Bad news for drinkers. FG/Labour to introduce minimum prices!

44leto

quietriot wrote: »

It might teach them something about engaging in active competition though, as opposed to meeting eachother and putting the prices up together while offering no actual value for money in their premises.

If I go out on a Saturday night with friends to a pub, I don't want to see sports on the TV, I want to be able to hear them and I want us to be comfortable. Unfortunately Irish pubs have a tendancy to offer the opposite.



Don't get me started on petrol stations, ****ing crooks.

In my local the price of drink has slightly come down, besides they would never be able to compete with the Supermarkets but people go to pubs for other reasons, I could save some bob and do all my drinking at home, but I would rather not.

Also I don't have sky sports and I have went to the pub to watch a game as do other punters, I am sure you could find a lounge in some pub that does not have a tele.

dr.fuzzenstein

quietriot wrote: »

LOL, just LOL.

Ok, eat what you want, we'll pull out the public health system funding and let the fatties and smokers either pay for their insurance (unsubsidized), or deal with diabetes, cancer and heart problems in the comfort of their couch with their junk food and fags.

Oh but I'm sure that wouldn't suit, right? You want the freedom to do whatever you want with your body, at a cost of the taxpayer! I don't think so buddy. Either we prevent people from unnecessarily damaging themselves to the point they require medical help, or we let them do what they want and not cover the costs when the **** hits the fan.

If this comes in people will do the same as in the UK, organise booze cruises.
Get big van or bus, off to France, buy booze and fags for the year and bring it back, all legal.
It will be a good business to get into and one of the effects is that people won't spend their money here.
What will this mean for the Irish state?
Less income from taxes on booze and fags and people getting their supply elsewhere.
The government will never learn and as it is in the free amrket, if you don't learn and keep making the same mistakes and following a course of action that doesn't work, you will go broke. And good riddance to the corrupt shower.
And that is without taking into account the explosion in the already rampant smuggling trade.
I'm far from needing medical help, pal.
I eat fast food, drink and smoke, but all in moderation, most of the time I live a healthy life.
I should not be punished for the foolishness of others, I don't have the problem.
But that would not be the Irish way, instead of engaging with a problem, ah sure now, jusht tax the fcukers.
Lazy, ignorant, retarded, hackneyed, pandering to the populous and, for God's sake, nobody use their brains.
The day someone tells me what I can and cannot do, is the day that person will get the finger, along with a friendly "get fcuked!"

maxfresh

If the government are so worried about the affects of alcohol and young people drinking ,why dont they ban alcohol advertising

Freddie59

The Government is merely pandering to the VFI, hoping it will drive people back into pubs. It will never happen.

44leto

Freddie59 wrote: »

The Government is merely pandering to the VFI, hoping it will drive people back into pubs. It will never happen.

I agree the culture has changed, before it was kind of shameful to drink at home, now everyone is doing it. After a long week in work I actually love getting a few cans and some films, its the perfect wind down, years ago I never would have done that.

Robdude

quietriot wrote: »

Yes, the government needs more money coming in at the moment. To say otherwise is sheer ignorance of the situation we're in.

The country is broke. Not just broke, but deeply in debt to nations surrounding us. Our country is currently being run on loans from foreign countries and this isn't going to change until the government has more money coming in.

Please don't go on a socialist rant about bondholders and the rich by the way, everything is being implemented in a fair manner at the moment and there's a lot more cuts and expenses coming in the next few years.

That is the price associated with voting for a party that put nothing behind for a rainy day when the country had a lot of money coming in, who deregulated the banks, guaranteed the same deregulated banks and let the country run riot with credit on a personal level.

Now, I didn't contribute to nor benefit from this and as I feel I don't want to be paying for it, I'll be emigrating within the next 2 years. However, the fact of the matter is that the government needs a lot more money coming in and a lot less money going out. Taxes and charges sort the former, cuts to services and public sector is the other.

Both are on the cards and thankfully we've a government who've shown they're not afraid to make the tough decisions at the moment, although if Labour weren't involved we'd see the PS getting hit much harder now.

Being broke is all about money in verse money out. It's really easy to not be broke. Seriously. It's very simple. Children understand the concept.

Ireland recently experienced a period of unprecedented prosperity. And what do we have to show for it? Nothing? Nope - we have LESS THAN NOTHING to show for it. We have a big, steaming, pile of debt to show for it.

