One-bed apartment rental prices - Dublin

boardie100

hey,

just wondering how much rental prices on apartments in dublin might drop after the recent rental allowance changes?
I'm thinking of leasing an apartment for a year but am kind of wondering would it be worth my while waiting a bit?....

I still can't get over the price of some of even smallest one bed apartments in average places in dublin

lima

I'm looking at renting a 1br in Dublin too, such a rip off

A Disgrace

There will be little or no reductions. The Government think that RA accepting landlords will reduce rents, but they won't - they'll simply stop accepting RA and take their chances, even if it means a couple of months with an idle property.

The only thing that might happen is that RA claimants will be forced out of the rental market, and it may result in extra supply which may in turn cause rents to drop. In fact, that's probably the plan. Not very comforting for RA recipients mind

barrackali

Something tells me you might be wrong on that one. All the factors for big rent reductions are in play, we have large scale unemployment, high rates of emigration, increasing taxes/charges and an oversupply of accommodation...all this equals pressure to lower rents. It also seems that NAMA is going to put more of its stock on the rental market, you can bet these will be available at very reasonable prices.

RA has distorted the rental market since its introduction....you will see significant reductions!

A Disgrace

barrackali wrote: »

Something tells me you might be wrong on that one. All the factors for big rent reductions are in play, we have large scale unemployment, high rates of emigration, increasing taxes/charges and an oversupply of accommodation...all this equals pressure to lower rents. It also seems that NAMA is going to put more of its stock on the rental market, you can bet these will be available at very reasonable prices.

RA has distorted the rental market since its introduction....you will see significant reductions!

I hope so! I totally agree that prices are way too high, but I also know that a lot of landlords have crazy mortgages. The problem is that RA tenants are the ones who will suffer, because it will not drop to their levels. Let's watch this space anyway

boardie100

i'm guessing then that any drops wont be seen for a year or two..... Personally i think they will drop also as if landlords don't drop their prices to new RA levels then they will have idle properties and their hands will be forced...

Giblet

Prices seem to be going up in some areas :S

boardie100

Giblet wrote: »

Prices seem to be going up in some areas :S

do you want us to guess these areas?

i think any drops caused by RA changes will have a knock on affect on all areas... when that will happen though is anyones guess

Giblet

boardie100 wrote: »

do you want us to guess these areas?

i think any drops caused by RA changes will have a knock on affect on all areas... when that will happen though is anyones guess

Rathmines, where I live, some places which were 850 last year are now 900 and above for single beds! Places in my development are gone up to 950 from 900 (two are the same buildings that were available last year) The average high used to be 900, which some as low as 750, now it's at 900 or above around Church Ave. Apartments that are around 750 now, are really small, a real drop in quality from what was available.

Cuddlesworth

Asking and actual prices are well different. I have found a most landlords are open to negotiation on asking now days in comparison to 3/4 years ago.

zef

Just checked on DAFT out of curiosity , 18 available flats/apts in the whole of Dublin under 500e that take RA. New rate is 475e for a single person, seems it would be difficult to find a 1 bed for that price, as most of those 18 properties advertised as '1 bed' are actually studios/ bedsits.
Tbh most of them are not the nicest either, mostly 1 room in large houses.
Anything 'nice' seems to be 600+ p.m.
It will be 'interesting' to see what happens, but then there is the human cost too, if LL's refuse to negotiate many will be left paying the extra & not declaring, or worse out on their ear. Wondering does the HSE have any kind of back up plans for the number of ppl who will be left homeless.

ProudDUB

I've been renting in the IFSC since last Spring. I began looking for an apt last Feb. I keep an eye on what the rental market here is doing, and I have to say there is not much difference between prices now now and prices this time last year. In August I moved from a shoe box size one bedroom into a much bigger 2 bedroom apt in the same development. It doesn't just have an additional bedroom. Everything about it is bigger...the living room, dining room area, kitchen, bathroom, storage space etc etc. It also comes with a parking space included. One bedrooms rarely do. The difference in rent is just 125 euros. I probably looked at about twenty 2 bed apts in the area before I moved. I just couldn't get over how much more bang for your buck you get for a 2 bedroom apt, by just paying a relatively small amount of money more. It really does make a huge difference to the quality of your life when you have the additional space. It feels like a real home and not some rabbit hutch.

shangri la

What is the max rent on a 1 bed in Dublin now and what is it if you rent a room in a shared house?

