team appearances who has well documented issues, both on and off the field?

kryogen

shadowcomplex wrote: »

Who from Rooney, Nani and Carrick are definetly out on saturday

I hope all three dont get anywhere near the field.

Wouldnt expect to see Carrick, hamstring injury is not something the club would want to risk.

Nani afaik hasnt deffo been ruled out, but again if he is in any way doubtful dont want him in the squad, same goes for Rooney.

Fact is we actually need to give our squad strikers game time anyway so this one shouldnt even be an issue.

Mikeyt086

I am still kind of hanging on to a tiny shred of hope that this Ravel Morrison situation is blown out of proportion and he was stay with us??

I dont know why though, if I had never saw him play I would be like "Who the fu'ck is this joker?" but I have seen him, and...

Johner

kmart6 wrote: »

£4million for a player who destroyed you in the Youth Cup...surely you can see the problem with that!?

kryogen wrote: »

4 million is huge for unproven potential actually!

Especially with the baggage he comes with, I want him to stay, I want him to knuckle down, to cop the **** on and realise what a golden opportunity he has right in front of him.

He has the potential to be one hell of a player, but all he is right now is unproven potential.

How much would you expect to pay for an 18 year old with a couple of first team appearances who has well documented issues, both on and off the field?

The 4 million is big now but as you say the potential he has is huge, he has all the talent in the world. Obviously he needs to cop on and soon but what harm is a loan spell first? If he acts the cunt on loan then get rid of him. I'm sure even after a loan spell somebody would be willing to take a risk on him.

kryogen

Johner wrote: »

The 4 million is big now but as you say the potential he has is huge, he has all the talent in the world. Obviously he needs to cop on and soon but what harm is a loan spell first?

Im sure a loan has been considered and if the club havent decided it is the best course of action with him i can accept that. there are various reasons for why a loan would be a bad idea potentially which i doubt i need to go into.

He has all the talent in the world yes, but he has not shown anything to suggest he will make it to the level we would hope and again I say, 4million for a player in his position is huge money! the deal is great right now, the future cant be predicted but I doubt Newcastle and the staff there (no disrespect to them) will be able to guide this lads career better then Man United and the staff there.

He was going to be given first team chances this year (according to Fergie) and he hasnt because of his poor training record and behaviour (by reports)

If Fergie is willing to give up on him I am afraid he is actually a lost cause.

Again, i do hope this situation is being blown out of proportion due to the slow January transfer window and its nice to take a break from the demise and crisis that the club are in every day or Wayne Rooney being upset about not getting the correct amount of parmesan cheese on his pasta and wanting to leave the club as a result.

Judging by how the club are behaving during this we wont know until he is gone or until he signs a contract

Johner

kryogen wrote: »

Im sure a loan has been considered and if the club havent decided it is the best course of action with him i can accept that. there are various reasons for why a loan would be a bad idea potentially which i doubt i need to go into.

A loan could turn out to be bad but it also might work, being away from his friends would be a good thing, obviously he could just move his friends to where he was but maybe a loan would work. Would it not be a better option then selling without trying the loan?

kryogen wrote: »

He has all the talent in the world yes, but he has not shown anything to suggest he will make it to the level we would hope and again I say, 4million for a player in his position is huge money! the deal is great right now, the future cant be predicted but I doubt Newcastle and the staff there (no disrespect to them) will be able to guide this lads career better then Man United and the staff there.

I think the fact he is still at United shows how highly he is rated and they obviously think he has shown enough to suggest he could go on to be a first team regular for United. Fair enough the 4 million is big now, I just meant in the grand scheme of things would it really be that much to United when you have a player that talented. I suppose with his attitude/problems it could be. He really does need to cop the fuck on though and fast!

kryogen wrote: »

He was going to be given first team chances this year (according to Fergie) and he hasnt because of his poor training record and behaviour (by reports)

If Fergie is willing to give up on him I am afraid he is actually a lost cause

Oh well if that is true then fair enough I didn't hear anything about that, in what way was he reported to be a bad trainer? No effort?

kryogen wrote: »

Again, i do hope this situation is being blown out of proportion due to the slow January transfer window and its nice to take a break from the demise and crisis that the club are in every day or Wayne Rooney being upset about not getting the correct amount of parmesan cheese on his pasta and wanting to leave the club as a result.

