New Ten Week Roster

MagicSean

MagicSean wrote: »

Their twitter is pretty good

I only found out they had one the other day from another member. But how many people in the job actually use twitter or even know what it is? This is one of the biggest changes to the job in years. They should be telling us on paper whenever anything significant happens with this roster. Not letting stuff come out in dribs and drabs through rumours.

MagicSean

foreign wrote: »

I only found out they had one the other day from another member. But how many people in the job actually use twitter or even know what it is? This is one of the biggest changes to the job in years. They should be telling us on paper whenever anything significant happens with this roster. Not letting stuff come out in dribs and drabs through rumours.

Paper is expensive

d3exile

MagicSean wrote: »

foreign wrote: »

I only found out they had one the other day from another member. But how many people in the job actually use twitter or even know what it is? This is one of the biggest changes to the job in years. They should be telling us on paper whenever anything significant happens with this roster. Not letting stuff come out in dribs and drabs through rumours.

Paper is expensive

Try telling local management that... Every time I have a few days off I come back to about 80sheets of paper in my locker... And my email inbox more or less empty...

they'll have to spread the word before 1st march to give the prerequisite months notice, so no doubt the next couple weeks will be all of the rumours before the announcements... I personally prefer the 2,2,2,4 roster, even with a young family... 4 rest days isn't to be sniffed at and delighted to see the back of the changeover... I've no problem going in for longer hours to get more time off together to spend with my family and forget about the job...

coolhandluke

foreign wrote: »

I only found out they had one the other day from another member. But how many people in the job actually use twitter or even know what it is? This is one of the biggest changes to the job in years. They should be telling us on paper whenever anything significant happens with this roster. Not letting stuff come out in dribs and drabs through rumours.

The gra website is updated to 31/1 with the roster proposals that have been agreed so far, saying negotiations will continue up to fri 3rd. What more do you want ?

MagicSean

MagicSean wrote: »

Paper is expensive

€4.12 per week from every member. I think they can afford some paper.

coolhandluke wrote: »

The gra website is updated to 31/1 with the roster proposals that have been agreed so far, saying negotiations will continue up to fri 3rd. What more do you want ?

Well, it would have been nice to have been kept informed of the negotiations as they went on. It would have been nice if the GRA sought feedback from it's members about what roster they wanted. It would be nice if we could have voted on ALL of the proposals, personally I prefer the 2 early 2 late 2 night roster. I'm sure the GRA executive will find the new roster easy to get used to as they won't be working it.

mbeire

foreign wrote: »

€4.12 per week from every member. I think they can afford some paper.


Well, it would have been nice to have been kept informed of the negotiations as they went on. It would have been nice if the GRA sought feedback from it's members about what roster they wanted. It would be nice if we could have voted on ALL of the proposals, personally I prefer the 2 early 2 late 2 night roster. I'm sure the GRA executive will find the new roster easy to get used to as they won't be working it.

I'd prefer if the GRA didnt waste money on sending out leters to people, as
1. It takes too long, and
2. Emails or twitter is free and instant.

In my place, the Regional and Divisional GRA Rep has our emails and we get nearly daily updates on the rosters and in other areas. We can also reply and send our views and feedback to them and they will reply to you and explain their answer. It is a great service they have recently started, compared to previous years.

I also check the GRA twitter page. This is the only reason I use twitter. We have also had meetings with the GRA president about the rosters and I am confident that they have our genuine interest in making this roster work.

The GRA arent always the best but i'd rather have them there than not. They are all we have to look out for our interests wheather you argee or not.

bluetop

mbeire wrote: »

In my place, the Regional and Divisional GRA Rep has our emails and we get nearly daily updates on the rosters and in other areas. We can also reply and send our views and feedback to them and they will reply to you and explain their answer. It is a great service they have recently started, compared to previous years.

The GRA arent always the best but i'd rather have them there than not. They are all we have to look out for our interests wheather you argee or not.

What a joke you are paying them every week, so they should keep you updated on what is happening and going on, its no different from any union, that is what they are there for, but dont think they always have your best interest at hand, no union have this, they always do what is easiest for them and what they can get away with or you tolarate.

msg11

bluetop wrote: »

What a joke you are paying them every week, so they should keep you updated on what is happening and going on, its no different from any union, that is what they are there for, but dont think they always have your best interest at hand, no union have this, they always do what is easiest for them and what they can get away with or you tolarate.

