beef price tracker

blue5000

MIKEKC wrote: »

It's more bizarre that people are paying crazy prices for cattle. At this stage we know the factories won't increase prices until they really have to

I think it could be Northern buyers in the marts.

tanko

Jjameson wrote: »

It’s big single farm payments, pensions, guys with business interests lists of money and a gra for cattle and perceive farming as better than giving it to revenue. Lucky for the guys selling stores, they are being cushioned from the market reality again.

If you think that lads selling stores are being cushioned from the market reality again you should go out, buy a batch of cows and produce your own calves and stores. You won't be long finding out out about "market reality".

barnaman

In all stages myself suckler, buying stores, and factory. Spend alot of time fooling the bank and all the time fooling myself.

Cut back on suckers and going to exit them this year when BDGP finishes. Going to concentrate on fattening heifers.

Just to add Northern men buying alot at moment expect the mart trade to last till brexit

epfff

tanko wrote: »

If you think that lads selling stores are being cushioned from the market reality again you should go out, buy a batch of cows and produce your own calves and stores. You won't be long finding out out about "market reality".

I think what he is trying to say is it would be a lot worse if these guys werent taking some of the pain and id have to agree.

kk.man

Jjameson wrote: »

Carnew mart last Saturday March 18/520 kg reasonable r grade but not overly growthy charolais bullocks 1280. The guy selling isn’t Winning but given the buyer is a large quarry/concrete business owner even this is subsidised. 700kg underage cattle would need everything to go right to gross €1450.
Narrow Angus cattle bringing close enough 2 euro a kg. Bass has posted here at Length before the nett results of these types.

I know who you are talking about. He took me out a few times before. I let the likes of them off on their quest.

Panch18

Jjameson wrote: »

Carnew mart last Saturday March 18/520 kg reasonable r grade but not overly growthy charolais bullocks 1280. The guy selling isn’t Winning but given the buyer is a large quarry/concrete business owner even this is subsidised. 700kg underage cattle would need everything to go right to gross €1450.
Narrow Angus cattle bringing close enough 2 euro a kg. Bass has posted here at Length before the nett results of these types.

At 1280 for those charolais bullocks, that aren't yet a year old, how is the seller not winning??

CloughCasey1

Panch18 wrote: »

At 1280 for those charolais bullocks, that aren't yet a year old, how is the seller not winning??

Either way the buyer wont!

Panch18

CloughCasey1 wrote: »

Either way the buyer wont!

I agree!!

Albert Johnson

Panch18 wrote: »

At 1280 for those charolais bullocks, that aren't yet a year old, how is the seller not winning??

By my reckoning March 18 to now is closer to 2 year's however I agree that it's a fair touch for them in the current times. The man selling them isn't going to be made up either but there bound to be €200 a head dearer than 2 months ago, it's not that long ago since circa €2-2.10 a kilo was buying those types compared to €2.40 or more today.

I think part of the reason that the beef trade doesn't react to market forces is that there's too much of an input of outside money. A lot of the stronger customers ringside have access to money from other businesses, legacies ect and it distorts the trade. This could be said of any industry to a point but beef farming isn't that difficult to get into especially if you've access to the land base.

Panch18

near 2 year olds of course!! long morning!

straight

Are cull cows making 3 euro per kg. Would they kill out at 50 percent liveweight? Dairy cows

wrangler

Panch18 wrote: »

near 2 year olds of course!! long morning!

Yea, poor money for two years but poor performance also, so self inflicted by the seller

Robson99

What way are base prices at the moment ??
Are we still 3.60 for heifers ??

Albert Johnson

wrangler wrote: »

Yea, poor money for two years but poor performance also, so self inflicted by the seller

Out of interest what would you consider good performance in the same time frame? I suppose the seller could have them near ready to kill if he put his mind to it as opposed to selling as store's to go back to grass but would he be any better off at current prices. I'm assuming those sort of stock would come into circa 700kg at slaughter and would they gross much with €1400 atm?

I'm of the opinion that beef production has become too intensive and it's now all about how much money can be thrown at the problem of non existent profitability. Just because it can be done doesn't mean it should be done imo although that won't wash with the meal salesmen or the so called state "advisors".