Why would they give more money to someone to have their own place?

The_Conductor

The drop in RA and the effect on rent for 1 bed apartments will really be determined by demand and location. Asking what effect the reduction will have on rents in 'Dublin' is a bit like asking how long is a piece of string tbh.

There is over supply in certain areas (some of them with very good transport links such as Adamstown/South Lucan/D22 area)- the reduction in rent allowance in areas such as these could be significant (particularly given the vacancy rates which have been increasing quite alarmingly).

Other areas- such as the city centre/ D2/4/6 DLRD etc- may not be affected at all- as demand is such that many landlords will just say 'sod it, its not worth accepting RA anymore'- particularly as for these areas the new limits may be significantly below the market rates.

At the end of the day- its all to do with supply and demand. Where there are high vacancy rates- or a significant proportion of the tenants are in receipt of RA- its highly probable that the reductions in RA will feedthrough to the market rates (it may take a while for this to happen). In areas where there is limited supply and/or a much smaller proportion of tenants in receipt of RA- it may actually act as an incentive to landlords to abondon RA tenants and focus on a different market segment- and could potentially result in rents increasings (as is suggested to be the case in the greater Rathmines/Ranelagh/Clonskeagh/Churchtown/Kilmacud/Stillorgan/Donneybrook area- where there is an alternate market that can be tapped into and it is happening)

If you want to live in an area where there was very limited development over the past 15 years- you're probably going to be in trouble. If you're willing to consider areas where significant numbers of new dwelling units were constructed over the past 15 years- you're probably going to be fine.

finch

I've been living and working in Dublin for 5 years and I cant afford my own one bed apartment. Why should all those people receiving rent allowance get one bed apartments. Can they not rent a room in a house like soo many other hard working people do.

the_syco

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Asking and actual prices are well different. I have found a most landlords are open to negotiation on asking now days in comparison to 3/4 years ago.

It's possible they have raised their prices by €50 as they expect people to hagle, and if the haggler got a €50 reduction, that may make them happy, and rent the place.

boardie100

finch wrote: »

I've been living and working in Dublin for 5 years and I cant afford my own one bed apartment. Why should all those people receiving rent allowance get one bed apartments. Can they not rent a room in a house like soo many other hard working people do.

i totally agree.... i earn a decent wage and still think they are out of my reach....
if a single guy earning say 35k (average wage) is struggling to afford one beds in areas where they are 750-850 then they are way too high.... surely there's not that amount of people on RA?.....

As finch said why should they get there own place where as us gob****es go out and work and struggle to afford one!

jackal

boardie100 wrote: »

i totally agree.... i earn a decent wage and still think they are out of my reach....
if a single guy earning say 35k (average wage) is struggling to afford one beds in areas where they are 750-850 then they are way too high.... surely there's not that amount of people on RA?.....

As finch said why should they get there own place where as us gob****es go out and work and struggle to afford one!

Would also question why the taxpayer should foot the bill for these extremely high rents so that these people can live in their preferred area. Wouldn't somewhere on the outskirts of town be OK for them rather than a premium location where people that want to live close to where they work are priced out of the market? The saying beggars can't be choosers is obviously not applicable to RA tenants.

A Disgrace

boardie100 wrote: »

i totally agree.... i earn a decent wage and still think they are out of my reach....
if a single guy earning say 35k (average wage) is struggling to afford one beds in areas where they are 750-850 then they are way too high.... surely there's not that amount of people on RA?.....

As finch said why should they get there own place where as us gob****es go out and work and struggle to afford one!

The MAXIMUM rent for a RA recipient is 475 per month in Dublin, and a lot less less elsewhere. So to compare to market rents of 800 PM is, well, wrong. Also, people have to live somewhere and like it or lump it, if someone is unemployed, they don't have much choice, and have to be supported.

