Curry pastes or blend your own?

bogman

Have to admit to being a big fan of Pataks curry pastes especially Vindaloo and Madras, am I missing out much on not blending my own spices, chili's etc, wouldnt consider myself as an expert but make a pretty tasty lamb curry...
Charles

Mellor

I like Mae Ploy thai pastes. I have the exact ingredients and amounts thet use also but haven't been bothered.

houseplant

Good thread. I'd be interested to hear from cooking enthusiasts, jar or from scratch? I like the pataks paste too but is making your own worth it? And if it is, HOW?

huskerdu

I use Pataks pastes and they are great, but every so often I make an Indian meal from scratch and it is worth it. I am making Rogan Josh tonight from a Jamie Oliver recipe. I have never tried it before, so wait until tomorrow and I will tell you how I got on. The lamb is marinating in ginger/garlic/turmeric/natural yoghurt at the moment.

Its not hard once you have the spices in the house.

Jamie Oliver has loads of recipes (I know there are loads more that are more authentic but I am not too much of an expert on Indian food and the Jamie Oliver recipes are very easy to follow and very tasty)


As always, the BBC food website has loads of recipes too.

Curry Addict

the best way to make indian curries is a step by step process
1. make ginger/garlic paste.
2. make the generic spice mix called "mix" or "curry masala"
3. make curry base.
4. Pre cook your chicken.
5. make a portion of curry using previous step ingredients.

most of the work is making the curry base but this can be frozen in portions for use anytime.

Darkginger

Totally agree with Curry Addict - that's the way to do it. The base sauce (gravy/garabi) is mostly onions, with varying amounts of other vegetables and spices (each restaurant seems to have their own version). Curry2Go's channel on YouTube explains one version, also a spice mix, how to pre-cook the chicken etc. I've tried his recipes - they work.

Having said that, some restaurant kitchens use ready-made pastes as some of their ingredients - the most common being Patak's Kashmiri Masala, Tikka Paste and Tandoori Paste.

Of all the commercially available pastes, I rate Patak's the highest - although there are probably better ones to be had in Asian shops. They don't come anywhere near making as good a curry as is possible if you follow the restaurant method, but they're better than a generic 'curry powder'.

bogman

Thanks for all the tips people especially Curry Addict's

Ophiopogon

Have to say I've never tried jars of curry sauce so I don't know what the taste compares to from scratch.(my mother alwasy used dolminos ragu when I was growing up so it put me off buying jars) We sometimes have a bought curry powder knocking about.

The main reasons I would go from scratch would be that cost, it's so much cheaper to do your own (esp if you buy spices at the asia market) and we would some sort of curry at least three times a week. Also, I liked to control salt content so almost everything we eat is from scratch.

The Hill Billy

Curry Addict wrote: »

the best way to make indian curries is a step by step process
1. make ginger/garlic paste.
2. make the generic spice mix called "mix" or "curry masala"
3. make curry base.
4. Pre cook your chicken.
5. make a portion of curry using previous step ingredients.

most of the work is making the curry base but this can be frozen in portions for use anytime.

Can you say what needs to be done at each step? For example - what does one do to "make a curry base"?

Darkginger

Thought I'd help out here, cos I've got a few mins Sure CA will be along later to add his take on it!

1. Ginger/garlic paste - I use a 2/3 garlic to 1/3 ginger ratio. Peel the ginger, peel the cloves, chop roughly and put them in a food processor and whizz until very finely chopped. Add a little oil if it's all sticking to the sides. Freezes well in ice cube trays, or keeps in the fridge for around 3 days (I use individual Christmas pudding bowls - the plastic ones, with lids - to store it).

2. A standard spice mix would be something like : 6 measures of a mild curry powder (I use Rajah Mild Madras), 1 measure ground cumin, 1 measure ground coriander, 1 measure ground tumeric, 3 measures paprika, 1 measure garam masala. (A measure depends on how much mix powder you're making - could be a teaspoon or a tablespoon - it's just the ratios that matter)

3. Again, go watch Curry2Go's YouTube vid on the subject - but basically, you want to be chopping around 600g onions, plus maybe one small carrot, half a green pepper, perhaps a bit of white cabbage - cook until softened in a generous amount of oil, add some garlic/ginger paste, add about 750ml water (which may or may not have been infused with aromatic spices - cardamom, Asian bay leaves, cassia bark/cinnamon, star anise for example), bring to the boil, simmer, add your choice of spices (the mix powder), let them cook in the floating oil, add some chopped tomatoes or passata, maybe some coconut cream, cool, and blend to the consistency of thin soup. Freezes well. You need about 300ml for each curry portion.

