Overrated fighters? who's yours and why.

cowzerp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sncQC8_5uEM

Wont embed for some reason so im just putting up the link.

I think he's really over rated and thats all aspects of his game, just watch his highlights and its crude and lacking skill, head movement, footwork, and power compared to the likes of Tyson, Foreman etc is more like a middleweight.

I'd have no doubt that Evander as a cruiser weight would have demolished him.

compare that clip to tysons

Rocky facts

This proves nothing but to me shows something!
Before beating the old and badly faded Joe Louis in 51 the Rock was fighting 4 years so not on his 1st few fights, he had 6 fights in 1951 before beating Louis, the combined record of his 6 foe's was 99 wins 64 losses and 10 draws,

after joe he beat lee savold 96-37-3 and coming off 2 losses in his last 3

then he fought Gino Buonvino who was 24-14-8 and coming off a loss and losing 3 of his last 6

then bernie reynolds, 51-9-1 and had lost 4 of his last 6

in the rest of the career he fought 3 lads who had a winning record in their last fights of 6 wins in a row

The rest (8 fighters) not 1 had more than a 2 fight win streak going, this may read harsh but there facts-Then he retired at 32 when he could have kept fighting at the top level. Or could he????

oh yeah and 10 of his 11 opponents before louis had not got even a 2 win streak record going on, with 9 of them coming off losses, the 1 not coming off a loss was coming off 4 losses from 5 fights.

30 of his 49 fights where not coming off win's.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sncQC8_5uEM

Wont embed for some reason so im just putting up the link.

I think he's really over rated and thats all aspects of his game, just watch his highlights and its crude and lacking skill, head movement, footwork, and power compared to the likes of Tyson, Foreman etc is more like a middleweight.

I'd have no doubt that Evander as a cruiser weight would have demolished him.

Is it Rocky? My browser will not open the link. If so, I think you are well off the mark. Think he was a fine fighter. At CW Holyfield may have beaten him, but demolished? Also, you say he is lacking power compared to Tyson and Foreman? Well, he was 185 lbs. Does that not at all explain that he may not hit as hard? If I said SRL lacked power compared to Michael Spinks, surely the weight difference has to be considered?

You know, some people will debate with you that punch for punch, Rocky hit as hard as any man in history. You saying it compared more to a MW is quite diffcult for me to get behind, when most everyone rates Rocky as a terrifically powerful hitter.

But, that is your view, and I respect that. I assume you don't mind me analysing and commenting on your choice, you know folks can get touchy about stuff.;)

I see subtlety, skill, neat "attacking" feet, dips, ducks, subtle defense, crippling power and all the intangibles in spades. His fitness level too was incredible.

Holyfield at CW better be prepared to be fighting for 12 or 15 rds non stop. And, it is not Dwight Muhammad Qawi hitting him either, and hitting him everywhere.

As for my example of overrated: Hamed, Monzon (although Monzon was an all time great, he never floated my boat, so maybe boring is best to describe him).

Hamed? Well, I just saw no fundamental technical skills. The bread and butter skills. He was all reflexes and nice movement, and was great at knocking out fighters that IMO were far from special. He hadn't even got a decent jab, remotely decent, and when he met skill, MAB, who barely broke sweat, his lunging and leaping and lack of technical skill showed up badly.

And, damn was I sick hearing people saying he had WW power. Had he WW power, I don't care, even Wayne was getting knocked out cold.

Johner

Pacquaio is overrated imo. Not saying he isn't a brilliant fighter just think he vastly overrated by many.

walshb

Johner wrote: »

Pacquaio is overrated imo. Not saying he isn't a brilliant fighter just think he vastly overrated by many.

That view wouldn't be all that uncommon.

I think he is brilliant. Also, I think he sure has improved as a fighter in the past few years. I mean, his whole body, balance and approach to a fight has changed. Not near as reckless, wild, lunging or left hand happy.

gene_tunney

Marciano is the first fighter that came to mind when I saw the thread title. Prime Roy Jones would beat him, so would any decent modern heavy.

Nowadays Khan, Helenius, Sergio Martinez

walshb

gene_tunney wrote: »

Marciano is the first fighter that came to mind when I saw the thread title. Prime Roy Jones would beat him, so would any decent modern heavy.