Unions are a joke in any job to be honest, going by my experience. I was told, I should get time off, which I accepted. Only to find out from another union rep, this was not the case and I should have been paid.

Dunno, I suppose I am more happy with a week off with them paying for it ..

As for paper wastage, another one of life's mystery's. Why someone prints off 50 pages only to keep 1 sheet and throwing the rest in the bin. Or just throwing all 50 pages in the bin, absolute waste of paper.

MagicSean

msg11 wrote: »

Unions are a joke in any job to be honest, going by my experience. I was told, I should get time off, which I accepted. Only to find out from another union rep, this was not the case and I should have been paid.

Dunno, I suppose I am more happy with a week off with them paying for it ..

As for paper wastage, another one of life's mystery's. Why someone prints off 50 pages only to keep 1 sheet and throwing the rest in the bin. Or just throwing all 50 pages in the bin, absolute waste of paper.

the way I figure it, there are about 16000 gardaí and civilians inthe job. Each one gets a payslip once a week in the post. 16000 x 52 weeks x 55c postage equals 457k a annually on pointless payslip posting alone. Throw in the cost of printing and envelopes and you probably hit a million. About 1.5% of the budget cut for this year. That's only the tip of the iceberg in terms of waste. Court lists are another big waste of paper. I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

deadwood

MagicSean wrote: »

I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

There's an ape for that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szrsfeyLzyg

msg11

MagicSean wrote: »

the way I figure it, there are about 16000 gardaí and civilians inthe job. Each one gets a payslip once a week in the post. 16000 x 52 weeks x 55c postage equals 457k a annually on pointless payslip posting alone. Throw in the cost of printing and envelopes and you probably hit a million. About 1.5% of the budget cut for this year. That's only the tip of the iceberg in terms of waste. Court lists are another big waste of paper. I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

In my place of work, we have the option of getting it online (not e-mailed). I get mine a day earlier than most staff so any issues that arise are quickly sorted before I get my pay. Plus, I don't have slips lying all over the place, they are all stored online. Saves me the hassle of collecting it and them the money of transporting and printing it.

The waste of paper in my job is really unbelievable until you witness it. Reports print off that never get used, 5 Pages printing off for one label to be used, the list is endless. Don't get me started on the waste of electricity, computers left on endlessly same with certain lights.

deadwood

msg11 wrote: »

In my place of work, we have the option of getting it online (not e-mailed). I get mine a day earlier than most staff so any issues that arise are quickly sorted before I get my pay. Plus, I don't have slips lying all over the place, they are all stored online. Saves me the hassle of collecting it and them the money of transporting and printing it.

The waste of paper in my job is really unbelievable until you witness it. Reports print off that never get used, 5 Pages printing off for one label to be used, the list is endless. Don't get me started on the waste of electricity, computers left on endlessly same with certain lights.

No envelopes?
What would we use to record DLIP's then?

Mr Jinx

deadwood wrote: »

There's an ape for that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=szrsfeyLzyg

freudian slip ??

bluetop

MagicSean wrote: »

the way I figure it, there are about 16000 gardaí and civilians inthe job. Each one gets a payslip once a week in the post. 16000 x 52 weeks x 55c postage equals 457k a annually on pointless payslip posting alone. Throw in the cost of printing and envelopes and you probably hit a million. About 1.5% of the budget cut for this year. That's only the tip of the iceberg in terms of waste. Court lists are another big waste of paper. I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

Postage cost's nothing payslips dont go to homes as its all done thru internal mail, so a saving of 457k a year. Unfortunately court stuff has to be done on hard copy and digital for some court cases, and usually done x 3/4

bluetop

deadwood wrote: »

What would we use to record DLIP's then?

you dont need paper to record dlip, the pc does that, after you input the details.

MagicSean

bluetop wrote: »

Postage cost's nothing payslips dont go to homes as its all done thru internal mail, so a saving of 457k a year. Unfortunately court stuff has to be done on hard copy and digital for some court cases, and usually done x 3/4

Payslips arive in the station by means of the postman. I doubt An Post do this or free I could be wrong.

pa990

MagicSean wrote: »

msg11 wrote: »

Unions are a joke in any job to be honest, going by my experience. I was told, I should get time off, which I accepted. Only to find out from another union rep, this was not the case and I should have been paid.

Dunno, I suppose I am more happy with a week off with them paying for it ..

