(UK) Stephen Lawrence murder - Dobson & Norris Guilty

biko

Batsy, I need you to find some proof of Lawrence being in a gang and that this was gang related, otherwise it's just you trolling this thread, trying to make it into something it's not. Even if other black youths are in gangs doesn't mean Lawrence was in one.
Come back when you have said proof. Thx

brummytom

El Weirdo wrote: »

I'm going to ask you again for any evidence that Stephen Lawrence was involved in gangs.

Thanks.

BECAUSE HE'S BLACK AND THEY ALL ARE!!!1111!!!



Jesus wept.

Batsy

ItsAWindUp wrote: »

Again, you are refusing to give statistics to back up these alleged facts

You wouldn't ask me for such statistics if I said that the majority of gang members are white (proving that it's not me that's racist but you).

Although I have already provided statistics. The facts are that black youths in Britain are more likely to be involved in gangs than white youths.

And pretending that that is not the case and dismissing that fact as "racist" - as the left like to do - will not solve the problem of black youths in Britain joining gangs.

There are so many gangs which are made up of predominantly black youths that, whenever it's on the news that a teenager has been stabbed to death, I always know instinctively that the victim and the perpetrator will both be black.

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

It turns out that the victim was a black gang member who once appeared in a rap song video which promoted drugs and violence.

brummytom

Batsy wrote: »

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

That's because you're a racist.

KINGVictor

Batsy wrote: »

You wouldn't ask me for such statistics if I said that the majority of gang members are white.

Although I have already provided statistics.

There are so many gangs which are made up of predominantly black youths that, whenever it's on the news that a teenager has been stabbed to death, I always know instinctively that the victim and the perpetrator will both be black.

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

It turns out that the victim was a black gang member who once appeared in a rap song video which promoted drugs and violence.

Stop equivocating and answer the damn question!!!! Do you have any proof Stephen lawrence was a Gang member?? If not shut up!

El Weirdo

Batsy wrote: »

You wouldn't ask me for such statistics if I said that the majority of gang members are white (proving that it's not me that's racist but you).

Although I have already provided statistics. The facts are that black youths in Britain are more likely to be involved in gangs than white youths.

And pretending that that is not the case and dismissing that fact as "racist" - as the left like to do - will not solve the problem of black youths in Britain joining gangs.

There are so many gangs which are made up of predominantly black youths that, whenever it's on the news that a teenager has been stabbed to death, I always know instinctively that the victim and the perpetrator will both be black.

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

It turns out that the victim was a black gang member who once appeared in a rap song video which promoted drugs and violence.

Here's a statistic:

99.99% of your posts are utter bollocks.

Fact.

Dudess

Batsy wrote: »

ItsAWindUp wrote: »

Again, you are refusing to give statistics to back up these alleged facts

You wouldn't ask me for such statistics if I said that the majority of gang members are white (proving that it's not me that's racist but you).

Although I have already provided statistics. The facts are that black youths in Britain are more likely to be involved in gangs than white youths.

And pretending that that is not the case and dismissing that fact as "racist" - as the left like to do - will not solve the problem of black youths in Britain joining gangs.

There are so many gangs which are made up of predominantly black youths that, whenever it's on the news that a teenager has been stabbed to death, I always know instinctively that the victim and the perpetrator will both be black.

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

It turns out that the victim was a black gang member who once appeared in a rap song video which promoted drugs and violence.

How do you know they wouldn't ask for stats about white gang members? No, that assumption proves nothing whatsoever. But you most certainly are a racist - just admit it, it won't shock anyone.
Now again, stats on other black people aside, why are you so sure he was in a gang and stabbed by a rival gang member. Solid reasons, not racially/geographically based assumptions, would be sweet.

Batsy

Challenging gang culture


Mark Easton
18:04 UK time
Thursday, 9 July 2009
BBC



The values of black gang culture are as warped and vile as anything preached in al-Qaeda's terror camps. The death and suffering which follow from its violent, misogynistic dogma are no less devastating.

Just read the background to the murder of 16-year-old Shakilus Townsend if you don't believe me. It makes one weep.

The young man lying in a suburban cul-de-sac cried: "Mummy, mummy, mummy. I don't want to die."

But die he did, with a gaping hole in his stomach where one of his killers had twisted the blade of a knife.

