War is a racket.

AngryPensioner

So I went ahead and watched that video about those US soldiers pissing on dead taliban members. Now I am pretty resistant to shock and disgust. Didn't even flinch watching it. That does not mean that sort of act is acceptable.

Does anybody else find it highly illogical that these countries waste billions per year on developing and sending their own citizens to kill sufficient numbers of brown or other colored people for whom have every right to equal rights as an American citizen

Why not just outlaw war and resign your foreign policy matters to protection of your own native borders? Social Democrats and parties which tend to be driven by emotions and not logic constantly moan about poverty etc, yet it's a ok to murder people who you have never met?

Obama still sanctions illegal wars.

Degsy

"Outlaw war"...:rolleyes:

AngryPensioner

Degsy wrote: »

"Outlaw war"...:rolleyes:

For which we have control over. Do you think I actually suggested to extend this policy to nations outside our own borders?

Gee Bag

WAR! OOOH! Yea!
What is is good for?
absolutley nothing!
say it again!

WAR! OOOH! Yea!
What is is good for?
absolutley nothing!

Agricola

War...............war never changes

Exar Khun

In fairness that idea does have a smell of naiveity. Countries dont go to war just to kill people based one their skin tone. There are very real geopolitical and economic reasons countries express foreign policy.

And in fairness afterhours isnt a great place for this conversation.

ejmaztec

The OP obviously doesn't realise that not all American troops are white.:eek:

RichieC

It's all about the transfer of public funds to private industry these days, then deploying to protect private interest.

AngryPensioner

Exar Khun wrote: »

In fairness that idea does have a smell of naiveity. Countries dont go to war just to kill people based one their skin tone. There are very real geopolitical and economic reasons countries express foreign policy.

And in fairness afterhours isnt a great place for this conversation.

Tongue in Cheek. Tongue in cheek:P

Not the best place perhaps. But I want general opinions from the general public.

It's nothing but sheer curiosity, I swear.

MagicSean

Do we declare war on countries that refuse to outlaw it?

Chuck Stone

Iraq II was an absolute tax-payer raping cluster-**** for weapons manufacturers and 'security' companies.

Immaculate Pasta

Outlaw war isn't the way to go.

It is certainly questionable why USA are in Afghanistan. I for one am very much against why they are there. However I think there are cases where state intervention is justified. if there is a state where atrocities such as mass genocide going on, then a state with resources to stop it should be morally obliged to do so. I would say state intervention in Bosnia in the mid 90s where there was ethnic cleansing mass genocide going on, state intervention was justified and someone should have intervened in the Rwandan genocide. There I condone it but for the majority including Iraq and Libya, I am against it and it's for the benefit of multinational companies which isn't the reason why a country should intervene somewhere.

AngryPensioner

MagicSean wrote: »

Do we declare war on countries that refuse to outlaw it?

No. The United Nations and International law can dictate these matters. All the suggestions so far are within the context of our own Constitution. No country should have the ability to police the world on their own. That implies a single country has greater precedence over another for little reason.

Of course, you come back to the argument that the country with the best arsenal pulls the strings, but that is not the result of a truly democratic process. China should bitch slap the US a couple of times. These Government sanctioned wars must be held to account.

When I say outlaw war, I am only talking in relation to our own borders.

D1stant

It is a racket. I wish they'd keep it down a bit

IM0

war is a racket

well spotted, but Im fairly sure you dont know why though

Wattle

We piss on your dead. Not exactly the best way to win hearts and minds there.

Cool_CM

AngryPensioner wrote: »

No. The United Nations and International law can dictate these matters.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TEvacFETvM

Not everybody listens to the UN

Hank_Jones

Before I opened this thread, I thought the title was a tennis related pun.

Stiffler2

Of course it's a racket. 50 cents from every dollar goes to the American War Machine.










America........F**K YEAH
They've arrived to save the mother f**kin day Yeah,

America....F**K YEAH

BrensBenz

No disrespect to any victims anywhere but……war is good for business, especially when economies are struggling.
You pay a fortune to maintain an army, navy, air force, marines and other, secret forces for…..“defence”;
You spend obscene fortunes on materiel / equipment / weapons and on subsidizing the manufacturers R&D.
Consuming these “assets”, preferably in some foreign land, creates a demand for replacement and, if you’ve been supporting your domestic suppliers, new business is kept local.

To maintain the headcount, throw around vast amounts of traditional notions of “honour”; “duty”; “service”; a “just war”; “God is on our side”; “women love men in uniform”; regimental flags; medals, etc. If that fails, wait until unemployment is rife and then advertise the salaries and opportunities in the forces.
Next, find or create a “demon” somewhere and throw in loads about “those savages would kill / rape / eat / rule us all”
Finally, pay eternal homage to the politicians, monarchs and generals who chose economics over morality and you’ve got the self-sustaining madness we call global security.
And, when you get a chance, make shed-loads of how-we-won-the-war movies showing our guys as honourable but cuddly and destined for Heaven and documentaries showing there are no war criminals on “our” side.

So yes, an economic racket and, in one way or another, we are all responsible.

Duggy747

The people who benefit most from war are the assualt & defence manufacturers / dealers, through legal or illegal markets.

Slimey cùnts.

Capt'n Midnight

Dwight D. Eisenhower's farewell speech warned of this back in 1961
http://www.h-net.org/~hst306/documents/indust.html

This conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence -- economic, political, even spiritual -- is felt in every city, every State house, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources and livelihood are all involved; so is the very structure of our society.

In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist.


...

