Slave labour jobs available

ThePower11

Eamon Gilmore and his Labour cohorts should be strung up for even allowing talk of this hair brained scheme.

Dudess

I can understand someone, who is desperate for a job to have structure and get out of the house, taking one of these roles, but the system is utterly repugnant IMO - exploitation of a most cynical kind.
I really doubt there's a well intentioned "chance to build experience" sentiment behind it - it is a cost-cutting measure, nothing else. Something well intentioned would be just: a job fully paid by the company, with standard conditions.

Doctor Jimbob

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Arrogant?

Is it arrogant to think that wasting six months of your life emptying trucks and moving boxes around for no reward is a bad life experience?

Maybe you might enjoy tiring yourself out every day to help the shareholders of DSG get higher dividends. If you do, more power to you. As for me I can think of far better things to do with my time.

Yes. In my opinion it is. There is a reward. You get money for it.

I don't see why the second part even has to come into it from a jobseekers point of view to be honest.

partyatmygaff

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Yes. In my opinion it is. There is a reward. You get money for it.

I don't see why the second part even has to come into it from a jobseekers point of view to be honest.

Money?

Maybe i'm misunderstanding this whole internship thing but isn't the whole point of the program that the positions are all unpaid?

BASHIR

partyatmygaff wrote: »

In fairness that's not the same as a "General Operative" internship. The internship you're doing is actually useful. Even what could be considered as 'manual labour' in Engineering (The likes of machining e.t.c.) would count as useful work experience by my standards.

But you cant apply your standards to everyone. I know lads fresh out of secondary school, who for whatever reason chose not to go to college (not for me to judge) who have no experience, on the dole in my opinion wasting their time. If these lads were to do these jobs for 6 9 months their job prospects have increased dramatically. do you not think so?

tayto lover

starbelgrade wrote: »

If government schemes are blatantly open to companies taking advantage of them, then you can hardly blame the companies for doing so.

And that makes this kind of behaviour right?

Ace2007

gambiaman wrote: »

Please don't forget that this is part of this govts 'Job Activation' program as being pushed by our overlords the IMF/EU just this week.
The message is engage with it (eventually) or be punished.

This is what the labour market in Ireland is coming to - actual paying jobs being replaced with low state subsidised 'internships'.

It's Orwellian.

The programme is not perfect, if it was done right,

a) travel costs would be paid for by the company
b) lunch costs (say €10) would be paid by the company
c) companies assessed and interns interviewd during the placement - to see what they were doing and if doing something like make tea, remove said company from database.


but this is FG in power - it is lol if you think they are going to fix anything, The only reason why FG are in power is by default, there was no other option than FF.

Doc Ruby

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Yes. In my opinion it is. There is a reward. You get money for it.

Yeah, my money. If you can't afford to pay minimum wage to be in business you shouldn't be in business. Business, laddie, which you can't support from the tax kitty because business supplies the entire tax kitty.

Slunk

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

All right, try putting that on a C.V and see how far it gets you then.

Ah right it will look better if i was a slave for a large multi national to make them even more money. No thanks. Id rather take my chances.

starbelgrade

Doc Ruby wrote: »

READ THIS: unskilled positions are NOT ALLOWED within the scheme

Yes they are.

Doc Ruby

Dudess wrote: »

it is a cost-cutting measure, nothing else.

Its a live-register-figures massaging exercise.

Doc Ruby

starbelgrade wrote: »

Yes they are.

No they aren't. Have a quick run through the other megathread about this for your edification.

Tiddlypeeps

starbelgrade wrote: »

Just because you are highly educated doesn't make you good material for a barman or a line worker in a factory and to be of the opinion that low level skilled jobs can be done by anyone with half a brain and no experience does a great dis-service to the many people working in those jobs.

Pouring a pint is a skill, one that can cost the owner a bit of money if the barman doesn't posses it so that position usually requires previous experience. Working in a factory is a bad example too because that can be skilled and unskilled depending on what the job actually is.

I've been in at least part time work since my early teens, I'm now in my mid twenties. I've worked in just about every sort of unskilled job you can come up with, waitressing, stacking shelves in a supermarket, dish washing, cleaning, cashier and lots more. The only thing I can think of that unskilled jobs really need in the employee is work ethic. Seeing on a cv that someone worked a couple of years as some relevant unskilled job shows they probably have the right work ethic. Seeing on a cv they worked as an intern for 6/9 months doesn't show this as the employer looses nothing from keeping them around even if they are lazy. That fact they took the position in the first place doesn't imply this either because the welfare office has been known to force people into these positions on the threat of cutting their dole.

