Carrauntoohill Route

rainbowdash · 17-02-2013 3:50pm

Deleted User wrote: »

That's pretty much it. Having done it dozens of times, I find that the more I do it the more respectful I become. One can do it on a fine day in summer in runners and shorts, and I have...but have been out there when heavy mist or a snowstorm rolls in reducing visibility to metres and wondering why I was so stupid as to leave the map and compass behind, have been out there as darkness came in wondering why I didn't bring a head torch, have been stuck to the side of a cliff there thinking a whistle now might be handy, have been up there as the temperature plummeted in winter thinking a second pair of gloves and another fleece would have been so light to pack, have been hungry, cold and wet without food and waterproofs, have used a first aid kit out there on bumps and cuts -not mine. And it's so easy to prepare for those events. I think of going out on mountains a bit like crossing a road without looking, most of the time nothing might go wrong, but when it does it can go horribly wrong.

I did it recently, in chronic weather conditions, with nothing but a mars bar, a packet of cola bottes and a small bottle of water.

I was soaked to the skin by the time I got to the base of the ladder on the way up. What good is a change of clothes, if I changed them they would be soaked by the time I got to the top of the ladder anyway, and I would have an even heavier bag on my back.

Turn right at the top of the ladder and follow the obvious path up and down from the top, what help would a map and compass be? The ladder was dodgy coming down but IMO much safer without a heavy bag of wet clothes and pointless kit throwing me off balance, tiring me out and slowing me down.

I've been up and down a number of times and each time I bring less kit as I get more familiar with it.

duckysauce · 17-02-2013 5:27pm

rainbowdash wrote: »

I did it recently, in chronic weather conditions, with nothing but a mars bar, a packet of cola bottes and a small bottle of water.

I was soaked to the skin by the time I got to the base of the ladder on the way up. What good is a change of clothes, if I changed them they would be soaked by the time I got to the top of the ladder anyway, and I would have an even heavier bag on my back.

Turn right at the top of the ladder and follow the obvious path up and down from the top, what help would a map and compass be? The ladder was dodgy coming down but IMO much safer without a heavy bag of wet clothes and pointless kit throwing me off balance, tiring me out and slowing me down.

I've been up and down a number of times and each time I bring less kit as I get more familiar with it.

compass is for when the mist or fog comes in and you cannot see, and it must be a tropical rain storm you got caught out in , as every 100m you go up the temp drops that combined with wet clothes = Hyperthermia

rainbowdash · 17-02-2013 6:29pm

duckysauce wrote: »

compass is for when the mist or fog comes in and you cannot see, and it must be a tropical rain storm you got caught out in , as every 100m you go up the temp drops that combined with wet clothes = Hyperthermia

No matter how bad I've ever seen the visibility I've always been able to see the path down, you will always be able to see 50-60" feet in the worst weather.

What good is a compass anyway if you don't know where you are and you can't see any landmarks to get your bearings from?

It wasn't a tropical storm either, there was snow at the top. I know what you are saying about hypothermia but my point is that if you bring no kit you can move much faster and be back before hypthermia would set in.

Its less risky as you are not as tired and less cumbersome so less likely to fall in the first place.

The exception to all of the above would be if extreme cold and snow is forecast or on the ground, then it would be a very different strategy.

duckysauce · 17-02-2013 9:28pm

rainbowdash wrote: »

No matter how bad I've ever seen the visibility I've always been able to see the path down, you will always be able to see 50-60" feet in the worst weather.

What good is a compass anyway if you don't know where you are and you can't see any landmarks to get your bearings from?

It wasn't a tropical storm either, there was snow at the top. I know what you are saying about hypothermia but my point is that if you bring no kit you can move much faster and be back before hypthermia would set in.

Its less risky as you are not as tired and less cumbersome so less likely to fall in the first place.

The exception to all of the above would be if extreme cold and snow is forecast or on the ground, then it would be a very different strategy.

are you taking the piss ?

DeepSleeper · 17-02-2013 10:38pm

rainbowdash wrote: »

No matter how bad I've ever seen the visibility I've always been able to see the path down, you will always be able to see 50-60" feet in the worst weather.

What good is a compass anyway if you don't know where you are and you can't see any landmarks to get your bearings from?

It wasn't a tropical storm either, there was snow at the top. I know what you are saying about hypothermia but my point is that if you bring no kit you can move much faster and be back before hypthermia would set in.

Its less risky as you are not as tired and less cumbersome so less likely to fall in the first place.

The exception to all of the above would be if extreme cold and snow is forecast or on the ground, then it would be a very different strategy.

This has to be one of the most bizarre posts I've read on boards.ie, but as a member of a MRT I shouldn't really be surprised....

Let's just take your soaked-to-the-skin, bad weather, no map or compass (and probably no ability to use same anyway?) and minimal food as our starting point.... now lets add in a simple slip, trip or fall which results, for example, in a broken ankle.... Now what do you do? You don't know your precise location (i.e. your National Grid Reference) because you don't have a map and compass, your core body temperature starts to drop as soon as you sit down, you haven't enough food to keep your energy up or to keep warm and you have entirely inadequate clothing which caused you to get wet in the first place and I'd guess you have no change of clothes and no spare layers either....