Going back to the cattle in question the seller could probably have invested more time, money and effort in them for little extra reward. The bottom line as I see it is that there's very little renumeration for anyone this side of the kill line and until that changes criticizing one system over another is akin to rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Panch18

I actually don't think there is anything too wrong with the performance of those Charolais cattle, hard to judge without seeing them.

But i reckon he's far better off selling at that money than pumping nuts into them trying to finish them

Robson99

Panch18 wrote: »

I actually don't think there is anything too wrong with the performance of those Charolais cattle, hard to judge without seeing them.

But i reckon he's far better off selling at that money than pumping nuts into them trying to finish them

Exactly.
Certainly not at 3.60 or there abouts. Winter finishing is a complete waste of time at those prices
They will be good cattle next June / July off grass with feck all meal

wrangler

Jjameson wrote: »

Say the man put 200€ of meal into them he now only has the butcher as a customer. And only 120€ more.

He didn't know they weren't going to be €4.00/kg, they're probably suckler calves you'd be expecting them to do better

Robson99

Jjameson wrote: »

What’ll they be worth?

Good question...you would hope the might average 1500??? Depends if they storey or fleshy now...Probably may take till August to get enough weight on them.
But if they fed now with meal for killing in April then I cannot see this paying

Bass Reeves

Robson99 wrote: »

Good question...you would hope the might average 1500??? Depends if they storey or fleshy now...Probably may take till August to get enough weight on them.
But if they fed now with meal for killing in April then I cannot see this paying

Alot depends on how early you can get them out to grass. If left out to grass March 1st and fed ration from last week in April to finish in mid June assuming 1.5kgs/ day and 530 kgs going to grass killing mid June at a base of 3.9 would grading R=/+ would have them making 1500 euro.

Going to grass late March 535kgs on grass until late August gaining an average of 1.3kgs/day. Give a base of 3.7/kgs and grade R+/U- brings them into about 1600euro. You have them 60days longer and be going overage in September.

Cavanjack

Jjameson wrote: »

They are going into a new shed (latest addition and another planned for this year) . 70k for just the steelwork. They won’t see grass. Whether they leave a margin or not doesn’t seem to matter..

€1280 plus close to €300 for meal if feeding him for 120 days @10kg a day leaves him at €1580.
If he goes on well he’ll put on 200kg so 720 live weight. He’ll come close to 400kg dead. At a base price of €3.70 and grading r+ he’ll be €3.96 kg so he’ll come into €1584.
That’s before silage/straw, transport, mart fees, factory fees, dosing, slurry etc.
He’d might break even with a base price of €3.90 but the shed has to be paid for too so....

kk.man

Jjameson wrote: »

The sums on o- p+ Angus cattle bringing close enough to 2 euro a kg are worse.

Your right i always said too many chasing the AA bonus for cattle that have less scope for weight.

Cavanjack

kk.man wrote: »

Your right i always said too many chasing the AA bonus for cattle that have less scope for weight.

The bonus is usually given away the day they are bought yet there are plenty of customers.

Base price

Jjameson wrote: »

Some great Angus cattle in your home county however in mine, bad easy calving bulls on bad cows and cattle buyers who are slow learners rewarding same.

Feck all quality Angus cattle out of dairy herds about in the last few years.

Bass Reeves

It amazing the way lads follow the bigger final cheque and yet fail to see margin as the pointer towards profitability. Those CHX if going into a shed are not going to leave profit unless buyer is getting a guaranteed final base price well above 4/kg. No matter what way you cost feeding it a minimum of above 2.5/day and maybe nearer 3/kg. To even achieve a modest profit buyer needs to a gross price of nearly 1800 euro to cover feeding, machinery costs, vet, dosing, transport etc.

It had to see these killing 400 kgs but even if they did they would need a gross price of 4.5/ kg or a base of nearly 4.3/kg ( assuming they graded R+ at slaughter. To achieve a slaughter weight of 400 kgs they need a daily live weight gain of 1.7kgs/day. Its unlikey they will achieve that at any feed cost of less than 2.8/day.

