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Caught with 18 ounces of weed

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    #122
    seanybiker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,898 ✭✭✭✭seanybiker


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    Are you?

    I can barely remember my acb's


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    #123
    Cavehill Red
    Registered Users Posts: 6,109 ✭✭✭Cavehill Red


    seanybiker wrote: »
    I can barely remember my acb's

    Me two.

    Which is why I accept it when senior medics and drugs researchers exhaustively examine the harm caused by all intoxicants over a three year period and produce their results.

    As a whiskey drinker, I'm not happy to see alcohol at the top of their list and certainly don't wish alcohol banned. But the bottom line of that logic is that if we're going to permit alcohol, then there is no argument remaining against decriminalising, if not actually legalising and taxing, something like cannabis.


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    #124
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    What part in the 'wider trade' of crime does someone growing four plants in their own home have? Perhaps the soil they bought in Woodies DIY went to the Westies? You tell me.
    Well none because they did not buy it.
    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    Anyhow, your argument is exactly why prohibition needs to end. The current system, as Milton Friedman compelling argues in the post above, simply protects the existing cabal of drug gang leaders in their opulence while criminalising end users at enormous cost to the state. See how Portugal have slashed crime rates and improved healthcare and addiction levels simply by decriminalising.

    You see you have a who blinks first scenario.

    Is it the Governments fault for not decriminalising it or the users fault for keeping the trade alive by buying it.


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    #125
    Cavehill Red
    Registered Users Posts: 6,109 ✭✭✭Cavehill Red


    Zambia wrote: »
    Well none because they did not buy it.

    So we're agreed that people who cultivate their own cannabis are not contributing to wider criminality, or the murder or journalists, or any other prohibitionist boogeymen? Good.
    Zambia wrote: »
    You see you have a who blinks first scenario.

    Is it the Governments fault for not decriminalising it or the users fault for keeping the trade alive by buying it.

    Obviously it is the government's fault. They serve the people, not the other way around. The people's will on cannabis is evidenced by the sheer numbers of the populace who have used it, and the numbers who state they support its decriminalisation. The people are sovereign. If the legislators don't have the courage of their Portuguese peers, nor the common sense to follow in their successful footsteps, then let them simply offer a referendum to the people and let direct democracy decide.


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    #126
    Zambia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,333 ✭✭✭Zambia


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    So we're agreed that people who cultivate their own cannabis are not contributing to wider criminality, or the murder or journalists, or any other prohibitionist boogeymen? Good.
    Oh god yeah totally, produced, rolled and smoked on their own premises why not.


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    Obviously it is the government's fault. They serve the people, not the other way around. The people's will on cannabis is evidenced by the sheer numbers of the populace who have used it, and the numbers who state they support its decriminalisation. The people are sovereign. If the legislators don't have the courage of their Portuguese peers, nor the common sense to follow in their successful footsteps, then let them simply offer a referendum to the people and let direct democracy decide.

    Sorry the government is elected by the majority ergo the majority votes to criminalise it.

    Yes I would be happy with a referendum. However if it was lost would the vast majority of users stop and obey the law?


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    #127
    Cavehill Red
    Registered Users Posts: 6,109 ✭✭✭Cavehill Red


    Zambia wrote: »
    Oh god yeah totally, produced, rolled and smoked on their own premises why not.

    Then you're already in favour of decriminalisation along the Belgian or Spanish models.
    Zambia wrote: »
    Sorry the government is elected by the majority ergo the majority votes to criminalise it.

    When was that vote? I must have missed it.
    Zambia wrote: »
    Yes I would be happy with a referendum. However if it was lost would the vast majority of users stop and obey the law?

    In this country we have a tradition of repeating referenda until we get the right answer. I see no reason to break with that tradition. The law is immoral, unethical, illogical and nonsensical. It defies medical science, sensible governance and flies in the face of the popular will of the people as polled consistently. I see no more reason to respect this law than I respect laws banning women from driving in Saudi Arabia, or laws allowing men to marry multiple pre-teen girls in Afghanistan. Such laws are wrong and ought to be opposed.


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    #128
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,030 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    Zambia wrote: »
    The war on drugs is not something that can be won its a constant battle to save lives. Its like the road toll everyone just tries to keep it in check.

    Well if it's a battle carried out by our benevolent govts. to save lives then the war is long since lost.

    It's extremely frustrating given all the evidence out there that prohibition is an abject failure.
    RAND studies released in the mid-1990s found that using drug user treatment to reduce drug consumption in the United States is seven times more cost effective than law enforcement efforts alone, and it could potentially cut consumption by a third

    Miller, Stephanie (April 7, 2009). "A Regional Strategy for Drug Wars in the Americas". Center for American Progress.