Judging by how the club are behaving during this we wont know until he is gone or until he signs a contract

It would be an incredible waste of talent if this lad doesn't make it. I've only seen him about 5 or 6 times, but only needed to see him once to see how good he is and how good he could be.

kryogen

He is apparently late quite often to training and doesnt train well when he is there anway.

Im too tired to go looking for links to give you examples, will do tomorrow if necessary ok. He was also apparently set a task that if he completed, which depended on him turning up to training on time consistently and some other things, he would have been brought through to the first team and given his opportunity.

He failed to do so.

Night peeps!

MagicMarker

Orando Broom wrote: »

The only place he'll succeed is at Manchester United under the tutelage of Alex Ferguson.

You're talking bollocks in fairness.

Mitch Connor

MagicMarker wrote: »

You're talking bollocks in fairness.

I love the way they say just before that: "There is absolutely no foundation for making that statement", and then follow it up with that psychic look into the future and determination of the players path in life.

Just brilliant.

VW 1

MagicMarker wrote: »

Orando Broom wrote: »

The only place he'll succeed is at Manchester United under the tutelage of Alex Ferguson.

You're talking bollocks in fairness.

Love how he says someone is speculating and their opiniOn basically doesn't count then he comes out with that cloptrop

Blatter

Mitch Connor wrote: »

and Young will be back..... when?

Fook it, give Morrison a go! (i actually wish we would, and try to keep him - although I am aware that he seems to have absolutely no future at United)

kryogen wrote: »

When is Young due back though?

Also, he will probably take a few games to get back into gear, which we dont have unfortunately, literally every game is huge!

He's back running since last week according to Fergie, so he should be back very soon.

I don't think he'll need that many games to get going, he isn't that long out. It seems like he's been out for months because of the amount of games he has missed over Christmas but he's only out since the 0-5 win over Fulham, around 4 weeks ago.

DOC09UNAM

VW 1 wrote: »

MagicMarker wrote: »

Orando Broom wrote: »

The only place he'll succeed is at Manchester United under the tutelage of Alex Ferguson.

You're talking bollocks in fairness.

Love how he says someone is speculating and their opiniOn basically doesn't count then he comes out with that cloptrop

Great use of the word cloptrop.

Orando Broom

MagicMarker wrote: »

You're talking bollocks in fairness.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I love the way they say just before that: "There is absolutely no foundation for making that statement", and then follow it up with that psychic look into the future and determination of the players path in life.

Just brilliant.

VW 1 wrote: »

Love how he says someone is speculating and their opiniOn basically doesn't count then he comes out with that cloptrop

Big men with big talk here. So If I disagree with one I disagree with all.

So just to get things straight I can't say anything to Lordgoat, who was also talking bollocks, for the record without his heyena's jumping in.

Is he your de facto leader or did you elect him at one of your little meet-ups?

The tacit bully-boy tactics are remarkable here. How the mods let you away with it is truly a wonder.

I'm happy to play the wait and see game. I am right about Morrison. No one would have got him as far as he has come bar Manchester United. Whether you guys think that is bollocks or otherwise Ferguson has a track record of dealing with problematic players and getting the very best out of them, whether you choose to believe that or not. Ferguson also has never tolerated a bad attitude. Remember Morrison is not the first superstar that Ferguson showed the door to.

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

Big men with big talk here. So If I disagree with one I disagree with all.

So just to get things straight I can't say anything to Lordgoat, who was also talking bollocks, for the record without his heyena's jumping in.

Is he your de facto leader or did you elect him at one of your little meet-ups?

The tacit bully-boy tactics are remarkable here. How the mods let you away with it is truly a wonder.