Nowadays Khan, Helenius, Sergio Martinez

"Prime" Jones was probably 168 lbs?

Jones from the Ruiz time I don't think beats Rocky.

I agree that Martinez is overrated.. Very good, but the way some speak of him you would think he was a monster. Put him in the 80s and he isn't a champ at 160 lbs. Nor is he a 154 lbs champ when the likes of McCallum and Hearns are around. I think he is very good for the level today.

gene_tunney

walshb wrote: »

"Prime" Jones was probably 168 lbs?

Jones from the Ruiz days I don't think beats Rocky.

I agree that Martinez is overrated.. Very good, but the way some speak of him you would think he was a monster. Put him in the 80s and he isn't a champ at 160 lbs. Nor is he a 154 lbs champ when the likes of McCallum and Hearns are around. I think he is very good for the level today.

What I mean is a prime Jones bulking up to maybe 185. The Roy Jones who remacted and beat Montell Griffin at 175 would beat Rocky IMO, but if it actually happened I'd imagine he'd bulk up to maybe 185 for it.

walshb

gene_tunney wrote: »

What I mean is a prime Jones bulking up to maybe 185. The Roy Jones who remacted and beat Montell Griffin at 175 would beat Rocky IMO, but if it actually happened I'd imagine he'd bulk up to maybe 185 for it.

Yes, I had a feeling that this is what you meant. Just wanted to clarify. Hey, Jones is so good and slick and cute that I see him being no walkover, but I think the pace Rocky sets, the intensity, the volume, the strength, the throwing of shots at almost any part of the body, and the fact that I don't think Jones can deter him, get his real respect, will see Rocky score a late rds KO, somewhere between 9-12. If over 15 rds, I think Jones does not make it to the end either. Rocky will make Roy fight move, work and fight at a pace he just will not like one bit.

tryingmybestt

Fraudley Harrison - most overrated fighter when he turned professional

Chavez Jnr - hopefully Rubio a B level fighter exposes him and gets the KO

Kelly Pavlik - never lived up to expectation

Amir Khan - he's good but not a p4p fighter

Pacman - he's great but not an all time great - excellent PR job done by Bob Arum

Lucian Bute - hugely overrated and protected fighter....hopefully froch fight happens and froch gets the ko

P.S. no way jones dominates MArciano......close call......jones could outbox him and move and run for 12 rounds of rocky could ko him at any point in fight....i'd have to choose marciano...too strong, too tough, too powerful, too determined, great pressure fighter, excellent stamina

gene_tunney

Pacquiao is most definitely an ATG.

Sorry, but you can't win world titles in 7 weight divisons and not be an ATG.

He's beaten Barrera, Morales, Cotto, Margarito, Mosley, De La Hoya, Hatton, Marquez. All this despite having his first pro fight at 106lbs.

tryingmybestt

gene_tunney wrote: »

Pacquiao is most definitely an ATG.

Sorry, but you can't win world titles in 7 weight divisons and not be an ATG.

He's beaten Barrera, Morales, Cotto, Margarito, Mosley, De La Hoya, Hatton, Marquez. All this despite having his first pro fight at 106lbs.

Barrera was past it after so many wars

morales was definitely past it and totally drained at the weight !!

cotto was damaged goods after margarito and was weight drained !

mosley was a shot fighter and an old man!

de la hoya - don't need to say much...de la hoya was beaten at the scales and way past his prime!

Hatton was already destroyed by mayweather and ****ed at the weight

Marquez beat him twice IMO and in the opinion of a lot of experts....add to that marquez is well past his prime and naturall smaller and pacman pciks weight limits that suits him and not JMM

How would pacman have done if he fought all these fighters in their prime?? i bet he loses most !! except maybe hatton and cotto would be close

walshb

gene_tunney wrote: »

Pacquiao is most definitely an ATG.

Sorry, but you can't win world titles in 7 weight divisons and not be an ATG.

He's beaten Barrera, Morales, Cotto, Margarito, Mosley, De La Hoya, Hatton, Marquez. All this despite having his first pro fight at 106lbs.