The only thing I can see anyone gaining from taking a position like the one advertised in the OP is not going crazy from being out of work too long.

mikemac1

Labour Party, party of the working man

Well maybe it was once but not anymore

partyatmygaff

BASHIR wrote: »

But you cant apply your standards to everyone. I know lads fresh out of secondary school, who for whatever reason chose not to go to college (not for me to judge) who have no experience, on the dole in my opinion wasting their time. If these lads were to do these jobs for 6 9 months their job prospects have increased dramatically. do you not think so?

No I don't.

If Currys/PC World/Dixons and all the other major businesses that need unskilled labour decided to take on this constant supply of free labour, why would they ever bother hiring them at cost?

Ace2007

Slunk wrote: »

Ah right it will look better if i was a slave for a large multi national to make them even more money. No thanks. Id rather take my chances.

Did some chap in the other thread take a job with a multi national and got hired ? so instead of still being on the dole, he now has a paid position out of it, (an example of a positive internship)

Doctor Jimbob

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Money?

Maybe i'm misunderstanding this whole internship thing but isn't the whole point of the program that the positions are all unpaid?

You get your welfare payments, you just work for it instead of sitting there doing nothing. I would rather work than sit on my ass.

Doc Ruby wrote: »

Yeah, my money. If you can't afford to pay minimum wage to be in business you shouldn't be in business. Business, laddie, which you can't support from the tax kitty because business supplies the entire tax kitty.

No argument with this, I agree the scheme is massively flawed. My issue is with people who are calling it slave labour and questioning why anyone would take the job.

Slunk wrote: »

Ah right it will look better if i was a slave for a large multi national to make them even more money. No thanks. Id rather take my chances.

Actual slaves do not get paid. Wise up.

starbelgrade

Doc Ruby wrote: »

No they aren't. Have a quick run through the other megathread about this for your edification.

I've read it - a lot of it is typical After Hours tripe - full of crap made up by people to suit their own arguments. The real criteria for eligible placements can be found here:

http://www.jobbridge.ie/toolkit/generalguidelines.pdf

Doc Ruby

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

No argument with this, I agree the scheme is massively flawed. My issue is with people who are calling it slave labour and questioning why anyone would take the job.

They would be fools to take a job stacking shelves under this scheme, and doing other people out of the minimum wage at the same time. I can see sort of how it might benefit young people in highly skilled professions, but even that isn't the best idea.

ahal

Hmm ...

I've applied for a rake of these positions. I've yet to get one reply. These boys are fussy too you know: they like university graduates for digging holes. It's a sham really ... I go along with the "better to be doing something" arguement in general, but I'm anti exploitation, which this clearly is.

Anyone happen to see that 'Get off your arse' effort on RTE a few weeks ago (can't remember the official title of it ) where a lad from a construction background takes a WPP "job" in a highly profitable Irish company. The pan shot of the foyer took in the cheif honcho's Porsche Carrera 3. What are they, about €160,000?

It's a huge pi55take. If employers were even made contribute 50 quid themselves it'd stamp out a lot of the taking advantage. As is, it's fully funded by the taxpayer. The likes of HP a/ don't need WPP people, and b/ even if they did, they could afford to pay them 50 a week out of the few billion profits they make ... and they make a fair wad selling products in the Irish market too.

This has set back the labour market by 10 - 15 years. 'Free' is the new 'Low paid'.

Sir Oxman

starbelgrade wrote: »

I've read it - a lot of it is typical After Hours tripe - full of crap made up by people to suit their own arguments. The real criteria for eligible placements can be found here:

http://www.jobbridge.ie/toolkit/generalguidelines.pdf

No-one on that thread made up the adverts and they were all linked.
In fact, you'd have to be a world class fantasist to even come close to matching some of those real Jobbridge ads.

Slunk

Well fifty euro extra. Travel and lunch and I'm already down money. And the fact dsg are getting free labour. I'm not saying all internships are bad. There may be SOME decent ones out there but you got to admit this is taking the piss. Dsg are not going to go out of business paying someone minimum wage are they. And to be fair there's no real experience to be gained from this position

partyatmygaff

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

You get your welfare payments, you just work for it instead of sitting there doing nothing. I would rather work than sit on my ass.

