Code Developed But Not Getting Paid

whiteboard

All,

I have developed some code for a customer to enhance an app they have, but I am finding it hard to get paid for the work. However, I still have posession of the only copy of the enhanced sourecode.

Although the development was done on their hardware & dev tools, I assume that I can & should hold onto the sourcecode until payment is made. I believe handing this over would weaken my position with regards to getting paid. I have given a version of the app to them for demo, but they will need the source for any support or enhancement in the future.

All opinions welcome.........

Whitey

PCPhoto

have you tried threatening with legal action ? Small claims court only costs €12 to file a dispute (I'm pretty sure it is for non-payment of jobs)

jimmycrackcorm

Perhaps you should give them an update with a mechanism to say that support will run out next month.

Trojan

You really need some legal advice, and to educate yourself about copyright and "work for hire".

Here's some articles for basic concepts, but some of these are US based and probably not relevant (and IANAL).

http://www.cai.ie/?page_id=11
http://copylaw.com/new_articles/wfh.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_for_hire

Rulmeq

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Perhaps you should give them an update with a mechanism to say that support will run out next month.

This will get you into serious trouble.

TonyStark

whiteboard wrote: »

All,

I have developed some code for a customer to enhance an app they have, but I am finding it hard to get paid for the work. However, I still have posession of the only copy of the enhanced sourecode.

Although the development was done on their hardware & dev tools, I assume that I can & should hold onto the sourcecode until payment is made. I believe handing this over would weaken my position with regards to getting paid. I have given a version of the app to them for demo, but they will need the source for any support or enhancement in the future.

All opinions welcome.........

Whitey

I really can't say what you should do next in relation to payment.

Moving forward for development work it would be ideal in future project to agree milestones with the client as you deliver work to them.

There should never be a situation where you are waiting for all of the money at the end of the project. You should request payment at various key stages. ie. Agreement of the spec, completion of their testing, their sign off on the project and then the install their side.

Where ever never do it on their systems, do it on your own development environment. That way you have control over the source and really the goal is not on your part to prick around but to ensure that you have some leverage in order to get payment.

The final stage of the project should involve you delivering the project whether that's a binary file or even an installation at that point you should be getting the final installment of your payment.

I know its not much use to you know.. best of luck though.

ocallagh

If you fulfilled your end of the contract and there was an agreed price, then don't hand over the code. Send them an email requesting payment by a certain date. If that date passes get a solicitor to send them a letter and start charging interest.

If there are other variables involved (ie: no agreed price, you were late delivering etc) you may need to seek advice now.

jimmycrackcorm

Rulmeq wrote: »

This will get you into serious trouble.

No it won't.
Had he got paid then your point would be valid. But I'd love to hear your argument about why someone should deliver a product, not get paid and then get into some sort of trouble.

Rulmeq

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

No it won't.
Had he got paid then your point would be valid. But I'd love to hear your argument about why someone should deliver a product, not get paid and then get into some sort of trouble.

I can offer my direct experience in front of a district court judge (I know, not a court of record, but generally these guys tend to come up with similar decisions).

I've had a number of bad experiences in the past, and had been attempting to cover my ass as much as I possibly could. So I took to sending a pretty standard cover email before I undertook any jobs. I found that anyone who had an issue with the terms, generally went elsewhere. However one crowd still tried to shaft me.
After 6 months I got my solicitor to send the usual letters, generally at this stage you get a phone call offering to pay off some thing, but this crowd were different they decided to go down the route of claiming that they didn't owe me anything because the work expired (I put a 30 day expiry on my work, with a visible count down timer).
So 12 months later, we are in front of a district court judge, and after sitting through 6 hours of motoring offences there's just us left in the court room.

