An open letter from Boards.ie to Minister Sean Sherlock

miec

@blublobklu,this might answer your question

Do you think people are entitled to download artists' works for free, even against their wishes?
How do you propose that artists make a living?

a pragmatic and intelligent take on piracy (in this instance books) http://vimeo.com/35780331

Daftendirekt

Spacedog wrote: »

I asked in the comments for the uploader to share the entire debate, including Sherlocks arrogant response.
Shame on RTE News, once again, asleep at the wheel.

Do these debates generally end up online in their entirety? Or am I out of luck?

Kudos to Stephen Donnelly. He was the first TD to give me a reply when I emailed him, and seems to be one of the very few who've engaged with people's concerns genuinely and competently (from the videos you've posted at least).

AntiRip

Daftendirekt wrote: »

Do these debates generally end up online in their entirety? Or am I out of luck?

Kudos to Stephen Donnelly. He was the first TD to give me a reply when I emailed him, and seems to be one of the very few who've engaged with people's concerns genuinely and competently (from the videos you've posted at least).

+ 1

He really knows what he's talking about fair play.

It's funny how sometimes I download my tv shows via torrents but my only concern is for legitimate sites such as boards etc. It does say a lot doesn't it when it will hurt good sites a HELL of a lot more than the sites they're trying to target. Going with the conspiracy theory earlier, it is strange all these are going through now during a crisis and also the censorship of twitter in some countries. Wonder if it's all about copyright at all. Don't want to sound like Jim Corr either

cee_jay

Daftendirekt wrote: »

Do these debates generally end up online in their entirety? Or am I out of luck?

Kudos to Stephen Donnelly. He was the first TD to give me a reply when I emailed him, and seems to be one of the very few who've engaged with people's concerns genuinely and competently (from the videos you've posted at least).

I am from Limerick, and I emailed all my local TDs - Michael Noonan, Jan O'Sullivan, Kieran O'Donnell and Willie O'Dea.
The only one to respond to the email was Willie O'Dea, and I was glad he was at the debate in the Dail today raising objections to it.
So fair play to him.

Citizen_Kane

So, as I do, I downloaded 'The 3rd World' by Immortal Technique via torrent.

After a month or two I really started liking it and headed over to Viper Records to pay my due.

No Paypal and only credit card with no 'Ireland' option. So I wrote to them:

Dear Sir/Madame

I have discovered and come to really appreciate the work done by one of your artists, Immortal Technique. In specific I am listening to his album 'The Third World' which you are retailing at $9.99.

The vehicle for my discovery has been P2P filesharing and I would like to compensate financially towards the ongoing production of this artists work.

Your sites download method however does not represent my country, Ireland, or my prefered payment method, Paypal.

Would you please be as kind as to facilitate my payment with a Paypal email payment address or a physical address and details to which I could mail a Euro cheque.

Best regards,

Here is their response:

appreciate it but not necessary

we don't care how you get the music as long as you listen to it and like it...we also don't use paypal and never will

would far prefer you make a donation to your favorite charity.....even if it's buying yourself a Guinness and toasting yourself for being a stand up guy ......and us for making the music available....

peace

jon

Wibbs

I've been concerned about this for a good kickback from the old media/money for a while. Bored people to tears about it. :) Over two years ago I said this in relation to another matter in feedback here(a matter that Boards.ie handled well and looked to the future while doing so):

Mise wrote:

IMHO the day of the interweb free lunch is not gone, but that day is coming I reckon. It was largely an unsustainable notion anyway. There have been a few shots over the bow already. The aforementioned facebook privacy issues, things like eircom blocking piratebay etc and the maxwell group moving to charge for content. Existing content providers will fight more and more to control "their" content and revenue.

How might this affect places like boards? I would worry less about users TBH. Most people use facebook et al and dont seem to be concerned about this stuff(foolishly IMHO). I would worry about larger entities getting involved and starting a precedent.

Say a poster copies and pastes content, copy or image, from a newspaper or other site. This happens all the time. I've done it myself. I would always leave the link which is good manners anyway. Most do. But all it needs is one large corporation to turn around and go "hang on do you have permission to reproduce that content to add to your sites content? We want money now thanks".

It's possible that in say 5 years time, users here will not be allowed to link to any site that is not "open source" like wikipedia and the like. Actually wikipedia have been clever to avoid this stuff so far. Well as far as I know anyway? Maybe take a leaf from their book re licencing and copyright etc?

How you police that for both the communities sake and Boards Ltd and how you attempt to limit possible future issues would take better minds than I have to muster. I do see it as an issue that will grow. We've had Web 1.0, we're now apparently in Web 2.0. I reckon Web 3.0 may be a quite different entity. I'm probably wrong and indeed hopefully I am.

The relative freedom of this bloody great medium has it's ups and downs. Yea you get 4chan at one extreme. Hell Youtube is peopled with an unmoderated mess of slack jawed mouth breathing fcukwits shouting nígger, Jew and fag thinking it's passing for discourse. OK grand, but you also get real communities that are well run. This site being one of them. And you get more of those kind of communities. This rushed through ballsology has a very real and practical risk of affecting those communities. Ballsology that was rushed through with unseemly haste and with no nod to even the best arguments. This is how debate is reduced even squashed. Riding in on a horse well fed on vested interests, cloaked in BS about safety/copyright/earnings/think about the childer. Delete as applicable. I fear we're pissing into the wind, but do you know what, I figure fcuk em and drink more water and keep pissing away.

Christ I really hope I'm wearing a tinfoil hat. Well... I look do good in foil.

Heisenberg.

