Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12

Red Crow

MoscowFlyer wrote: »

Nuri Sahin needs to swap Madrid for Manchester ASAP. The good side of Manchester that is!

Was never going to play. Alonso would of have to been dropped. Doesn't fit into the typical Mourinho side. He's a damn fine player, has been injured since day 1 really. This is going to be one of those dream moves that doesn't work out.

Will never play for United though IMO.

shadowcomplex

Mitch Connor wrote: »

first part - this is an issue many untied fans, and the club itself, imo, have.

This fabled 'United' quality - seemingly deeming players like Keane, Robson and Scholes as good enough for United.

Nicky Butt was a damned fine player for us over the years, Phil Neville was an excellent player for us, many times in midfield. Bloqvist was a key member of the 99 treble wining side imo. We won teh CL with a starting midfield partnership of Beckham and Butt with Blomqvist and Giggs on the wing.

For the last few years O'SHea and Gibson have played with regularity, an inconsistent Anderson too. Alan Smith was considered a potential answer in midfield, Kleberson and Liam Miller too. Remember Djemba Djemba - I'm sure you do Helix!

Now, some of those players can be considered failures overall, but the fact is most of them have been part of title winning sides. As squad players.

United don't operate on the level of City, or Madrid, or Barcelona in term if transfers. Unlike Mancini, Fergie isn't going to moan about an injury crisis when two players are out injured, he isn't going to say that he needs money from the owners to continue a title tilt because a youth player might need to be used. We can't afford to have 2 world class players in every position. What we need are top players in the first 11 and secondary players capable of coming in to the side and doing a job. For the most part, we do this very well - with excellent options in most areas of the pitch - except the centre of the park.

Yes, Dempsey is not in Scholes' (of old) class, or Keane or Robson - but he IS better than Gibson, he is better than Miller, and Kleberson, and Smith etc. He is better than most squad option we have had down the years. I don't think dempsey is good enough to be first choice for a CL challenging side (looking to next season) but as part of the squad? I'm fine with that, happy with that.

If we brought Dempsey in now, with the plan in place to sign (for example, not saying we'll sign him, or should) Sniejder or Modric in the summer - i'd be happy with that. My issue would be is if Dempsey is seen as the answer (assuming Anderson doesn't actually find his top form consistently) and our 1 CM signing - that, imo, wouldn't be good enough.

As a first choice signing - would have big reservations. As a squad signing - would be very happy. It comes down to money. At the rumoured price, can we afford him as a squad option and still sign another top CM?

What about the arguement that strengthening the first team should be the priority because by doing that your effectively strengthening your squad, the guy that was in your first 11 is now the squad player

K-9

eugeneious wrote: »

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2092364/Manchester-United-Liverpool-best-enemies.html?ITO=socialnet-twitter-manunitedmail&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed

Decent read. Interesting to see how the rivalry has not always been so bitter even during Fergie's reign.

Guardian first ran with it nearly 2 years ago, simple times:

The forgotten story of ... When Anfield was Manchester United's home ground | Sport | guardian.co.uk

Liam O

people are very much underestimating Dempsey imo, he has shined at every level he's played at in his career so far. Wont happen though...

RasTa

Liam O wrote: »

people are very much underestimating Dempsey imo, he has shined at every level he's played at in his career so far. Wont happen though...

And should it never unless it's a free transfer. Andy Carroll syndrome.

MagicMarker

Why, at 28, would Dempsey swap regular first team football for Utd's bench?

Mitch Connor

shadowcomplex wrote: »

What about the arguement that strengthening the first team should be the priority because by doing that your effectively strengthening your squad, the guy that was in your first 11 is now the squad player

I agree with that, but it would fall into my point that I would like Dempsey as a squad signing and not the big midfield signing that I think we need.

I think we need two midfielders, so I would be happy with Dempsey as the second of those and a bigger/better player signed in the summer (no chance of signing them now). If Dempsey was considered to be the bigger of the two signings, or the only signing, I would not be happy with that situation. I would see the signing of Dempsey as one step in strengthening the squad, with a further one to improve the first team directly required.

homerjay2005

does fergie have a press conference today? may end the talk over who is in or who is out.

getting really worried about tomorrow, its my first trip to anfield and it could be a bad day

hopefully we have 3 or 4 of the players who are supposed to be out, available and we pull through.

going to be a hugely difficult game.