Work for it?

You're not working for your welfare payments. Instead you're putting further strain on the taxpayer and improving the balance sheets of private corporations. You're letting private corporations (Who may have foreign shareholders) take advantage of you and taxpayers in one fell swoop.

Doc Ruby

starbelgrade wrote: »

I've read it - a lot of it is typical After Hours tripe - full of crap made up by people to suit their own arguments. The real criteria for eligible placements can be found here:

http://www.jobbridge.ie/toolkit/generalguidelines.pdf

You're bending over backwards to defend this abuse because you are making a profit from my taxes. There is no justification for chain stores like Dixons to take those taxes and remove jobs that should have paid the minimum wage.

Eric Cartman

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Eric Cartman wrote: »

While ill agree its ****ty, everyone on the dole longterm should be made apply for these jobs, atleast made work for their easy money

Everyone on the dole should be given an extra €50 a week by the government and handed over to private enterprises to be used for manual labour.

Sounds like a good plan alright.

An extra 50 a week wtf thats madness, they shouldnt get extra to their overinflated dole

Sir Oxman

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

You get your welfare payments, you just work for it instead of sitting there doing nothing. I would rather work than sit on my ass.



No argument with this, I agree the scheme is massively flawed. My issue is with people who are calling it slave labour and questioning why anyone would take the job.



Actual slaves do not get paid. Wise up.

You have an issue with people questioning something?

Dudess

If a qualified teacher or engineer or solicitor applied, would they be turned down?

starbelgrade

gambiaman wrote: »

No-one on that thread made up the adverts and they were all linked.
In fact, you'd have to be a world class fantasist to even come close to matching some of those real Jobbridge ads.

I never said that the ads were made up - I said that there is no criteria that excludes companies from any type of job regardless of the skill levels - a fact that 90% of the posters on that thread chose to ignore.

The only type of jobs that are excluded are crafts or trades related ones.

Doctor Jimbob

:rolleyes:

gambiaman wrote: »

You have an issue with people questioning something?

mikemac1

Give an inch, take a mile

Fault here isn't with the companies.
Owners want profits and managers want promotions from slashing cost

The fault lies with the organizers of this sham.
One decent person in charge of filtering and approving job ads would sort all this

BASHIR

partyatmygaff wrote: »

No I don't.

If Currys/PC World/Dixons and all the other major businesses that need unskilled labour decided to take on this constant supply of free labour, why would they ever bother hiring them at cost?

Ya ok fair enough I'm looking at it from a worker with no prospects perspective. But I still believe the Idea of an internship is a good one. It does need to be enforced though.

Doctor Jimbob

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Work for it?

You're not working for your welfare payments. Instead you're putting further strain on the taxpayer and improving the balance sheets of private corporations. You're letting private corporations (Who may have foreign shareholders) take advantage of you and taxpayers in one fell swoop.

Sounds like the argument of someone on the dole making excuses not to get off their ass to be honest.

Sir Oxman

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Fckin says it all.
/.

Doctor Jimbob

gambiaman wrote: »

Fckin says it all.
/.

If you want to properly respond to what I said, I'll gladly discuss it with you.

If you want to select random parts of my sentences and bold them in an attempt to make me look like an idiot, then I'll continue to be a condescending prick.

:rolleyes:

starbelgrade

Doc Ruby wrote: »

You're bending over backwards to defend this abuse because you are making a profit from my taxes.

I pay out several hundred thousand euro in VAT to the taxman every year, so I think I have the €250 my guy gets every week from FAS pretty much covered myself.

cloptrop

i got employed as a plumber for ten weeks a month or so ago , i got let go when the boss heard fas are paying fourth years wages to have them work onsite , a gang of fas 4th years turned up within a couple of weeks , laters cloptrop nice knowin ye

Doc Ruby

starbelgrade wrote: »

I pay out several hundred thousand euro in VAT to the taxman every year, so I think I have the €250 my guy gets every week from FAS pretty much covered myself.

No, you aren't, because you would be paying that regardless of whether or not this scheme existed. And how mean do you have to be to be handing over that kind of money and not pay the minimum wage to an employee? Easier just to use my taxes I suppose.

Seriously, do you and the rest reckon this is a proper use of the scheme?