So you brought your phone with you I'd imagine - most people do.... so you call the emergency services (if you have phone reception where you are lying and if your phone hasn't been lost or damaged in the rain or the fall) and ask them to come and get you.... The good volunteers of Kerry MRT now get a call out and leave the workplaces, their families, their sporting events and their shopping trips to come get you regardless of the weather or the time of day or night....

Where will they look?

How many hours can you lie in there that condition (and in those conditions) before they arrive?

Please take the time to do a Mountain Skills course to get a basic understanding of mountain navigation and the necessary equipment - doing things in a responsible way is a sign of individual strength, not weakness...;)

18-02-2013 10:57am

rainbowdash wrote: »

I did it recently, in chronic weather conditions, with nothing but a mars bar, a packet of cola bottes and a small bottle of water.

I was soaked to the skin by the time I got to the base of the ladder on the way up. What good is a change of clothes, if I changed them they would be soaked by the time I got to the top of the ladder anyway, and I would have an even heavier bag on my back.

Turn right at the top of the ladder and follow the obvious path up and down from the top, what help would a map and compass be? The ladder was dodgy coming down but IMO much safer without a heavy bag of wet clothes and pointless kit throwing me off balance, tiring me out and slowing me down.

I've been up and down a number of times and each time I bring less kit as I get more familiar with it.

Ha ha! You must be really cool! You walk around mountains in wet clothes. That's just kerrazzee talk man!

Though you know, you could even save yourself the petrol by just standing in your clothes in a cold shower at home?

The Dagda · 18-02-2013 12:00pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Ha ha! You must be really cool! You walk around mountains in wet clothes. That's just kerrazzee talk man!

Though you know, you could even save yourself the petrol by just standing in your clothes in a cold shower at home?

He brings less kit each time he climbs it, he's obviously aiming to do it nude, so no wet clothes, and faster due to improved aerodynamics...
He could also try these amazing tablets that help Tvercetti breathe on "her", might be some improvement in performance with them too...

18-02-2013 12:20pm

The Dagda wrote: »

He brings less kit each time he climbs it, he's obviously aiming to do it nude, so no wet clothes, and faster due to improved aerodynamics...
He could also try these amazing tablets that help Tvercetti breathe on "her", might be some improvement in performance with them too...

Ha!

Nude. And with his eyes closed. After all, why rely on 50 feet of visibility when 0 would be even wackier!

rick_fantastic · 18-02-2013 6:32pm

it never ceases to amaze me how many people think its safe to go into the mountains without the ability to read a map / navigate / carry the correct equipment...

please dont go out onto any mountains (hills) anywhere unless you are familiar with the area / able to navigate / have someone with you to guide you

and always - leave no trace!

my aim is primrose this year, after i lead up howling ridge again.

jusmeig · 18-02-2013 7:33pm

rainbowdash wrote: »

...if I changed them they would be soaked by the time I got to the top of the ladder anyway, and I would have an even heavier bag on my back.

Turn right at the top of the ladder and follow the obvious path up and down from the top, what help would a map and compass be?

I've been up and down a number of times and each time I bring less kit as I get more familiar with it.

Did you get a bang on the head as a young fella?

You bring rain gear, to keep you dry. If it's good rain gear....you don't get soaked/cold!!!! You change your clothes when you finish your hike, you feel warm and dry (What an amazing idea!!!!)

What if you loose the trail in the horrendous weather that sometimes descends? If you have a compass you can navigate to safety...if you dont you end up in BIG trouble.

Take your silly comments off the Outdoor Pursuits forum, and stick to navigating between bars.

What sickens me is that the good folk of mountain rescue would have to risk their lives to search for you...or your soaked corpse!

jusmeig · 18-02-2013 7:45pm

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this post btw

We did Brother I Shea's in the end last Saturday (Central Gully was a waterfall!!!), on what was a very windy and wet day, with poor visibility!! The route was challenging and fun, there were even a few other brave souls out and about on the mountain.

The Devil's ladder was a complete washout. This path needs to be closed asap. It's the worse I have seen in Ireland.
The gully was literally collapsing under out feet. It was like descending a waterfall.
Lots of stone and rock moving, glad we had the helmets on.
There must be people hurt all the time on this route?

I've done the Hydro Route several times, and think I will be descending this way in future as the trail is less eroded.

