[CoD Black Ops 2] News and Discussion

deafroadrunner

Kells... wrote: »

New patch out today,brings Nuketown into normal playlists

Don't suppose that includes zombies ??

x43r0

Kells... wrote: »

New patch out today,brings Nuketown into normal playlists

About ****ing time

Seridisand

Clay Pidgeon Shooting Playlist coming soon...

Kells...

Not going to be that soon going by the performances from the pigeons last night!

Seridisand

It can be a new playlist "clay pidgeons and attempted clay pidgeons who got stuck in the window"...see very catchy title.

smileyj1987

I got a message when I was playing last night that said it was a double xp on firday on PC . I would assume that is for everybody .

Seridisand

Probably the most indepth lag video:

smoking_kills

Seridisand wrote: »

Probably the most in-depth lag video:

Something’s are right, but mostly not very well explained, and lots of things wrong too. And some things were never explained, like off line lag. Just the devs making excuses for their shi**y net code, and finding the most inept twats on YouTube to spout their nonsense. 3arc's devs decided to talk to a guy who thought buffer bloat was at fault for the lag without ever investigating it first. I wrote to Driftor and explained what utter crap his video on that was and he never took it down, even though he agreed with me? (Dat YouTube money) Tmart video was worse, his suggestion was to get better internet, whatever that means.

First they blame the internet, then your connection, now the engine. MW2 ran the same engine, and IW managed to avoid all the problems Blops2 created. Videos like that create more misunderstanding. People will now be crying for dedicated servers and a new engine thinking that will solve the issue...IT WONT...

Whereas in reality 3arc could copy and paste functional code into their game and fix the issue in a heartbeat.

AdamD

smoking_kills wrote: »

Something’s are right, but mostly not very well explained, and lots of things wrong too. And some things were never explained, like off line lag. Just the devs making excuses for their shi**y net code, and finding the most inept twats on YouTube to spout their nonsense. 3arc's devs decided to talk to a guy who thought buffer bloat was at fault for the lag without ever investigating it first. I wrote to Driftor and explained what utter crap his video on that was and he never took it down, even though he agreed with me? (Dat YouTube money) Tmart video was worse, his suggestion was to get better internet, whatever that means.

First they blame the internet, then your connection, now the engine. MW2 ran the same engine, and IW managed to avoid all the problems Blops2 created. Videos like that create more misunderstanding. People will now be crying for dedicated servers and a new engine thinking that will solve the issue...IT WONT...

Whereas in reality 3arc could copy and paste functional code into their game and fix the issue in a heartbeat.

Unless they can paste a code that puts everyone on LAN they will never fix it. Online games will lag, its inevitable. Haven't even noticed this 'lag compensation' on black ops and the one important thing he said in that video, which everybody needs to get in their head is; On average players with better connections will get the advantage. That's how it is and hearing some fairy tales about people making their connections worse to get an advantage is just horse****.

smoking_kills

AdamD wrote: »

Unless they can paste a code that puts everyone on LAN they will never fix it. Online games will lag, its inevitable. Haven't even noticed this 'lag compensation' on black ops and the one important thing he said in that video, which everybody needs to get in their head is; On average players with better connections will get the advantage. That's how it is and hearing some fairy tales about people making their connections worse to get an advantage is just horse****.

There is offline lag in blops2 you know. It’s not funny perspective/camera angles like some have tried to make out, simply because collision damage (bullet damage) shows the same delay. Ruling out the camera's as the issue. So the issue is with the game's net code. Driftors video in essence is trying to blame the engine, which activison own and so can make any changes to it they want, even changing how the engine handles networking, so it’s no excuse.

If you get your matchmaking right and good functional code, the game should play like a Lan. Actually if you host a game and get 11 players with ping to you under say 30ms (and you just host the game and don’t play) you could in effect turn off the lag comp, as the players pings are so low and all roughly the same with such small timeframes a human would never notice the difference. Lag comp is really only there to account for very laggy players, say 80ms and above (depending on tic rates and other factors in the code)

Your right on your last point, Only the developers can fix the net code.

But simply saying there will always be lag is oversimplifying the issue. For instance valves net code recommends kicking players with 150ms+ ping to server. (the code will do it for you; you just need to set the option) That’s not a throw away comment from valve. They think the once the players are all 150ms and below, the lag is negligible if at all noticeable.

