The Tipperary GAA (Club and intercounty) Discussion thread 2012

Loughmore beat Mullinahone by 5.

0-22 to 2-11

Drom/Inch off to a flyer v Clonoulty. 1-3 to no score up

Christ above Drom/Inch absolutely mauled Clonoulty 2-22 to 13 points :eek:

alan27

Donal O'Grady or Justin McCarthy over any of the remaining candiates.

carryharry

Deleted User wrote: »

Christ above Drom/Inch absolutely mauled Clonoulty 2-22 to 13 points :eek:

Drom & Inch will retain their title imo.

Best panel left in the County.

Sars will be close but imo the loss of Stevie Lillis diminishes their chances greatly.

daniels.ducks

Davin Stand wrote: »

Early results from this afternoon's Intermediate Hurling Quarter Finals. Silvermines beat Moyne-Templetuohy (aet) and Sean Treacy's beat Ballybacon by 3 points.

What did I say?

ReacherCreature

alan27 wrote: »

Donal O'Grady or Justin McCarthy over any of the remaining candiates.

If history and trends suggest, the committee won't venture outside Tipperary. Would love O' Grady on board though.

robbiezero

Drom were very impressive. Even better than last year.

Even the subs they brought on took some lovely scores. Serious outfit.

Loughmore struggled to put away a poor Mullinahone side. Noel McGrath the difference between the two sides. He was outstanding when he moved out to the middle of the field.

Tipperary animal lover

How's the game going in thurlas? Anybody ...

ormond lad

Tipperary animal lover wrote: »

How's the game going in thurlas? Anybody ...

Where's thurlas?;)
Sars beating Kiladangan 2-12 to 1-6 at halftime

Tipperary animal lover

Sorry lad a few beers in me ...... Thurles.... Cheers for the up date

Alot of alarmingly one sided games in Tipp Senior hurling. So it would seem 3 mid teams in the semi's and either a North/West side joining them. I personally think Portroe will join them but only just.

Toomevara's stock has fallen alarmingly rapid the last two years. They were a great club and so dominant but no real abundance of young hurlers apart from Mark McCarthy breaking through the ranks.

For all the ideas some of the Mullinahone players have of themselves (other then the county lads that is) they contributed absolutely nothing to the 2-11 tally yesterday. I dread to think how bad they'd be if it wasnt for Eoin Kelly and to a lesser degree Sean Curran.

ormond lad

Sars just got another goal
3-16 to 1-11 48mins gone

ormond lad

ormond lad wrote: »

Sars just got another goal
3-16 to 1-11 48mins gone

2 of the quarter finals unbelievably one-sided. Paradoxically 3 divisional champions are knocked out. The county board will have to look at restructuring the championship. I know i sound like a broken record at this stage but we have 32 teams in it and an abundance of one sided games. Only 3 teams have a realistic chance of winning Dan Breen it would seem on an annual basis, OK i cant help feeling Clonoulty may be better than last nights tally suggested so that is 4 perhaps.

We cant continue to have a situation where teams go 9 weeks without playing a match as in Portroe's case tonight.

I honestly think they should at the very least experiment with creating an all county senior championship in place of the current structure.

For the first year try 8 groups of 4 teams per group. Top teams for quarters and whoever comes bottom of each group should be relegated to a premier intermediate division (SOR Cup) the following year which would also be composed of a few top intermediate teams from the previous year.

That would leave 24 Senior the following year. Have 4 groups of 6 and relegate the bottom 8 teams (6 bottom and the 2 worst 2nd bottom). Top 8 for quarters.

Year 3 you have 16 teams consisting 4 groups of 4. Top 2 from each group for Quarters. Bottom 4 for relegation semis.

the ideal situation at the end is to have Senior (16 teams), Premier Intermediate/Senior B (16 teams), Intermediate X amount of teams, Junior A with X amount of teams and Junior B with X amount of teams.

Basically though the only way we will know the true level of each team is if we have an all county championships for Snr and the IHC. We will learn nothing having them in the divisions.

Im a south man myself but would have no problem of a championship where there is divisional imbalance as i would far prefer to see the best take their place amongst the elite.

ormond lad

Deleted User wrote: »

2 of the quarter finals unbelievably one-sided. Paradoxically 3 divisional champions are knocked out. The county board will have to look at restructuring the championship. I know i sound like a broken record at this stage but we have 32 teams in it and an abundance of one sided games. Only 3 teams have a realistic chance of winning Dan Breen it would seem on an annual basis, OK i cant help feeling Clonoulty may be better than last nights tally suggested so that is 4 perhaps.

We cant continue to have a situation where teams go 9 weeks without playing a match as in Portroe's case tonight.

I honestly think they should at the very least experiment with creating an all county senior championship in place of the current structure.

