Things will come to those who wait...

pconn062

RunningKing wrote: »

Hills and wind........who needs 'em!

I know, we've both been victim to it this weekend! That's why I'm going back to the track, at least it eliminates the hills! :pac:

RacoonQueen

Sounds like it was a tough course from reports I've heard. Kind of glad I couldn't make it now.

Kurt Godel

pconn062 wrote: »

I was annoyed that I got dropped by the entire group on the hill, I really suck at running uphills and need to look at that.

Some useful things you can do to improve on hills are (in order of value):
1) Train on hills (2&3 will follow);
2) Lose weight (skinny guys do hills better);
3) Baby steps (and high cadence) going up. Always keep the breathing under control (if you start gasping going uphill you're finished, better to slow a little and control the breathing). Use your upper body to help forward momentum, swing your arms. A general rule is keep the same effort going up as you would running flat.

pconn062

RacoonQueen wrote: »

Sounds like it was a tough course from reports I've heard. Kind of glad I couldn't make it now.

Was a tough one all right, not a PB course anyway. Should be back to the usual course for next year I believe.

Kurt Godel wrote: »

Some useful things you can do to improve on hills are (in order of value):
1) Train on hills (2&3 will follow);
2) Lose weight (skinny guys do hills better);
3) Baby steps (and high cadence) going up. Always keep the breathing under control (if you start gasping going uphill you're finished, better to slow a little and control the breathing). Use your upper body to help forward momentum, swing your arms. A general rule is keep the same effort going up as you would running flat.

Thanks Kurt, good advice. I don't live in a particularly hilly area so there are no major hills on my everyday runs. I'm training for track at the minute but hope to include weekly hill sessions towards the end of the summer for cross country. Weight is definitely not an issue, I'm 5'10 and 10 and half stone (just). But your last point is very interesting, I have no technique for running uphill (unless trundling to the top is a technique!) so will try out your ideas the next time I'm on a hilly course. Today my legs just went dead and like you said my breathing went mental and I was fried!

ThePiedPiper

PConn, you would've ran a very decent mid 38 time yesterday if not for the uphill. My mile split for the hilly mile was 6:20 so as you say, 7.10 really was well out of sync.

My uphill technique is to shorten the stride, increase the leg turnover, get up on my toes, and in race situation, I definitely increase the effort levels. Can only afford to significantly increase the effort levels if I know that there's a downhill section after cresting the hill to recover.

But I think this is only working for me due to every single run I ever do having the hills back up to the house here. Get your ar$e over here every so often, especially if it looks like there's a hilly race coming up.

madon

pconn062 wrote: »

Thanks Kurt, good advice. I don't live in a particularly hilly area so there are no major hills on my everyday runs.

:eek: You need to start doing hill reps up castlecoe!
Well done on the run yesterday even if it was just good for getting you motivated for the next one.

ThePiedPiper

I was going to say something about your "everyday runs"... Best leave that one out of it! :-)

pconn062

RunForestRun wrote: »

I was going to say something about your "everyday runs"... Best leave that one out of it! :-)

I was going to say thanks for your helpful comment about hill running but now you can go fcuk yourself! :pac:

pconn062

madon wrote: »

:eek: You need to start doing hill reps up castlecoe!
Well done on the run yesterday even if it was just good for getting you motivated for the next one.

Thanks madon, well done yourself, tough old day. I usually held the opposite direction towards the beach so maybe I need to start heading up castlecoe direction!

NiallG4

"North East Runners cleared up with first and second team, for a bunch of aul lads they know how to run!!" (ouch)

pconn062

NiallG4 wrote: »

"North East Runners cleared up with first and second team, for a bunch of aul lads they know how to run!!" (ouch)

Very much tongue in cheek Niall, I assure you! Wish I could run like you guys can, didn't see you there, how'd ya get on?

NiallG4

pconn062 wrote: »

Very much tongue in cheek Niall, I assure you! Wish I could run like you guys can, didn't see you there, how'd ya get on?