Although I agree Manny is a great, winning 7 'world titles' is not my main reason. Just look at the comp level and how there are so so many more titles available, and, not even at the official weights. Catchweights too. Great great fighter all the same.

tryingmybestt

for me pacman might sneak into the top 50 p4p ever but i wouldn't have him near the top 20...

to many cherry picked opponents and fighters past their prime or damaged goods

besides hatton his ko's have stopped at the higher weights further detracting from his legacy of a good ko%

walshb

I have watched that video of Rocky again. I must say, I see so much to appalud in that. His power, angles, dips, switch hitting, variation in his hots, variation in power shots, neat uppercuts. Gentle feet on the attack, sliding into range. Man, to me, that video really showcases one of the best fighters ever. I cannot see anything crude. Wanna' see crude, watch Edwin Valero, not the great Marciano. What a tremendous inside fighter too. Tremendous.

The KO of Walcott is pure class. The set up, the feet in movement, the drive thru, the effortless power from such a short shot. Poetry in motion. Oh, and the great music to accompany the clip.

tryingmybestt

i'd also rate armstrongs achievement of holding 3 proper world titles at 126, 135 and 147 at same time as being better than pacman winning 7 phoney world titles

back then the title meant something

now titles mean nothing with 4 main organisations and so many weights and not only that now there's 'super champs' and 'champion emeritus' and 'international champ'....WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

now its more about the fighters and the good matches, noone cares if its for a title!!

greedy ****ing promoters and boxing organisations

gene_tunney

tryingmybestt wrote: »

Barrera was past it after so many wars

morales was definitely past it and totally drained at the weight !!

cotto was damaged goods after margarito and was weight drained !

mosley was a shot fighter and an old man!

de la hoya - don't need to say much...de la hoya was beaten at the scales and way past his prime!

Hatton was already destroyed by mayweather and ****ed at the weight

Marquez beat him twice IMO and in the opinion of a lot of experts....add to that marquez is well past his prime and naturall smaller and pacman pciks weight limits that suits him and not JMM

How would pacman have done if he fought all these fighters in their prime?? i bet he loses most !! except maybe hatton and cotto would be close

Pac beat a prime Barrera. Cotto and Hatton are "damaged goods" after 1 loss? :rolleyes:

You can tear apart anyone's resume by going on like that. Muhammad Ali is widely regarded as an ATG but watch this:

- lost to joe Frazier who went on to be pummelled around the ring and Ko'd in 2 by Foreman
- struggled to beat a washed up Frazier in their 3rd fight, tried to quit on his stool but Dundee wouldn't let him
- Beaten by the very average Ken Norton and arguably lost the rematch which he was awarded by SD.
- 29 of Ali's opponents were cruiserweights
- Cleveland Williams was in absolute bits in their fight having been shot in the kidney by a cop
- Joe Frazier shouldn't have been allowed to take on Ali in the 3rd fight; he was almost completely blind in his left eye.
- Leon Spinks beat him in his 8th pro fight, then went on to be KO'd in the 1st round by a journeyman

Not saying I necessarily suscribe to the above points, just showing how anyone's resume can be exposed.

tryingmybestt

marciano was a great champion who overcame everything....he had short arms, similar to pacmans in length, he cut very easily and he was relatively light....

he was a beast and usually became a little wild only when his man was in trouble or against the ropes

Marciano KO's tyson in rounds 6-9

tryingmybestt

gene_tunney wrote: »

Pac beat a prime Barrera. Cotto and Hatton are "damaged goods" after 1 loss? :rolleyes:

You can tear apart anyone's resume by going on like that. Muhammad Ali is widely regarded as an ATG but watch this:

- lost to joe Frazier who went on to be pummelled around the ring and Ko'd in 2 by Foreman
- struggled to beat a washed up Frazier in their 3rd fight, tried to quit on his stool but Dundee wouldn't let him
- Beaten by the very average Ken Norton and arguably lost the rematch which he was awarded by SD.
- 29 of Ali's opponents were cruiserweights
- Cleveland Williams was in absolute bits in their fight having been shot in the kidney by a cop
- Joe Frazier shouldn't have been allowed to take on Ali in the 3rd fight; he was almost completely blind in his left eye.
- Leon Spinks beat him in his 8th pro fight, then went on to be KO'd in the 1st round by a journeyman