AdamD

smoking_kills wrote: »

There is offline lag in blops2 you know. It’s not funny perspective/camera angles like some have tried to make out, simply because collision damage (bullet damage) shows the same delay. Ruling out the camera's as the issue. So the issue is with the game's net code. Driftors video in essence is trying to blame the engine, which activison own and so can make any changes to it they want, even changing how the engine handles networking, so it’s no excuse.

If you get your matchmaking right and good functional code, the game should play like a Lan. Actually if you host a game and get 11 players with ping to you under say 30ms (and you just host the game and don’t play) you could in effect turn off the lag comp, as the players pings are so low and all roughly the same with such small timeframes a human would never notice the difference. Lag comp is really only there to account for very laggy players, say 80ms and above (depending on tic rates and other factors in the code)

Your right on your last point, Only the developers can fix the net code.

But simply saying there will always be lag is oversimplifying the issue. For instance valves net code recommends kicking players with 150ms+ ping to server. (the code will do it for you; you just need to set the option) That’s not a throw away comment from valve. They think the once the players are all 150ms and below, the lag is negligible if at all noticeable.

You have a good point but I always thought that they'd have the limit that high in order to accommodate people with poor connections (rightly or wrongly) and that its more a case of not wanting to kick vast amounts of players out of games rather than considering 120 ping fine.

So you're saying they could code it to turn lag comp off if pings in the lobby are low enough? Would be interesting though I'm not sure if it would make much of a difference, if the host is decent and everyone has low pings the effect of lag comp is negligible anyway.

smoking_kills

AdamD wrote: »

You have a good point but I always thought that they'd have the limit that high in order to accommodate people with poor connections (rightly or wrongly) and that its more a case of not wanting to kick vast amounts of players out of games rather than considering 120 ping fine.

So you're saying they could code it to turn lag comp off if pings in the lobby are low enough? Would be interesting though I'm not sure if it would make much of a difference, if the host is decent and everyone has low pings the effect of lag comp is negligible anyway.

Not on systems like Xbox. If you pay for the service you get to play, regardless of how high your ping is. On a private server you can do what you like. Devs have several tricks now to minimize the effect of very laggy players,(Lock Step protocol is one) but again if the code is sloppy, it can be detrimental to everyone in the lobby (besides the host)


Yes, if the pings are low enough (and stable), though turning off the Lag comp is only theoretical. In reality it would be a nightmare, depending on how the game is coded. But in theory it would work. 30ms is (in a 60fps game) just below 2 frames, one frame being approx. 17ms. So it’s a tiny timescale, Factor in normal human response times are about 180-240ms, you can see why 30ms would not be noticeable. A LAN would have 0 ping. So the difference is really nothing.

Thats why matchmaking is SOOO important, find players with similar pings (regardless of location) and the game will run much better for all.

RGDATA!

smoking_kills wrote: »

Something’s are right, but mostly not very well explained, and lots of things wrong too.

i happened to watch that video last night - just wondering if you could explain in a bit more detail what specific things are wrong about what he's saying, because I've been trying to get my head round this.

smoking_kills

RGDATA! wrote: »

i happened to watch that video last night - just wondering if you could explain in a bit more detail what specific things are wrong about what he's saying, because I've been trying to get my head round this.

Do remember that Driftor talked to the devs for his info, asking the devs about their game is like like asking Sony about their tv's. What answer do you think your going to get.

1) Yes there is latency on any network, even a LAN, however no one would ever be able to tell. The time frames are just to small, so i have no real idea why he mentioned it. Saying all game have lag is also like saying water is wet. The idea behind the net-code in gaming is to "disguise" the lag, so players don't notice.

2) Halo and B/F both have sniper rifles, if those games lagged, it would show there, also dodging round a corner in halo and B/F you would still receive damage, and maybe not die like in Blops2.(wanted effect) So its a poor excuse, however slower game in general do hide the lag better, but there are still ways of telling if the net-code is poor.

3) Where he talks about all the disagreements is irrelevant. COD uses an authoritative server. NOT P2P. Its the classic server/client model. Where an Xbox acts as the server. He then claims this is the source of all lag in games, again completely wrong.

4) From about 7.00 mins he just blames the engine, and continues to do so at other points in the video. Just to clear this up. This is their engine. They own it, modified it so they can change it anytime they like. The fact that the engine is so old should work in favor of the developer, as they should know the software inside out by now. I'll come back to this later..