Is the problem that we didn't collect enough in taxes? Is that why we don't have money? If you were earning 120k per year but were still spending more than you earned; would you say, 'I need to earn more money!' or would you say, 'What the hell am I doing wrong when I can't live comfortably on 120k?'

boobar

The more I read about these things the sicker I get.

A household charge to "fund local services".

A carbon tax to "help the environment"

Now this and they wave the fact that alcohol abuse costs the state over 3 billion a year.

I just feel that for the majority alcohol misuse is not an issue and for the minority that abuse alcohol, well they will do that irrespective of the price the have to pay, and cost is not a factor that they'll consider in deciding whether to drink or not.

In short, we're getting hammered again, and I don't mean getting drunk.

quietriot

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

If this comes in people will do the same as in the UK, organise booze cruises.
Get big van or bus, off to France, buy booze and fags for the year and bring it back, all legal.
It will be a good business to get into and one of the effects is that people won't spend their money here.
What will this mean for the Irish state?
Less income from taxes on booze and fags and people getting their supply elsewhere.

Then they'll have to get the reduced income from somewhere else - different taxes and cuts that affect your life in a very real way, as opposed to on luxury goods such as alcohol. There's no point in threatening "I'll just shop elsewhere", the country needs money and it's getting it from you in one way or another. The difference being that if you're paying more for alcohol, you still get your booze. If they've to take the money out of something else, you might never enjoy the benefit.

See how that works? Pretty simple, right? If I have to get money in to the Government, and the revenue from one thing shrinks, I've to take the difference from something else because at the end of the day, that money is still needed.

So it's your choice really. Go up north, buy your booze and then sit in your house drinking it while paying stealth tax through more charges you'll never see the value of. OR, buy your booze here, let them get the revenue off it so that they don't have to introduce more charges or increase income taxes.

The government will never learn and as it is in the free amrket, if you don't learn and keep making the same mistakes and following a course of action that doesn't work, you will go broke. And good riddance to the corrupt shower.

The government understands the market an immeasurable amount better than you do. The advisors to the government understand the markets in a way that you can never hope to.

You're not smarter than them, you never will be. The sooner you (and the rest), realise that this, the sooner we can move on from stupid suggestions on ways to get money that won't affect ourselves.

And that is without taking into account the explosion in the already rampant smuggling trade.

Yep, and that lost government revenue is being taken out of your pocket in another form now. So get your cheapo Eastern European fags, and thanks for paying that household charge like a good lad

I'm far from needing medical help, pal.

Right now you are. Good way to be, right? Well, you may well need it in the future and it can be extremely expensive, so lets just be glad the government & taxpayer pay for a public health system. Lets show some appreciation for what we have.

I eat fast food, drink and smoke, but all in moderation, most of the time I live a healthy life.

Great!

I should not be punished for the foolishness of others, I don't have the problem.

You already are, by paying taxes to cover a public health service that is dealing with the foolishness of others. Drunks hurting themselves and ending up in A&E, obese people having heart problems and requiring medical help on the public bill, smokers getting heart disease or cancer from it and the treatment being paid for by the taxpayer. You are ALREADY paying for other people's foolishness.

The Government are aiming to reduce the foolishness and thus reduce the health service bills, so we can spend the money elsewhere.

But that would not be the Irish way, instead of engaging with a problem, ah sure now, jusht tax the fcukers.

Non-tax or charged solutions require money, money is something our government do not currently have.

Lazy, ignorant, retarded, hackneyed, pandering to the populous and, for God's sake, nobody use their brains.

Again, they're much more knowledgeable than you and the people supporting them are professionals who are immeasurable better in their fields than you will ever be. I'm sorry, but that is the truth.

The day someone tells me what I can and cannot do, is the day that person will get the finger, along with a friendly "get fcuked!"

Yep, worked well with the smoking ban, didn't it? Worked well with speed limits, didn't it? What about the other prohibiting laws we have, I'm amazed you haven't rebelled and overthrown the whole thing yet!

Robdude wrote: »

Being broke is all about money in verse money out. It's really easy to not be broke. Seriously. It's very simple. Children understand the concept.

Ireland recently experienced a period of unprecedented prosperity. And what do we have to show for it? Nothing? Nope - we have LESS THAN NOTHING to show for it. We have a big, steaming, pile of debt to show for it.