Not saying I necessarily suscribe to the above points, just showing how anyone's resume can be exposed.

yeah ali had some bad points but he also had great achoevements...

he ko'd foreman when ali was a huge underdog

he ko'd liston twice and the first time he was a huge underdog

he beat many very good fighter during his first reign

his performance against frazier the first time was exceptional considering he was out of the ring so long and frazier was unbeaten then

ali won olympic gold

where are pacman's great achievements????

frazier v ali 3 is considered the greatest fight of all time and the greatest display of heart and guts of all time !!!!! GREAT ACHIEVEMENT

pool8

what about the italian stallion, rocky balboa a never say die atitude. very hard to compare fighters from different era's. different health and training facilities.

walshb

pool8 wrote: »

what about the italian stallion, rocky balboa a never say die atitude. very hard to compare fighters from different era's. different health and training facilities.

I don't see this difficulty at all. Has things so much changed that in 50 years we cannot comapre, or match man against man? Rocky Marciano today beats ANY man weighing up to 200 lbs. That is what I feel. So, what has changed so much?

Over 200 lbs and he still could well. Haye? Solis? Rocky tires these guys out from the mere sight of him. BTW, not saying you are saying that one era is best. Just posing the question.

It's 12 rds these days. I will see pigs fly before I could even envisage some heavyweights lasting 15 rds of action, because in Rocky's time, he went 15 rds of actual fighting.

Raekwon

The first name that came to my mind when I read the thread title was Sven Ottke.

He won the IBF Super Middleweight title in 1998 and defended his title 21 times as well as adding the WBA Super Middleweight title in 2003. He retired undefeated in 2004 with a record of 34(6)-0-0 and defeated the likes of Charles Brewer (twice), Thomas Tate (twice), Glen Johnson, Silvio Branco, James Butler, Anthony Mundine, Robin Reid & Byron Mitchell.

What makes him overrated with such an impressive CV? Well he never fought outside of Germany and a large percentage of his wins were perceived as highly controversial 'home town' decisions. He was also somewhat protected and dodged fights against the likes of Joe Calzaghe, Mikkel Kessler & even Jeff Lacey. But the strangest decision was his point blank refusal to fight fellow German & WBC Super Middlewight champion Markus Beyer to unify the division. I think that he actually preferred to retire unbeaten then to risk his undefeated record against the likes of Beyer or move up to Light Heavy to challenge Dariusz Michalczewski or RoyJones Jr.

In my opinion he is totally overrated.

tryingmybestt

95% of german fighters or fighters based in germany are overrated due to hometown decisions and being protected fighters fighting only limited opposition

also they have the most boring crowd ever....i fought there once in cologne and when a german crown goes crazy they clap in unison in an orderly fashion:D:D

Raekwon

That is true but Ottke is a particular standout because of his long title reign and the fact that he retired undefeated.

At least other undefeated champions like Joe Calzaghe put their titles on the line and actually went to Germany & the US to fight Mario Veit & Bernard Hopkins.

tryingmybestt

most ppl never heard of ottke....so his unbeaten run isn't worth one of mickey wards exciting fights

gene_tunney

tryingmybestt wrote: »

95% of german fighters or fighters based in germany are overrated due to hometown decisions and being protected fighters fighting only limited opposition

also they have the most boring crowd ever....i fought there once in cologne and when a german crown goes crazy they clap in unison in an orderly fashion:D:D

I prefer that kind of atmosphere at a fight. At the end of the day, it's a boxing match and not a street fight, so I never cared for the whole thing of the crowd going nuts baying for blood, usually downing pints of horrible overpriced beer while they're at it.

I was at Haye vs Klitschko in Germany and the stands were full of drunken Brits singing inappropriate Nazi and anti-German chants. They were all fairly well on and most of them probably passed out before the fight started. I had the misfortune to be on the plane with some of them as well and they were all going on about how Haye was going to destroy this eastern stiff.

As I got closer to the ring, you could see that the more expensive the seats were the more educated the fans were, and the drunken chanting lessened.