SomeFool · 18-02-2013 8:03pm

You could always descend by the heavenly gates or the zig zags

jusmeig · 18-02-2013 8:39pm

SomeFool wrote: »

You could always descend by the heavenly gates or the zig zags

First time on that side of the mountain, and as mentioned the weather was dreadful:

Regarding Heavenly gates, I did not fancy having to do the reverse of the first and second step, as the wind was howling. We also met a guy who had descended and he said to listen out for rock fall, he had heard and seen stones falling down! Best take what I thought would be the "safer" route. Safer and devils ladder cannot be used together tho

Where is the Zig Zag? Did not see another safe decent route on the map.

duckysauce · 18-02-2013 10:55pm

jusmeig wrote: »

First time on that side of the mountain, and as mentioned the weather was dreadful:

Regarding Heavenly gates, I did not fancy having to do the reverse of the first and second step, as the wind was howling. We also met a guy who had descended and he said to listen out for rock fall, he had heard and seen stones falling down! Best take what I thought would be the "safer" route. Safer and devils ladder cannot be used together tho

Where is the Zig Zag? Did not see another safe decent route on the map.

to the left of the devils ladder, went up and down it last year here is the route

http://mountainviews.ie/track/1517/

Aiel · 14-03-2013 2:10pm

The Devil's ladder route is still open I assume yes? I haven't seen anything on the Kerry Mt Rescue site to indicate otherwise, i assume that's where they would announce if its closed yes? My wife and I plan to do it in May and ive been checking the Mt rescue site in recent weeks to make sure its still open but i'll have another route(zig zags) or routes researched just in case.
I cant believe there's people here who question why you would need a rucksack with you with compass etc. We take a rucksack on pretty much every hike we do no matter how small.

jusmeig · 14-03-2013 2:33pm

Aiel wrote: »

The Devil's ladder route is still open I assume yes? I haven't seen anything on the Kerry Mt Rescue site to indicate otherwise, i assume that's where they would announce if its closed yes? My wife and I plan to do it in May and ive been checking the Mt rescue site in recent weeks to make sure its still open but i'll have another route(zig zags) or routes researched just in case.
I cant believe there's people here who question why you would need a rucksack with you with compass etc. We take a rucksack on pretty much every hike we do no matter how small.

It was open, as I came down it about a month ago! They can't really "close" it as such...I mean u can't put up a barrier.

I however would avoid it, as its horrendously eroded.

We went up via Brother O Shea's Gully, and back via the Devils Ladder. On the way down the ladder I could actually see the Zig Zags, and wished I had went for that route.

The ladder was literally crumbling under our feet, with a waterfall running down it. At the bottom it actually looked like looking up into a waterfall

We got absolutely soaked, but then again it rained on us all day. Dont know if its always like this, but my advice would be AVOID!!!

Gillo · 15-03-2013 1:36am

jusmeig wrote: »

Where is the Zig Zag? Did not see another safe decent route on the map.

Give yourself about 50 mtr's before the devils staircase and go left straight up the side of the valley, you'll hit a take at some stage and follow it up. Sorry haven't got a map handy at the moment so can't give you a grid reference.
Look at Br. O'Shea's gully for the ascent and come back by the zig zags.

BriangC · 15-03-2013 1:18pm

Gillo wrote: »

Give yourself about 50 mtr's before the devils staircase and go left straight up the side of the valley, you'll hit a take at some stage and follow it up. Sorry haven't got a map handy at the moment so can't give you a grid reference.
Look at Br. O'Shea's gully for the ascent and come back by the zig zags.

A agree, the best route is up via O'Sheas gully and down on the Zig Zags here http://www.activeme.ie/guides/walks/carrauntoohil-via-osheas-gully-and-zig-zags-kerry/ or down Heavenly gates.

The zig zags are way more obvious now as people decide against the Ladder and wear in a more obvious path. IMO the ladder is fine if your careful but is a boring route compared to O'Sheas and The Bone which are way more interesting.

burly · 16-03-2013 11:19am

here are some of my route descriptions and gpx files.

Carrauntoohil via Coomloughra Horseshoe

http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=1582500

Carrauntoohil via Curved Gully & Heavenly Gates

http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=1437214

Carrauntoohil via O'Sheas Gully

http://www.everytrail.com/view_trip.php?trip_id=1405634

As with anything shared on here, use these at your own risk! Dont try new routes unless you are an experienced hiker, and are able to navigate!

rgfuller · 20-03-2013 3:54pm

Went up and down via the zig-zags last Friday, lovely snow at the top and sticking to the path/worn patches on the route.

Looking at the Devils ladder from the top I didn't feel it was safe enough to decend in the slippy conditions we had, I did see a group disappear down safely using icepicks.

Also met a couple of groups who both came up and went down via O'Sheas gully which was quite snowy but passable too - you could see the route they followed cut into the snow.

hmmm · 20-03-2013 9:37pm

Is there much exposure on the O'Sheas gully route? How safe it is it?

21-03-2013 8:37am

hmmm wrote: »

Is there much exposure on the O'Sheas gully route? How safe it is it?

Fine for an ascent. You could walk it upright all the way up. In snow and ice, indeed I guess any time, just make sure of your footing, it can be a bit crumbly around there and is getting more eroded. If descending, not as easy as some other routes like zig zags, and be careful about sending stones down on others coming up.

Carrauntoohill Route

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