TYSON v FRAZIER & LISTON v FOREMAN

tryingmybestt

Two of my absolute favourite fantasy matches at heavyweight;

Tyson v Frazier

Liston v Foreman

Who wins ????

cowzerp

tryingmybestt wrote: »

Two of my absolute favourite fantasy matches at heavyweight;

Tyson v Frazier

Liston v Foreman

Who wins ????

Tyson wins unless it goes into the late rounds

Foreman wins but a great fight.

walshb

I almost forgot about Joe and had inteneded on listing him in both my lists. I WILL DO THAT

Tyson v.s Frazier?

Hell of a fight. He is mostly a one handed fighter.

12 rds peak to peak I will go with Joe IF he can take the shots, big IF.

His engine and workrate will win on points. But, can he make it out of the first few rds. Tyson had a wicked uppercut; Joe didn't take them all that well.

Liston vs. Foreamn. Liston is the more complete and all around fighter who is more composed and skilled. He takes George's shots, which I believe he will, he wins this on points or late stoppage. Liston has the physical strength not to be bullied, and the power to keep George honest, and the skill and variation to win the batte.

Liston also has pretty good stamina.

tryingmybestt

For me i don't see tyson every stopping frazier......first 5 rounds would be a war but frazier then starts to wear him down....frazier by late stoppage or points defeat IMO

Foreman v Liston is harder to call.....similar power, similar size....foreman little taller...liston little longer reach and thicker build with the huge fists......i think i'd lean slightly towards liston because he was a better boxer in terms of the jab etc......this is based on the foreman of the 1970s....liston probably had better defence too IMO

megadodge

I can't see Frazier NOT getting stopped. Joe had a massive, massive heart, but his chin was nothing special. His toughness reputation is based on the Ali fights, but Muhammad wasn't a big hitter.

People are forgetting that Oscar Bonavena (not a renowned hitter) floored Joe twice and there was nothing flukey about them.

Obviously Foreman destroyed him twice (the only reason the second lasted as long as it did was cos Joe spent the entire fight moving away) and Tyson is much faster and more accurate than George.

This is a real bad matchup for Joe as not only has he to contend with a much faster, bigger, stronger two handed boxer, but with his fairly one-handed style and Tyson's excellent head movement he'd have difficulty landing himself.

Tyson by very early TKO.

tryingmybestt

thats definitely an option....tyson by early ko

i think if tyson was to win it would be early....if it goes late i think joe

walshb

If this goes the route then I am 99 percent for Joe, NOT because Mike will tire bad, or crumble, but because Joe will be working non stop for 12 rds and will win on work rate and landed shots.

I do believe that saying that Joe's chin could suffer vs. Tyson just because Foreman stopped him, or Bonavena dropped him, and then extrapolating this to Tyson's style, could be off the mark. Not saying Mike cannot get him, badly hurt him, and stop him, just that Mike's size and delivery may not be as effective as Foreman's. Tyson may have to get in real close, and Joe was a divil for bobbing, weaving and smothering. Foreman did not allow this and used the upperut from range so well. Tyson usues the uppercut in close. May not be as effective.

tryingmybestt

for me the most important factors for a frazier win are:

1) frazier would not be intimidated at all by tyson...this is half the battle against tyson

2) frazier would be going forward every minute of every round....tyson couldn't fight backing up or boxing and IMO frazier was better fighting in close quarters.....he would crouch and launch his left hook to body and head while leaning in on tyson ....

frazier had a great chin...foreman put him down 5 times with some of the cleanest punches...and he got up...what a chin

bonavena was extremely strong......he gave everyone including ali a hard time....no shame being put down by him

Daroxtar

I saw the thread title and thought it was a tag team event:D

section4

good fight, and tyson was a pretty accurate puncher, but he also liked to measure his man up and then attack, i dont know if frazier would give him the time to do this, he had the punch rate of a welterweight, and if he did catch him with that left hook, tyson would feel it big time. while tyson was a good accurate hitter Frazier would be throwing twice the number of punches in bunches in the same time.

tryingmybestt

section4 wrote: »

good fight, and tyson was a pretty accurate puncher, but he also liked to measure his man up and then attack, i dont know if frazier would give him the time to do this, he had the punch rate of a welterweight, and if he did catch him with that left hook, tyson would feel it big time. while tyson was a good accurate hitter Frazier would be throwing twice the number of punches in bunches in the same time.

totally agree and frazier had great power too....one of only a few that put ali down....

the only way i see tyson winning is is frazier suddenly turned into a boxer and backed away and that would never happen

minty16

I think Tyson KO's Frazier early. I think Foreman KO's Liston early. I think Foreman KO's all the mentioned fighters early!

section4

minty16 wrote: »

I think Tyson KO's Frazier early. I think Foreman KO's Liston early. I think Foreman KO's all the mentioned fighters early!

there is no way foreman ko liston early or late
Liston was a very good boxer with a ramrod jab that would have set foreman up all night for booming right hands and combinations and liston had stamina

foreman i would say hit harder but liston hit very hard

foreman was clumsly and liston was very good trchnically and the problem foreman would have is he would be outboxedby a guy who could hurt him with the punches he landed and who could keep doing it all through the fight

foreman has a chance but liston has too many advantages

minty16

I think it's a likely KO. In my opinion Liston relied heavily on his ability to walk through punches, he was ponderous. Foreman was ponderous at times but one of the hardest hitters to enter a ring. Liston doesn't walk through Foremans punches.

tryingmybestt

i would give the older version of foreman a better chance against liston because the older foreman was a better boxer with an excellent jab and much shorter punches.....he also utilised the cross arm defence very well.....i'd still pick liston

i think liston ko's the early foreman because liston had a great jab and longer reach and better boxing skills.....his defence was better and he had brutal power....foreman would not be able to walk through listons puches

walshb

minty16 wrote: »

I think it's a likely KO. In my opinion Liston relied heavily on his ability to walk through punches, he was ponderous. Foreman was ponderous at times but one of the hardest hitters to enter a ring. Liston doesn't walk through Foremans punches.

But, does Foreman walk through Liston's? Liston was a helluva hitter off both wings. Liston also had a solid beard. Much like George's beard. But, Liston was a more technial puncher, neater, cleaner and more accurate. Could be a case that Liston's stats and accuracy are too much. He will probably be landing the cleaner shots, and more often. And, not just any shots. Heavy hitting. I can't see Foreman winning all that much. Maybe 2-3/10. Liston to me is a 7-8/10 winner here.

minty16