I was there alright. 36.19. Happy enough. I am only getting back in shape now. I have very little strenght training done and this was a tough 10K. It was uphill with wind in our faces until 2K and then gradually uphill from 5k to 7K where the hill really was cruel. I thought I entered an IMRA race when I got halfway up the hill. All roads are leading to Dunshaughlin 10K now for me. 34.45 is the target. All the boys in the club were a minute at least off where I would expect them for a 10K now so I think we can forget Boyne 10K until next year when the hill disappears. One guy ran 16.16 in the PK5K and 35.3x on Sunday and that does not tally.

pconn062

NiallG4 wrote: »

I was there alright. 36.19. Happy enough. I am only getting back in shape now. I have very little strenght training done and this was a tough 10K. It was uphill with wind in our faces until 2K and then gradually uphill from 5k to 7K where the hill really was cruel. I thought I entered an IMRA race when I got halfway up the hill. All roads are leading to Dunshaughlin 10K now for me. 34.45 is the target. All the boys in the club were a minute at least off where I would expect them for a 10K now so I think we can forget Boyne 10K until next year when the hill disappears. One guy ran 16.16 in the PK5K and 35.3x on Sunday and that does not tally.

That's a cracking time on that course, was such a tough one, I was hoping to sneak under 38 but the hill killed me, lost a full minute on it. I missed 10 days training with my knee a few weeks ago and still only getting back so am happy enough considering that. Dunshaughlin will be a good one alright, sub 35 is great running. I'm doing track for the next while but might give my local 10k in Clogherhead a bash at the end of June, good course.

NiallG4

pconn062 wrote: »

That's a cracking time on that course, was such a tough one, I was hoping to sneak under 38 but the hill killed me, lost a full minute on it. I missed 10 days training with my knee a few weeks ago and still only getting back so am happy enough considering that. Dunshaughlin will be a good one alright, sub 35 is great running. I'm doing track for the next while but might give my local 10k in Clogherhead a bash at the end of June, good course.

You better stay off the Tallght 5K forum then. Only 100 people turned up at their race yesterday and the whole "club race v commercial race" debate is going on.

pconn062

NiallG4 wrote: »

You better stay off the Tallght 5K forum then. Only 100 people turned up at their race yesterday and the whole "club race v commercial race" debate is going on.

I know, I would usually always support club races but this one is right on my doorstep, I can jog to the start line from my house and I know the course inside out and is a good PB course so might give it a bash. Too many races these days is the problem, the clubs runners need to stick together I agree.

dna_leri

pconn062 wrote: »

I'm doing track for the next while but might give my local 10k in Clogherhead a bash at the end of June, good course.

It's hard to do both mile and 10K distances properly - IMO.
You can do both but you may need to prioritise one over the other.

pconn062

dna_leri wrote: »

It's hard to do both mile and 10K distances properly - IMO.
You can do both but you may need to prioritise one over the other.

Thanks DL, I totally agree. The 1500m training is the priority, the 10k will simply be a bit of fun. It's on a Sunday so I will probably just tack on a mile or two before and after and treat it like a long run. I won't be compromising any of my sessions in order to do it and won't be disappointed if the time is only average. I'm treating it more like a social occasion with friends and family!

pconn062

Monday: Rest

Tuesday: 7 miles steady around 7 minute pace

Legs were fried on Monday after the hills and I tried to do a few squats when doing my core workout on Monday night but it wasn't happening! The hills really chewed me up and spat me out.

Felt better on Tuesday and trying to keep up with my tradition of including 1 steady run a week I picked up the pace on this run and felt great. It was an awesome day for running, not to get too poetic but it was the first real warm day. The sun was shining, the tide was in and the air was full of the smells of flowers and the sea, it was a pleasure to be out.