For the first year try 8 groups of 4 teams per group. Top teams for quarters and whoever comes bottom of each group should be relegated to a premier intermediate division (SOR Cup) the following year which would also be composed of a few top intermediate teams from the previous year.

That would leave 24 Senior the following year. Have 4 groups of 6 and relegate the bottom 8 teams (6 bottom and the 2 worst 2nd bottom). Top 8 for quarters.

Year 3 you have 16 teams consisting 4 groups of 4. Top 2 from each group for Quarters. Bottom 4 for relegation semis.

the ideal situation at the end is to have Senior (16 teams), Premier Intermediate/Senior B (16 teams), Intermediate X amount of teams, Junior A with X amount of teams and Junior B with X amount of teams.

Basically though the only way we will know the true level of each team is if we have an all county championships for Snr and the IHC. We will learn nothing having them in the divisions.

Im a south man myself but would have no problem of a championship where there is divisional imbalance as i would far prefer to see the best take their place amongst the elite.

The championship should be restructured and numbers have to be reduced esp in the north championship where there is way too many senior sides.
What happened to Port was damn unfair and should never happen again but undoubtably will.
Would you still have divisional championships in this new format?
Divisional championships have to be kept as they give smaller clubs the chance to actually win something
Reducing the number of clubs at senior level is good but maybe to give stronger intermediate players more games at a higher level we should look to create amalgamations.

ormond lad

ormond lad wrote: »

The championship should be restructured and numbers have to be reduced esp in the north championship where there is way too many senior sides.
What happened to Port was damn unfair and should never happen again but undoubtably will.
Would you still have divisional championships in this new format?
Divisional championships have to be kept as they give smaller clubs the chance to actually win something
Reducing the number of clubs at senior level is good but maybe to give stronger intermediate players more games at a higher level we should look to create amalgamations.

I agree with your point on amalgamations tbf.

On the importance of divisional championships being kept for the sake of giving teams a chance of winning something....ah i dunno i mean i was delighted for Portroe getting their first but in these times what is a divisional title in all honesty? 3 of the semi finalists with the exception of Sars have come in the back door and 3 of them (including Sars) are from the Mid so if your the champions of the West, South or North it doesnt really mean anything in the great scheme of things and doesnt truly reflect the true level of the winning divisional teams in question any longer. In most cases its not the building block we think it is. Killenaule for example have over 20 souths but have come no where near winning the county title. Carrick Swan have 21 souths but have only ever won one county back in the late 40's.
I cannot help thinking the divisions have become peripheral and meaningless. Teams will have to learn to aim that bit higher and be a bit more ambitious then winning the division and if anything it has put alot of clubs into this very comfort zone

ormond lad

Deleted User wrote: »

I agree with your point on amalgamations tbf.

On the importance of divisional championships being kept for the sake of giving teams a chance of winning something....ah i dunno i mean i was delighted for Portroe getting their first but in these times what is a divisional title in all honesty? 3 of the semi finalists with the exception of Sars have come in the back door and 3 of them (including Sars) are from the Mid so if your the champions of the West, South or North it doesnt really mean anything in the great scheme of things and doesnt truly reflect the true level of the winning divisional teams in question any longer. In most cases its not the building block we think it is. Killenaule for example have over 20 souths but have come no where near winning the county title. Carrick Swan have 21 souths but have only ever won one county back in the late 40's.
I cannot help thinking the divisions have become peripheral and meaningless.

For most clubs esp in the bigger divisions a divisional championship once in a blue moon is the height of achievement as they wont get anywhere near a county title
Yes in the overall context of a county title winning the north means less but with the back door the bigger/stronger clubs are nearly always going to be at the business end of the county wither through winning their division or the back door.
Being totally honest the ports/burgess etc are never really going to win a county senior title but a north title is well withing their grasp and winning a divis title can be a building block in many ways
Its slightly different in divisions like the south where there's about 6 teams

ormond lad

ormond lad wrote: »

For most clubs esp in the bigger divisions a divisional championship once in a blue moon is the height of achievement as they wont get anywhere near a county title
Yes in the overall context of a county title winning the north means less but with the back door the bigger/stronger clubs are nearly always going to be at the business end of the county wither through winning their division or the back door.
Being totally honest the ports/burgess etc are never really going to win a county senior title but a north title is well withing their grasp and winning a divis title can be a building block in many ways
Its slightly different in divisions like the south where there's about 6 teams

Yeah i see where your coming from and at the end of the day GAA is all about the communities more than anything.

However, whatever about keeping them or running them separate im not so sure they have a part in the race for the county championship any longer. Id prefer to prioritise a stronger county championship and fair enough if the divisions could be accommodated alongside it then well and good but the performance in the divisional championships should no longer reflect whether you get a bye into the county quarter finals in my opinion. Maybe scrap the county league as premierstone suggested and play the divisions then instead.

robbiezero

Deleted User wrote: »

Yeah i see where your coming from and at the end of the day GAA is all about the communities more than anything.