4. Pre-cooking chicken - methods vary, but the way I do it is to cut the chicken into chunks, heat about a tablespoon of oil, add a ladle of the base gravy (above), bring to the boil, add the chicken, turn down to a simmer, put a lid on it, and cook for about 20 mins, or until done. Drain the liquid, and you're done (this means that any water etc. that comes out of the chicken doesn't go on to dilute your curry, the drained juices work well in Bombay Potato, I've found).

5. Obviously it varies depending on what type of curry you're making - but off the top of my head, a generic curry would be something like this:

Heat a little oil in a pan, add a tablespoon of the garlic/ginger paste and fry until light golden, add some watered down (1:3 puree to water) tomato puree, half a tablespoon of dried fenugreek leaves (methi), and a tablespoon of your mix powder. Add 1 tsp chilli powder, or to taste. Cook for a few minutes - it should sizzle but the garlic must not burn!

Add a ladleful (150ml, ish) of the base gravy (hot), and stir well. Add the pre-cooked chicken. Reduce until you have a thick sauce, then add another ladleful of the base gravy. Add one quartered tomato, and a tsp of garam masala. Add a handful of chopped fresh coriander leaves, and serve.

That's the basic method - obviously, there are different spices/main ingredients/additions according to what type of curry you're making.

Hope that helps - but seriously, those videos I recommend will help more (and no, am not affiliated in any way with Curry2Go, or Julian - I just find them the best guide to curry cooking!).

huskerdu

I agree with all the tips given above apart from the advice to precook the
meat.

You get a much better flavour if the meat is cooked in the curry sauce.
All the better if it is cooked slowly for a long time.

Curry Addict

thanks darkginger thats the bones of it. i think ill post it up in the cooking club since there has been so much interest and its my week

Curry Addict

ok there it is http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=76584619#post76584619

Brian?

Simplest curry base you'll ever make:

Put 2 medium onions, 4 cloves of garlic, 2 green chillis and a thumb sized piece of ginger in a blender with a splash of water (just enough water so it blends).

Cook that in a wok with a bit of oil and add your dried spices. I usually use coriander, cumin, tumeric, fengureek and mustard seeds.

Base made.

Fajitas!

I find the Green Saffron spice mixes great. When you're comfortable making them from the sachet, it's easy enough to find and mix your own.

Check'em out - http://www.greensaffron.com/

stacexD

Don't have a clue what kind of curry I make but I've been making it for a couple of years and never get sick of it!
Brown the chicken in a pot with some butter
Throw in some natural foods curry powder, bit of garlic, salt, ginger, chili, powder, onions, tomato puree, mix the paste up with the chicken, cover it with water then add some chopped tomatoes. Maybe a chicken stock cube too depending on how it tastes!

brick tamland

I use the Mae Ploy thai paste when I'm making Thai, and Pataks when making indian. As good as the ones above look, its cheaper and quicker to use the jats of paste plus I dont have the freezer space to fill up with bases. The Moy Ploy is really excellent, really good Thai red curry. Pataks are fine, I usually add a bit more in that the reciepe says(Garlic, Ginger, Chilli and a lot of fresh Corriander).

Anyone ever try the Pataks Vindaloo? I havent tried it yet

Babooshka

brick tamland wrote: »

I use the Mae Ploy thai paste when I'm making Thai, and Pataks when making indian. As good as the ones above look, its cheaper and quicker to use the jats of paste plus I dont have the freezer space to fill up with bases. The Moy Ploy is really excellent, really good Thai red curry. Pataks are fine, I usually add a bit more in that the reciepe says(Garlic, Ginger, Chilli and a lot of fresh Corriander).

Anyone ever try the Pataks Vindaloo? I havent tried it yet

I used to buy Pataks vindaloo when they sold it by the tin back in the 90's, haven't seen it sold like that in a long time, maybe the asia markets still sell it that way?

I tried the jars of paste and it wasn't the same. they've changed their recipes and even their madras hasn't got the kick it once had, it's a lot more tomato based, the older one was a darker brown in colour. Anyway I lived off the vindaloo stuff years back as a student...loved it, but my friends didn't. Made them a curry one night and the next Birthday card I got was a pic of a cat clinging to the roof with its claws and a cloud coming out of its butt, and the husband looking at the wife saying "you've been feeding your curry to the cat again, haven't you?" I thought it was lovely.:( (my curry, not the card!)Try it, maybe it's not as hot as back then, but it still might have a kick.

