Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12-Jan 2012 onwards

opr

mike65 wrote: »

Now if you know who had come out with that. Disingenuous.

I am not going to start Kenny bashing as I am firmly in the camp that will fully support him being manager next season but that interview is such bollox.

He talked about at the start of the season how a quality first eleven was most important but that it was a squad game and he had a really good one at his disposal. Players like Maxi have hardly had a bloody kick of the ball all season despite playing well. His use of the squad has been of his own making.

Opr

dannydiamond

Kenny talking about luck after games is poor. He did the same after the QPR game.
I guess it must be hard to know what to say but he was more than happy to give the players a bollocking on camera a few short weeks ago. He sounds a little lost.

He's saying that he hasn't enough players to rotate the squad? Every team gets injuries and you just have to prepare the best you can and deal with it when need be, it's no excuse. We're not even playing in europe for crying out loud.

Chucky the tree

There is no reason why the second goal should be chalked off for me

Jesus Kenny, he's turning into Woy with this stuff.

missingtime

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

missingtime wrote: »

Hand on heart I would **** the two cups in the bin if it meant we got 4th. Tuesday and Wednesday nights with the champions league music is so much more satisfying.

If we have a chance of doing something in it! Arsenal and Spurs are happy to simply get in the dance and get embarrassed away from home a couple of times before they exit before the money games. I want us to get back into Europe and be mixing it in the business end. We're not at such a point yet.

As such, winning competitions we are good enough to compete in is as happy as one can be at present.

utd went into it league winners and didnt get to the knockout round. We need to be in the champions league.

Will I Amnt

opr wrote: »

Kenny: "It doesn't matter how well or badly you play, you still need a wee bit of luck sometimes and there is no reason why the second goal should be chalked off for me.

Opr

I'm guessing he didn't see a replay,either that or he's gone mental.

LuckyLloyd

Interview is awful. He shouldn't be hiding from bad results. We were poor and we got what we deserved. That is what he should be saying.

rossie1977

liverpool are miles from being a champions league team atm and would be embarrassed if they came up against the likes of real, barca or bayern so its probably better they stick to the europa at least for next year

even if they qualified i wouldn't bet on them winning the qualifying round, in fact whoever finishes 4th this year won't get into the champions league proper imo given how poor english sides have been in europe last 3 years

Jesus Wept

We'd obviously only go and win the champions league with Rafa at the helm, would have a harder time getting into it.

DDC1990

All the Cúnts are out today, gleefully rubbing their hands at Liverpools "downfall".

Sad day.

applehunter

Downfall from what?

Turtyturd

DDC1990 wrote: »

All the Cúnts are out today, gleefully rubbing their hands at Liverpools "downfall".

Sad day.

That's the worst thing about it.

I am tempted to go to Anfield next week with the match thread printed out on a giant banner. Hopefully I can score a meet and greet out of it like that Italian kid a few weeks back.

Jesus Wept

Turtyturd wrote: »

That's the worst thing about it.

I am tempted to go to Anfield next week with the match thread printed out on a giant banner. Hopefully I can score a meet and greet out of it like that Italian kid a few weeks back.

Doni would surely take heart from it. He'd have to meet you, plenty of time to do so too.

citytillidie

Given up now, just hoping Liverpool can win the cup just so they do not have to go through 2 rounds in the Europa League and go straight to the group stage,

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Meh, season's been a write-off for a few weeks now, tbh. At least some of reserves made it to tthe bench.

The alarming thing for me is that this is the third manager who seems unable to inspire a semmingly lethargic squad.

Tusky

Form table, grim:

redzerdrog

how did sterling do today? I know he only got 10 mins but was he involved much?

Phoenix Park

redzerdrog wrote: »

how did sterling do today? I know he only got 10 mins but was he involved much?

Came on after 84 mins or so. got a good few touches. I thought he looked decent and i want to see more of him this season.

rossie1977

redzerdrog wrote: »

how did sterling do today? I know he only got 10 mins but was he involved much?

he offered more in the 10 mins he was on the field than downing did for the 80 mins he was on, one good run, won a freekick in a dangerous position

Gbear

donfers wrote: »

Kenny's post-match interview is concerning, head in the sand is my take on it

You think what Kenny shows to the camera's is the same as what he really thinks?