I'm happy to play the wait and see game. I am right about Morrison. No one would have got him as far as he has come bar Manchester United. Whether you guys think that is bollocks or otherwise Ferguson has a track record of dealing with problematic players and getting the very best out of them, whether you choose to believe that or not. Ferguson also has never tolerated a bad attitude. Remember Morrison is not the first superstar that Ferguson showed the door to.

STFU, to be fair.

You had a go at him for having no foundation what-so-ever, for giving his own opinion, then you state, AS FACT, the only place Morrison would succeed is at United under Ferguson.

Your two comments are so freaking hypocritical when put together it is funny. Get over your little persecution complex, grow up, and think about what you are saying.

VW 1

Orando Broom wrote: »

So just to get things straight I can't say anything to Lordgoat, who was also talking bollocks, for the record without his heyena's jumping in.

The issue was that LG made a statement based on his opinion. Which you dismissed as there was no basis in fact.

You then went on to make an assertion based on your opinion, which had no more basis in fact than Lordgoat's original statement.

I would imagine this is where others had a problem, as did I.

Orando Broom wrote: »

How the mods let you away with it is truly a wonder.

Touché my good man, how you are still around amuses me. At least the muppet did it in a humorous way.

VW 1

Mitch the timing and content of our posts are alarmingly similar this morning.

Nalz

Orando Broom wrote: »

I'm happy to play the wait and see game. I am right about Morrison. No one would have got him as far as he has come bar Manchester United.

Do you honestly believe that no one else would be capable?

bullvine

Orando Broom wrote: »

Big men with big talk here. So If I disagree with one I disagree with all.

So just to get things straight I can't say anything to Lordgoat, who was also talking bollocks, for the record without his heyena's jumping in.

Is he your de facto leader or did you elect him at one of your little meet-ups?

The tacit bully-boy tactics are remarkable here. How the mods let you away with it is truly a wonder.

I'm happy to play the wait and see game. I am right about Morrison. No one would have got him as far as he has come bar Manchester United. Whether you guys think that is bollocks or otherwise Ferguson has a track record of dealing with problematic players and getting the very best out of them, whether you choose to believe that or not. Ferguson also has never tolerated a bad attitude. Remember Morrison is not the first superstar that Ferguson showed the door to.

I have to agree, I find some of you are being a bit of a bully to him, hes entitled to his opinion, no need to say its absolute bollocks. I enjoy coming here mainly to read your updates and I occasionally post but seriously, I think some of you need to chillout a little here.

Mitch Connor

bullvine wrote: »

I have to agree, I find some of you are being a bit of a bully to him, hes entitled to his opinion, no need to say its absolute bollocks. I enjoy coming here mainly to read your updates and I occasionally post but seriously, I think some of you need to chillout a little here.

:rolleyes:

He is entitled to his opinion.

Do you not find it the least beat amusing and/or hypocritical when he slams someone else for their opinion, states his opinion AS FACT, then moans when people call him on it?

Really?

You don't see that, no?

Orando Broom

VW 1 wrote: »

The issue was that LG made a statement based on his opinion. Which you dismissed as there was no basis in fact.

You then went on to make an assertion based on your opinion, which had no more basis in fact than Lordgoat's original statement.

I would imagine this is where others had a problem, as did I.



Touché my good man, how you are still around amuses me. At least the muppet did it in a humorous way.

"The most virulent defence of Lordgoat gets to touch his leg at the next meet up."

You have a healty lead VW1, but I caution you, Magic Marker will not give up his spot at LG's (I take it that's your pet name for Him) feet.

Just to clarify, you had no problem with Lord Goat's bollocks but just a problem with mine despite the fact that my statement actually was not plucked out of thin air and has a basis in history. Cantona, Keane both troubled players Ferguson got the very best out of.

Lordgoat claims Morrison will be this great player away from United. I say büll****. Ill informed unremitting büll****. The fact that you and the rest of the comely maidens leap to his defence says it all really. If Ferguson has decided the boy is beyond salvaging then he is beyond salvaging. This is the manager who got rid of Paul McGrath and Norman whiteside because they were beyond salvaging. Are you going to tell me that either of those players went to bigger and better after leaving United?