So many aspects of this tale make one catch one's breath:

• the fact that young Shakilus had been led to his gang-land execution by his ex-girlfriend, a 15-year-old schoolgirl;

• the fact that the victim had posted a social networking site profile of himself wearing a stab-vest and holding a knife next to a message in which he warns that if you mess with him he will "slash your face up"

• the fact that two of his killers had "tried hard" to build up a criminal record - the pre-requisite of a true gangster;

• the fact that Samantha Joseph - the girl in the "love triangle" - was prepared to see Shakilus murdered in order to win back gangster Danny Mclean, a man who beat her regularly.

These are the features of a parallel morality, a distorted interpretation of the creed of capitalism where bling is king, where tolerance is weakness, where women are whores, where a criminal record is a badge of honour, where lack of "respect" justifies bullying, torture and even murder.

It is a form of imported fundamentalism as alien to democratic society as the views of the most hard-line Islamists.

When fighting al-Qaeda-inspired terror, the focus is not on the weapons but the ideology. When fighting murderous gang-culture, it seems to me, the focus is not on the ideology but the weapons.

Politicians obsess about knives and guns but do far les
s to counteract the values which inspire the behaviour.

British gang culture models itself on the criminal underworld of black ghettoes in America. There are, of course, white and Asian youths involved in gang violence and crime here in the UK. But look at its victims.

Look at the mug-shots. Overwhelmingly they are black - tragic black youths corrupted by a culture which should have no place here.

So why do we tolerate the preachers of black gang culture? Who is effectively challenging this stuff? I don't mean banning it - that almost certainly wouldn't work.

A better approach might be to mock it - make it appear so unsophisticated and out-dated that no self-respecting young black kid would want to be associated with it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/07/challenging_gang_culture.html

ItsAWindUp

biko wrote: »

Batsy, I need you to find some proof of Lawrence being in a gang and that this was gang related, otherwise it's just you trolling this thread, trying to make it into something it's not. Even if other black youths are in gangs doesn't mean Lawrence was in one.
Come back when you have said proof. Thx

I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you tbh

Dudess

Batsy wrote: »

[SIZE="5"]Challenging gang culture[/SIZE]


Mark Easton
18:04 UK time
Thursday, 9 July 2009
BBC



The values of black gang culture are as warped and vile as anything preached in al-Qaeda's terror camps. The death and suffering which follow from its violent, misogynistic dogma are no less devastating.

Just read the background to the murder of 16-year-old Shakilus Townsend if you don't believe me. It makes one weep.

The young man lying in a suburban cul-de-sac cried: "Mummy, mummy, mummy. I don't want to die."

But die he did, with a gaping hole in his stomach where one of his killers had twisted the blade of a knife.

So many aspects of this tale make one catch one's breath:

• the fact that young Shakilus had been led to his gang-land execution by his ex-girlfriend, a 15-year-old schoolgirl;

• the fact that the victim had posted a social networking site profile of himself wearing a stab-vest and holding a knife next to a message in which he warns that if you mess with him he will "slash your face up"

• the fact that two of his killers had "tried hard" to build up a criminal record - the pre-requisite of a true gangster;

• the fact that Samantha Joseph - the girl in the "love triangle" - was prepared to see Shakilus murdered in order to win back gangster Danny Mclean, a man who beat her regularly.

These are the features of a parallel morality, a distorted interpretation of the creed of capitalism where bling is king, where tolerance is weakness, where women are whores, where a criminal record is a badge of honour, where lack of "respect" justifies bullying, torture and even murder.

It is a form of imported fundamentalism as alien to democratic society as the views of the most hard-line Islamists.

When fighting al-Qaeda-inspired terror, the focus is not on the weapons but the ideology. When fighting murderous gang-culture, it seems to me, the focus is not on the ideology but the weapons.

Politicians obsess about knives and guns but do far les
s to counteract the values which inspire the behaviour.

British gang culture models itself on the criminal underworld of black ghettoes in America. There are, of course, white and Asian youths involved in gang violence and crime here in the UK. But look at its victims.

Look at the mug-shots. Overwhelmingly they are black - tragic black youths corrupted by a culture which should have no place here.

So why do we tolerate the preachers of black gang culture? Who is effectively challenging this stuff? I don't mean banning it - that almost certainly wouldn't work.