The prospect of domination of the nation's scholars by Federal employment, project allocations, and the power of money is ever present and is gravely to be regarded. Yet, in holding scientific research and discovery in respect, as we should, we must also be alert to the equal and opposite danger that public policy could itself become the captive of a scientific technological elite.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424053111903554904576462373038573518.html

The report says the U.S. at one point employed more than 209,000 people in Iraq and Afghanistan. That figure outstrips the total number of U.S. troops currently serving in combat: 46,000 in Iraq and 99,000 in Afghanistan.

The Department of Defense, the U.S. agency that has spent the most on battlefield contracting, didn't respond to requests to comment.

RichieC

Speaking of Dwight, better go for one now..

Degsy

I was once asked would i be prepared to die for my country.

I replied no,but i was damn prepared to help the other guy die for his.

Killer Pigeon

AngryPensioner wrote: »

So I went ahead and watched that video about those US soldiers pissing on dead taliban members. Now I am pretty resistant to shock and disgust. Didn't even flinch watching it. That does not mean that sort of act is acceptable.

Does anybody else find it highly illogical that these countries waste billions per year on developing and sending their own citizens to kill sufficient numbers of brown or other colored people for whom have every right to equal rights as an American citizen

Why not just outlaw war and resign your foreign policy matters to protection of your own native borders? Social Democrats and parties which tend to be driven by emotions and not logic constantly moan about poverty etc, yet it's a ok to murder people who you have never met?

Obama still sanctions illegal wars.

Of course it's illogical. The war in Afghanistan should have ended in 2001/2002. The bulk of Osama Bin Laden's organisation was decimated during the invasion of Afghanistan. Bin Laden himself then fled into Pakistan around the same time.

I watched an interesting three-part documentary recently called "The Power of Nightmares". It covered the simultaneous rise of Neo-Conservatism in the United States and Islamic Fundamentalism is the Middle East and their eventual clash after 9/11.

The theory put forth in the documentary is that the Neo-Conservative mindset justifies perpetual war. It argues that throughout the latter half of the 20th century liberalism in the US lead to apathy, materialism and eventually social decay. Neo-Conservatism was meant to maintain a certain social order while still promoting the ideas of freedom and democracy. This was done by creating a jingoistic fantasy that the US was destined to bring freedom and democracy to the entire world and that anyone who stood in its way was the embodiment of evil. This new order was to be maintained by creating the illusion that the US was under constant threat and that people needed the government/politicians for protection against these threats. In hindsight, it was all hypocrisy.

This Neo-Conservative mindset is reflected nearly everywhere the US has strong influence today, especially in Iraq and Afghanistan. It is now known that Al Qaeda, as we know it, is merely a US invention. This isn't a mere conspiracy theory and it has been alluded to by some high ranking politicians. One of these, the former British Foreign Secretary Robin Cook, said in 2005 that;

"Bin Laden was, though, a product of a monumental miscalculation by Western security agencies. Throughout the 80s he was armed by the CIA and funded by the Saudis to wage jihad against the Russian occupation of Afghanistan. Al-Qaida, literally "the database", was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2005/jul/08/july7.development

Al Qaeda is a Neo-Conservative illusion to make Islamic Fundamentalism look like a large, global, interconnected and highly organised terrorist movement. The reality couldn't be further from the truth. The goal of this illusion is to make the Islamic threat against the US look greater than it actually is.

The US' presence in the Middle East is only putting fuel on the fire and sparking up more Islamic Fundamentalist support.

The same warmongering Neo-Conservative elements who brought you the war in Iraq and Afghanistan are trying to push for a war with Iran. It's happening as we speak. There's an illusion that Iran's nuclear ambitions are a greater threat to the US and her allies than they actually are. This illusion will be made to justify a war with Iran.

There are many people who will gain from it, especially arms markers/dealer backed by government. This is what happens when the government gets so large that it can have influence on private industry. War is a very profitable industry.

RichieC

Degsy wrote: »

I was once asked would i be prepared to die for my country.

I replied no,but i was damn prepared to help the other guy die for his.

Classic Patton..

Doc Ruby

As Major General Smedley Butler, "old gimlet eye", a man who in his day had forgotten more about war than the combined population of boards will ever know, being the most decorated marine in US history, put it:

War is a racket. It always has been. It is possibly the oldest, easily the most profitable, surely the most vicious. It is the only one international in scope. It is the only one in which the profits are reckoned in dollars and the losses in lives.

A racket is best described, I believe, as something that is not what it seems to the majority of the people. Only a small 'inside' group knows what it is about. It is conducted for the benefit of the very few, at the expense of the very many. Out of war a few people make huge fortunes.

I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. In short, I was a racketeer, a gangster for capitalism.

I helped make Mexico and especially Tampico safe for American oil interests in 1914.
I helped make Haiti and Cuba a decent place for the National City Bank boys to collect revenues in.
I helped in the raping of half a dozen Central American republics for the benefit of Wall Street.
I helped purify Nicaragua for the International Banking House of Brown Brothers in 1902-1912.
I brought light to the Dominican Republic for the American sugar interests in 1916.
I helped make Honduras right for the American fruit companies in 1903.
In China in 1927 I helped see to it that Standard Oil went on its way unmolested.

Looking back on it, I might have given Al Capone a few hints. The best he could do was to operate his racket in three districts. I operated on three continents.

Ronin247

Not a black and white issue for me.In America it is a racket but somewhere like Iran are being forced into an arms race.If Iran dont get nuclear capabilities quickly America will invade.Unlike Iraq,they will not stop the program to avert this coming invasion because everyone in the world saw what happened when Saddam got rid of his one major deterrent!!

I would love to have information on exactly how much money Haliburton and the Bushes have made from war.I read "House of Bush,House of Saud" years ago and it really makes you wonder what is going on in the world.