As for paper wastage, another one of life's mystery's. Why someone prints off 50 pages only to keep 1 sheet and throwing the rest in the bin. Or just throwing all 50 pages in the bin, absolute waste of paper.

the way I figure it, there are about 16000 gardaí and civilians inthe job. Each one gets a payslip once a week in the post. 16000 x 52 weeks x 55c postage equals 457k a annually on pointless payslip posting alone. Throw in the cost of printing and envelopes and you probably hit a million. About 1.5% of the budget cut for this year. That's only the tip of the iceberg in terms of waste. Court lists are another big waste of paper. I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

And the title of this thread is.............

MagicSean

pa990 wrote: »

And the title of this thread is.............

It's at the top of the page there

deadwood

Mr Jinx wrote: »

freudian slip ??

No.

...and look up freudian slip.



I think i'm getting to old for this.

pah

I dont get the ape thing?

d3exile

MagicSean wrote: »

the way I figure it, there are about 16000 gardaí and civilians inthe job. Each one gets a payslip once a week in the post. 16000 x 52 weeks x 55c postage equals 457k a annually on pointless payslip posting alone. Throw in the cost of printing and envelopes and you probably hit a million. About 1.5% of the budget cut for this year. That's only the tip of the iceberg in terms of waste. Court lists are another big waste of paper. I'd love to see a court presenter with an ipad containing all relevant info. Think of the paper saved if you could submit a digital copy of a file for court.

Forgive me if I'm wrong but payslips arrive in the An Post blue pouches, they aren't all 55c stamps, there is a set charge, dunno how much, for the pouch and all the days' post goes in it... Doubt they spend that much on the payslips tbh...

I do think 90% of what's done on paper now should be done electronically, instant and free!! And it can still be tracked and delivery/opening can be recorded...

Not great for those of us who like to keep the shredder beside our post locker tho

I don't see iPads taking hold, court lists will stay as they are, but do agree digital copies of files should suffice for Garda and DPP use, with a single printed file for court...

We're drifting off topic again aren't we...

deadwood

pah wrote: »

I dont get the ape thing?

Nothing to get. Just messing around.
(I was going to say it's a quote from Planet of the Apps.)


Anyhoooo, back on topic.

I don't really agree that gardai should be discussing proposed changes to their own work practices. I know the roster proposals are not state secrets and are in the public domain, but concerned parties should be speaking to their reps (or getting involved - it's easy to get on a local committee). Sign on to the gra twitter account too. Your opinions might get some sort of hearing there.

The ESF site contains worthwhile discussion too.

d3exile

deadwood wrote: »

pah wrote: »

I dont get the ape thing?

Nothing to get. Just messing around.
(I was going to say it's a quote from Planet of the Apps.)


Anyhoooo, back on topic.

I don't really agree that gardai should be discussing proposed changes to their own work practices. I know the roster proposals are not state secrets and are in the public domain, but concerned parties should be speaking to their reps (or getting involved - it's easy to get on a local committee). Sign on to the gra twitter account too. Your opinions might get some sort of hearing there.

The ESF site contains worthwhile discussion too.

ESF is a bit of a joke in fairness and no more "secure" than boards...
I disagree that it's easy to engage and get involved with the GRA most reps have it cushty and keep it that way

deadwood

d3exile wrote: »

ESF is a bit of a joke in fairness and no more "secure" than boards...
I disagree that it's easy to engage and get involved with the GRA most reps have it cushty and keep it that way

Like I said. Get involved. Get yourself on the local rep body at the next AGM, or just speak up.
We can all shout from the ditches.

As for esf, you'll find the discussion there is by people who are working in the system, not school kids or wannabe's. I never mentioned the security aspect. Nothing on the net is secure to those who have an interest and you'd be naiive to think it was. It's something I always caution other users about.

d3exile

deadwood wrote: »

Like I said. Get involved. Get yourself on the local rep body at the next AGM, or just speak up.
We can all shout from the ditches.

As for esf, you'll find the discussion there is by people who are working in the system, not school kids or wannabe's. I never mentioned the security aspect. Nothing on the net is secure to those who have an interest and you'd be naiive to think it was. It's something I always caution other users about.

Like I said its not easy to get involved, becoming a local GRA member is one thing but stirring the current ones into doing something proactive is another... Plus it's the CEC members that make decisions and most wouldn't get off their ass if a train was coming...