Paul McGrath is a folk hero to many and was a wonderful servant to Ireland but if that chap actually fulfilled his potential it would not be with Aston Villa he'd have played out his career, it would have been with some of Serie A giants. Instead Ferguson knew he was dealing with a lost cause and cut him adrift. He was vindicated. He will be vindicated with Morrison too, I have no dobut. If there was a shred of hope for Morrison Ferguson would not in a million years let him go.

But don't allow football talk get in the way of a protecting His virtues. You'd better email the others and tell them to come quick!

bullvine

Mitch Connor wrote: »

:rolleyes:

He is entitled to his opinion.

Do you not find it the least beat amusing and/or hypocritical when he slams someone else for their opinion, states his opinion AS FACT, then moans when people call him on it?

Really?

You don't see that, no?

I might have missed that part.. Its just that I like reading this thread, especially the stuff that you and homer, etc post about. I'd rather just not see a petty argument

Orando Broom

bullvine wrote: »

I have to agree, I find some of you are being a bit of a bully to him, hes entitled to his opinion, no need to say its absolute bollocks. I enjoy coming here mainly to read your updates and I occasionally post but seriously, I think some of you need to chillout a little here.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

:rolleyes:

He is entitled to his opinion.

Do you not find it the least beat amusing and/or hypocritical when he slams someone else for their opinion, states his opinion AS FACT, then moans when people call him on it?

Really?

You don't see that, no?

Woah Bullvine, careful I talked back to Him. His acolytes can not stand for my impudence.

I stated the first post as FACT, now did I? No more or less 'factual' than Lordgoats guff (see what I did there). I no you can't pull Him up on his faux pas as that would be tantamount to blasphemy so I'll let it slide.

Orando Broom

Trilla wrote: »

Do you honestly believe that no one else would be capable?

Yes. I don't think any of the continental managers could get thier head around the fact that a kid like Morrison is so disinterested in playing at the highest level. I don't think Morrison would have lasted a week at La Masia for instance.

Ferguson comes from left wing stock, he takes pride in his understanding of the social malaise that so many young footballers emerge from. Ferdinand, the two Browns and countless others have emerged from backgrounds similar to Morrison, yet these guys are ultra professional.

Ferguson is one of the few managers who openly talks about society and the value of work and how the two correlate to one another, so yes in summation I believe Ferguson is the only manager in top level football who could manage Morrison to the standards people expect him to attain.

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

"The most virulent defence of Lordgoat gets to touch his leg at the next meet up."

You have a healty lead VW1, but I caution you, Magic Marker will not give up his spot at LG's (I take it that's your pet name for Him) feet.

Just to clarify, you had no problem with Lord Goat's bollocks but just a problem with mine despite the fact that my statement actually was not plucked out of thin air and has a basis in history. Cantona, Keane both troubled players Ferguson got the very best out of.

Lordgoat claims Morrison will be this great player away from United. I say büll****. Ill informed unremitting büll****. The fact that you and the rest of the comely maidens leap to his defence says it all really. If Ferguson has decided the boy is beyond salvaging then he is beyond salvaging. This is the manager who got rid of Paul McGrath and Norman whiteside because they were beyond salvaging. Are you going to tell me that either of those players went to bigger and better after leaving United?

Paul McGrath is a folk hero to many and was a wonderful servant to Ireland but if that chap actually fulfilled his potential it would not be with Aston Villa he'd have played out his career, it would have been with some of Serie A giants. Instead Ferguson knew he was dealing with a lost cause and cut him adrift. He was vindicated. He will be vindicated with Morrison too, I have no dobut. If there was a shred of hope for Morrison Ferguson would not in a million years let him go.

But don't allow football talk get in the way of a protecting His virtues. You'd better email the others and tell them to come quick!