A better approach might be to mock it - make it appear so unsophisticated and out-dated that no self-respecting young black kid would want to be associated with it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/07/challenging_gang_culture.html

Horrible stuff indeed. And a serious problem for black communities.
Now again, why are you pretty much certain Stephen was in a gang and those thugs didn't kill him?

AnonoBoy

Batsy wrote: »

Challenging gang culture

None of that has anything to do with Steven Lawrence.

It must be sad to be as deluded as you quite obviously are. You know full well you have no proof that Lawrence was ever involved in gangs but continue to rabbit on about gang culture as if it has something to do with this case.

KINGVictor

Batsy wrote: »

Challenging gang culture


Mark Easton
18:04 UK time
Thursday, 9 July 2009
BBC



The values of black gang culture are as warped and vile as anything preached in al-Qaeda's terror camps. The death and suffering which follow from its violent, misogynistic dogma are no less devastating.

Just read the background to the murder of 16-year-old Shakilus Townsend if you don't believe me. It makes one weep.

The young man lying in a suburban cul-de-sac cried: "Mummy, mummy, mummy. I don't want to die."

But die he did, with a gaping hole in his stomach where one of his killers had twisted the blade of a knife.

So many aspects of this tale make one catch one's breath:

• the fact that young Shakilus had been led to his gang-land execution by his ex-girlfriend, a 15-year-old schoolgirl;

• the fact that the victim had posted a social networking site profile of himself wearing a stab-vest and holding a knife next to a message in which he warns that if you mess with him he will "slash your face up"

• the fact that two of his killers had "tried hard" to build up a criminal record - the pre-requisite of a true gangster;

• the fact that Samantha Joseph - the girl in the "love triangle" - was prepared to see Shakilus murdered in order to win back gangster Danny Mclean, a man who beat her regularly.

These are the features of a parallel morality, a distorted interpretation of the creed of capitalism where bling is king, where tolerance is weakness, where women are whores, where a criminal record is a badge of honour, where lack of "respect" justifies bullying, torture and even murder.

It is a form of imported fundamentalism as alien to democratic society as the views of the most hard-line Islamists.

When fighting al-Qaeda-inspired terror, the focus is not on the weapons but the ideology. When fighting murderous gang-culture, it seems to me, the focus is not on the ideology but the weapons.

Politicians obsess about knives and guns but do far les
s to counteract the values which inspire the behaviour.

British gang culture models itself on the criminal underworld of black ghettoes in America. There are, of course, white and Asian youths involved in gang violence and crime here in the UK. But look at its victims.

Look at the mug-shots. Overwhelmingly they are black - tragic black youths corrupted by a culture which should have no place here.

So why do we tolerate the preachers of black gang culture? Who is effectively challenging this stuff? I don't mean banning it - that almost certainly wouldn't work.

A better approach might be to mock it - make it appear so unsophisticated and out-dated that no self-respecting young black kid would want to be associated with it.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thereporters/markeaston/2009/07/challenging_gang_culture.html

You have been repeatedly warned about this sort of lazy and daft posts.

You post an entire link that you think supports your argument without making any meaningful contribution whatsoever, how does the above post prove that lawrence was a gang member or that his killing wasn't racially motivated?

Batsy, you got to do better than that

ItsAWindUp

Batsy, you are a racist troll.

bruschi

Batsy wrote: »

You wouldn't ask me for such statistics if I said that the majority of gang members are white (proving that it's not me that's racist but you).

Although I have already provided statistics. The facts are that black youths in Britain are more likely to be involved in gangs than white youths.

And pretending that that is not the case and dismissing that fact as "racist" - as the left like to do - will not solve the problem of black youths in Britain joining gangs.

There are so many gangs which are made up of predominantly black youths that, whenever it's on the news that a teenager has been stabbed to death, I always know instinctively that the victim and the perpetrator will both be black.

On Boxing Day it was on the news that a guy had been stabbed to death on London's Oxford Street. I thought: "I bet the victim is a black gang member."

It turns out that the victim was a black gang member who once appeared in a rap song video which promoted drugs and violence.

so would it be far to say in this case, that you know nothing of the facts, at all, and are basing all your assumptions on Stephen Lawrences case on your prejudices and racist beliefs, rather than actually looking at the facts? Your mind was made up before any case was put forward, if we are to believe your way of thinking. you see Stephen Lawrence killed, and you already automatcially assume he was killed by another black gang member.