Is the problem that we didn't collect enough in taxes? Is that why we don't have money? If you were earning 120k per year but were still spending more than you earned; would you say, 'I need to earn more money!' or would you say, 'What the hell am I doing wrong when I can't live comfortably on 120k?'

Yes, that is my point. We have no money because instead of saving money, as a Government, FF just spent everything they got and left nothing behind in case things went belly up, which they did, and now we're all ****ed.

If they had saved and invested the money we would be in a better position than we are now. Instead, the same party guaranteed banks and created a huge financial burden for themselves and the taxpaying citizens here in Ireland. This is linked to loans to Europe which have to be paid also.

We're ****ed and we have to get money together to get out of it. There has to be a balance struck between taking money in now and leaving enough to support the businesses established here plus trying to get new business open here. They're trying their best to find this balance. They can't just tax corporations more - they'll just **** off. The rich here pay most of the tax already, they can't just tax them more - they'll take everything they own and **** off. So they've got to try to hit everyone evenly, with more charges per household and more charges for the things we all buy.

It's the only way we'll ever see light at the end of this ****ty financial tunnel.

dr.fuzzenstein

quietriot wrote: »

Then they'll have to get the reduced income from somewhere else - different taxes and cuts that affect your life in a very real way, as opposed to on luxury goods such as alcohol. There's no point in threatening "I'll just shop elsewhere", the country needs money and it's getting it from you in one way or another. The difference being that if you're paying more for alcohol, you still get your booze. If they've to take the money out of something else, you might never enjoy the benefit.

At some stage the government is taking more money out of the economy than it can sustain.
People already shop less due to higher taxes, that means shops go out of business.
Less income for landlords, less tax take on VAT and income tax.
More people on the dole, less tax take, higher taxes, less spending, more businesses go bust.
So the government cranks up taxes, more businesses go bust, and so on and so forth.
Unemployment is already at 15% and rising, it might hit 20% the way things are going.
What is going to be done?
Hike taxes?
At some stage there's nothing more to be gained, it's the law of diminishing returns.
It's an old chestnut, but you cannot tax your way out of a recession, never has worked, never will work.
This will lead to Ireland defaulting and then what?
Raise taxes?
This "scheme for our own good" is simply another way of raising revenue, just like anything else.
We're being punished for the idiocy of our banks and the foolishness of foreign investors, why don't they just put a 20% "we're desperate and need the money" tax on our income?
It would save them the bother of having to cobble together a million tax laws that will have to be policed by thousands of civil servants.
The government is desperate and it shows.
At this stage, at least a partial default looks very likely, because the way things are going, a return to growth and a strong economy isn't going to happen, quite the opposite.
Taxing my booze won't help. Especially since I don't even drink that much.
But I HATE the hypocrisy of feigning to care for me, they do in their hole.

quietriot

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

At some stage the government is taking more money out of the economy than it can sustain.
People already shop less due to higher taxes, that means shops go out of business.
Less income for landlords, less tax take on VAT and income tax.
More people on the dole, less tax take, higher taxes, less spending, more businesses go bust.
So the government cranks up taxes, more businesses go bust, and so on and so forth.
Unemployment is already at 15% and rising, it might hit 20% the way things are going.
What is going to be done?
Hike taxes?
At some stage there's nothing more to be gained, it's the law of diminishing returns.
It's an old chestnut, but you cannot tax your way out of a recession, never has worked, never will work.
This will lead to Ireland defaulting and then what?
Raise taxes?
This "scheme for our own good" is simply another way of raising revenue, just like anything else.
We're being punished for the idiocy of our banks and the foolishness of foreign investors, why don't they just put a 20% "we're desperate and need the money" tax on our income?
It would save them the bother of having to cobble together a million tax laws that will have to be policed by thousands of civil servants.
The government is desperate and it shows.
At this stage, at least a partial default looks very likely, because the way things are going, a return to growth and a strong economy isn't going to happen, quite the opposite.
Taxing my booze won't help. Especially since I don't even drink that much.
But I HATE the hypocrisy of feigning to care for me, they do in their hole.

This is just the beginning and you need to keep that in mind. The next two budgets, at least, will actually be rough. I'd like to think they're easing us into next years budget where things like the social welfare and public sector pay gets slashed hugely and private sector income tax rises and the tax brand expands.