It's a bit rich for people to complain about the lack of prospects and jobs in this country, and then get bitter when they hear of the affected people getting support in order to have a roof over their head. Yes, there are chancers and spongers who have never worked in their lives, and that's an issue, but there are people who have worked, and who have contributed to the state. They deserve a hand

The big issue here is that private renters are beginning to believe that RA renters have inflated the rents around the country. It's simply not true. Rents are dictated by landlords, and probably more so by their mortgages. Most RA folks live in sub-standard bedsit accommodation that a private renter wouldn't touch. Whereas there is a healthy rental market for good quality properties, with a decent amount of demand.

How can Burton say that RA is keeping rents artificially high when less than 20% of landlords accept it, and those that do, are offering places that could barely be considered rental accommodation

And btw, an awful lot of current RA renters were once, " gob****es who go out and work and struggle to afford one" so bear that in mind boardie100 if you ever end up umeployed

not even wrong

A Disgrace wrote: »

The MAXIMUM rent for a RA recipient is 475 per month in Dublin, and a lot less less elsewhere.

Yes but it's €700 for a couple on RA.

Rents are dictated by landlords, and probably more so by their mortgages.

No, rents are dictated by the balance between supply and demand.

How can Burton say that RA is keeping rents artificially high when less than 20% of landlords accept it,

Actually 40% of the private rented sector is RA so we know that at the very least 40% of landlords accept it (and probably more).

A Disgrace

not even wrong wrote: »

Actually 40% of the private rented sector is RA so we know that at the very least 40% of landlords accept it (and probably more).

Well I don't believe that for a second. It's saying practically HALF of all renters are claiming RA?

It's rubbish, and as with a lot of Burtons claims, WAY off the mark.

Monty Burnz

A Disgrace wrote: »

Well I don't believe that for a second. It's saying practically HALF of all renters are claiming RA?

It's rubbish, and as with a lot of Burtons claims, WAY off the mark.

Evidence has been linked to support this assertion. You can rubbish it, but in the absence of an actual argument or any evidence, it's a pretty hopeless position.

Incidentally, I think the figure is closer to 50% based on what I've read elsewhere.

A Disgrace

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Evidence has been linked to support this assertion. You can rubbish it, but in the absence of an actual argument or any evidence, it's a pretty hopeless position.

Incidentally, I think the figure is closer to 50% based on what I've read elsewhere.

Well, take a straw poll of people you know that rent, and I'll do the same and tell me the percentage of those that are on RA. I find the quoted figures really hard to believe, especially since I don't know anybody on it.

If they're saying 40-50%, then that's half the rental population claiming RA. I obviously don't have the resources to come up with an accurate figure myself, but it simply does not sound right

Again, a quick search on daft with the criteria of a €700pm in Dublin finds the following:

Accepts RA - 71 PROPERTIES
Does not accept RA - 442 PROPERTIES

If half the rental market is RA tenants, then they are dealing with a severe lack of supply. Does not add up.

Monty Burnz

A Disgrace wrote: »

Again, a quick search on daft with the criteria of a €700pm in Dublin finds the following:

Accepts RA - 71 PROPERTIES
Does not accept RA - 442 PROPERTIES

If half the rental market is RA tenants, then they are dealing with a severe lack of supply. Does not add up.

I don't mean to offend, but if you think your 10 second search of Daft gives you access to better information than that available to the statisticians who do this stuff for a living all day, every day...you are probably wrong.

A Disgrace

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I don't mean to offend, but if you think your 10 second search of Daft gives you access to better information than that available to the statisticians who do this stuff for a living all day, every day...you are probably wrong.

Well if you think Government figures are always dead on, good luck to you. Remember they have an agenda, I don't. I just cannot believe that half of all renters in this country are claiming Rent Allowance - for a start you have to be claiming Unemployment Benefits to avail, and far from everyone on the dole actually gets RA. And with 14% unemployment, the figures just do not add up.