If the forensic evidence was so flimsy, then why was it permissable?
Why was it so strong that it over turned a double jeopardy case, which seldom (if ever) happens?
How come when they re did tests to see if the same results from dried blood from 'contamination' could produce the same results, it was negative, and the blood found, no matter how miniscule could only have been ingrained from fresh blood?
How could blood from Stephen Lawrence get onto clothes belonging to these men? It was proved it COULD NOT be derived from cross contamination. Tests were done.


Or, do you still want to stay on your racist prejudices and not actually look at fact, and keep writing rubbish but yet keep claiming this nonsense as facts?

mackg

Arianna_26 wrote: »

So what you are saying is that the only reason any Irish people have sympathy for an innocent man like Stephen Lawrence is because we don't have to deal with black communities here? Wow.

tl;dr the blacks are grand in theory :pac:

Batsy and BWatson since you're in the UK yourselves what do your black mates think of all this?

Batsy

Originally Posted by biko
Batsy, I need you to find some proof of Lawrence being in a gang and that this was gang related, otherwise it's just you trolling this thread, trying to make it into something it's not. Even if other black youths are in gangs doesn't mean Lawrence was in one.
Come back when you have said proof. Thx

I don't think there's any proof that Dobson and Norris killed Lawrence, apart from a few hairs from their clothes that were found on some of Lawrence's clothes.

"That is proof that they killed him!!" you all cry, even after being told that Norris and Dobson's clothes that were being used for evidence were stored right next to Lawrence's clothes in a storage room and that, therefore, it's likely that hairs from their clothes went onto Lawrence's clothes whilst they were being stored.

And the two were convicted on the fact that a few hairs from their clothes were found on Lawrence's jacket, despite their clothes and Lawrence's clothes being stored together in the same storage room!

Today is not a day to be proud of British justice.

AnonoBoy

You've gone all quiet on the "Lawrence was in a gang" lark suddenly haven't you Batsy?

It must be very annoying for you when actual facts are asked for.

brummytom

Batsy wrote: »

I don't think there's any proof that Dobson and Norris killed Lawrence, apart from a few hairs from their clothes that were found on some of Lawrence's clothes.

"That is proof that they killed him!!" you all cry, even after being told that Norris and Dobson's clothes that were being used for evidence were stored right next to Lawrence's clothes in a storage room and that, therefore, it's likely that hairs from their clothes went onto Lawrence's clothes whilst they were being stored.

How is that likely at all? Do you really think forensic scientists are that incompetent? Would the defence not have mentioned that?

There is evidence they killed Lawrence. There is absolutely none he was in a gang. Give up.

Today is not a day to be proud of British justice.

Reading your posts, I couldn't be any less proud to be British.

Dudess

We don't "cry" anything because there's far more evidence than that - evidence you'd be happy with if they were white and their victim black.
So anyway... the proof he was in a gang and killed by a rival gang member - our breaths are baited here.

Intensive Care Bear

I used to work with a guy (mixed race so i don't think he had anything against black people) who lived beside Stephen Lawrence and i remember him telling me years ago that Stephen Lawrence was part of a gang who used to break into cars, rob people etc and was know locally as a "proper rude boy" Now i have no way of knowing how true this is and in my opinion it doesn't matter (Hearsay not proof), i just thought id mention it. BTW i'm glad these guys have been locked up and hopefully more convictions will follow.

mackg

brummytom wrote: »

How is that likely at all? Do you really think forensic scientists are that incompetent? Would the defence not have mentioned that?

There is evidence they killed Lawrence. There is absolutely none he was in a gang. Give up.


Reading your posts, I couldn't be any less proud to be British.

He's doing for British pride what Fr. Neil Horan did for Irish.

KINGVictor

Batsy wrote: »

I don't think there's any proof that Dobson and Norris killed Lawrence, apart from a few hairs from their clothes that were found on some of Lawrence's clothes.

"That is proof that they killed him!!" you all cry, even after being told that Norris and Dobson's clothes that were being used for evidence were stored right next to Lawrence's clothes in a storage room and that, therefore, it's likely that hairs from their clothes went onto Lawrence's clothes whilst they were being stored.

And the two were convicted on the fact that a few hairs from their clothes were found on Lawrence's jacket, despite their clothes and Lawrence's clothes being stored together in the same storage room!