What LG actually said was this:

"I think he'll grow up eventually and will play at the top level and for England too. He's the best youth player i've seen play"

He THINKS he will grow up and play at the top level and for England. Paul McGrath, as you point to, played top level football for YEARS after United let him go. Roy Keane.... a problem player? Are you for real? A headcase on the pitch but a freaking professional perfectionist off it. Often described as 'Fergson on the pitch' - do you think Fergie turned him into that? Keane had to be calmed down on the pitch, but a problem player off it? Un-freaking-believable.

He thinks Morrison is the best youth player he has seen play....

Whats the issue there? Morrison would be the best youth player I have seen too - never watched Barca academy to see Messi as a youth player. My knowledge of youth football is Man United and the teams they play. LG is probably similar in that respect.

Really, honestly, I don't see what LG said as being worthy of the post you responded with. You may not agree with what he presented as his opinion.

You then state, AS FACT, the only place Morrison could do well is at United, and more specifically under Ferguson. I do admire Fergie, as many others do, but he isn't freaking perfect and to say there is simply no way Morrison could ever become a good player, playing in the PL and for England, if he leaves Man United is absolute bollox. Getting away from Manchester and possibly away from his mates could actually be one of the things that could save his career.

You bitch about someone else's opinion, counter it with your own stated AS FACT, and then moan some more when people point out the hypocracy of your actions.

I wasn't even aware it was LG who made the first comment, I couldn't care less that it was. It has nothing to do with your laughable behavior and persecution complex.

MagicMarker

Orlando, someone else stated their opinion and you critizised them for having ''no foundation'', you then went on to express an absurt opinion as fact. Now you can cry about it and accuse everyone of being against you, but in reality you're simply talking bollocks.

VW 1

I'll end my piece in this with the following,

My point to you Orando was that you can't call Lorgoat's opinion bóllocks and then portray your own opinion as fact.

It was the manner in which you did this I have a problem.

Getting as petty as you did is not needed, attack the post and not the posters.

Orando Broom

Mitch Connor wrote: »

What LG actually said was this:

"I think he'll grow up eventually and will play at the top level and for England too. He's the best youth player i've seen play"

He THINKS he will grow up and play at the top level and for England. Paul McGrath, as you point to, played top level football for YEARS after United let him go. Roy Keane.... a problem player? Are you for real? A headcase on the pitch but a freaking professional perfectionist off it. Often described as 'Fergson on the pitch' - do you think Fergie turned him into that? Keane had to be calmed down on the pitch, but a problem player off it? Un-freaking-believable.

He thinks Morrison is the best youth player he has seen play....

Whats the issue there? Morrison would be the best youth player I have seen too - never watched Barca academy to see Messi as a youth player. My knowledge of youth football is Man United and the teams they play. LG is probably similar in that respect.

Really, honestly, I don't see what LG said as being worthy of the post you responded with. You may not agree with what he presented as his opinion.

You then state, AS FACT, the only place Morrison could do well is at United, and more specifically under Ferguson. I do admire Fergie, as many others do, but he isn't freaking perfect and to say there is simply no way Morrison could ever become a good player, playing in the PL and for England, if he leaves Man United is absolute bollox. Getting away from Manchester and possibly away from his mates could actually be one of the things that could save his career.

You bitch about someone else's opinion, counter it with your own stated AS FACT, and then moan some more when people point out the hypocracy of your actions.

I wasn't even aware it was LG who made the first comment, I couldn't care less that it was. It has nothing to do with your laughable behavior and persecution complex.

Roy Keane had a drinking problem when he joined United. He was an absolute liability off the field. Ferguson curtailed his bad habits and moulded him into the pro he became.

You are rowing back now by saying 'good player'. If Morrison level was good player he'd hardly be generating the column inches he is. Him being a good player is a failure. McGrath was a good defender. He should have been so very much more. Maybe by irish standards him wining one PFA award might constitute greatness but we've saw (Italy in 1994) glimpses of greatness, baresi, Maldini greatness. There are two levels here, if you think Morrison becoming king **** at Newcastle is greatness then we have a huge disparity in what we consider great.

You and others blame Morrison's mates. It's not them, it's him. No one else. You'd swear that Newcastle was Alpha Centauri the way you talk about it. I'm sure the 'mates' can make the 120 mile journey to Newcastle the odd time.