Wednesday: 4 mile with 3k race

My club out together a 3k race in the unusual venue of a go-karting track and I got roped into doing it. Had some kilometer repeats planned for tonight so thought this would be an OK replacement and I tacked on a few 200m repeats at the end. My first thought was at least it will be flat, WRONG! A very testy lap which we had to undertake 3 times accompanied by a challenging headwind. Lined up and one guy shot off with myself, my bro and a friend of mine following. We didn't take it too seriously and kept the pace steady until the last lap when the bro tried to shoot off and I couldn't be having that! The ego won over and I chased after him, pipping him before the line to take second place. Not sure of time but it was slow, a little over 11 minutes I think. Still with the 200's as well it was a good workout and it could be a good place for future hill training. Have a good session of 200/300's planned for Friday which I'm looking forward to.

pconn062

Finding it hard to feel the love for running at the minute, the weather is just so poor it's putting me off, still getting out out which is the important thing I suppose.

Thursday: 7 miles easy

Was sitting in the house looking out the window waiting for a break in the showers. A big one just passed and I could see blue skies so out I went. Was three miles in when the heavens opened. I got absolutely soaked straight away and the rain poured down for the next four miles. I was like a drowned rat when I got home, with stage 1 hypothermia and clothes that weighted half a kilo more that they did before I went out. Typical Irish summer weather so.

Friday: 4.5 miles easy

Had my session planned for tonight but when I got to the track the Louth junior T+F champs were on so I couldn't use it so only had time for this by the time I got home.

Saturday:

Session: 8x300m @1500m pace with 60 secs recovery, 4 mins rest, 4x200m @ 800m pace with 75 secs recovery

Splits: 56, 56, 55, 55, 55, 56, 55, 55, 33, 33, 36, 33

So I headed into the track today to get my abandoned session done. Without sounding like a broken record the conditions were pretty bad, a very strong wind down the back straight that I had to run into for the first 120m and occasional heavy showers. The target for the 300's was 55/56 which equates to 74 seconds for 400m and I was pretty bang on. Was tough with only the short recovery and the headwind and I probably should have adjusted the effort level a bit. After the eight one I was glad to have them done and changed into my spikes during the 4 mins rest. This was probably the toughest part of the session, my hands were numb and the wind was blowing my spikes all over the place every time I put them down!!
So slightly flustered I launched into the 200's, I think if I was to run an 800m today I would be between 2.12-16 so was aiming for about 33/34. Again kept them fairly even, don't know what happened on the third one, I think I started my watch a second too early but must have lost a bit of concentration as well, got it back for the last one though. Only meant to take 60 secs recovery but that would have meant starting every second one from the finish line and running into the headwind for the whole thing and I couldn't face that so jogged each time back to the 200m mark which took about 75 seconds.

So that's the first proper track session done, happy with how it went given the inclement conditions, although it's very likely to be raining and windy when I race so probably not a bad thing to be training in it. Running the 1500m at the Graded meets next week so will see how that goes, long run tomorrow.

ThePiedPiper

What time you long running tomorrow? Wouldn't mind getting out for a few miles. Afternoon might suit me best..

KielyUnusual

The weather is definitely a bit of an irritant these days. I suffered through it a lot when the marathon was on the horizon but I'm happy enough to gaze out the window at it these evenings when I've no races on the agenda. You're hitting some very good track sessions these days regardless so you'll be well set up for the meets over the summer. This windy weather can't last forever. I hope;).

pconn062

KielyUnusual wrote: »

The weather is definitely a bit of an irritant these days. I suffered through it a lot when the marathon was on the horizon but I'm happy enough to gaze out the window at it these evenings when I've no races on the agenda. You're hitting some very good track sessions these days regardless so you'll be well set up for the meets over the summer. This windy weather can't last forever. I hope;).

Jeez I hope so too man, I'm on the verge of emigrating here if it gets any worse! Are you running graded meets on Wednesday?

KielyUnusual

pconn062 wrote: »

Jeez I hope so too man, I'm on the verge of emigrating here if it gets any worse! Are you running graded meets on Wednesday?