Mitch Connor

homerjay2005 wrote: »

does fergie have a press conference today? may end the talk over who is in or who is out.

getting really worried about tomorrow, its my first trip to anfield and it could be a bad day

hopefully we have 3 or 4 of the players who are supposed to be out, available and we pull through.

going to be a hugely difficult game.

Should be a conference at 9.30, with updates on twitter from 10. Last week I think the conference was at 12 though, or maybe it was the week before.

homerjay2005

its really impossible to pick a team, but so far, assuming all doubts are out its going to be -

anders
rafael smalling evans evra
valencia carrick scholes giggs/park
welbeck hernandez.

that leaves berba, fabio, giggs/park, de gea and then 3 youths or lads who are injured.

not great is it? not many teams will go to a top 8 team in the PL and win with 10 players out.

Mitch Connor

homerjay2005 wrote: »

its really impossible to pick a team, but so far, assuming all doubts are out its going to be -

anders
rafael smalling evans evra
valencia carrick scholes giggs/park
welbeck hernandez.

that leaves berba, fabio, giggs/park, de gea and then 3 youths or lads who are injured.

not great is it? not many teams will go to a top 8 team in the PL and win with 10 players out.

lads in work this morning were saying liverpool are over 2 to 1 to win the game, crazy odds considering the injury problems united have.

Giggsy11

I would take a draw if offered before the game. Draw at Anfield will a good result and with injury crisis we have, I would consider it to be a very good result. We can beat them at OT with few players returing to full fitness.

nicklauski

lordgoat wrote: »

I think DOc or nicklauski posted about it on boards yesterday.

Yeah, I may change my avatar. Even I get confused looking at mine and DOC's post sometimes.

Word on the tweet (see what I did there ) Rooney is a serious doubt tomorrow. Couple of Journo's from the Times and Guardian reporting it.

Your Airbag

nicklauski wrote: »

Word on the tweet (see what I did there )it.

What the? I don't even.....

MoscowFlyer

Jones and Nani officially out. Not that surprising.

jaykay74

From manutd.com

Friday 27 January

09:41 Sir Alex has just completed his pre-match press conference. On United's injury problems, he didn't name names but did say he hopes to have "two or three" players back training today ahead of tomorrow's match against Liverpool.

On the match, he said: "It's a massive game for both clubs. There's a tremendous profile around it. Steven Gerrard said it's the responsibility of the players to behave properly and I expect my players to. And also the fans. Both sets of fans need to make sure we're talking about the game and nothing else."

On how to combat an expected hostile atmosphere: "You just have to concentrate on the game. That's what you have to do, just try and play your game. That helps. I think both sets of players are aware of that."

There was also high praise for Danny Welbeck and the boss commented on his journey from boy to man: "When he was 16 he had problems with his knees because he was growing. Then he had some thigh problems. It was just a matter of Danny developing into a man. He has a great physique about him now but I think there's still more to come. I don't think he's finished."

Orando Broom

Trilla wrote: »

its just twitter bullshít

You're taking these Twitter rumours to heart!:)

They are just toying with your emotions aren't they?

Did you see the Xabi Alonso one?

Orando Broom

Mitch Connor wrote: »

lads in work this morning were saying liverpool are over 2 to 1 to win the game, crazy odds considering the injury problems united have.

You sure it's not 2 to 1 on? It would still be a bit mad.

Checked there Liverpool 8/5. Draw 11/5 and United to win 7/4.

Mitch Connor

Orando Broom wrote: »

You sure it's not 2 to 1 on? It would still be a bit mad.

Checked there Liverpool 8/5. Draw 11/5 and United to win 7/4.

was 23/10 according the liverpool lads in work this morning.

Liverpool should be favourites imo.

DM_7

MagicMarker wrote: »

Why, at 28, would Dempsey swap regular first team football for Utd's bench?

To challenge himself and improve further. He has done all he can at Fulham even reaching the Europa league final. He has played two world cups and performed well in them. The Next step of his career is to play in the Champions League.

Dempsey comes from a sports country where your not expected to make the breakthrough as a teenager to become a top player. I don't think americans share the mentality an English player would have, at 28 they start to look to the limited time left while Dempsey is probably looking at reaching the next level (this is just my opinion).