However, whatever about keeping them or running them separate im not so sure they have a part in the race for the county championship any longer. Id prefer to prioritise a stronger county championship and fair enough if the divisions could be accommodated alongside it then well and good but the performance in the divisional championships should no longer reflect whether you get a bye into the county quarter finals in my opinion. Maybe scrap the county league as premierstone suggested and play the divisions then instead.

Deffo.
Play the divisional championships as a separate competition. Allow any team to play the senior champo of their division, but only have a set amount of seniors teams in the county championship. i.e. 16 in 4 groups of 4.

Davin Stand

Winning their first North title was a huge thing for Portroe and winning the South Senior Football for the first time was huge for Killenaule. We can not do away with these kind of days for clubs who treasure those days no matter how the county works out later.

tonyduggan

ReacherCreature wrote: »

If history and trends suggest, the committee won't venture outside Tipperary. Would love O' Grady on board though.

What would you know about history and trends, shur a few pages ago you didnt even know st marys of clonmel had a team, and and all ireland winnder from 01 on the panel.

If this O shea being unavailable is true, if its between bonnar, mcintyre and ken hogan, then surely it has to be ken? he seems to have learned a lot from his first go as manager during the dark days, if he came on board with the right selectors who knows what would happen, id be willing to give him a go anyway, if all else fails with o shea of course!

ReacherCreature

tonyduggan wrote: »

What would you know about history and trends, shur a few pages ago you didnt even know st marys of clonmel had a team, and and all ireland winnder from 01 on the panel.

If this O shea being unavailable is true, if its between bonnar, mcintyre and ken hogan, then surely it has to be ken? he seems to have learned a lot from his first go as manager during the dark days, if he came on board with the right selectors who knows what would happen, id be willing to give him a go anyway, if all else fails with o shea of course!

Nice one, be offensive and disencourage new people and fans from speaking. It's been expressed on this page that Tipperary don't go outside the county, that much I've gotten from Boards. I'm explicitly against that but oh, you can't state our opinions unless we're experts.

Sorry that we're all not a hivemind of information like your good self.

OAOB

tonyduggan wrote: »

What would you know about history and trends, shur a few pages ago you didnt even know st marys of clonmel had a team, and and all ireland winnder from 01 on the panel.

If this O shea being unavailable is true, if its between bonnar, mcintyre and ken hogan, then surely it has to be ken? he seems to have learned a lot from his first go as manager during the dark days, if he came on board with the right selectors who knows what would happen, id be willing to give him a go anyway, if all else fails with o shea of course!

No need to be obnoxious or disparaging. And his point was correct about Tipperary not wanting to go outside the county.

Personally i'd favour a Tipperary man to lead the team and if we go down that road then Ken seems like the obvious choice. If we decide a suitable candidate isn't in Tipp then i think Donal O'Grady could do a serious job with this team

tonyduggan

tonyduggan wrote: »

What would you know about history and trends, shur a few pages ago you didnt even know st marys of clonmel had a team, and and all ireland winnder from 01 on the panel.

If this O shea being unavailable is true, if its between bonnar, mcintyre and ken hogan, then surely it has to be ken? he seems to have learned a lot from his first go as manager during the dark days, if he came on board with the right selectors who knows what would happen, id be willing to give him a go anyway, if all else fails with o shea of course!

Easy there now Tony. We're all good Tipperary GAA people on this forum so there no is no need to be starting arguments with our own. If you disagree with him then just state your argument. Dont be making personal attacks and tbf to Reacher he is a regular contributor and has considerable interest and knowledge in GAA.

ReacherCreature

OAOB wrote: »

i think Donal O'Grady could do a serious job with this team

O' Grady is a bit of an enigma to me (although I'm a big fan). He stepped down as Cork boss after they halted Kilkenny's three-in-a-row when would have naturally expected him to stay on. He cited family reasons. Then he took up a job with Limerick hurling and did very well, picking up the pieces after Justin McCarthy left but he only stayed a year, 2010-11.

I think in both cases he could have remained long term and is fairly well-liked (from what I read) yet his short term stays are a little curious. I wonder does he like coaching as a long term prospect or did he not like the Cork/Limerick set ups. Now he's into work for RTÉ and TG4.

That being said, I'd welcome him aboard. He's done/did a fantastic job for Limerick and they play a lovely stylish and fluid game over there that, in parts is being continued under John Allen. We have some real good talented and athletic players that could benefit from that style of play (Lord knows, anything is better than bombing it down on top of the finest defenders in the country). But the short stays are puzzling.