As dire as that was and while it's true that a manager needs to be able to motivate and set up a team no matter what, the league was over when we lost to Arsenal. We have literally nothing to play for. So long as we don't get relegated the only thing at stake is pride.

We've had one problem this season that we need to fix - scoring goals. You can't win em all and sometimes everyone plays ****e.
We've got one major problem to fix.
It wasn't necessarily a problem before last summer when we brought lots of players in. You can only address a problem as it appears.

If Kenny can't fix that problem (as well as sort out a little depth) than he's not the right man, but we can't say that until we see what we do during the summer.
Unless we actually get money invested into the squad it will be difficult to move forward much. It isn't enough having to generate our own transfer funds. We don't have as many salable assets and don't have as much fat to trim off the wage bill for next summer so we won't have that 70m quid to spend without the owners getting serious.

Glico Man

redzerdrog wrote: »

how did sterling do today? I know he only got 10 mins but was he involved much?

Looked confident, took players on and beat them. Tbf though, it wasn't hard to look good after what you'd have seen the previous 80 odd minutes. Will definitely be a good asset to have as an impact sub for the rest of the season. Having said that, I'd start him against Villa.

opr

redzerdrog wrote: »

how did sterling do today? I know he only got 10 mins but was he involved much?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zB9-8Civ8Q

Opr

rossie1977

Gbear wrote: »

We've had one problem this season that we need to fix - scoring goals.

liverpools problem atm is their midfield, its pisspoor, no goals, no creativity, not protecting the back four, wigans midfield ran rings around liverpools today, letting aquilani and meireles leave (as i thought) back in august was a terrible decision to make

The Chessplayer

Shelvey and Sterling appearances could mean that Kenny has finally lost faith in a couple of the under-performers. If this is what it takes to get the young lads a chance, then maybe some good will come out of it.

He needs to follow it up by giving them a run out against Villa. Villa are in the same boat as us, confidence wise so I'd like to see some young players getting a chance. I think we've had our November and will only get better.

NukaCola

Players didnt seem that bothered today, not tired but what can kenny say really.

I hate being a LFC fan sometimes. More so because of some of the so called "fans". Instant success isn't a viableLFC model, and honestly would not work in reality. It will take more than one season to get us back contending. Some people think its easy to turn around all that has happend these past few years. Its not. That should be obvious.

Kenny signed above average players to get a healthy stable squad at an inflated price. Many of those have been playing well below average. It didnt work out this season, but we have almost a completly new squad of players....some will take time to settle, some may not....they are the gambles of any signing. Some bar stool analysers will say, sure i knew yer man was ****e......sure a lot of people in here think they are scouts, accountants and managers. I think its obvious that Kenny was trying to take safe gambles. The next transfer window will tell a lot.
We have the squad. We now need to build on the starting 11.

Some peopl say "We should be challenging for 4th". I agree, but look at the top 5. 2 of those teams possibly 3 can buy almost any player needed. 3 maybe four of those teams have a stable manager at the helm. The league has completely changed. IMO 4th was always a long shot. Stability is what we need and squad building. We have been playing good positive football but havent been taking chances. One change will change that which doesnt involve Kenny leaving.

I dont know why i bothered writing it in here, a lot of people should take a breather and think about things for a minute instead of jumping on Kenny for any little thing. I'm not saying Kenny is faultless here....but he needs time. Wheter people like it or not, we arent at CL standard yet. Some LFC fans are turning into little children wanting the next quick fix. There are none. Give the man time. Jeez.

Jesus Wept

opr wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5zB9-8Civ8Q

Opr

Why did they speed up the footage a bit?

NukaCola

The-Rigger wrote: »

Why did they speed up the footage a bit?

He's so fast i think they actually slowed it down...

NukaCola

rossie1977 wrote: »

letting aquilani and meireles leave (as i thought) back in august was a terrible decision to make

Meireles wanted to leave. As for aquilani.......meh thats been done to death.

mike65

The Chessplayer wrote: »

Shelvey and Sterling appearances could mean that Kenny has finally lost faith in a couple of the under-performers. If this is what it takes to get the young lads a chance, then maybe some good will come out of it.