Monty Burnz

A Disgrace wrote: »

Well if you think Government figures are always dead on, good luck to you. Remember they have an agenda, I don't. I just cannot believe that half of all renters in this country are claiming Rent Allowance - for a start you have to be claiming Unemployment Benefits to avail, and far from everyone on the dole actually gets RA. And with 14% unemployment, the figures just do not add up.

I'm not sure how it furthers the government's agenda to exaggerate the numbers on rent allowance. Perhaps you can explain?

And the absolute numbers of RA tenants is of secondary importance; the key point is that RA sets a floor on the rental market. Why would any landlord rent a half-decent place for less than RA?

There are some good threads about this on www.thepropertypin.com if you are interested in reading more.

not even wrong

A Disgrace wrote: »

Well if you think Government figures are always dead on, good luck to you.

You're right, we should trust the figures that anonymous internet commentator "A Disgrace" pulls out of his/her ass instead.

Remember they have an agenda, I don't.

What exactly is the government's agenda here?

I just cannot believe that half of all renters in this country are claiming Rent Allowance - for a start you have to be claiming Unemployment Benefits to avail,

No you don't. (But even if you did the figures would still add up because of the high home ownership rate in Ireland -- half the private rented sector amounts to less than 14% of households.)

The_Conductor

A Disgrace- the other people posting here are backing up their comments with reliable sources- please do likewise if you want to continue debating here. A strawpole of family/friends/acquaintances etc- is not a valid data source.

Regards,

SMcCarrick

daltonmd

A Disgrace wrote: »

Well, take a straw poll of people you know that rent, and I'll do the same and tell me the percentage of those that are on RA. I find the quoted figures really hard to believe, especially since I don't know anybody on it.

If they're saying 40-50%, then that's half the rental population claiming RA. I obviously don't have the resources to come up with an accurate figure myself, but it simply does not sound right

Again, a quick search on daft with the criteria of a €700pm in Dublin finds the following:

Accepts RA - 71 PROPERTIES
Does not accept RA - 442 PROPERTIES

If half the rental market is RA tenants, then they are dealing with a severe lack of supply. Does not add up.

You are making a mistake in how you are trying to reconcile the figure of RA in the private rental market - the figure incidentally is provided by the minister. You have done a search on Daft and found 71 properties that accept RA and 442 that do not - that means absolutely nothing because those properties are NOT rented.
To be eligible for RA then you have to be in private rental accommodation for 6 months supporting yourself, which means that those initially in the private rental market who lost their jobs in the last few years, mid lease needed RA to pay their rent. They are private tenants who switched to RA.

Out of the 442 trying to rent a property, how many of them will kick a tenant out if he loses his job midway through the lease and is then on RA?

"claiming Unemployment Benefits to avail,"

You could be working full time, have your hours reduced to part time and make an application for rent allowance. The criteria is if your situation changes and you can no longer afford to pay the rent.

A Disgrace

smccarrick wrote: »

A Disgrace- the other people posting here are backing up their comments with reliable sources- please do likewise if you want to continue debating here. A strawpole of family/friends/acquaintances etc- is not a valid data source.

Regards,

SMcCarrick

It's a discussion, and I'm simply saying I do not believe the facts and figures being put forward by the Government. In fact, like the figures for the amount of money 'saved' from the crackdown on welfare fraud, I believe they have exaggerated the totals once again.

And why would they do it? Well, to justify the huge reductions in RA rates and levels of course

Of course, it's hard to argue against so-called official figures and I am far from an expert on the matter, but as I'm at pains to say in each of my posts, I simply find it hard to believe the stats. That's all.

Monty Burnz

A Disgrace wrote: »

And why would they do it? Well, to justify the huge reductions in RA rates and levels of course

Huge reductions? Very small reductions I think you mean, if referring to those made to date. But do you understand they can't fudge this? It's an actual line item in the budget - you can see exactly how much is spent on RA.

A Disgrace wrote: »

Of course, it's hard to argue against so-called official figures and I am far from an expert on the matter, but as I'm at pains to say in each of my posts, I simply find it hard to believe the stats. That's all.

Fair enough. I'd have the same suspicion as you do of anything government related, but this looks above board to me.