Darkginger

I totally agree that Patak's has changed out of all recognition over the years - they used to have a much stronger, more authentically Indian restaurant flavour - but then again, many Indian restaurants seem to cater more to the 'average' palate than that of the curry-head nowadays.

Those of us who are trying to reproduce the restaurant flavour at home treat it as more of a hobby than a way to put dinner on the table - you end up obsessed with tweaking complex recipes!

One of my favourite 'easy' curries is simply minced beef, cooked with chopped onion, some good curry powder (like the Rajah, TRS or East End blends), maybe a few chopped mushrooms, and a handful of frozen peas thrown in at the end. Doesn't get much simpler than that!

It all depends what you're trying to achieve - a tasty dinner, or something that tastes like it came from your local takeaway. For the former, there are numerous ways to achieve it - the latter requires you to follow the restaurant methods and use the correct ingredients.

I wouldn't really know where to begin with Thai curry, 'cos it's not my thing (though Curry Addict's Malaysian Beef Curry from last year's Cooking Club is really good)!

DyldeBrill

I love to blend my own, I find it more enjoyable and I actually find that it tastes better!

MrO

Curry Bible by Madhur Jaffrey - never looked back

Babooshka

Darkginger wrote: »

I totally agree that Patak's has changed out of all recognition over the years - they used to have a much stronger, more authentically Indian restaurant flavour - but then again, many Indian restaurants seem to cater more to the 'average' palate than that of the curry-head nowadays.

QUOTE]

I am now going to admit something very nerdy and geeky, I actually contacted Patak's and asked them why their recipe for madras changed...they just said that they always strive to improve their recipes and blah blah...I was actually telling them I thought it was nicer originally. But I reckon maybe it had some ingredients that might not be passed by the health authorities now, additives and things maybe? I don't know, I am just guessing, cos it tasted a lot nicer back then!

Babooshka

MrO wrote: »

Curry Bible by Madhur Jaffrey - never looked back

Will check that out.

GeorgeCostanza

I'd respectfully disagree with the previous posters who recommend making a curry "base" and pre-cooking meat for curries. These are steps used by low/mid-end Indian restaurants so that they can churn out curries very quickly - curries are the same as any stew or braise, low and slow cooking. Pre-cooking meat in particular seems like a very odd thing to do.

I'd recommend getting a good book (Anjum Anand's are excellent) and making each dish from scratch, then freezing the leftovers, rather than freezing a "base". That way every curry you create will taste unique as they're not all derived from the same sauce.

I'd also stay away from any recipe which specifies "curry powder". Indian people don't use "curry powder" at home, tailoring the spices in each dish individually. It allows you much more control. Also, curry powder is typically composed of higher proportions of the cheapers spices like cumin and corinder and less of the expensive aromatic ones (cardamom, cinnamon, clove etc.). I also think they contain way too much turmeric.

MrO

Definitely true - the curry base option can be easier but not as good as building from scratch.

It's great making up your own garam masala etc. - I think heating and grinding your own spices each time is the only way to go. A lot of the bulky powder packs seem to lose their potency quickly enough so I mostly just buy seeds now (with the exception of cayenne, tumeric etc.)

Jaysus, I'm getting hungry just thinking about it

GeorgeCostanza wrote: »

I'd respectfully disagree with the previous posters who recommend making a curry "base" and pre-cooking meat for curries. These are steps used by low/mid-end Indian restaurants so that they can churn out curries very quickly - curries are the same as any stew or braise, low and slow cooking. Pre-cooking meat in particular seems like a very odd thing to do.

I'd recommend getting a good book (Anjum Anand's are excellent) and making each dish from scratch, then freezing the leftovers, rather than freezing a "base". That way every curry you create will taste unique as they're not all derived from the same sauce.

I'd also stay away from any recipe which specifies "curry powder". Indian people don't use "curry powder" at home, tailoring the spices in each dish individually. It allows you much more control. Also, curry powder is typically composed of higher proportions of the cheapers spices like cumin and corinder and less of the expensive aromatic ones (cardamom, cinnamon, clove etc.). I also think they contain way too much turmeric.

Babooshka

MrO wrote: »

Definitely true - the curry base option can be easier but not as good as building from scratch.

It's great making up your own garam masala etc. - I think heating and grinding your own spices each time is the only way to go. A lot of the bulky powder packs seem to lose their potency quickly enough so I mostly just buy seeds now (with the exception of cayenne, tumeric etc.)