The Brits fell fairly quiet fairly soon though

Apologies for rant! :pac:

tryingmybestt

gene_tunney wrote: »

I prefer that kind of atmosphere at a fight. At the end of the day, it's a boxing match and not a street fight, so I never cared for the whole thing of the crowd going nuts baying for blood, usually downing pints of horrible overpriced beer while they're at it.

I was at Haye vs Klitschko in Germany and the stands were full of drunken Brits singing inappropriate Nazi and anti-German chants. They were all fairly well on and most of them probably passed out before the fight started. I had the misfortune to be on the plane with some of them as well and they were all going on about how Haye was going to destroy this eastern stiff.

As I got closer to the ring, you could see that the more expensive the seats were the more educated the fans were, and the drunken chanting lessened.

The Brits fell fairly quiet fairly soon though

Apologies for rant! :pac:

no way!!

i was at hatton v tszyu in manchester....best atmosphere and event i ever experienced!!

can you imagine madison square garden, york hall, MGM etc. full of germans clapping in unison...lol

minty16

Pains me to see it but one has got to be Prince Naseem Hamed. In terms of boxing ability he was not as good as he was made out. I've heard some pundits call him the greatest Brittish fighter of all time recently. Shocking statement. Maybe the greatest showman of all time. Don't get me wrong I loved watching him but he did not have fundamental boxing skills. His jab was non existent, He was badly exposed by MAB , and the fighters he had previously walked through were not of great standard. I liked him, wish he could have won that fight, but if you have it 100 times he's never going to win. Best ever British boxer - Sorry can't have it , or even close.

cowzerp

As someone who loves to study boxing and its skills I don't see them in Marciano- crude, wild and sloppy I might say, defensively hunching over and back
He was quite slow, footwork was poor-saying his skills where subtle is a cop out, then we can say that about anyone we don't see skills in.

He had heart, tenacity, power and fitness, after that very limited.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

As someone who loves to study boxing and its skills I don't see them in him, crude, wild and sloppy I might say, defensively hunching over and back
He was quite slow, footwork was poor-saying his skills where subtle is a cop out, then we can say that about anyone we don't see skills in.

He had heart, tenacity, power and fitness, after that very limited.

Wrong thread, Paul!:). Copied over Bren

If you avoid shots, does it so matter how you do it? Hunching, turning, dipping, "running", shoulder rolling etc?

And, nothing at all wild about a lot in that clip. Yes, some wild, but almost any fighter can throw wild shots.

Skill is a very subjective word. He had more than the things you list. That clip on the other thread shows great punch variation; short, long, in close, uppercuts, hooks off both sides, and also, doing this whilst dipping and turning and ducking. His whole body in sync. A fantastic fighter.

Wanna' see sloppy, and possibly overrated, I would look at Rocky Graziano.

Although Dempsey was a great fighter, I think folks overrate the guy when saying he'd ko this man and that man. He could be wild and not all that technically skilled. Real wide and wild shots he threw. Not always, but plenty. Very fast feet, very good hitter, but when I hear that he'd KO Foreman or Tyson, for example, and he himself would not be KO'd, I find that difficult to take. Jack suffered a couple of KO losses if I am correct, when not past peak, and by men that were not close to the two names I mention.

pool8

who from present day fighters would you like to see fighting against boxers of previous years. i would have liked mike tyson v audley harrison and then when finished with him bring david haye out and put him down all in the same night.
possible??

walshb

pool8 wrote: »

who from present day fighters would you like to see fighting against boxers of previous years. i would have liked mike tyson v audley harrison and then when finished with him bring david haye out and put him down all in the same night.
possible??

How from so so many years boxing/fighters did Fraudley come into a fantasy fight, and then Haye:p?

Result: Tyson wins by KO in both bouts at the staredown.

walshb

cowzerp wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sncQC8_5uEM

Wont embed for some reason so im just putting up the link.

I think he's really over rated and thats all aspects of his game, just watch his highlights and its crude and lacking skill, head movement, footwork, and power compared to the likes of Tyson, Foreman etc is more like a middleweight.