Your last paragraph shows such a lack of awareness and is so laughably stupid it defies explanation!

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

Woah Bullvine, careful I talked back to Him. His acolytes can not stand for my impudence.

I stated the first post as FACT, now did I? No more or less 'factual' than Lordgoats guff (see what I did there). I no you can't pull Him up on his faux pas as that would be tantamount to blasphemy so I'll let it slide.

Is English your first language? I ask because you seem to have a poor grasp of it when it comes to stating things as fact and as opinion.

What LG said:

lordgoat wrote: »

He doesn't booze or party much by all accounts.
I think he'll grow up eventually and will play at the top level and for England too. He's the best youth player i've seen play. 4

Not the 'I THINK' part. An opinion. No statement of fact. he did not say he will grow up and be great, just that is what he thinks; his opinion.

Now, what you said:

Orando Broom wrote: »

The only place he'll succeed is at Manchester United under the tutelage of Alex Ferguson.

Note - there is no 'I think', no 'i feel' no 'in my opinion'. You statement is presented as a statement of FACT, not opinion.

You blast LG for his opinion and then spend the morning moaning about people calling you on stating your opinion as fact.

You are a hypocrite.

As I have said before, I don't care who said it - didn't even realise it was LG, so LG saying it has nothing to do with my annoyance over your aggresive dismissing of someone else's opinion.

Most of what you have said makes sense, now that you have explained and expanded upon your OPINION, though I disagree that Ravel wouldn't have even made it this far somewhere else. You point to Brown and Rio as coming from a similar stock as Ravel and being pro's, seemingly championing Fergie for that, but he isn't the reason. Those lads were determined to get away from the gang culture they grew up in and put their all into football as their escape route. Ravel seemingly doesn't have that same desire to get away from the gang culture. He doesn't have the same drive.

Fergie will help and protect the players as they get towards the first team, but as youth players their attitude and application will come from them and their own hunger.

I would say it is more likely Fergie has no clue how to handle a wannabe gangster like Ravel, and that his attitude is completely alien to anything Fergie has encountered before - rather than an attitude Fergie has a history of sorting and turning professional.

Orando Broom

MagicMarker wrote: »

Orlando, someone else stated their opinion and you critizised them for having ''no foundation'', you then went on to express an absurt opinion as fact. Now you can cry about it and accuse everyone of being against you, but in reality you're simply talking bollocks.

VW 1 wrote: »

I'll end my piece in this with the following,

My point to you Orando was that you can't call Lorgoat's opinion bóllocks and then portray your own opinion as fact.

It was the manner in which you did this I have a problem.

Getting as petty as you did is not needed, attack the post and not the posters.

Hahaha! start by taking your own advice, lads!

Magic Marker is back in the lead.

MagicMarker

I said you're talking bollocks, not you are a bollocks. One is attacking what you said, the other is attacking you.

kryogen

In fairness lads, her paranoid ramblings and hysterical style of posting does have potential, i have smiled at a few I read today, may one day turn out to be a top class in the same vein of The Muppet etc...

I have faith anyway.

comely maidens was particularly amusing!

Still no official word from the club I assume? the story is probably not 100% accurate so!

Why is it always Newcastle he is linked with? If they want him enough we should just ask for Cabaye in exchange

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

Roy Keane had a drinking problem when he joined United. He was an absolute liability off the field. Ferguson curtailed his bad habits and moulded him into the pro he became.

You are rowing back now by saying 'good player'. If Morrison level was good player he'd hardly be generating the column inches he is. Him being a good player is a failure. McGrath was a good defender. He should have been so very much more. Maybe by irish standards him wining one PFA award might constitute greatness but we've saw (Italy in 1994) glimpses of greatness, baresi, Maldini greatness. There are two levels here, if you think Morrison becoming king **** at Newcastle is greatness then we have a huge disparity in what we consider great.

You and others blame Morrison's mates. It's not them, it's him. No one else. You'd swear that Newcastle was Alpha Centauri the way you talk about it. I'm sure the 'mates' can make the 120 mile journey to Newcastle the odd time.