They're in no way "desperate". They're being tough when tough is needed and it's going to cost them at the next general election.

The biggest hindrance to the Government at the moment is that it is a coalition government, where FG are chained to a party of limp-wristed talkers who want more for everyone at a cost to no one.

The best thing that can happen is more EU intervention so Enda and Co can turn around to the public sector and the social welfare and say "Listen lads, tough ****, it's all being cut, EU says so. Sorry!". It'd stem the retarded socialist protesting if people thought it was being imposed by an entity they essentially cannot touch.

0066ad

It'd stem the retarded socialist protesting if people thought it was being imposed by an entity they essentially cannot touch.


Heil quietroit, such a fitting name

Liam Byrne

Weathercheck wrote: »

Deleted User wrote: »

Lol, you think this is actually going to reduce drinking.

You think they are doing it just for the craic, im sure there has been research on this. Perhaps the measure doesn't go far enough, but they will test it and see the results.

Perhaps it should go up to 1.50 but you'd be moaning more then.

The fact is the population has a horrible disease, and even the bullshiet that the problem only affects 1% is total crap.

Id say 30-50% of the Irish population from 16+ has a serious problem with alcohol.

So ? Why should the rest of us - by your estimation 50-70% of us - suffer because of the lawbreakers and idiots ?

DoneDL

Ban cheap drink in supermarkets and off licences. Then make it cheaper for pubs to sell drink. People will hopefully go out more and we get to keep pubs as a social point within the community.

hmmm

DoneDL wrote: »

Ban cheap drink in supermarkets and off licences. Then make it cheaper for pubs to sell drink. People will hopefully go out more and we get to keep pubs as a social point within the community.

I like a glass of wine or a beer at home in the evenings. Why should I have to go to a government authorised drinking factory instead?

It's not like we never had alcohol abuse back when there were only pubs.

This is about punishing everyone because there is no enforcement of existing laws. Tell the Guards to get the finger out.

dr.fuzzenstein

quietriot wrote: »

This is just the beginning and you need to keep that in mind. The next two budgets, at least, will actually be rough. I'd like to think they're easing us into next years budget where things like the social welfare and public sector pay gets slashed hugely and private sector income tax rises and the tax brand expands.

They're in no way "desperate". They're being tough when tough is needed and it's going to cost them at the next general election.

The biggest hindrance to the Government at the moment is that it is a coalition government, where FG are chained to a party of limp-wristed talkers who want more for everyone at a cost to no one.

The best thing that can happen is more EU intervention so Enda and Co can turn around to the public sector and the social welfare and say "Listen lads, tough ****, it's all being cut, EU says so. Sorry!". It'd stem the retarded socialist protesting if people thought it was being imposed by an entity they essentially cannot touch.

An awful lot of faith in the leaders of the country.
Before the crash it was blind, unquestioning flagwaving for FF that caused most of the trouble, because everyone was making too much money to care.
Blind, unquestioning flagwaving for FG is not the answer.
They are just punishing the population to bail out the banks and foreign investors who where gambling billions for years so a few select could get immensely rich.
I feel much better that all our money is going to them, rather than such frivolous pinko, lefty nonsense like hospital and schools.
This is nothing but a slash and burn, but so far the true elite hasn't been touched, instead it has been the blind, the disabled, the elderly, people in need of medical care and who knows who else, who have been targeted.
It shows that the government is ultimately weak and spineless, targeting the vulnerable to save a few measly millions, when billions are needed.
Many mortgage holders are already in trouble, more will follow. This will mean defaults, write-offs, more trouble for the banks, more government money into the banks, higher taxes, more mortgages in trouble and so on.
This idea that A: the unemployed are lazy wasters who will just have to get punished or go and find work and B: there's billions sloshing around the population but us mangy bastards are just holding out and need to be squeezed is, at best, fanciful.
1 in ten mortgages introuble
96000 mortgages in trouble
This is from last year, I'm sure things haven't improved since.
What will happen when 100000 mortgages default?

"For a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket trying to lift himself up by the handle."
Winston Churchill

123balltv

FG/Labour goodbye im off to the North I cant AFFORD drink in pubs

Expensive alcohol will start riots in Ireland we need drink to survive this
crappy, tiny Country

Resi12

This is so... Words fail me.