Plenty of members working the system here on boards too with a mix of public imput, so you're not living in a bubble of the same attitudes and opinions the whole time, I mentioned the security issue cos it's the only thing ESF tries to use to differ itself from boards.

I spend enough time in cars and stations talking between members, sometimes it's no harm to hear from the public opinion or for other people to see what we're dealing with and our attitudes to it, rather than reading articles in the sindo where guards get 6 months off a year and drive to work in gold plated cars, They can come on here and see what our attitudes and opinions really are, instead of us talking behind a blue wall

deadwood

d3exile wrote: »

Like I said its not easy to get involved, becoming a local GRA member is one thing but stirring the current ones into doing something proactive is another... Plus it's the CEC members that make decisions and most wouldn't get off their ass if a train was coming...

Plenty of members working the system here on boards too with a mix of public imput, so you're not living in a bubble of the same attitudes and opinions the whole time, I mentioned the security issue cos it's the only thing ESF tries to use to differ itself from boards.

I spend enough time in cars and stations talking between members, sometimes it's no harm to hear from the public opinion or for other people to see what we're dealing with and our attitudes to it, rather than reading articles in the sindo where guards get 6 months off a year and drive to work in gold plated cars, They can come on here and see what our attitudes and opinions really are, instead of us talking behind a blue wall

All very admirable. I love the public, don't get me wrong. They pay my wages after all.

I include myself in this when I say we all bitch and moan about the GRA but in the same way we complain about politicians, we sit aside and let those in power stay in power. Change starts at the bottom.

Since this thread is about rosters, i'll leave it at that.

Maybe some members of the public have some suggestions.

mbeire

mbeire wrote: »

I'd prefer if the GRA didnt waste money on sending out leters to people, as
1. It takes too long, and
2. Emails or twitter is free and instant.

In my place, the Regional and Divisional GRA Rep has our emails and we get nearly daily updates on the rosters and in other areas. We can also reply and send our views and feedback to them and they will reply to you and explain their answer. It is a great service they have recently started, compared to previous years.

I might give you my email address then. I've had one email since the discussions started.

0325422

Eru wrote: »

Jeez, is it that hard to use a calculator? 34 days X 8 hours = 272 hours per annum.

27 x 10 hours = 270 hours.

Your getting screwed out of 2 hours which I had no doubt would happen, your annual leave was never going to increase.

does this mean that we cant complain about it for the sake of it?
27 days wont be long slipping away

pa990

what is the expected final date of discussions ??

it seems to drag on and on and on

from gra website
Discussions resume Fri. 10th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

and tonight i expect it to say
:
Discussions resume Tue. 14th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

and on Tuesday i expect it to say:

Discussions resume Thur. 16th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

etc

rondeco

GRA have said its 34 days leave

pah

Great...:rolleyes:

Tomorrows sindo -

Gardaí work less days and keep 7 weeks holidays, they now only work 5 months of the year...

pa990

pah wrote: »

Great...:rolleyes:

Tomorrows sindo -

Gardaí work less days and keep 7 weeks holidays, they now only work 5 months of the year...

sounds good to me

bluetop

pa990 wrote: »

what is the expected final date of discussions ??

it seems to drag on and on and on

from gra website
Discussions resume Fri. 10th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

and tonight i expect it to say
:
Discussions resume Tue. 14th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

and on Tuesday i expect it to say:

Discussions resume Thur. 16th Febr to finalise the Roster, Working Time Agreement & Start Date. Nothing is agreed until everything is agreed on any Pilot Roster

etc

Sure that's the GRA for ya, they like to make their members think they are getting something or doing something for their money, so they go on and on, looks good i suppose

FGR

rondeco wrote: »

GRA have said its 34 days leave

Is there a source to confirm this? And even then; is it 34 x 8 hours or 34 x 10 hours ?

Zambia

Ha 7 weeks leave poor you.

are you serious

no more changeovers... #winning!!!

esf2012

d3exile wrote: »

ESF is a bit of a joke in fairness and no more "secure" than boards...

d3exile wrote: »

I mentioned the security issue cos it's the only thing ESF tries to use to differ itself from boards.

Well, at least we know your not working in the IT section if your even a serving mule.

I wont get into the whole were a joke thing or comparing esf to boards now but you need to read up on internet security my friend because comparing reading this thread to the ESF one is like comparing a shops cash register to a bank vault.