He needs to follow it up by giving them a run out against Villa. Villa are in the same boat as us, confidence wise so I'd like to see some young players getting a chance. I think we've had our November and will only get better.

A bit of me thinks he threw them on as a distraction as much as anything else unfortunately. Clearly they need to be given as much game time as possible, but it'll interesting to see if they are on the bench if Johnson, Bellamy and Agger are back. I fear they won't be.

redzerdrog

Having the europa league next year means that we cant afford to get rid on the likes of adam and carragher as they will be needed to play with the extra games. Getting the likes of cole, aquilani, maxi and aurelio off the wage bill will be a boost but I cant see us bringing in much money through sales.

With this in mind i can see us making one big money signing. I know the majority would like that to be a striker or even a winger but I think we need a quality centre midfielder, one that doesnt need a babysitter but can make things happen, a 25 year old alonso would be perfect.

Would many be happy with signing someone like hoilet and jordan rhodes if it ment bringing in a quality CM or would ye prefer not the bring in a CM and spend the money on a striker?

Gbear

rossie1977 wrote: »

liverpools problem atm is their midfield, its pisspoor, no goals, no creativity, not protecting the back four, wigans midfield ran rings around liverpools today, letting aquilani and meireles leave (as i thought) back in august was a terrible decision to make

Defence and attack are not just limited to their respecitve positions. We were missing three important players who contribute to both defence and attack - Johnson, Agger and Lucas. Without them not only do we lose defensive solidity (although flanagan and spearing do ok) but the pace with which we take the ball out of defence and turn it into attack is much slower.

Turtyturd

redzerdrog wrote: »

Having the europa league next year means that we cant afford to get rid on the likes of adam and carragher as they will be needed to play with the extra games. Getting the likes of cole, aquilani, maxi and aurelio off the wage bill will be a boost but I cant see us bringing in much money through sales.

With this in mind i can see us making one big money signing. I know the majority would like that to be a striker or even a winger but I think we need a quality centre midfielder, one that doesnt need a babysitter but can make things happen, a 25 year old alonso would be perfect.

Would many be happy with signing someone like hoilet and jordan rhodes if it ment bringing in a quality CM or would ye prefer not the bring in a CM and spend the money on a striker?

The striker has to be the priority for me. Midfield have been creating chances which have not been put away, and the midfield still has Lucas to come back into it.

joe123

First of all Kenny deserves one more season. Some of the results have been terrible and 95% of the transfers have been terrible.

But remember the football Hodgson had us playing? It was the worst I ever witnessed. Kenny came in and changed all that.Think to how many games this season we dominated, couldnt score, played really well but still couldnt score?

We lost our best midfielder in Lucas, a vital cog in our defensive game and being able to control the midfield.

We lost our best attacker for 8 games.

We have won the Carling cup and are in with a great shout of winning the FA cup.

I know that we would all give the cups up for champions league but Kenny deserves another season. Focus on getting us back into the top 4. If its not achieved then fair enough...its time for Rafa!

There is too much knee jerk and trolling opposition fans/people who dont watch enough football (referring to those who keep comparing Hodgson and Dalglish).

Today was a combination of players thinking the league season is over, having the FA cup in mind and Wigan battling for their lives.

We have played some great stuff this season, we keep the ball on the deck and god knows where we would be if we actually could finish the amount of chances we create.

Sterling looked fantastic today too. If this is the time for the Hendersons and Adams to be dropped for Shelvey and Sterlings of this world then so be it. Take a no nonsense approach this summer.

Chelsea are a knee jerk team and look at them!

Our league season ended after the Arsenal game. Not trying to make excuses but people need to calm down and look at the broader picture.

Nalz

What is the expected transfer budget Kenny will have in the summer? I don't think he'll be sacked tbh.

Copper_pipe

If the premier league started on January 1st 2012, Liverpool would be bottom of the table

Gbear

NukaCola wrote: »

Meireles wanted to leave. As for aquilani.......meh thats been done to death.

That's well and good but with them we had good quality and depth. We didn't replace that.

For defence next year I think we're okish - LB might need cover.

We'll have Johnson, Skrtel, Agger, Enrique and backup/rotation of Kelly(RB/emergency CB), Flanagan, Coates, Robinson and maybe another emergency backup in the shape of Wisdom.