Today is not a day to be proud of British justice.

Yes it would not be a proud day for racists and their apologists-including Dobson/Norris friends that the prosecution team has warned that they would be coming for them.

However, the majority of the British public and all peoples with any civility left in them would be rest assured that no matter how long it takes- Justice shall surely be served!

fedor.2.

Whats with all the english racists in this thread, i always thought they had their own sh1tty websites for that

Dudess

1210m5g wrote: »

I used to work with a guy (mixed race so i don't think he had anything against black people) who lived beside Stephen Lawrence and i remember him telling me years ago that Stephen Lawrence was part of a gang who used to break into cars, rob people etc and was know locally as a "proper rude boy" Now i have no way of knowing how true this is and in my opinion it doesn't matter (Hearsay), i just thought id mention it. BTW i'm glad these guys have been locked up and hopefully more convictions will follow.

Yeah maybe it's true, but maybe it's bullsh1t - we don't know. Batsy will use it as an official source though. And how come none of that ever leaked out through police findings? Oh yeah, the "black protecting" conspiracy nobody can prove, despite the fact some of the police involved were found to have racial biases.

Tipsy McSwagger

After looking at those YouTube videos of the Martin Bashir interviews with the suspects, I don't understand why they don't refer to killing Stephen Lawrence in the secret police videos. They go on about killing **** & pakis and lots of other racist stuff but never boast about killing Stephen Lawrence. I'm not saying they are innocent at all, it just doesn't make sense. The only thing why they don't say anything is maybe because someone not involved is in the room.

Intensive Care Bear

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah maybe it's true, but maybe it's bullsh1t - we don't know. Batsy will use it as an official source though. And how come none of that ever leaked out through police findings? Oh yeah, the "black protecting" conspiracy nobody can prove, despite the fact some of the police involved were found to have racial biases.

For the record i don't believe in any "black protecting conspiracy's" and i acknowledged what i was told could have been Bulls*it, i just thought i'd share an opinion from someone who lived near by.

Dudess

1210m5g wrote: »

Dudess wrote: »

Yeah maybe it's true, but maybe it's bullsh1t - we don't know. Batsy will use it as an official source though. And how come none of that ever leaked out through police findings? Oh yeah, the "black protecting" conspiracy nobody can prove, despite the fact some of the police involved were found to have racial biases.

For the record i don't believe in any "black protecting conspiracy's" and i acknowledged what i was told could have been Bulls*it, i just thought i'd share an opinion from someone who lived near by.

Oh sorry - I didn't mean it towards you.

AnonoBoy

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

The only thing why they don't say anything is maybe because someone not involved is in the room.

Good chance of that alright. Considering they knew they were suspects it would be extremely stupid of them to boast about it no matter how friendly they were with the guys in the room.

biko

Batsy banned

Logical Fallacy

Batsy wrote: »

I don't think there's any proof that Dobson and Norris killed Lawrence, apart from a few hairs from their clothes that were found on some of Lawrence's clothes.

"That is proof that they killed him!!" you all cry, even after being told that Norris and Dobson's clothes that were being used for evidence were stored right next to Lawrence's clothes in a storage room and that, therefore, it's likely that hairs from their clothes went onto Lawrence's clothes whilst they were being stored.

And the two were convicted on the fact that a few hairs from their clothes were found on Lawrence's jacket, despite their clothes and Lawrence's clothes being stored together in the same storage room!

Today is not a day to be proud of British justice.

Yes, if there is one thing about forensic evidence it is that it's kept in a big pile. Not with each item sealed off in a separate air tight bag.

bwatson

mackg wrote: »

tl;dr the blacks are grand in theory :pac:

Batsy and BWatson since you're in the UK yourselves what do your black mates think of all this?

I have no close black friends in London or (less surprisingly) Ballymena. What is the point of your question btw? Does such an answer make me a racist now?

bwatson

brummytom wrote: »

How is that likely at all? Do you really think forensic scientists are that incompetent? Would the defence not have mentioned that?

There is evidence they killed Lawrence. There is absolutely none he was in a gang. Give up.


Reading your posts, I couldn't be any less proud to be British.

I'm sure I remember reading in a thread that you identified as Irish, not more than a week ago? Not really relevant to Stephen Lawrence really, but I'm sure Arianna can make it so as she did one of my posts earlier.

