Extractor fan and a 2 way switch

yop

Hello,
I did a few searches but I didn't find the answers I think!

2 questions here please;

I am wiring up a shed at the moment with an office upstairs.
I have a light upstairs in office, I have a light in a small bathroom with extractor fan for the "Eau de Toillet" and then a light on the stair well.
The light in the office has 1 switch.
The light in the bathroom has a switch which operates the fan and light.
The light in the hall is controlled from a switch upstairs and a switch downstairs.


So I have run a 1.5 twin and earth from the fuseboard to the ceiling rose. I have ran a twin and earth from ceiling rose to the switch for this.

I have run a T&E from ceiling rose above to ceiling rose for light in bathroom.
I have a T&E from ceiling rose to the light switch.
*** NEED IDEA WHAT TO DO WITH THE EXTRACTOR****

I have run a T&E from ceiling rose in Bathroom to ceiling rose for hall light.
I have run a T&E from ceiling rose in hall light to light switch at top of stairs.
I have run a T&E from light switch at top of stairs to light switch at bottom of stairs.

Ok so this is where I have my questions

1 - Extractor fan - I have read that I run a wire from the ceiling rose to the extractor, but I have read about terminal boxes. Is this standard T&E?
Do I also run a T&E from the extractor to the switch or how is this wired?

2 - Hall Light - I have seen 2 different diagrams but I am not sure which is the correct 1 so I would appreciate some guidance on this.
Have I ran the correct wires, from ceiling rose to switch 1 and then from switch 1 to switch 2?
Is there a wire to be run from switch 2 back to ceiling rose?
Am I ok using T&E from switch 1 to switch 2? If told them in the electrical wholesaler what I was wiring and this is what he gave me.
What is the wiring then for this? I have a good idea but I would prefer to know from you lads who definitely know!

I have only the cables ran, so nothing connected yet!

Another question, maybe you can't answer this, but this shed is wired off the fuse board in the house. Will the shed be covered for insurance if an official spark doesn't sign off?

Thanks v much

concur4u?

the way you have it wired will not meet with current regs and wiring practice

and yes it can effect your insurance

yop

concur4u? wrote: »

the way you have it wired will not meet with current regs and wiring practice

and yes it can effect your insurance

It was more of a question of if its not right then what is the right way?

concur4u?

the fan and the bathroom have to be wired on a dedicated circuit with a saftey device fitted to meet new regs and then any other lights on another circuit

can be wired in singles or t+e you seem to following the loop in system

yop

concur4u? wrote: »

the fan and the bathroom have to be wired on a dedicated circuit with a saftey device fitted to meet new regs and then any other lights on another circuit

can be wired in singles or t+e you seem to following the loop in system

Ok thats sound.
So I need to run a separate T&E off its own breaker from the fuse board to the bathroom ceiling rose or to a safety device in the bathroom?

If I take the loop from the office light to the bathroom out and wire from office to the hall light instead, then is that ok?

concur4u?

an rcd protected t+e for any bathroom power and ioslolater for fan

and then another for any other lights

Bruthal

The bathroom light will have its own circuit from an RCBO. I dont see any problem having the extractor fan wired from this lighting circuit.

But the bathroom should have its own dedicated lighting circuit from a 10 amp RCBO.

The order i have the feed, neutral and switch wire in ceiling rose in diagram might not be right, but you can judge from where the bulb is connected to as to what terminals are what.

Here are some diagrams.

Extractor fan wiring.


Note the extractor fan has a 3 pole isolator. The diagram above is for a fan with timer, but if a fan without timer is used, you should still wire as above but put the permanent live (PL) into a connector inside the fan terminal area.

I have the PL and SL to isolator coming from the switch, but they can be taken from the ceiling rose in the ceiling rose fed setup. If done as per above, a single pvc/pvc blue is brought from ceiling rose to isolator for fan neutral. The fan isolator would be outside the bathroom door.

2 way switching from ceiling rose.








The twin and earth to the switches should be twin brown and earth rather than brown and blue. As the diagram above shows, you will need twin brown to the first switch from ceiling rose, and another between switches, as well as a single core pvc/pvc brown between both switches connecting the 2 commons (C). All earths need to be connected.

In reality its a job for an electrician.

Bruthal

yop wrote: »

Ok thats sound.
So I need to run a separate T&E off its own breaker from the fuse board to the bathroom ceiling rose or to a safety device in the bathroom?

Yes as said, a dedicated circuit for the bathroom light, direct from the MCB board which you will have in the shed building. Then the other lights can be looped together and connected back to the board also.

The bathroom one needs a 10 amp RCBO.

It is one for a sparks anyway. These jobs are never really done well by non electricians

yop

Mighty that makes sense.
I have the wiring ok for the 2 way switch then going by that.
I will run a dedicated supply to the bathroom and use a 3 way isolator.