If we sold Adam we'd be left with Gerrard, Lucas, Spearing and Shelvey. With a high quality midfielder - which we need anyway, we'd be ok depth-wise I think.
Then for 4 attacking places we'd have Suarez, Carrol, Downing, Sterling and we need 2 other high quality players. Ideally we'd have Suarez+ 2 new guys with Downing, Carrol in rotation and Sterling (and maybe Silva) in reserve.

ShamoBuc

We need width, badly. Players that can go down the wing, beat their men and cross properly - on a regular basis and score goals. That would surely help Carroll/Suarez/Kuyt or whoever was playing up front.
We need a CM badly.
Our defence is very good. Despite recent losses we have one of the best defences in the league, especially when outside of todays back four we could have Kelly/Coates/Agger/Johnson.
I would like to see Sterling get some more action in the league, preferably when we were winning!!!

kingshankly

Just after seeing kenny's interview total bull**** Wigan were by far the better side simple as

TheTownie

Copper_pipe wrote: »

If the premier league started on January 1st 2012, Liverpool would be bottom of the table

lol you beat RTE to it! Although they say 18th rather than bottom.

Either way its relegation form.

firemansam4

NukaCola wrote: »

Players didnt seem that bothered today, not tired but what can kenny say really.

I hate being a LFC fan sometimes. More so because of some of the so called "fans". Instant success isn't a viableLFC model, and honestly would not work in reality. It will take more than one season to get us back contending. Some people think its easy to turn around all that has happend these past few years. Its not. That should be obvious.

Kenny signed above average players to get a healthy stable squad at an inflated price. Many of those have been playing well below average. It didnt work out this season, but we have almost a completly new squad of players....some will take time to settle, some may not....they are the gambles of any signing. Some bar stool analysers will say, sure i knew yer man was ****e......sure a lot of people in here think they are scouts, accountants and managers. I think its obvious that Kenny was trying to take safe gambles. The next transfer window will tell a lot.
We have the squad. We now need to build on the starting 11.

Some peopl say "We should be challenging for 4th". I agree, but look at the top 5. 2 of those teams possibly 3 can buy almost any player needed. 3 maybe four of those teams have a stable manager at the helm. The league has completely changed. IMO 4th was always a long shot. Stability is what we need and squad building. We have been playing good positive football but havent been taking chances. One change will change that which doesnt involve Kenny leaving.

I dont know why i bothered writing it in here, a lot of people should take a breather and think about things for a minute instead of jumping on Kenny for any little thing. I'm not saying Kenny is faultless here....but he needs time. Wheter people like it or not, we arent at CL standard yet. Some LFC fans are turning into little children wanting the next quick fix. There are none. Give the man time. Jeez.

Have to say I would not be one calling for his head now but I would be very worried if given funds again to strengthen before next season it is used to pay inflated prices on more mediocre players.
But I would like to see him get more time and hopefully if he brings in a few decent signings turn things around for next year

Gbear

ShamoBuc wrote: »

We need width

That's one thing we need to improve in the new stadium. The Anfield pitch is absolutely tiny.

whatawaster

Someone give me an honest, logical, unsentimental argument as to why Kenny should get another season.

The way I see it he has bought badly, used those signings badly, been poor tactically - and it's only gotten worse as the season has gone on.

Yes, it's better than it was under Hodgson, but that wouldn't be f*cking hard. That is not an argument for keeping him on imo. Next season is so bloody important. We are becoming a mid-table club.

He is a club legend, on and off the pitch. But the one thing far more important than Liverpool's history - is its future. And there are no signs that I can see that things are going to get better next season.

Do we want him to stay on because we think he will do well?
Or is it because we want him to do well?

joe123

whatawaster wrote: »

Someone give me an honest, logical, unsentimental argument as to why Kenny should get another season.

The way I see it he has bought badly, used those signings badly, been poor tactically - and it's only gotten worse as the season has gone on.

Yes, it's better than it was under Hodgson, but that wouldn't be f*cking hard. That is not an argument for keeping him on imo. Next season is so bloody important. We are becoming a mid-table club.

He is a club legend, on and off the pitch. But the one thing far more important than Liverpool's history - is its future. And there are no signs that I can see that things are going to get better next season.