Outside that I am a big fan of his,

He is a verstile footballer, strong, athlethic, takes up great positions, brilliant finisher and works very hard.

He has steadily improved throughout his career and would make a fine addition to Uniteds squad.

not saying its going to happen, the hat trick the other day probably just has him fresh in peoples minds.

stesaurus

Mitch Connor wrote: »

was 23/10 according the liverpool lads in work this morning.

Liverpool should be favourites imo.

Talking out of their arse then unless its some kind of enhanced odds. Liverpool have been slight favourites all week.

I'd say if you're into trading then a lay of Utd and then back them after the team is announced. No doubt Utd will drift once whatever the Random Midfield Generator produces.

Blatter

Mitch Connor wrote: »

was 23/10 according the liverpool lads in work this morning.

Liverpool should be favourites imo.

You are completely underestimating a few things:

Liverpool played a high intensity game on Wednesday while our players had a rest. - this is a massive factor and is often bizarrely overlooked by people. Playing on a Tuesday night and then playing on a Sunday afternoon is bad enough, but playing on a Wednesday night and then playing on a Saturday afternoon is a huge disadvantage. And the fact that they are both high intensity games just adds to this.

They are missing two of their best players in Lucas and Suarez.

Their current most dangerous attacking threat in Bellamy almost certainly won't play 3 games in less than a week - possibly Gerrard too. This probably means Andy Carroll up front on his own - If that happens they are genuinely going to struggle to score as they have done all season.

Jay Spearing is apparently a big doubt - he's not great but Liverpool desperately miss someone who can do decent defensive work in midfield.



We have injuries and we are playing away from home, but there is a **** load of things going against Liverpool as well. I certainly don't see them as being clear favorites. The way I see it is that we are ever so slightly favorites to progress at best (because the team we put out should still be technically better than Liverpool's) or the exact same odds as Liverpool to progress at worst.

Mitch Connor

Blatter wrote: »

You are completely underestimating a few things:

Liverpool played a high intensity game on Wednesday while our players had a rest. - this is a massive factor and is often bizarrely overlooked by people.

They are missing two of their best players in Lucas and Suarez.

Their current most dangerous attacking threat in Bellamy almost certainly won't play 3 games in less than a week - possibly Gerrard too. This probably means Andy Carroll up front on his own - If that happens they are genuinely going to struggle to score as they have done all season.

Jay Spearing is apparently a big doubt - he's not great but Liverpool desperately miss someone who can do decent defensive work in midfield.



We have injuries and we are playing away from home, but there is a **** load of things going against Liverpool as well. I certainly don't see them as being clear favorites. The way I see it is that we are ever so slightly favorites to progress at best (because the team we put out should still be technically better than Liverpool's) or the exact same odds as Liverpool to progress at worst.

We could be without Ferdinand, Vidic, Jones, Fletcher, Anderson, Cleverley, Nani, Young and Rooney. On top of that, recent performances at Anfield have not been great. Yes, Liverpool are missing a few players, but nowhere near as many as us - potentially closer to their first team.

With the amount of players that look like missing the game, at Anfield, I make Liverpool clear favourites for the game to be honest.

Blatter

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We could be without Ferdinand, Vidic, Jones, Fletcher, Anderson, Cleverley, Nani, Young and Rooney. On top of that, recent performances at Anfield have not been great. Yes, Liverpool are missing a few players, but nowhere near as many as us - potentially closer to their first team.

With the amount of players that look like missing the game, at Anfield, I make Liverpool clear favourites for the game to be honest.

Fergie said that he hopes to have 2 or 3 players back training today. From listening to him over the years that sounds like 2 or 3 doubts will almost certainly be fit to play tomorrow.

When we played and lost 3-1 at Anfield last season, on of the biggest reasons for our ****e performance was that we had played Chelsea in a high intensity game a few days before whilst Liverpool had a nice little rest.

The year before when they beat us 2-0 at Anfield we had an away game at CSKA Moscow only 4 days prior to that game, whilst I think Liverpool had a home game.

They aren't excuses as it's the luck of the draw the way the fixtures fall, but these things do make a HUGE difference to a team's preparation and fitness.


For tomorrow, they are at home and are missing plenty of key players. We are missing more. But we have a much better squad than them and have the advantage of not having had a game midweek whilst they they did - and a high intensity one at that.