5) Wrong wrong wrong. The hitboxes are not out of sync, the models are out of sync. see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xNe7LuQ4OI for what that means. He then demonstrates the point himself? He dose not really under stand how it really works.

6) the offline camera issue. I think its a FOV issue not a camera issue. However he then goes on to show and explain that blops2 has the worst issue, with cod 2 being the Best. If this was simply down to the engine, then they would all be the same. However other devs (old IW team) managed to modify the engine to resolve these issues better than 3arc.

Conclusion....

So he's saying that there's problems with the engine, everyone lags to some extent, lag com is rather complicated..so on and so on....But as i mentioned earlier its their engine. Respawn (the old IW team) had to write a new engine for their upcoming game. They have a very small staff compared to 3arc. So rewriting sections of the engine should be a cake walk for 3arc. Its a poor excuse, however they may not have bothered due to the next gen consoles. Instead write (or license) a new engine. Knowing full well the consequences of that decision on us games.

last thing, first 3arc blamed the internet (a tweet from vhan). Then your connection (a post on the activision forum) now the engine. I smell something...what is that smell. And Driftors 2nd video on this is Facepalm central.

deafroadrunner

when your playing die rise and you take the elevator in the first room that u start in. u can pick up parts anyone know where they go and what they are for. cant seem to find anything online bout it

MarkY91

deafroadrunner wrote: »

when your playing die rise and you take the elevator in the first room that u start in. u can pick up parts anyone know where they go and what they are for. cant seem to find anything online bout it

they are keys to be put into the elevator to make it go up and down when you want

swampyk08

If anyone interested I downloaded the new maps - better than the first batch in my opinion.

Firing Range is back.
Vertical is similar to Summit.
Encore has a Stadium feel.
Magma is average.

Yousef

swampyk08 wrote: »

If anyone interested I downloaded the new maps - better than the first batch in my opinion.

Firing Range is back.
Vertical is similar to Summit.
Encore has a Stadium feel.
Magma is average.

A friend's opinion on Studio... (I've not bought it yet or played it)

He said Studio is not like Firing Range at all. Yeah, the layout is the same but it's been layered with so much crap, it's all really distracting. I've seen a few YT vids and I agree with him although I've no first hand experience.

For example, that tower overlooking the map in Firing Range was a pain in the arse if you had a guy camping up there. But now they've plastered a castle theme over it, it's even harder to flush people out of there...particularly if they've got all the Black Ops 2 crap like a target finder etc...

Then you've got all the animated moving props like the spaceship down the alley or the dinosaur to contend with. In the past, the wood shack was static...anyone moving around on top could be easily identifiable....but now the colour palette throws your eyes off....the same with that made white room....it's really blinding....or the small city like setup beside the respawn...how can you concentrate on the enemy with these eye grabbers?

He said if they just left it the way it originally was it would be better and I tend to agree with him. Again,I've no played it yet. But IMO it doesn't look or play like Firing Range in BO1. It, like Nuketown, is not a map suited to BLOPS2.

Creasy_bear

Yousef wrote: »

A friend's opinion on Studio... (I've not bought it yet or played it)

He said Studio is not like Firing Range at all. Yeah, the layout is the same but it's been layered with so much crap, it's all really distracting. I've seen a few YT vids and I agree with him although I've no first hand experience.

For example, that tower overlooking the map in Firing Range was a pain in the arse if you had a guy camping up there. But now they've plastered a castle theme over it, it's even harder to flush people out of there...particularly if they've got all the Black Ops 2 crap like a target finder etc...

Then you've got all the animated moving props like the spaceship down the alley or the dinosaur to contend with. In the past, the wood shack was static...anyone moving around on top could be easily identifiable....but now the colour palette throws your eyes off....the same with that made white room....it's really blinding....or the small city like setup beside the respawn...how can you concentrate on the enemy with these eye grabbers?

He said if they just left it the way it originally was it would be better and I tend to agree with him. Again,I've no played it yet. But IMO it doesn't look or play like Firing Range in BO1. It, like Nuketown, is not a map suited to BLOPS2.

I've played it a couple of times and I'd have to agree. I'm finding it hard to pick people out on certain parts of the map.

swampyk08

I agree about Studio - very distracting and takes away from the great map design.

KERSPLAT!

What are they like compared to the original maps? I really like hijacked, slums, standoff and raid but that's about it

deafroadrunner

whats mob of the dead like

BGozIE

Encore and magma are not great at all, IMHO..