However, it's looking likely that Hogan seems the top candidate, albeit unofficially from what you read here and Twitter.

tonyduggan

ReacherCreature wrote: »

Nice one, be offensive and disencourage new people and fans from speaking. It's been expressed on this page that Tipperary don't go outside the county, that much I've gotten from Boards. I'm explicitly against that but oh, you can't state our opinions unless we're experts.

Sorry that we're all not a hivemind of information like your good self.

So its if boards.ie states, not history and trends? Shur you yourself were havin a go at someone a few pages ago for being peed off at the tipp team this year, when theyd every right to be. Never said i was an expert either, didnt even imply it. Unless you feel that having an honest knowledge of the game before 2010 is being a know all?

You can state your opinion all you want. Its when the bandwagon hoppers start talking about things as if they know them, and they only after reading someone elses opinion on the internet and passing it off as their own, thats what bothers me i suppose. Tipp man or not. Ive family in waterford, and some of the cousins would be a few years older than me, and they couldnt tell you a thing about say, fergal hartley, but they seem to have a savage knowlegde of the team from around 2008ish. Funny how that works somethimes. youd say one thing if they were children.

In other news, apparantly a different song is being sung about o shea today. the rumor mill is rampant. you couldnt believe a word of it, but the uncle was telling me good news a while ago, and hed have had a few stories from the camp durin the year before they made their way into the rumor mill. so take that for what ye will.

ReacherCreature

tonyduggan wrote: »

So its if boards.ie states, not history and trends? Shur you yourself were havin a go at someone a few pages ago for being peed off at the tipp team this year, when theyd every right to be. Never said i was an expert either, didnt even imply it. Unless you feel that having an honest knowledge of the game before 2010 is being a know all?

Wasn't having a go. I was stating that the attitude is poor when it rests on gossip and unfounded knowledge. I'd rather a more coherent argument.

You can state your opinion all you want. Its when the bandwagon hoppers start talking about things as if they know them, and they only after reading someone elses opinion on the internet and passing it off as their own, thats what bothers me i suppose. Tipp man or not. Ive family in waterford, and some of the cousins would be a few years older than me, and they couldnt tell you a thing about say, fergal hartley, but they seem to have a savage knowlegde of the team from around 2008ish. Funny how that works somethimes. youd say one thing if they were children.

That logic is incredibly faulty. By that reasoning (as I can see it) then no one is allowed become a fan of the game unless you've supported them for over a decade and have a deep knowledge of it. I'm only 22 and came along during the 2010 finals, so in your logic I'm a bandwagoner even though I despise the term. So I'm not expected to know about Tipp hurling back in the 40s, 50s, 60s etc. in any great detail.

The "historical trends" is what I extrapolated purely from Boards. I didn't know a thing of it until folks on Boards were talking about it.

OAOB

Well to be honest if you're still posting about Tipperary hurling at the end of Sept and especially after the hammering we took this year the chances are you're not a bandwagoner;)

tonyduggan

ReacherCreature wrote: »

Wasn't having a go. I was stating that the attitude is poor when it rests on gossip and unfounded knowledge. I'd rather a more coherent argument.



That logic is incredibly faulty. By that reasoning (as I can see it) then no one is allowed become a fan of the game unless you've supported them for over a decade and have a deep knowledge of it. I'm only 22 and came along during the 2010 finals, so in your logic I'm a bandwagoner even though I despise the term. So I'm not expected to know about Tipp hurling back in the 40s, 50s, 60s etc. in any great detail.

The "historical trends" is what I extrapolated purely from Boards. I didn't know a thing of it until folks on Boards were talking about it.

Theres plenty of founded knowledge about the shortcomings both on and off the field this year in fairness.

Let me ask you this then, why do you love hurling so much now when you didnt watch it in 2005 or 6? Its like, to use an example, the new wave of man city fans that have suddenly made themselves known. No sign of them when shaun goater was banging them in against the goliaths of colchester and bradford, yet they make out they love the club with all their heart. I'm only a few years older than you myself lad. Its the attitude of new tipp fans. even your post there about donal o g. Maybe its just the nature of the internet when everyone can find out anything at the click of a button and act as if they know everything about it.

I know bits and bobs about tipp hurling in the 50's and that, but you wouldnt hear me saying jesus john doyle was some hurler. shur i never saw the man play. by all accounts he was, but id never act like i saw him and that. ya get me?

premierstone

tonyduggan wrote: »

In other news, apparantly a different song is being sung about o shea today. the rumor mill is rampant. you couldnt believe a word of it, but the uncle was telling me good news a while ago, and hed have had a few stories from the camp durin the year before they made their way into the rumor mill. so take that for what ye will.

Heard the same from a former player who would still be very close to the set up, and even better news he has apparently been given a 5 year contract nd will have full control of everything

tippspur

premierstone wrote: »

Heard the same from a former player who would still be very close to the set up, and even better news he has apparently been given a 5 year contract nd will have full control of everything wh:D

By God I hope all of what you say is true.:)