I question there in your diagram bout the 2 way switch.

You have a 2nd blue there under the "Supply to ceiling rose", where is that going to as it doesn't seem to go anywhere.

Bruthal

yop wrote: »

I question there in your diagram bout the 2 way switch.

You have a 2nd blue there under the "Supply to ceiling rose", where is that going to as it doesn't seem to go anywhere.

That blue wire is the remenants of the forst diagram for the extractor fan, as i used the same diagram but altered it. I forgot to rub that out properly:D

There will be an empty terminal in the ceiling roses, thats where the live loops in and out to supply the ceiling rose. Then the blue loops in and out where the ceiling rose bulb fitting has its blue connected. So they are where you being the live and neutral feed to the rose, and back out to the next rose. The bathroom one will just have a single supply in as it will be on its own circuit.

Bruthal

yop wrote: »

Mighty that makes sense.
I have the wiring ok for the 2 way switch then going by that.

Dont forget you need 3 wires between the 2 way switches, and an earth. So a twin and earth is 1 core short. So a single pvc/pvc brown should be run between the 2 2way switches as well as the t&e

I will run a dedicated supply to the bathroom and use a 3 way isolator.

There is a proper 3 pole isolator for extractor fans. Its the size of a light switch except the rocker is much wider.

yop

robbie7730 wrote: »

That blue wire is the remenants of the forst diagram for the extractor fan, as i used the same diagram but altered it. I forgot to rub that out properly:D
.

Lol, sound job!

robbie7730 wrote: »

Dont forget you need 3 wires between the 2 way switches, and an earth. So a twin and earth is 1 core short. So a single pvc/pvc brown should be run between the 2 2way switches as well as the t&e

Perfect, will run that.

robbie7730 wrote: »

There is a proper 3 pole isolator for extractor fans. Its the size of a light switch except the rocker is much wider.

I spotted that for the fan in our own bathroom. Thanks for that.

yop

Quick question, the cable there between the 2 switches, which is currently a T&E, what is happening the earth on that? Is it not used?

These are plastic surfaces boxes btw.

If the earth is not used, could I use it and strip it back and put a brown cover on the ends of it, instead of running 1 single brown between these 2 switches?

Just curious on that point.

Bruthal

yop wrote: »

Quick question, the cable there between the 2 switches, which is currently a T&E, what is happening the earth on that? Is it not used?

These are plastic surfaces boxes btw.

If the earth is not used, could I use it and strip it back and put a brown cover on the ends of it, instead of running 1 single brown between these 2 switches?

Just curious on that point.

No that would be the best of cowboy work to do that. Run in the extra single core pvc/pvc brown.

Plastic boxes usually have earth terminals in them. If not, you put the earth into a connector. Plenty of slack on it, not cut just barely long enough. Later on, you may change to metal switches etc.

So the earth connects from the ceiling rose earth down to the first switch, and loops to the second.

The ceiling rose earth is usually a single big brass connector, the supply and loop out cable earths will go into it, as well as the earths of cables going down to the switches.

The earth core should be sleeved with earth sleeving properly. Leaving it bare is also another complete cowboy job.

yop

robbie7730 wrote: »

No that would be the best of cowboy work to do that. Run in the extra single core pvc/pvc brown.

Plastic boxes usually have earth terminals in them. If not, you put the earth into a connector. Plenty of slack on it, not cut just barely long enough. Later on, you may change to metal switches etc.

So the earth connects from the ceiling rose earth down to the first switch, and loops to the second.

The ceiling rose earth is usually a single big brass connector, the supply and loop out cable earths will go into it, as well as the earths of cables going down to the switches.

The earth core should be sleeved with earth sleeving properly. Leaving it bare is also another complete cowboy job.

What near worrying about that is that the electrical wholesaler, who are Connaught wide if not country wide, told me to wire brown to L1, blue to L2 and use the earth in the earth as the common!
I expected to get another cable as you mentioned but I got the "Thats the way they are doing them"....... :eek:

Thanks for all the advice, I have enough now to go away and blow myself up

M cebee

yop wrote: »

What near worrying about that is that the electrical wholesaler, who are Connaught wide if not country wide, told me to wire brown to L1, blue to L2 and use the earth in the earth as the common!
I expected to get another cable as you mentioned but I got the "Thats the way they are doing them"....... :eek:

Thanks for all the advice, I have enough now to go away and blow myself up

don't worry bout that:) i'd be worried if they were right

Bruthal

M cebee wrote: »

don't worry bout that:) i'd be worried if they were right

Indeed, i dont think there is much to worry about.

yop

robbie7730 wrote: »

Indeed, i dont think there is much to worry about.

Bit like saying that they government are in their jobs cause they know what they are on about...

Thanks again lads.