Arianna_26

bwatson wrote: »

I'm sure I remember reading in a thread that you identified as Irish, not more than a week ago? Not really relevant to Stephen Lawrence really, but I'm sure Arianna can make it so as she did one of my posts earlier.

:rolleyes:

KINGVictor

bwatson wrote: »

I have no close black friends in London or (less surprisingly) Ballymena. What is the point of your question btw? Does such an answer make me a racist now?

You said in an earlier post that Black people are very racist towards White people!

When you were probed to provide evidence to support your comment, you said that it is as a result of personal experience and experience of 'others'- you even indicated that the average Irish poster is tolerant because Ireland does not have a similar black population relative to the UK.

Can you explain what you meant?

44leto

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Yes, if there is one thing about forensic evidence it is that it's kept in a big pile. Not with each item sealed off in a separate air tight bag.

But the blood had to be wet to get onto the jacket, if it was cross contamination the blood would have been dry.

Then the defence questioned could the blood have got there in a test they do by using water, again the answer was NO, the blood had to have came from Stephens stabbed body while it was wet.

They were there alright, they are guilty.

brummytom

bwatson wrote: »

I'm sure I remember reading in a thread that you identified as Irish, not more than a week ago? Not really relevant to Stephen Lawrence really, but I'm sure Arianna can make it so as she did one of my posts earlier.

I've never called myself Irish, ever. I recently had a thread (over a week ago, though) asking what it meant to be a 'Plastic Paddy' though, if that's what you're referring to?

I don't really see how that's relevant in any way, to anything though?

mackg

bwatson wrote: »

I have no close black friends in London or (less surprisingly) Ballymena. What is the point of your question btw? Does such an answer make me a racist now?

No of course it doesn't, saying you're a racist because you don't have any black friends would be as ridiculous as saying someone was in a gang because they were black.

bwatson

KINGVictor wrote: »

You said in an earlier post that Black people are very racist towards White people!

When you were probed to provide evidence to support your comment, you said that it is as a result of personal experience and experience of 'others'- you even indicated that the average Irish poster is tolerant because Ireland does not have a similar black population relative to the UK.

Can you explain what you meant?

There is very much a difference between classing someone as a friend and someone as an associate, fellow student, neighbour, co-worker and so on. Are you trying to suggest that because I would not class anyone who is black as being a "close friend" I am in fact totally ignorant of any social or cultural issues which may exist in London?

bwatson

mackg wrote: »

No of course it doesn't, saying you're a racist because you don't have any black friends would be as ridiculous as saying someone was in a gang because they were black.

Are you suggesting that I said such a thing?

Defiler Of The Coffin

Batsy wrote: »

I don't think there's any proof that Dobson and Norris killed Lawrence, apart from a few hairs from their clothes that were found on some of Lawrence's clothes.

There was blood from Stephen Lawrence found on the guilty pairs clothes too. The evidence against them is a lot stronger than what you are making it out to be.

Right from the get go the cops had a good idea of who the killers were.

Dudess

bwatson wrote: »

brummytom wrote: »

How is that likely at all? Do you really think forensic scientists are that incompetent? Would the defence not have mentioned that?

There is evidence they killed Lawrence. There is absolutely none he was in a gang. Give up.


Reading your posts, I couldn't be any less proud to be British.

I'm sure I remember reading in a thread that you identified as Irish, not more than a week ago? Not really relevant to Stephen Lawrence really, but I'm sure Arianna can make it so as she did one of my posts earlier.

Why did you bring it up on a thread about Stephen Lawrence so?

amacachi

FFS people if you're going to respond to racist trolling at least don't give them a chance to be right about something. Asking and picking on a point like "black people are more likely to be in gangs" just gives the racist a chance to be right, focus on the stuff they're saying that isn't true.

mackg

The average Irish person will be far more sympathetic towards black people because there are far fewer, far smaller black communities in the Republic at the moment. Generally, blacks are by far the most viciously racist section of British society, not just to whites, but mainly to whites.

Of course racism exists in all peoples in Britain, but most will not accept that it is anyone but the native whites who are the perpetrators of such crimes.

Tbf to you apart from this coming off as a really racist post (however you may have meant it) you are nowhere near as bad as the other guy and tbh I was getting the 2 of ye mixed up. What exactly do you have to say about this particular topic? All I've gotten from your posts is that black people are racist and the subsequent defence of this statement.