The more maps you have the better though, as everything is far less repetitive in the long run

AdamD

Rather play 4/5 good maps over and over as you do in league than play the entire set if most of them are awful

KERSPLAT!

AdamD wrote: »

Rather play 4/5 good maps over and over as you do in league than play the entire set if most of them are awful

Definitely!

Stone Deaf 4evr

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

What are they like compared to the original maps? I really like hijacked, slums, standoff and raid but that's about it

Did you get the first map pack? On that id say grind,hydro and downhill are very good,mirage is only fair imo.

I haven't had a chance to play the new maps much, but my initial impressions would be that encore, is very good, vertigo and studio are good and magma is brutal - as bad as aftermath or turbine.

PerrinV2

Right so the bro has the season pass and has the maps downloaded to his xbox.
Now previously we used to both use the same xbox,so when I downloaded maps for MW2 or black ops we both could access/play them.
So in this case if I were to download his profile to my xbox and then copy over the pass and maps packs would I still be able to access them?
Or maybe I should re-download them as opposed to copying them

miralize

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

Did you get the first map pack? On that id say grind,hydro and downhill are very good,mirage is only fair imo.

I haven't had a chance to play the new maps much, but my initial impressions would be that encore, is very good, vertigo and studio are good and magma is brutal - as bad as aftermath or turbine.

Downhill is trash. The rest are good. Mirage can be good if you hug the edge

Seridisand

miralize wrote: »

Downhill is trash. The rest are good. Mirage can be good if you hug the edge

Hug the edge? So you mean hide at the back of the map?:P

miralize

Seridisand wrote: »

Hug the edge? So you mean hide at the back of the map?:P

why do people assume I camp? Thats twice in a week now :P

MarkY91

i hate downhill also. the skate park is great. one of the best maps ive played in the past few call of dutys. simple design

Finical

Does anyone know if I buy black ops 2 off a friend, but I also purchase a season pass would I get the nuketown map? Heard only people who pre ordered the game got it.

smileyj1987

Finical wrote: »

Does anyone know if I buy black ops 2 off a friend, but I also purchase a season pass would I get the nuketown map? Heard only people who pre ordered the game got it.

Nuketown has been released for everyone to play . You could only play it in Chaos Moshpit but its now in standard rotation .

Finical

smileyj1987 wrote: »

Nuketown has been released for everyone to play . You could only play it in Chaos Moshpit but its now in standard rotation .

Brilliant, thanks a lot!

smileyj1987

Finical wrote: »

Brilliant, thanks a lot!

I knew I saw it somewhere

http://www.computerandvideogames.com/395498/black-ops-2-patched-nuketown-2025-free-for-all-on-xbox-360/

KERSPLAT!

Nuketown on BLOPS2 doesn't have the same appeal to me as it did in BLOPS1, kinda like terminal on MW2 and MW3, just not the same

Randall Floyd

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

Nuketown on BLOPS2 doesn't have the same appeal to me as it did in BLOPS1, kinda like terminal on MW2 and MW3, just not the same

It was crap in Black Ops too. *runs for cover*

KERSPLAT!

Randall Floyd wrote: »

It was crap in Black Ops too. *runs for cover*

Ah I loved it on BLOPs1. Demo was probably my favorite game type on it but they ruined that as well

Randall Floyd

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

Ah I loved it on BLOPs1. Demo was probably my favorite game type on it but they ruined that as well

Demo is a nightmare on nuketown in black ops 2, the spawns give me panic attacks lol.

Yousef

Princess Petulia Pissy Pants wrote: »

Nuketown on BLOPS2 doesn't have the same appeal to me as it did in BLOPS1, kinda like terminal on MW2 and MW3, just not the same

Yep. Nuketown and Firing Range are just two maps that, while best suited to a game like BO1, are somewhat out of place in BLOPS2. I think the reason for this is that, although BO1 had some crazy crap in it that subtracted from the game, overall I think more highly of it than BLOPS2. BLOPS2 has the target finder and these hunter killer drones etc. I mean, if you thought the RC-XD was bad in BO1, at least you had to manually control it. But with these "flying RC-XD's", all a noob can do is pick up a couple of kills and throw it up...that's the end of a high killstreak right there. It's not right...