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    #129
    Ned_led16
    Registered Users Posts: 329 ✭✭Ned_led16


    Why let the dealers make the money???????
    Its the same as prostitution - the Govt cant stop it - but they CAN tax it! However a bigger concern is the use of heroine - a walk around Dublin city centre is quite disturbing! The walking dead! its the one drug alongside crystal meth that should stay illegal.

    Personally im against legalisation and decriminalisation for reasons i cant explain. If im right in saying a garda doesnt have to do anything to you if he catches you with enough for a few joints depending on your circumstances etc

    In early 2009, California state representative Tom Ammiano introduced a bill, titled Marijuana Control, Regulation, and Education Act, to legalize, regulate, and tax the recreational use of cannabis in California.[146] According to the Wall Street Journal, Ammiano, a Democrat, estimates that marijuana legalization "would generate more than $1 billion annually for the cash-strapped state". Currently, marijuana is California's biggest cash crop, with annual sales reaching $14 billion. The bill "proposes a tax of $50 on an ounce of marijuana, which sells for a few hundred dollars on the street".[147]


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    #130
    Cavehill Red
    Registered Users Posts: 6,109 ✭✭✭Cavehill Red


    Ned_led16 wrote: »
    Why let the dealers make the money???????

    In early 2009, California state representative Tom Ammiano introduced a bill, titled Marijuana Control, Regulation, and Education Act, to legalize, regulate, and tax the recreational use of cannabis in California.[146] According to the Wall Street Journal, Ammiano, a Democrat, estimates that marijuana legalization "would generate more than $1 billion annually for the cash-strapped state". Currently, marijuana is California's biggest cash crop, with annual sales reaching $14 billion. The bill "proposes a tax of $50 on an ounce of marijuana, which sells for a few hundred dollars on the street".[147]

    A recent study here found that legalising and taxing cannabis would bring in, at a very minimum, nearly half a billion euro annually. The reason why this was suggested as a floor figure was because they could not estimate the potential return or knock-on income from tourism and other indirect benefits. Add to that the reduction in police and healthcare costs, and the reduction of healthcare costs for people whose symptoms are better treated by cannabis than expensive pharmaceuticals, and you're looking at a very likely billion euro annual fillip to the economy here.


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    #131
    Ned_led16
    Registered Users Posts: 329 ✭✭Ned_led16


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    A recent study here found that legalising and taxing cannabis would bring in, at a very minimum, nearly half a billion euro annually. The reason why this was suggested as a floor figure was because they could not estimate the potential return or knock-on income from tourism and other indirect benefits. Add to that the reduction in police and healthcare costs, and the reduction of healthcare costs for people whose symptoms are better treated by cannabis than expensive pharmaceuticals, and you're looking at a very likely billion euro annual fillip to the economy here.

    How much money does the Dutch Govt take a year on prostitution and drugs?
    I think the police force are far busier in Holland than here because they are dealing with far more high profile criminals. Its not black or white or yes or no...
    But perhaps we all need to "think differently."


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    #132
    Cavehill Red
    Registered Users Posts: 6,109 ✭✭✭Cavehill Red


    Ned_led16 wrote: »
    How much money does the Dutch Govt take a year on prostitution and drugs?
    I think the police force are far busier in Holland than here because they are dealing with far more high profile criminals. Its not black or white or yes or no...
    But perhaps we all need to "think differently."

    Prostitution is another matter entirely. It's not really relevant to the discussion. Even without any tourism, our exchequer would be up at least half a billion in annual revenue just from taxing the sale of cannabis. Costs of policing and healthcare would be lower. You can take the tourism factor out, as it's not measurable as a hypothetical, and it's still an economic no-brainer.


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    #133
    goodweed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3 ✭goodweed


    sounds very fishy that someone gave him 18oz of weed to hold, also sounds fishy the gards just randomly stopped and searched an unknown person. Either they were watching him or it was a setup, but why would someone set him up if he never did any sort of crime in his life.

    If you were the judge and this case came before you and the defence was ''he was just holding it for a person''.

    I'd say 12months.


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    #134
    badgerbaiter
    Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭badgerbaiter


    the "i was just holding it i got dupped" story will not hold unless u give names..
    so just take the 18months stay quiet and dont do it again?
    i knw of this happening to a few people. always the same scenario..


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    #135
    oeb
    Registered Users Posts: 2,793 ✭✭✭oeb


    Cavehill Red wrote: »
    When was that vote? I must have missed it.
    As a whole, the current government is anti-cannabis, they got voted in.

    Was the candidate you voted for running on a pro-legalisation platform?


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