Why are they lying, do they takes us for fools? It's obviously not to stop underage drinking or alcoholics. How on this Earth, in this Universe and Galaxy will 10 -80c extra make any sort of difference? It's a stupid tactic to get people (who will be more than willing) to shell out more money, it might seem small but it will of course add up.

What is this government playing at? First their odd version of SOPA without a vote, now this. Are they trying to actually make themselves into some George Orwell society? It's annoying and quite frankly feels wrong to try and pull the wool over our eyes.

Even odder both these laws are against EU law. They really need to piss off now, they are doing my head in with all this "we know better" when really it's all greed and corruption. Don't want kids drinking? Then build some actual activity centres.. no wait, that would COST the government money and that's not how this works.

hmmm

It'll be a lot more than 10 to 80c. The proposed changes today would outlaw alcohol sales in supermarkets, so bye bye LIDL, ALDI etc, and we'd be back to overpriced Off Licences selling nothing but cans of Bud.

Not wanting to sound too pretentious, but anyone who likes a cheap bottle of wine would be very hard hit.

simit

I live 20mins from the border but have always tried to shop locally. If they really do bring this nonsense in I'll be spending my euros up north.

44leto

They take our internet with their version of sopa and now they are after our "dwink"

The mob is unhappy "Panem et circenses" they are taking our bread and circuses.

nice_very

(in the not so distant future....) An Taoiseach Gearóid Mac Ádhaimh, today said he is happy with the outcomes of having reversed many of the previous Govt. of FG/Lab's policies.


you read it here first.

dr.fuzzenstein

hmmm wrote: »

It'll be a lot more than 10 to 80c. The proposed changes today would outlaw alcohol sales in supermarkets, so bye bye LIDL, ALDI etc, and we'd be back to overpriced Off Licences selling nothing but cans of Bud.

Not wanting to sound too pretentious, but anyone who likes a cheap bottle of wine would be very hard hit.

Just heard Roisin Whatsherface on Newstalk.
She said it will be very difficult to remove alcohol sales from supermarkets, due to established selling rights.
So Aldi and LIDL booze is safe.
This weekend I'll be buying a six-pack and a bottle of vodka to celebrate and top it off with a nice, cheap packet of German fags.
If the health police call to my door, come on in, have a drink

mongdesade

& the tax free booze at Dáil Eireann keeps on flowing folks :rolleyes:

lividduck

Hi ho Hi ho, to newry we'll all go....
How dumb can any government be

amacachi

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-16758609

I'd love to know where they're getting 2 litre bottles of 7% cider at that price!

dr.fuzzenstein

I'll just make my own hooch!:p
So, own hooch, the return of Poitin backyard distillery and the annual booze cruise to France.
Just say Narf!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y-Q-aeF5UPk

Also, it might be illegal under EU law.
Scotland is trying this at the moment and are facing quite some opposition.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2011/nov/01/scotland-ministers-minimum-pricing-alcohol

fitz265

the minimum cost of drink in off licence's the govenment are proposing to bring in. in my opionion is prove of more cronyisem in tne government to get more people to stop drinking at home and back into pubs dont mean to insult anyone ( FG, LB party tds) but they obviously have alot of friends that own pubs because it isnt for our health they want to drive up offy drink prices

previous user

DarkJager wrote: »

Pack of short sighted ****ing imbeciles. They changed off licence closing times to 10pm because of teenagers and guess what, people are now forced to buy their drink earlier and teens are still drinking. I'm not sure what they see this increase doing, pocket money is a thing of the past and these kids have money now to buy it if they want it.

I'm sick of having my rights infringed for the sake of some spotty faced ****ing geeks who can't hande more than a can. Not to mention that every sweaty fat publican **** is rubbing his hands with glee at this.

An absolute ridiculous law having the off licences close at 10pm, doesn't do anything at all except make it more frustrating to live in this ****ing country.

Predalien

Unfortunately I can't see EU law preventing minimum pricing on alcohol, it's a measure which could be easily justified on health grounds.

SafeSurfer

simit wrote: »

I live 20mins from the border but have always tried to shop locally. If they really do bring this nonsense in I'll be spending my euros up north.

Thats not going to work. The new minimum prices for alcohol are being introduced on an all island basis, both north and south.