I'd have no doubt that Evander as a cruiser weight would have demolished him.

compare that clip to tysons

Rocky facts

This proves nothing but to me shows something!
Before beating the old and badly faded Joe Louis in 51 the Rock was fighting 4 years so not on his 1st few fights, he had 6 fights in 1951 before beating Louis, the combined record of his 6 foe's was 99 wins 64 losses and 10 draws,

after joe he beat lee savold 96-37-3 and coming off 2 losses in his last 3

then he fought Gino Buonvino who was 24-14-8 and coming off a loss and losing 3 of his last 6

then bernie reynolds, 51-9-1 and had lost 4 of his last 6

in the rest of the career he fought 3 lads who had a winning record in their last fights of 6 wins in a row

The rest (8 fighters) not 1 had more than a 2 fight win streak going, this may read harsh but there facts-Then he retired at 32 when he could have kept fighting at the top level. Or could he????

oh yeah and 10 of his 11 opponents before louis had not got even a 2 win streak record going on, with 9 of them coming off losses, the 1 not coming off a loss was coming off 4 losses from 5 fights.

30 of his 49 fights where not coming off win's.

Can anyone post a more "wicked miss" than the uppercut Rocky throws right at the start of the video, 5 secs in. Had that landed it could have been the first punch ever to decapitate a fighter. Holy sh1t that was thrown with serious intent, and was very technical too.

tryingmybestt

finesse in boxing is not everything

to say Marciano is overrated is saying that you don't rate:

power
strenght
toughness
determination
stamina/fitness
chin

he fought eveyone around...he gave walcott a rematch after thier first

his last 5 opponents had records of:

148-19
66-11
83-11
83-10
52-3

i think these are very good records for a time when fighters fought much more often and a loss was not the end of the world

forgot to add one of marciano's best attributes....Balance.....he had excellent balance even when missing a punch he was always in position to throw another hard punch

Spazdarn

Ricky Hatton, once all the hype dies down, he didn't really beat anyone of worth bar Tszyu, he was horsed by Mayweather and Manny, and wasn't really convincing in any of the other fights at the tail end of his career. He wasn't old when he retired either so old age isn't a factor.

Other overrated stars at the moment would be Devon Alexander, Chavez Jr, and Canelo.

I think Canelo will end up being very good but right now, he's far too hyped and regarded by most.

walshb

Hatton really is only overrated by the British. The Americans never really thought much of him.

Spazdarn

walshb wrote: »

Hatton really is only overrated by the British. The Americans never really thought much of him.

I'll admit I definitely did buy into the Sky sports driven hype, thinking the fights with Mayweather and Manny would be competitive.

I was wrong

efb

Ricky (Sky sponsored Hype) Hatton.
A scrapper that beat a fighter one fight out of retirement and got he ass handed to him to two genuine p4ps

runboyrun

I loved Hatton's style but I feel he was overrated.

cowzerp

runboyrun wrote: »

I loved Hatton's style but I feel he was overrated.

I did too, really enjoyed it and always loved watching him fight but he was a good fighter not a great 1,at times people under rate him because he lost to 2 elite fighters too

runboyrun

He was world class not p4p class.

RiseToTheTop

tryingmybestt wrote: »

i'd also rate armstrongs achievement of holding 3 proper world titles at 126, 135 and 147 at same time as being better than pacman winning 7 phoney world titles

back then the title meant something

now titles mean nothing with 4 main organisations and so many weights and not only that now there's 'super champs' and 'champion emeritus' and 'international champ'....WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

now its more about the fighters and the good matches, noone cares if its for a title!!

greedy ****ing promoters and boxing organisations

Armstrong won titles from the weight of 126 to 147 lbs, a 21lbs span. Pacman won titles from 106-147 lbs, a 41lb span. Say what you want about the titles, but if Pacman fought back then he'd have had more titles than Armstrong. (back then as in the old time era, i'm not putting him straight into the timeline of Armstrong as in they'd be fighting.)

corny

Ricky Hatton overrated? Who ever said he was great?

A fabulous body puncher with a great attitude who was unable to match Floyd or Mannys excellence. Doesn't make him cannon fodder. At least he had the balls to find his limitations.

walshb

corny wrote: »

Ricky Hatton overrated? Who ever said he was great?