KINGVictor

bwatson wrote: »

There is very much a difference between classing someone as a friend and someone as an associate, fellow student, neighbour, co-worker and so on. Are you trying to suggest that because I would not class anyone who is black as being a "close friend" I am in fact totally ignorant of any social or cultural issues which may exist in London?

Did you read my post or you are just purposely evading my questions? I am asking you to clarify your comments.

I don't care if you have black friends or not, that is your prerogative and no one can fault you for that.

However, to reiterate, you said that Blacks are very racist towards White people from your experience ( and the experience of 'others').... you further stated that the average Irish poster here would support black people because Ireland does not have a black population relative to the UK.

I dont understand that- can you kindly explain what you meant?

starviewadams

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

After looking at those YouTube videos of the Martin Bashir interviews with the suspects, I don't understand why they don't refer to killing Stephen Lawrence in the secret police videos. They go on about killing **** & pakis and lots of other racist stuff but never boast about killing Stephen Lawrence. I'm not saying they are innocent at all, it just doesn't make sense. The only thing why they don't say anything is maybe because someone not involved is in the room.

There was suspicion that one of the lead detectives in the original investigation was being bribed by one of the accused fathers(a known drug/gun smuggler)to protect the 5 accused as best he could,so if that was the case they more then likely knew that their flat had been bugged by the MPS so didn't talk about the murder openly.

It's mentioned in this documentary from around the 6 minute mark:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MrpFMm353Rw

bwatson

mackg wrote: »

Tbf to you apart from this coming off as a really racist post (however you may have meant it) you are nowhere near as bad as the other guy and tbh I was getting the 2 of ye mixed up. What exactly do you have to say about this particular topic? All I've gotten from your posts is that black people are racist and the subsequent defence of this statement.

So it is racist now to say that black people are by far the most intollerant section of British society that I have come across? I have formed this opinion from my own experiences and as I have said, the experiences of my peers. Of course I do not think that all blacks are racist and that all blacks are in gangs, however I cannot say that my opinions have not been forged through experience. Before moving to London for the first time, less than three years ago, I would probably have had no opinion or input in this thread whatsoever.

I would feel safer walking through some parts of Derry with my face painted orange than I would some areas in London, less than 10 minutes away from where many people I know live.

bwatson

KINGVictor wrote: »

Did you read my post or you are just purposely evading my questions? I am asking you to clarify your comments.

I don't care if you have black friends or not, that is your prerogative and no one can fault you for that.

However, to reiterate, you said that Blacks are very racist towards White people from your experience ( and the experience of 'others').... you further stated that the average Irish poster here would support black people because Ireland does not have a black population relative to the UK.

I dont understand that- can you kindly explain what you meant?

By others, I generally mean people who are not me.

KINGVictor

bwatson wrote: »

By others, I generally mean people who are not me.

I was expecting more explanation than that tbh.

I am not too sure but I assume you said you are in University where the importance of facts and empirical evidence must have been taught. You have not explicated these personal experiences and as you know in a debate of this manner, anecdotal evidence is basically unreliable- because anyone here can come up with them.

So can you explain why you think Blacks are 'very racists' towards White people from your own experience. Also can you explain why you think the 'average Irish poster' would support Blacks because they do not have a relative population of blacks in Ireland compared to the Uk.

brummytom

Sorry to butt in.

As an English person (oh look, I didn't say I was Irish!), I feel that black and white communities get on better than any other. Black immigrants have assimilated into society in a way other groups haven't.

mackg

bwatson wrote: »

So it is racist now to say that black people are by far the most intollerant section of British society that I have come across? I have formed this opinion from my own experiences and as I have said, the experiences of my peers. Of course I do not think that all blacks are racist and that all blacks are in gangs, however I cannot say that my opinions have not been forged through experience. Before moving to London for the first time, less than three years ago, I would probably have had no opinion or input in this thread whatsoever.

I would feel safer walking through some parts of Derry with my face painted orange than I would some areas in London, less than 10 minutes away from where many people I know live.

Yeah ok, I said your post came across as racist even allowing that you may have not meant it that way, what I'm asking is what does some black people in your experience being intolerant have to do with the conviction of these two lads for this murder, if you have explained already simply link the post.