Jaysus, I'm getting hungry just thinking about it

Could you do a sort of half and half type compromise then? As in, I have been buying the seed form of cumin, coriander, cardamom, mustard seeds, heating and grinding in mortar and pestle, and then I add them to fresh garlic and ginger and chillis that I've heated in a wok for about 10 minutes to make the paste, cook that up with the meat, then add tinned tomatoes and water and simmer....but what if you made the base sauce out of blended onions and garlic and ginger and added that to the home made ground spice mix, that sound ok?

MrO

Babooshka wrote: »

Could you do a sort of half and half type compromise then? As in, I have been buying the seed form of cumin, coriander, cardamom, mustard seeds, heating and grinding in mortar and pestle, and then I add them to fresh garlic and ginger and chillis that I've heated in a wok for about 10 minutes to make the paste, cook that up with the meat, then add tinned tomatoes and water and simmer....but what if you made the base sauce out of blended onions and garlic and ginger and added that to the home made ground spice mix, that sound ok?

To be honest, I can't see why not - but I'm open to correction on that. Some Indian cooks have fairly regimental sequencing about what should be added at what stage to get best from the flavours.

I guess ultimately it whatever works for you (in terms of taste).

I did notice something recently though, I've done a few Indian cookery course over the last few years - but I was at one in a restaurant in Rathmines. The cook there said it was really important to fry the onions (pretty much on their own) for a lot longer than I ever had, 20 -35 minutes on a medium heat. Then add spices and tomatoes etc.

Until they get that really sweet crunchy texture (without being burned). Now maybe it was my imagination - but I did notice a big difference!

Babooshka

MrO wrote: »

To be honest, I can't see why not - but I'm open to correction on that. Some Indian cooks have fairly regimental sequencing about what should be added at what stage to get best from the flavours.

I guess ultimately it whatever works for you (in terms of taste).

I did notice something recently though, I've done a few Indian cookery course over the last few years - but I was at one in a restaurant in Rathmines. The cook there said it was really important to fry the onions (pretty much on their own) for a lot longer than I ever had, 20 -35 minutes on a medium heat. Then add spices and tomatoes etc.

Until they get that really sweet crunchy texture (without being burned). Now maybe it was my imagination - but I did notice a big difference!

Thanks...you know, the mad thing about curries is (maybe it's because they originate from so many different regions ) is every time I look up an online recipe, they always differ in at least one ingredient or method, but I guess that's the lovely thing about making them, every one is slightly different depending on what way you do it, or even if you vary the ingredients slightly. I definitely find fresher is better, especially garlic and ginger for their zing.

I could ask questions all day...but another one is....I have seen different things about this in recipes, some say "slightly bruise" the cardomom pods, and I guess that is so the aromas come out, some say "de-seed" them...some say put them in the roasting process and then take them out, and some just say put them in and leave them in. Any thoughts on that?

Raditub

always blend my own...its easy really and after a while u can really develop the perfect mixture suiting your very own tastebuds hahah

the beer revolu

Babooshka wrote: »

Thanks...you know, the mad thing about curries is (maybe it's because they originate from so many different regions ) is every time I look up an online recipe, they always differ in at least one ingredient or method, but I guess that's the lovely thing about making them, every one is slightly different depending on what way you do it, or even if you vary the ingredients slightly. I definitely find fresher is better, especially garlic and ginger for their zing.

Well it would be kind of like googling 'stew' you'd get a massive variation of methods and ingredients to make a huge number of different 'stews' from many different regions.

sjaakie

Curry addict is totally right....

with all the respect in the world but I had to response to "georgecostanzea" 's post:


as for the below quote from georgecostanze ; "steps used by low/mid-end restaurants"..... errrr.... and what do the higher end restaurants use according to you?
and; "pre-cooking meat seems a very odd thing to do".... acually pre-cooking meat makes it juicy and tasty"

GeorgeCostanza wrote: »

I'd respectfully disagree with the previous posters who recommend making a curry "base" and pre-cooking meat for curries. These are steps used by low/mid-end Indian restaurants so that they can churn out curries very quickly - curries are the same as any stew or braise, low and slow cooking. Pre-cooking meat in particular seems like a very odd thing to do.

I'd recommend getting a good book (Anjum Anand's are excellent) and making each dish from scratch, then freezing the leftovers, rather than freezing a "base". That way every curry you create will taste unique as they're not all derived from the same sauce.

I'd also stay away from any recipe which specifies "curry powder". Indian people don't use "curry powder" at home, tailoring the spices in each dish individually. It allows you much more control. Also, curry powder is typically composed of higher proportions of the cheapers spices like cumin and corinder and less of the expensive aromatic ones (cardamom, cinnamon, clove etc.). I also think they contain way too much turmeric.