Your last paragraph shows such a lack of awareness and is so laughably stupid it defies explanation!

Did LG say he would become world class? No, he said he though he would grow up and go on to play at the top level.

The PL is the top level.

McGrath played top division/PL football for years after Fergie let him go. If Morrison goes on to play in the PL, for newcastle or anyone else, LG will have been proven partially correct. If he gets England caps, he will have been proven fully correct. He doesn't have to win world player of the year, that is not what LG said he thought could happen.

I also honestly don't get what me not paying attention to who is saying something, rather than paying attention to what is being said, is that big an issue for you. Are you making it that personal that it is all about the fact LG said it and not homer, or MM, or bullvine?

bullvine

Whats the injury list looking like for the weekend? I wonder will Carrick play or do we need to wrap him in cotton wool.

Mitch Connor

kryogen wrote: »

Still no official word from the club I assume? the story is probably not 100% accurate so!

Why is it always Newcastle he is linked with? If they want him enough we should just ask for Cabaye in exchange

Newcastle apparently off at a training camp, so him being in newcastle is unlikely. 4million is also very unlikely.

Why would newcastle pay that for him now, rather than sign him for compo in June? If sold now, Morrison would be sold for a very low fee - just cause the buying club really want him now.

Orando Broom

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Is English your first language? I ask because you seem to have a poor grasp of it when it comes to stating things as fact and as opinion.

What LG said:



Not the 'I THINK' part. An opinion. No statement of fact. he did not say he will grow up and be great, just that is what he thinks; his opinion.

Now, what you said:



Note - there is no 'I think', no 'i feel' no 'in my opinion'. You statement is presented as a statement of FACT, not opinion.

You blast LG for his opinion and then spend the morning moaning about people calling you on stating your opinion as fact.

You are a hypocrite.

As I have said before, I don't care who said it - didn't even realise it was LG, so LG saying it has nothing to do with my annoyance over your aggresive dismissing of someone else's opinion.

Most of what you have said makes sense, now that you have explained and expanded upon your OPINION, though I disagree that Ravel wouldn't have even made it this far somewhere else. You point to Brown and Rio as coming from a similar stock as Ravel and being pro's, seemingly championing Fergie for that, but he isn't the reason. Those lads were determined to get away from the gang culture they grew up in and put their all into football as their escape route. Ravel seemingly doesn't have that same desire to get away from the gang culture. He doesn't have the same drive.

Fergie will help and protect the players as they get towards the first team, but as youth players their attitude and application will come from them and their own hunger.

I would say it is more likely Fergie has no clue how to handle a wannabe gangster like Ravel, and that his attitude is completely alien to anything Fergie has encountered before - rather than an attitude Fergie has a history of sorting and turning professional.

You see boys, if you hadn't lept to the defence of Lordgoat like a band of chidden courtiers then we wouldn't be wasting pages and pages of text on points scoring. The fact is you didn't, you played the poster (despite VW1's whining) and not the post. Magic Marker was the first in to protect his place at the crotch. I'll play this however you like, lads, I can debate football or not, it entirely your decision. I expect that you afford me the same courtsey and you afford each other.

You made my point for me, "he hasn't the same drive". There it is, it is why Lordgoat is wrong. Ravel Morrison is closer in attitude to Nicklas Bendtner than Leo Messi.

I disagree with you on Ferguson, he may be Seventy but the guy knows a wideboy when he sees one. Gangster's have existed since Christ was a child, the motifs might have changed but that is all, the attitude, the world view is no differnet from a 1950's Glasgow hoodlum.

Orando Broom

bullvine wrote: »

Whats the injury list looking like for the weekend? I wonder will Carrick play or do we need to wrap him in cotton wool.

Cotton wool and lots of it is my first reaction; the other side of it is he is in a rich vein of form and playing well, would he benefit from a sustained, unbroken run in the side?

Mitch Connor

bullvine wrote: »

Whats the injury list looking like for the weekend? I wonder will Carrick play or do we need to wrap him in cotton wool.