There are other frustrations I have with this game. Recently, I've gone back to that game that we dare not speak it's name....yeah, that one. And I've been giggling like a school girl! It's easy to go from COD to that game, but it's not easy to play that game for any significant amount of time and then put COD into your drive. COD just looks more "cartoony". And IMO, the age demographics couldn't be more different. I can't speak of what it's like on console but on the PC, I see more people in their late 20's/early 30's playing it. Contrast that with COD where all the teenagers spend their time. I could be wrong but it's just what I've come across. Even two years on and I think the other game is as playable as it was when it was released. MW3 on the other hand is dead and BLOPS2 is wearing thin. Hell, I've not even got the patience to go and download the new maps. Says a lot...

KERSPLAT!

Yousef wrote: »

Yep. Nuketown and Firing Range are just two maps that, while best suited to a game like BO1, are somewhat out of place in BLOPS2. I think the reason for this is that, although BO1 had some crazy crap in it that subtracted from the game, overall I think more highly of it than BLOPS2. BLOPS2 has the target finder and these hunter killer drones etc. I mean, if you thought the RC-XD was bad in BO1, at least you had to manually control it. But with these "flying RC-XD's", all a noob can do is pick up a couple of kills and throw it up...that's the end of a high killstreak right there. It's not right...

There are other frustrations I have with this game. Recently, I've gone back to that game that we dare not speak it's name....yeah, that one. And I've been giggling like a school girl! It's easy to go from COD to that game, but it's not easy to play that game for any significant amount of time and then put COD into your drive. COD just looks more "cartoony". And IMO, the age demographics couldn't be more different. I can't speak of what it's like on console but on the PC, I see more people in their late 20's/early 30's playing it. Contrast that with COD where all the teenagers spend their time. I could be wrong but it's just what I've come across. Even two years on and I think the other game is as playable as it was when it was released. MW3 on the other hand is dead and BLOPS2 is wearing thin. Hell, I've not even got the patience to go and download the new maps. Says a lot...

I wouldn't agree with you there. While I did stop playing it for a while, just this week a few of us went back to it and it was great craic and I think, overall, I'd prefer it to BLOPs2. No problems finding a game and no serious connection issues.

ECO_Mental

Is it just me but do any of you find that BLOPS 2 playing better over the last week or so. I seem to be getting on a lot better even won a couple FFA and putting together a few streaks.

I have changed my style though getting great results with the LSAT with Target Finder, Stock, (and or FMJ, QD handle). Using the stock has been a revelation to me.

Also from what I have played the new maps are good, although I seem to get the the studio map about 80% of the time.

MarkY91

ECO_Mental wrote: »

Is it just me but do any of you find that BLOPS 2 playing better over the last week or so. I seem to be getting on a lot better even won a couple FFA and putting together a few streaks.

I have changed my style though getting great results with the LSAT with Target Finder, Stock, (and or FMJ, QD handle). Using the stock has been a revelation to me.

Also from what I have played the new maps are good, although I seem to get the the studio map about 80% of the time.

im the opposite. ive been playing ****e the past week or so

MarkY91

any league play players here? im sick of being with 3 noobs against an organised clan im 3rd in my league and id really like 3 decent players so i can win it.


add MarkLogan-91 if you are currently playing league play and want a very good player on your team

KERSPLAT!

MarkY91 wrote: »

any league play players here? im sick of being with 3 noobs against an organised clan im 3rd in my league and id really like 3 decent players so i can win it.


add MarkLogan-91 if you are currently playing league play and want a very good player on your team

I think AdamD plays mostly league, you'll probably find him somewhere on the COD forum. You should fire him a PM and see if he's looking for someone

AdamD

MarkY91 wrote: »

any league play players here? im sick of being with 3 noobs against an organised clan im 3rd in my league and id really like 3 decent players so i can win it.


add MarkLogan-91 if you are currently playing league play and want a very good player on your team

Add Doyier on psn or adam.doyle242 on skype (skype would be better). Won't be particularly active for a few weeks though, have exams.

MarkY91

AdamD wrote: »

Add Doyier on psn or adam.doyle242 on skype (skype would be better). Won't be particularly active for a few weeks though, have exams.

ill add you now

DaveNoCheese

Shifty Shellshock

Most people are Prestige Master by now so what good is Double XP weekend?

miralize

Shifty Shellshock wrote: »

Most people are Prestige Master by now so what good is Double XP weekend?

It's just to get people playing again.