Their solicitor first attempted to say that the email wasn't a contract, because it was an email, and they didn't explicitly agree to it (the judge said it was ok to consider it a contract because they continued to deal with me after receiving it). Then he tried to claim that it was a time bomb in the code, which the judge said would be true if I had hidden it - I didn't it was in the email, and it was clear on the screen at all times that the software delivered was a time-limited demo. The judge did point out that if I didn't have the email, or I had attempted to hide the fact that time was running out, that I would have lost that point. He also brought up the fact that had I tried to implement this after delivery it could be considered hacking (not his exact words, but I'm giving you my interpretation of this anyway)
The next point they tried to bring up was that because of this lock, I was tying them to me as a developer, and that they wouldn't be free to pay me for what I had done, and move to someone else - The judge ruled on this by giving an analogy, that if garages can specify that only their computers can be used to service a car, then I'm allowed to say that only I could upgrade the system (I don't agree that it's the same thing, but I wasn't going to contradict the judge when I was winning)

I know that's a long rambling story, without proof to back it up ( I do remember a case at some stage, where a guy did this and lost because he had not told them in advance about the time-bomb - but google searches are not coming back with anything.), but it's as simple as this, you can't retroactively damage something one someone else's computer - it's considered hacking/computer fraud. It would be like breaking into someones home or work place to take back something you sold to them that they didn't pay for. They can sue you for criminal damage.

My advice to the OP is to use this as a life lesson, and to ensure that all future work is paid for in instalments, and that if you are going to logic/time-bomb the code that it's very clear in the pre-work agreements.

I know it's painful now, and you are out of pocket, but you could end up in more trouble and lose more money going after them. But it might be worth getting a solicitor to send out a letter, generally most people cave at that point (I've far too much experience in this, I would prefer if I didn't even have to know this)

irishdude11

Rulmeq wrote: »

I can offer my direct experience in front of a district court judge (I know, not a court of record, but generally these guys tend to come up with similar decisions).

I've had a number of bad experiences in the past, and had been attempting to cover my ass as much as I possibly could. So I took to sending a pretty standard cover email before I undertook any jobs. I found that anyone who had an issue with the terms, generally went elsewhere. However one crowd still tried to shaft me.
After 6 months I got my solicitor to send the usual letters, generally at this stage you get a phone call offering to pay off some thing, but this crowd were different they decided to go down the route of claiming that they didn't owe me anything because the work expired (I put a 30 day expiry on my work, with a visible count down timer).
So 12 months later, we are in front of a district court judge, and after sitting through 6 hours of motoring offences there's just us left in the court room.

Their solicitor first attempted to say that the email wasn't a contract, because it was an email, and they didn't explicitly agree to it (the judge said it was ok to consider it a contract because they continued to deal with me after receiving it). Then he tried to claim that it was a time bomb in the code, which the judge said would be true if I had hidden it - I didn't it was in the email, and it was clear on the screen at all times that the software delivered was a time-limited demo. The judge did point out that if I didn't have the email, or I had attempted to hide the fact that time was running out, that I would have lost that point. He also brought up the fact that had I tried to implement this after delivery it could be considered hacking (not his exact words, but I'm giving you my interpretation of this anyway)
The next point they tried to bring up was that because of this lock, I was tying them to me as a developer, and that they wouldn't be free to pay me for what I had done, and move to someone else - The judge ruled on this by giving an analogy, that if garages can specify that only their computers can be used to service a car, then I'm allowed to say that only I could upgrade the system (I don't agree that it's the same thing, but I wasn't going to contradict the judge when I was winning)

I know that's a long rambling story, without proof to back it up ( I do remember a case at some stage, where a guy did this and lost because he had not told them in advance about the time-bomb - but google searches are not coming back with anything.), but it's as simple as this, you can't retroactively damage something one someone else's computer - it's considered hacking/computer fraud. It would be like breaking into someones home or work place to take back something you sold to them that they didn't pay for. They can sue you for criminal damage.

My advice to the OP is to use this as a life lesson, and to ensure that all future work is paid for in instalments, and that if you are going to logic/time-bomb the code that it's very clear in the pre-work agreements.

I know it's painful now, and you are out of pocket, but you could end up in more trouble and lose more money going after them. But it might be worth getting a solicitor to send out a letter, generally most people cave at that point (I've far too much experience in this, I would prefer if I didn't even have to know this)

That is not the same situation as the OPs. He is not going to logic/time-bomb the code because they arent even using the code yet. The OP still has it in his possesion. There is no way in hell I would be handing over code to somebody who wasnt going to pay me for it.

Rulmeq

irishdude11 wrote: »

That is not the same situation as the OPs. He is not going to logic/time-bomb the code because they arent even using the code yet. The OP still has it in his possesion. There is no way in hell I would be handing over code to somebody who wasnt going to pay me for it.

I was responding to the response to my original response.