Anyone with an internet connection can read this but yet you, a supposed Garda cant read the secure thread on esf and thats just the forum softwares basic security settings at play. ESF also uses SSL / HTTPS security which is the same as most banks and financial institutes use for their online processing. I think that qualifies as just a tad more secure.

Heres some reading about that: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HTTP_Secure

(I do agree with Deadwood though, no serving mule should give too much away on any site)

rondeco

ForegoneReality wrote: »

Is there a source to confirm this? And even then; is it 34 x 8 hours or 34 x 10 hours ?

gra tweeted it on thursday

bluetop

esf2012 wrote: »

Anyone with an internet connection can read this but yet you, a supposed Garda cant read the secure thread on esf and thats just the forum softwares basic security settings at play. ESF also uses SSL / HTTPS security which is the same as most banks and financial institutes use for their online processing. I think that qualifies as just a tad more secure. away on any site)

No matter what security is in place, if someone wants to really get in they will, there is always holes or exploits that can be used.

esf2012

bluetop wrote: »

No matter what security is in place, if someone wants to really get in they will

Naturally, but that doesn't change the fact that ESF has made it a hell of a lot harder for them. If someone wants to break into your house they will, doesn't mean you leave the door open.

As for exile, just a word to the wise, it took less than a minute for me to find out who you are so for your own sake, stop posting about work on open forums.

d3exile

esf2012 wrote: »

As for exile, just a word to the wise, it took less than a minute for me to find out who you are so for your own sake, stop posting about work on open forums.

I don't need to hide who I am..
It's the guards, lads, not MI5. If you can find i'm in any breach of the secrets act then go ahead and point em out, other than that I'm as entitled to talk about the aspects of my job that I do as much as any other worker.

Now back to the 10 week roster topic maybe?

are you serious

Lads for anyone not expecting this to come into effect on April 2nd I for one urge you to see sense. Nothing the GRA do and or say will effect the top mans decisions, he is going to bring it in as early as he chooses.

I'm prepared for then and if you and your unit are not I think your being naieve. If it has to come in why would he bother waiting?

6 on 3 1/2 off not bad! It's not realistically 4 days lads, just like after a week of nights you don't really get 2 1/2 off its more like 1 1/2

MagicSean

garkane wrote: »

Lads for anyone not expecting this to come into effect on April 2nd I for one urge you to see sense. Nothing the GRA do and or say will effect the top mans decisions, he is going to bring it in as early as he chooses.

I'm prepared for then and if you and your unit are not I think your being naieve. If it has to come in why would he bother waiting?

6 on 3 1/2 off not bad! It's not realistically 4 days lads, just like after a week of nights you don't really get 2 1/2 off its more like 1 1/2

The sooner the better as far as I am concerned. I'm confused as to why it is the 2nd April and not the 1st though.

are you serious

2nd is a monday

pa990

MagicSean wrote: »

The sooner the better as far as I am concerned. I'm confused as to why it is the 2nd April and not the 1st though.

the 2nd is the start of a new roster

Delancey

Probably don't want to kick it off on April Fool's day

are you serious

pa990 wrote: »

the 2nd is the start of a new roster

Not just any roster.. The new new roster!

Hooch

d3exile wrote: »

I don't need to hide who I am..
It's the guards, lads, not MI5. If you can find i'm in any breach of the secrets act then go ahead and point em out, other than that I'm as entitled to talk about the aspects of my job that I do as much as any other worker.

Now back to the 10 week roster topic maybe?

Couple of things I just have to comment on. Not all aimed at the quoted post or poster

ESF provides a forum just like boards. It does have a secure part to the forum which I'm quite happy is near impossible to get into. Hense I post in there every now and then (but boards is better:p!!!)

Next the ESF forum does not bad mouth us so we should extend them the same courtesy

Thirdly it's up to each poster to decide how they play in regards real identities, I think any AGS member is MAD to allow their identity be known. Again, it's up to yerselves.

Finally, we're already back on topic so lets just leave it at that. No need to reply to this post.

bluetop

garkane wrote: »

Not just any roster.. The new new roster!

The one and only GRA roster, if it works it will be their brain child, and then they will be looking for a pat on the back for all the work they have put in to it, yet they are getting sub's every week to do their job. if it dont work they will blame everyone else for it, typical GRA

FGR

Ahh yes...D day..

I can see all Supers/Cigs/Sgt ICs scratching their heads wondering..

Where the feck are we going to find lads for this fabled Unit E?