Do we want him to stay on because we think he will do well?
Or is it because we want him to do well?

Well I gave most of my points in my last post. For the most part this season we played some good football. If we add up the amount of chances we missed we would be doing much better this season.

So many games we should of been 1-3 nil up by half time.

The thing that is really hurting Kenny is the transfers. Henderson,Carroll,Downing,Adam have all been absolutely **** and I dont think anyone would care if we sold the four of them in the summer.

Selling Merieles was a terrible move too.

I have a friend in Liverpool who is adamant that Kenny is stepping down in the summer and Rafa is coming back in. I still think he will have another season. Especially if we win the Fa cup.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

WHo do you think would step up and take the job if Kenny went?

joe123

Ikky Poo2 wrote: »

WHo do you think would step up and take the job if Kenny went?

Rafa. That man has unfinished business.

Edit: Saying that, the one thing I would be slightly worried about is with him coming back in there already would be relationships formed with some of the players. If there good thats great but I do think he has fallen out with some of the people within the club. Then again the team has changed drastically since hes been gone. I think Benitez' break from football will have done him some good. Maybe more open to change? Its hard to say. I just keep thinking back to that 08 season and how damn good we were.

Not a hope in hell Rafa will stand for the likes of Comolli though.

NukaCola

whatawaster wrote: »

Do we want him to stay on because we think he will do well?
Or is it because we want him to do well?

Both?

One season where we won one trophy and in with a good shout for another isnt a disaster. League form is poor, but we've been so so unlucky, i know it seems like a weak argument but it amazes me how razor thin the line between draws and wins have been is agonising.

Let him build on the foundation he has made. One season isnt enough for any manager.

greendom

Kess73 wrote: »

Funny thing that league cup. Gets written off by many as a joke nowadays or a youth cup as you just called it.

I was in Wembley when Arsenal won it in 1987. Was not seen as a joke cup by Arsenal back then as it was their first bit of silverware in almost a decade and their next silverware before that agin was the 1971 double.

Back then Arsenal fans were lauding the win, and saying it would spark off many more wins.

I guess what I am trying to say is that it is easy to be dismissive of a trophy, but it is one your own club made a very big deal out of winning in the past and as a supporter of that club you should then understand what winning a domestic cup means to a club and it's supporters.

Arsenal won it again in 1993, the arm break cup, as part of a domestic cup double and again the trophy was not seen as a joke.

I am not an Arsenal supporter but years like 1987 and 1993 will linger long in my head with regards to Arsenal. Years they won silverware. Ask me about years that Arsenal came fourth in the league and I will be guessing more often than not unless it was a very recent thing.

History remembers the winners not the almosts.

The Carling Cup or whatever it was called back then was a more important competition. European competition wasn't the all consuming event back then that it is now. Less games and fewer teams involved. Not as financially lucrative either. The FA Cup was massive back then too. Much less so now.

greendom

2 key questions.

1. Does the board think Kenny can turn it around ?

2. Does Kenny think Kenny can turn it around ?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

NukaCola wrote: »

Both?

One season where we won one trophy and in with a good shout for another isnt a disaster. League form is poor, but we've been so so unlucky, i know it seems like a weak argument but it amazes me how razor thin the line between draws and wins have been is agonising.

Let him build on the foundation he has made. One season isnt enough for any manager.

That's papering over the cracks. There have been long periods whereby the team simply didn't make the effort or showed no creatvity. No matter how much luck you have, that's not going to get you anywhere fast.

Regarding his foundation - has he made a foundation? If he'd not going to get the best out of the new players, when will he?

whatawaster

Football has changed massively - the cups simply do not mean as much anymore. They are nice to win, but 4th place, to me, means 10X as much as winning the Carling Cup. There is surely not a Liverpool fan with full use of their faculties who wouldn't swap the Carling Cup and (maybe) the FA Cup for a spot in next season's champions league.

Things change, and that is the new standard now. There may not be a trophy for 4th, but it is a much better mark of a good team than a domestic cup run. By that measure, this season has been a failure, and it is verging on disaster.

citytillidie

Copper_pipe wrote: »

If the premier league started on January 1st 2012, Liverpool would be bottom of the table

But it does not its starts in August.

That is like saying last season if the league started in Jan 1st Liverpool would have finished 2nd