Liverpool have usually been able to get the better of us through high intensity performances - I really don't see them doing that tomorrow especially with Carroll leading the line and Adam & Henderson playing their third game in a week, there's a very high chance that they'll be as flat as ****.

It's quite even the way I look at it tbh.

keane2097

The sample size of poor performances at Anfield is way too small to make any difference in handicapping the game from a betting POV fwiw.

Literally would have no impact at all.

Blatter

keane2097 wrote: »

The sample size of poor performances at Anfield is way too small to make any difference in handicapping the game from a betting POV fwiw.

Literally would have no impact at all.

Yep. The last meeting between the sides at Anfield was a draw, the three previous were Liverpool wins and the two further back were United wins.


Zero, red, red, red, black, black.

If anything it's due to land on black again:p

Nalz

Orando Broom wrote: »

You're taking these Twitter rumours to heart!

LOL yep fair enough I overreacted! Two many rumours come along on twitter, and someone writes 4 or 5 paragraphs on one in particular and its a full blown discussion. No real harm though I suppose!

Whats the Alonso one?

Your Airbag

I said before Dempsey would be a great buy and it could really give his career a shot in the arm to take him to the next level. I've seen him make the difference in big games against tough opposition but it is just twitter talk at the moment so its probably not even in the pipeline.

Speaking of which, it looks like Rio and Katie Price may have gotten themselves into a spot of bother over a snickers bar via twitter.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-16748215

There is a great pun in there somewhere I just need to find it.

Kylo Ren

Blatter wrote: »

Jay Spearing is apparently a big doubt - he's not great but Liverpool desperately miss someone who can do decent defensive work in midfield.

Obviously.

nicklauski

Feck it anyway. Going to miss the match tomorrow. Raging. Out of the last 4 games against Liverpool, I've seen one!

Will be tough tomorrow, no doubt. I reckon United could possibly sneak a win depending on the 2-3 who could be back that Fergie won't name.

Phil Jones I reckon could be one. After that I have no idea. Bare bones in midfield. Wouldn't risk Carrick at all tomorrow.

Orando Broom

Trilla wrote: »

LOL yep fair enough I overreacted! Two many rumours come along on twitter, and someone writes 4 or 5 paragraphs on one in particular and its a full blown discussion. No real harm though I suppose!

Whats the Alonso one?

I was codding about Alonso! I just made that up, there. Apologies!

Twitter is a fertile ground for innuendo and bull****e.

JimsAlterEgo

reckon we could see one of the brazilans in CM tomorrow, if nothing else would give us energy there

MagicMarker

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

reckon we could see one of the brazilans in CM tomorrow, if nothing else would give us energy there

Guaranteed red card right there.

Mitch Connor

Player Rating results for the Arsenal game.

Name|Avrage Rating
Valencia | 8.64
Evra | 8.27
Carrick | 7.45
Welbeck | 7.45
Evans | 7.09
Smalling | 6.91
Giggs | 6.82
Nani | 6.64
Rooney | 6.55
Lindegaard | 6.18
Rafael | 6
Scholes | 5.64
Park | 5.45
Jones | 5.27

JimsAlterEgo

MagicMarker wrote: »

Guaranteed red card right there.

I dunno, less exposed as a CM than at FB.

stesaurus

JimsAlterEgo wrote: »

reckon we could see one of the brazilans in CM tomorrow, if nothing else would give us energy there

I mentioned it a few days ago also. Fabio could really do a job in there, he's got great ability on the ball but he'd ideally need to be part of a 3 man.
Scholes, Fabio and Jones. Welbeck, Chicarito and Valencia as the forward 3 could work.
Whatever happens you can be sure ITV won't have a clue how they'll line up once the team sheet is handed in. Will be interesting.

ShooterSF

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Player Rating results for the Arsenal game.

Interesting to see Smalling's score in comparison to Evra when many in the match thread were putting Val and Smalling ahead of Evra for m.o.t.m.

homerjay2005

im heading off to manchester now and then on to anfield in the mornin bright and early.

go easy in the match thread lads. heres hoping for at least a draw tomorrow.

The_Kew_Tour

homerjay2005 wrote: »

im heading off to manchester now and then on to anfield in the mornin bright and early.

go easy in the match thread lads. heres hoping for at least a draw tomorrow.