Buyer needs to learn to use a calculator

Who2

How many good Charolais cattle will grade r especially with feeding? At 2 year old and over 500kg they are just ready for feeding but it would be put on grass. If the lad wants to give big money fair play to him, he’s supporting someone else. Too many spend far too much time worrying about what the neighbors at.

memorystick

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Buyer needs to learn to use a calculator

The best bit of machinery on any farm. And the cheapest.

Hershall

Robson99 wrote: »

What way are base prices at the moment ??
Are we still 3.60 for heifers ??

3.65 the best I can get for heifers next week. Midlands.

straight

memorystick wrote: »

The best bit of machinery on any farm. And the cheapest.

Calculator is dangerous in the wrong hands. What are cull cows making in the factory? Would they kill out at 50%?

Bass Reeves

straight wrote: »

Calculator is dangerous in the wrong hands. What are cull cows making in the factory? Would they kill out at 50%?

At the end of the time everybody knows there own system. Easiest part but it the part lads find hardest to quantify is there own costs. That where the calculator is an essential tool. After a while you get a handle it. After that essentially you find the unprofitable bits and exit those parts. Lots of lads that are continuously turning cattle fail to access unprofitable parts of there system and move away from it. I used to winter finish. I left it for a few main reasons, nitrates due to stocking level, problem with spring purchases of stock or else overwintering large numbers compared to summer output.

Robson99

Bass Reeves wrote: »

At the end of the time everybody knows there own system. Easiest part but it the part lads find hardest to quantify is there own costs. That where the calculator is an essential tool. After a while you get a handle it. After that essentially you find the unprofitable bits and exit those parts. Lots of lads that are continuously turning cattle fail to access unprofitable parts of there system and move away from it. I used to winter finish. I left it for a few main reasons, nitrates due to stocking level, problem with spring purchases of stock or else overwintering large numbers compared to summer output.

Exactly.
Also a big problem a lot of lads have is they never factor in a cost for days spent at grass...how often do you hear sure the only ate a couple of pounds of meal...when they could have ate a 1/2 ton
Moving away from Winter Finishing here for now anyways...doesn't add up at 3.60 a kg...lesson learned and will probably take another year to have adjusted fully..

Bass Reeves

Robson99 wrote: »

Exactly.
Also a big problem a lot of lads have is they never factor in a cost for days spent at grass...how often do you hear sure the only ate a couple of pounds of meal...when they could have ate a 1/2 ton
Moving away from Winter Finishing here for now anyways...doesn't add up at 3.60 a kg...lesson learned and will probably take another year to have adjusted fully..

I allow about 40-60c/day for grass costs depending on whether it is yearling stores or two year old stores/finisher's. I generally allow 3kgs/day for 7-8 weeks as ration costs or 150-180kgs ration (barley,maize,hulls costing about 30-40 euro)

Lots of lads get excited about shed costs but if you factor in a shed at 40+years and allow for tax and grant back if applicable these costs are negible. Slurry is factored in as cost in silage production as is fertilizer and in grass costs as well. Even allowing 40c/ day as grazing costs on 60 cattle at 240 days grazing season gives me a grass production cost of 5760 or 9# euro/ acre. It hardly costs that but I want to make sure I am not being a fool either

lalababa

Is everyone playing the fool or what?
Who can make money at the base price? My brother's shed cost 80k...he won't even make that back in 40years!
WTF are we at?

marathon

Bit of advice needed. Have a bull born April 17 that I used as stock bull but not needed anymore where best place go with him considering he over the 30 month mark. He a Hereford. Would I be cut much in factory?

Cavanjack

lalababa wrote: »

Is everyone playing the fool or what?
Who can make money at the base price? My brother's shed cost 80k...he won't even make that back in 40years!
WTF are we at?

This shed mightn’t cost as much as it sounds. Maybe he has an off farm job and on the high tax rate? Maybe he is getting a 60% grant on it? Does it include vat? If yes for all it’ll only cost him a fraction of the 80k

Anto_Meath

Jjameson wrote: »

Old bull price. If he’s plenty of flesh the mart is often best.