Sir Oxman

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

If you want to properly respond to what I said, I'll gladly discuss it with you.

If you want to select random parts of my sentences and bold them in an attempt to make me look like an idiot, then I'll continue to be a condescending prick.

:rolleyes:

I did respond properly, you weren't snipped or your post altered.

You have a problem with people asking questions about this scheme.

And as for your response to partyatmygaff's point, well...

Ace2007

starbelgrade wrote: »

I pay out several hundred thousand euro in VAT to the taxman every year, so I think I have the €250 my guy gets every week from FAS pretty much covered myself.

you are talking yourself into a corner, if you pay aout several hundred thousands, paying someone a min wage after a few months instead of waiting for the 9 to be up should be possible.

I'm all in favourite of the scheme if run right, but some of your comments are what lead to people hating the scheme,

you offered him a job when he is finsihed? why not start paying him 3 months ago - you know someone's work ethic after a few months, no need to wait 9.

Doctor Jimbob

Doc Ruby wrote: »

No, you aren't, because you would be paying that regardless of whether or not this scheme existed. And how mean do you have to be to be handing over that kind of money and not pay the minimum wage to an employee? Easier just to use my taxes I suppose.

Seriously, do you and the rest reckon this is a proper use of the scheme?

And you'd be paying your taxes regardless of whether or not this scheme existed. Congratulations, you just defeated your own point.

partyatmygaff

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

Sounds like the argument of someone on the dole making excuses not to get off their ass to be honest.

https://ww7.investorrelations.co.uk/dixons/en/contactus/contact_feedback

Here you go. Fire off an email to DSG and let them know you're willing to help them reduce their costs.

I've even prepared the email:

Dear Sir/Madam,

I am writing to you today to express my desire to work in your distribution channels as an unpaid general operative.

I am currently unemployed and in receipt of social welfare and wish to offer my services to you in the hope that one day you may offer me a paid position.

I enclose my CV.

Yours Faithfully,
Doctor Jimbob.

Have fun in your new job. If DSG actually take you on, we'll all chip in and give you €50 a week for your show of initiative. Don't forget to change the username to your real name. I doubt they'll care about something as unimportant as your name but even so...

cloptrop

im not shopping in tesco again , was bad enough last year when they were advertising for managers to come here in slovakia

Doctor Jimbob

gambiaman wrote: »

I did respond properly, you weren't snipped or your post altered.

You have a problem with people asking questions about this scheme.

And as for your response to partyatmygaff's point, well...

It was altered, parts were bolded to draw attention to them and away from the rest of my post.

Doc Ruby

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

And you'd be paying your taxes regardless of whether or not this scheme existed. Congratulations, you just defeated your own point.

I am paying higher taxes there laddie. And VAT gets paid by the people who buy your goods and services regardless.

Doctor Jimbob

partyatmygaff wrote: »

https://ww7.investorrelations.co.uk/dixons/en/contactus/contact_feedback

Here you go. Fire off an email to DSG and let them know you're willing to help them reduce their costs.

I've even prepared the email:



Have fun in your new job. If DSG actually take you on, we'll all chip in and give you €50 a week for your show of initiative. Don't forget to change the username to your real name. I doubt they'll care about something as unimportant as your name but even so...

I'm not trying to be smart here, I genuinely don't get where you're going with this.

Slunk

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

And you'd be paying your taxes regardless of whether or not this scheme existed. Congratulations, you just defeated your own point.

Yes but if there taxes were not paying interns maybe they could be used to keep some of the 31 beds in a hospital open which was on the news earlier.

Sir Oxman

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

I'm not trying to be smart here, I genuinely don't get where you're going with this.

That appears to be your main problem.

Doctor Jimbob

Slunk wrote: »

Yes but if there taxes were not paying interns maybe they could be used to keep some of the 31 beds in a hospital open which was on the news earlier.

Maybe. In an ideal world. But they more than likely wouldn't be.

Doctor Jimbob

gambiaman wrote: »

That appears to be your main problem.

Again, :rolleyes:

cloptrop

so you think its ok small medium businesses are struggling
say nolans supermarket in clontarf
good family business been there years
tesco rolls into town , starts taking on staff for 50 quid , starts laying off the other workers it had
these people are still getting dole so no benefit to tax payer
tesco sends the money it makes back to england
you have a problem with people on the dole dont let that blind you to whats going on here