I might do. I'm all about the ten round numbers thread these days and unfortunately none of these are represented on Wednesday nights schedule. Well, the 10k is there but I don't fancy being lapped multiple times. I don't think it would be a recipe for a good time. The 1500m would be great preparation for the mile and give me an idea of what time to aim for so I'll probably pop out and run this. I'm very close to Santry and it's cheap to enter so I've no excuses not to go. Will you be running yourself? Would it be just the 1500m that you would be racing as well?

pconn062

KielyUnusual wrote: »

I might do. I'm all about the ten round numbers thread these days and unfortunately none of these are represented on Wednesday nights schedule. Well, the 10k is there but I don't fancy being lapped multiple times. I don't think it would be a recipe for a good time. The 1500m would be great preparation for the mile and give me an idea of what time to aim for so I'll probably pop out and run this. I'm very close to Santry and it's cheap to enter so I've no excuses not to go. Will you be running yourself? Would it be just the 1500m that you would be racing as well?

Yes I'm running alright, down for the 1500m only, had a look at previous results and I'll prob be in the D grade. The 1500m would be a great indicator for the mile, I'd say you could jump into the C or B grade, you would be well under 5 minutes for the mile. I'll be in the D grade with a Dunleer AC singlet, glasses and beard, give me a shout if you see me.

pconn062

Today: 11 miles @ 7.50 pace

I thought I had put the under armour gear and gloves away for the foreseeable future but unfortunately not and I had to dig them out again this morning. Was tired from the get go and this affected the pace, found it hard to get going and the wind was tough enough in places especially on the up hill drags, could still feel yesterdays session in the legs. Slogged through it though, my longest run in a few weeks. A decent week overall, mileage is up a bit and got a good session done yesterday, looking forward to the race on Wednesday, will give me a good indication of where I am 1500m wise at the minute and I can build from there.

pconn062

Monday: Off

Tuesday: 5.5 mile easy

Up at the crack of dawn for this (OK, half 7, I work afternoons!) as I had to get away early. I am terrible at running in the mornings, I feel really sluggish. Nice morning for it even if it was a bit cold. Looking forward to the 1500m at the Graded Meet tomorrow, I will be one of the slowest in all the grades by far but it doesn't bother me. I have a plan not to go out quicker than 54 seconds for the first 300m, which is still sub 4.50 mile pace. I don't care what anyone else does I'm just going to sit back and try to run my own race, tomorrow is a bit of a time trial to see where I stand. Hopefully I should get s PB (sub 4.54), depends on the weather, rain is fine but hopefully the wind dies down a bit. I'm pumped up though and ready to race!

ecoli

pconn062 wrote: »

Monday: Off

Tuesday: 5.5 mile easy

Up at the crack of dawn for this (OK, half 7, I work afternoons!) as I had to get away early. I am terrible at running in the mornings, I feel really sluggish. Nice morning for it even if it was a bit cold. Looking forward to the 1500m at the Graded Meet tomorrow, I will be one of the slowest in all the grades by far but it doesn't bother me. I have a plan not to go out quicker than 54 seconds for the first 300m, which is still sub 4.50 mile pace. I don't care what anyone else does I'm just going to sit back and try to run my own race, tomorrow is a bit of a time trial to see where I stand. Hopefully I should get s PB (sub 4.54), depends on the weather, rain is fine but hopefully the wind dies down a bit. I'm pumped up though and ready to race!

I think you are psyching yourself out a little sub 5 will put you well placed in a grade D race so you should be in or around mid pack which would be ideal for getting a good race and hopefully pushed to a fast time

pconn062

ecoli wrote: »

I think you are psyching yourself out a little sub 5 will put you well placed in a grade D race so you should be in or around mid pack which would be ideal for getting a good race and hopefully pushed to a fast time

Maybe so man, I'm just still a bit scarred from being last after 200m when I ran the 3,000m last year at one of the meets!! Managed to pull back one place before the end though!

ThePiedPiper

Best of luck this evening PConn.. I know it's early days with the change of training plan, but the old one had plenty of excellent work, so I'm sure this'll go well for you. Enjoy.

dna_leri

You are right not to go out too hard.
Conserve your energy for later on in the race but try to hang with a group.
Get an inside line and let others do the work.

ecoli is right - 4:54 would have had 10 guys behind you last year.
The third lap is the big one, with your strength, you'll pass a few of the quick starters here.

Good luck.