Yes there is a few lads that are in the local mart that buy these type of cattle and usually give more than you would get for him in the factory. I don't know they must be able to get 1 at a time away on a load as a young bull or something.
You would get crucified in a factory with him.

weatherbyfoxer

anyone get prices for this week?..hearing 370 is negotiable on steers with another 5c available on heifers

Robson99

weatherbyfoxer wrote: »

anyone get prices for this week?..hearing 370 is negotiable on steers with another 5c available on heifers

Heifers still 3.60 in a lot of places

1373

Was offered 3.60 flat for O/R fr bulls but not a fan of the factory , so didn’t go with it . They are well able to offer higher prices to go the next day

Cavanjack

1373 wrote: »

Was offered 3.60 flat for O/R fr bulls but not a fan of the factory , so didn’t go with it . They are well able to offer higher prices to go the next day

I would have let them off. Rang factory today wanted bulls and bullocks tomorrow. €3.65 u grade bulls 3.55 r’s. €3.65 bullocks.

Bass Reeves

Cavanjack wrote: »

I would have let them off. Rang factory today wanted bulls and bullocks tomorrow. €3.65 u grade bulls 3.55 r’s. €3.65 bullocks.

Friesian Bulls could be in more demand as carcass weight would be nearer supermarket spec. R and U grades could be killing too heavy

Base price

1373 wrote: »

Was offered 3.60 flat for O/R fr bulls but not a fan of the factory , so didn’t go with it . They are well able to offer higher prices to go the next day

I would always take a flat rate for FR bulls if given the opportunity.

Base price

Bass Reeves wrote: »

Friesian Bulls could be in more demand as carcass weight would be nearer supermarket spec. R and U grades could be killing too heavy

Chinese trade for bulls is offsetting supermarket specs.

Bass Reeves

Base price wrote: »

Chinese trade for bulls is offsetting supermarket specs.

If inspec retail carcass's arein short supply 280-380DW then Fr bulls will be much more likely to meet spec rather than heavy U&R grade bulls. Not too long ago processors graded bulls U350 DW as bullocks.

1373

Jjameson wrote: »

That was a serious price. They’re mostly good r grade? 3.45 for a mix of over and under 30 month bullockslast week and wasn’t got that soft either.

Same man offered me 3.50 flat a week earlier. They’re all well fed u24 months ,British friesian , 50/50 o/r but they all kill out fat score 3 , if short of fat nobody wants them

kk.man

1373 wrote: »

Same man offered me 3.50 flat a week earlier. They’re all well fed u24 months ,British friesian , 50/50 o/r but they all kill out fat score 3 , if short of fat nobody wants them

That's a good fat score for fr bulls. They must have taken a good lot of feeding?

1373

kk.man wrote: »

That's a good fat score for fr bulls. They must have taken a good lot of feeding?

Unfortunately yes , plenty of maize meal will put fat on

memorystick

Jjameson wrote: »

That was a serious price.

Just shows how low they have been when someone considers this to be a good price.

Base price

Bass Reeves wrote: »

If inspec retail carcass's arein short supply 280-380DW then Fr bulls will be much more likely to meet spec rather than heavy U&R grade bulls.Not too long ago processors graded bulls U350 DW as bullocks.

All under 30 month old bulls non QA are eligible for the Chinese market.

The reality is it doesn't matter what the situation was "not too long ago". You have to understand the situation. Fit bulls are wanted by the factories for the Chinese trade but unfortunately that market is only for the forequarter's.

1373

memorystick wrote: »

Just shows how low they have been when someone considers this to be a good price.

It’s a good price for this week

Bass Reeves

Base price wrote: »

All under 30 month old bulls non QA are eligible for the Chinese market.

The reality is it doesn't matter what the situation was "not too long ago". You have to understand the situation. Fit bulls are wanted by the factories for the Chinese trade but unfortunately that market is only for the forequarter's.

Yes but the steaks from the he FR bull's are suitable for the UK retail market not all supermarket will take them but some will.