A fabulous body puncher with a great attitude who was unable to match Floyd or Mannys excellence. Doesn't make him cannon fodder. At least he had the balls to find his limitations.

Great attitude? Ballooning up consistently between fights is not a great attitude. Rough and tough, but limited. A tough slugger. I liked watching Hatton, but I overrated him. The British certainly did too.

Yes, good body puncher too. Fundamental wise he was very ordinary. No jab, and almost no straight and clean punches.

slapbangwallop

tryingmybestt wrote: »

no way!!

i was at hatton v tszyu in manchester....best atmosphere and event i ever experienced!!

can you imagine madison square garden, york hall, MGM etc. full of germans clapping in unison...lol

I was at Hatton v Tszyu as well - wasnt a patch on Dunne v Cordoba in my opinion.

Also cant believe some people added Chavez Jnr as being overrated. By how exactly? Over popular does not equate to over rated. For more on this subject turn to page 482 for the chapter on John Duddy.

My contribution to this thread could be many - Willie Casey (even before Rigo), Amir Khan (even before Prescott) etc but I will settle on British golden boy, Darren Barker.

efb

slapbangwallop wrote: »

I was at Hatton v Tszyu as well - wasnt a patch on Dunne v Cordoba in my opinion.

Also cant believe some people added Chavez Jnr as being overrated. By how exactly? Over popular does not equate to over rated. For more on this subject turn to page 482 for the chapter on John Duddy.

My contribution to this thread could be many - Willie CaseIy (even before Rigo), Amir Khan (even before Prescott) etc but I will settle on British golden boy, Darren Barker.

I was at Hatton Mayweather - listening to the stunned silence while their hero got bounced off the corner post- priceless!

FeckinUsername

Any of the well known British fighters over the last number of years - Haye, Hamed, Hatton, Khan etc. Not because they are bad fighters, but because the British hype machine made them out to be the best we have ever seen.

corny

walshb wrote: »

Great attitude? Ballooning up consistently between fights is not a great attitude. Rough and tough, but limited. A tough slugger. I liked watching Hatton, but I overrated him. The British certainly did too.

Yes, good body puncher too. Fundamental wise he was very ordinary. No jab, and almost no straight and clean punches.

Yeah very ordinary fighters regularly go 40 odd fights without defeat beating the likes of Tszyu and Castillo along the way.;)

He was put in place by two greats in their prime that were made for his style. Does that suddenly demote him to the status of also-ran? And in order for him to be overrated you must have thought him the equal of those 2 fighters because he accounted for everyone else. Is that right?

He enjoyed life in between fights thats for sure but he had a super attitude where it mattered - in the ring.

walshb

corny wrote: »

Yeah very ordinary fighters regularly go 40 odd fights without defeat beating the likes of Tszyu and Castillo along the way.;)

He was put in place by two greats in their prime that were made for his style. Does that suddenly demote him to the status of also-ran? And in order for him to be overrated you must have thought him the equal of those 2 fighters because he accounted for everyone else. Is that right?

He enjoyed life in between fights thats for sure but he had a super attitude where it mattered - in the ring.

Very ordinary in the sense of his fundamental skills, text-book skills.

BTW, Castillo was a bit past his best. Never a threat to Hatton.

Good fighter, not great.

cowzerp

I do think hatton is underrated now because he was overrated when he was doing well-losing to 2 of the era's lb for lb greats is expected in reality and no shame in it-he was not legendary great but was a very good fighter

I will remember him fondly, as a fightervand as an entertainer as I always loved watching him.

FeckinUsername

cowzerp wrote: »

I do think hatton is underrated now because he was overrated when he was doing well-losing to 2 of the era's lb for lb greats is expected in reality and no shame in it-he was not legendary great but was a very good fighter

I will remember him fondly, as a fightervand as an entertainer as I always loved watching him.

I always enjoyed watching him. I liked his style. Even his loses to Pac and Mayweather were entertaining. No shame in either of those loses either.

gene_tunney

Hatton is underrated IMO.

He gave prime Mayweather his hardest fight apart from DLH.