Lucky Bas-tard;)

Have a great time!!

Have you been to Anfield before?

First time was the league game this season was great craic.

Son Of A Vidic

jaykay74 wrote: »

From manutd.com
There was also high praise for Danny Welbeck and the boss commented on his journey from boy to man: "When he was 16 he had problems with his knees because he was growing. Then he had some thigh problems. It was just a matter of Danny developing into a man. He has a great physique about him now but I think there's still more to come. I don't think he's finished."

keep it coming Danny, you're well on track. Pity a few others wouldn't learn from his exemplary behaviour and attitude.

Mitch Connor

what are the thoughts on Danny?

I'm a big fan of him now, though a few years ago I thought he would be another frazier campbel. I don't think he is world class now or anything like that, but he certainly is very promising. Has pace and power, good control and a decent dribbler - his finishing does need work though, doesn't have a clinical air to him, yet. I also love the way he works the channels and links play - a better option from a team blend perspective than Chico or Berbatov imo. Some more experience and knowledge he could be our new Saha - though hopefully without the injury issues!

I know I have spoken to other fans of United who don't rate him as much of a prospect, find him too wasteful and don't think his control is near good enough.

shadowcomplex

Mitch Connor wrote: »

what are the thoughts on Danny?

I'm a big fan of him now, though a few years ago I thought he would be another frazier campbel. I don't think he is world class now or anything like that, but he certainly is very promising. Has pace and power, good control and a decent dribbler - his finishing does need work though, doesn't have a clinical air to him, yet. I also love the way he works the channels and links play - a better option from a team blend perspective than Chico or Berbatov imo. Some more experience and knowledge he could be our new Saha - though hopefully without the injury issues!

I know I have spoken to other fans of United who don't rate him as much of a prospect, find him too wasteful and don't think his control is near good enough.

I think he will be a very good player but he will never be a worldclass striker

G.K.

Based on what?

lordgoat

G.K. wrote: »

Based on what?

On the magic beans and other paraphernalia he uses to make those astute opinions in his noodle. Duh G.K. Duh.

Blatter

If Welbeck was foreign people would be saying that we have a world class prospect on our hands.

I know British prospects are often over hyped but there can also be a 'he'll never be world class' stigma attached to them too.

The next 18 months of Welbeck's development will tell us if he will become world class or not. If there is a vast improvement in his abilities in that time, he won't be too far off world class because he is a very good player as things stand right now.

shadowcomplex

G.K. wrote: »

Based on what?

My opinion that is all but I could be wrong

adox

I like Welbeck.

















Kinda obvious

Blatter

On Welbeck's abilities, he is actually one of my favorite players at United. He can do pretty much everything at a good level.

He can dribble, has a good shot on him, his link up play is very good, he's good in the air, has good football intelligence and has that creative spark about him. He is also a great athlete, which is always a plus.

The draw back with him at the moment is that he can go missing in large spells of games and he isn't very clinical yet. But he is only gone 21 and he has a great chance of improving on those things, especially with his dedication and enthusiasm.

DM_7

Danny Welbeck will be a top class footballer (I hope and think)

I judge him the same way I judge all players.

First what has he got physically. Well he is strong and tall which is good for a centre forward. He has a bit of pace about him too.

Has he a brain? Yes, He is a very intelligent footballer. He takes up good positions in and around the box. He has good vision and knows what is going on around him.

Now his actual play, touch is good, his interplay with Cleverly, Young, Nani and Rooney has been really good at times. Quick passes.

I actually think he is a pretty good, composed finisher already. See his goal v Spain in the Under 21's as an example. Evan against Arsenal he scored one well and kept his head when through on goal and didn't just lash at for the one Mertesacker cleared away. He scores a variety of goals and his physical size makes him a threat in the air. He will improve more with experience.

He can Dribble well, has some lovely skills and has a powerful shot.

This all underpinned by a great work ethic. He will do as his manger asks, play on the defenders shoulder and run in behind, drop deep, go wide - whatever is asked of him. He is also willing to work hard defensively and chase back like Rooney does.

I don't get why some people don't rate him, each to their own. But then some though Ronaldo would never do much apart from step overs.

MagicMarker

I love Welbeck, he's a class player, and his goal celebrations are awesome!