Won't know until tomorrow.

I would imagine that Ferdinand, Jones and nani can be added to the injury list. Question marks over Anderson, Cleverley, Young - all of whom I would be surprised to see. Rooney and Carrick picked up knocks last week and if any doubt, I would leave them out (Stoke and Chelsea much bigger games)

We'll know better tomorrow though.

MagicMarker

Orlando, I don't know how you've come to the conclusion I was defending Lordgoat seeing as my response to you didn't make any reference to what he said or what you said in response to him. I specifically only quoted what YOU said with regards to Morrison not making it anywhere but at Utd.

But don't let facts get in the way of your persecution complex.

Orando Broom

MagicMarker wrote: »

Orlando, I don't know how you've come to the conclusion I was defending Lordgoat seeing as my response to you didn't make any reference to what he said or what you said in response to him. I specifically only quoted what YOU said with regards to Morrison not making it anywhere but at Utd.

But don't let facts get in the way of your persecution complex.

I won't. Stay cosy. If you keep this up, he might buy you a basket.

G.K.

The big trouble with Morrisson is that his Mates are in Manchester. Send him off someplace else and he might shine.

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

You see boys, if you hadn't lept to the defence of Lordgoat like a band of chidden courtiers then we wouldn't be wasting pages and pages of text on points scoring. The fact is you didn't, you played the poster (despite VW1's whining) and not the post. Magic Marker was the first in to protect his place at the crotch. I'll play this however you like, lads, I can debate football or not, it entirely your decision. I expect that you afford me the same courtsey and you afford each other.

You made my point for me, "he hasn't the same drive". There it is, it is why Lordgoat is wrong. Ravel Morrison is closer in attitude to Nicklas Bendtner than Leo Messi.

I disagree with you on Ferguson, he may be Seventy but the guy knows a wideboy when he sees one. Gangster's have existed since Christ was a child, the motifs might have changed but that is all, the attitude, the world view is no differnet from a 1950's Glasgow hoodlum.

No - it would be a reason why LG may be wrong, until it plays out his opinion is not wrong, and you know it. He doesn't have the same drive as others - and that is what has held him back at United. If he leaves United and Manchester, it may prove to be a kick up the arse and he may knuckle down a bit more, may become something of the player we expected. A good chance he will tumble a league or two and give up football at 22 to become a DJ - it wouldn't surprise me. It also wouldn't surprise me to see him become a very decent PL player with off the field problems and issues - like Joey Barton.

I think the kid culture these days, for lads like Ravel, is completely different to what was seen years ago, and the money available to a guy like morrison (increasing the hangers-on) makes it more of an issue too. I don't blame his mates, as you said earlier, but I don't think his mates help the situation and moving away from them could be good for him. It may not help at all, but it could do. The club thought so, and tried to move him out of home into digs with Josh King last year, not sure what happened there though.

The kid has more talent than I have ever seen in the United youth team - his attitude is the problem. If can fix that, even a little, he can play PL football imo. I wish he had the attitude of Neville, Butt, Scholes, Cleverley etc - he would already be a first team player for United imo. It won't take much for him to become a PL player, just as it won't take much for him to be a Sunday league player.

Mitch Connor

G.K. wrote: »

The big trouble with Morrisson is that his Mates are in Manchester. Send him off someplace else and he might shine.

Should have got him a new contract in the summer then sent him to Molde for the first half of the season, under Solskjaer - then to FC Twente now (under McClaren).

Oh well, whatever happens from now it won't benefit United, imo.

MagicMarker

Personally, I don't THINK Morrison is going anywhere.

Mitch Connor

MagicMarker wrote: »

Personally, I don't THINK Morrison is going anywhere.

I think he is basically already gone.

Everyone who I think would know about the situation (journo's, people on twitter i would trust) say it is just a wait til the summer when he can sign for whomever he wants.

I would like to be proven wrong, I'd like to see him and United give it one more proper go (and for Rav to really focus and try) but I just don't see it.