This post has been deleted.

Wibbs

Citizen_Kane wrote: »

So, as I do, I downloaded 'The 3rd World' by Immortal Technique via torrent.

After a month or two I really started liking it and headed over to Viper Records to pay my due.

No Paypal and only credit card with no 'Ireland' option. So I wrote to them:


Here is their response:

Fair play. Though you're probably well up to speed on this CK, I'd be suggesting other interested people research The Grateful Dead band and how they did things, long before the interweb. When the record companies were crowing on about how "Home taping was killing music!!", the Dead were setting aside areas in their concerts so that "bootleg" tapers could get the best sounds. Even let them sell said recordings at their gigs. Ditto for amateur fans making up merchandising. Didn't affect them. Indeed they were stinking rich and broke all sorts of records as one of the biggest touring acts of the 80's and before. Just to make clear, I couldn't abide their output, this is no fanboi talking, but while they may have been real honest to goodness hippies, they were defo onto something. And it worked. Pissed off the "money" and the "maaan" but they were quids in and so were their community of fans.

We need to preserve that sense of community. Communities like we have here. Real communities. Not people shilling for a quick buck however they see it. We ban those fcukers.

Citizen_Kane

Wibbs wrote: »

Fair play. Though you're probably well up to speed on this CK, I'd be suggesting other interested people research The Grateful Dead band and how they did things, long before the interweb. When the record companies were crowing on about how "Home taping was killing music!!", the Dead were setting aside areas in their concerts so that "bootleg" tapers could get the best sounds. Even let them sell said recordings at their gigs. Ditto for amateur fans making up merchandising. Didn't affect them. Indeed they were stinking rich and broke all sorts of records as one of the biggest touring acts of the 80's and before. Just to make clear, I couldn't abide their output, this is no fanboi talking, but while they may have been real honest to goodness hippies, they were defo onto something. And it worked. Pissed off the "money" and the "maaan" but they were quids in and so were their community of fans.

We need to preserve that sense of community. Communities like we have here. Real communities. Not people shilling for a quick buck however they see it. We ban those fcukers.

Other good examples of artists coining it from 'free' are:
Radiohead
Nine Inch Nails

Even the creators of the Angry Birds game says 'piracy' drives their sales.

The only c*nts in the story are the protectionist middlemen who are fully conscious that their distribution network is no longer required and can't let go of the 80's.

thebman

I think many people that don't oppose this (I don't believe many support it, most don't care or oppose it IMO) have not seen how great the alternatives can be.

Here is one example of one website (there are many) committed to sharing of quality music being distribute for free.

http://www.jamendo.com/en/top

A top site for music sharing legally. It can work, all it takes is for people to decide to support an open culture sharing world. Since many of the best artists actually give a crap about this type of thing, this will be the way forward in the end IMO.

Those in it for the money will lose to those that do it for passion.

DavidCollins

You know, in terms of supporting people who oppose oppressive copyright laws, I feel I have to mention the Green Party. They seem to genuinely oppose this sort of law and stand up for digital rights, long before the recent popularity of the issue. I remember Eamon Ryan blogging in strong opposition to proposed laws that would implement "three strikes" just before the 2011 elections. There was an article in the Irish Times where they emphasised their opposition to SOPA just before the Wikipedia blackout. Right now, one of the articles on their website is "Green Party asks Why the Government wants to turn Ireland into a repressive internet location."

I know that the Green Party currently has no force in the government and like any political party it has it's critics. But right now they are the only political party that seem to have a strong stance on the issue and unless Ireland forms a Pirate Party, we will need to keep these guys in mind come the next election.

ShooterSF

DavidCollins wrote: »

I know that the Green Party currently has no force in the government and like any political party it has it's critics. But right now they are the only political party that seem to have a strong stance on the issue and unless Ireland forms a Pirate Party, we will need to keep these guys in mind come the next election.

Fair point but if I ever find myself in front of the ballot box honestly thinking the greens or FF are my best option I'm emigrating.

Citizen_Kane

The future is really bright and positive if only we could let it be. If all humanity puts their heads together via the internet we can solve all our problems. We don't even need the big corporations to facilitate with their terms and conditions.

There are already properly free technologies in place to replace Facebook and Google search .

All we need to do is stop eating the sweet candy we are given as 'services' and 'culture' and get our elected leaders to stop saying 'Yes sir, no sir, 3 bags full sir' to the corporations and financiers.

Citizen_Kane

And how could I forget BITCOIN - which, technically, can replace all the currencies into one big decentralised common marketplace via P2P.

Now that is really 'sticking it to the man'

Wibbs

Daftendirekt wrote: »

Kudos to Stephen Donnelly. He was the first TD to give me a reply when I emailed him, and seems to be one of the very few who've engaged with people's concerns genuinely and competently (from the videos you've posted at least).

Yep a clearly sensible man making 24 carat points that most onlookers can see plain as day for the good sense they are. However... sadly this doesn't seem to compute for his fellows in the moronic infrastructure he finds himself in. When you start to question a clearly sane man's sanity, you start to see the real madness in this so called government. And this guff goes right across the board. I truly hope this penny drops. Though I'm not holding my breath. Too many vested interests working the wires. So Mr Sherlock, prove us all wrong. Prove those voters were right to tick the box beside your picture. Go on. I dare you.

Citizen_Kane

Link to full article here.

Apart from the concerns about the substantive questions about legal consequences, there is a problem with method. When it takes a Freedom of Information request to discover that Enda Kenny held a private meeting last summer with the new head of the Motion Picture Association of America, former Democrat Senator Chris Dodd, then the suspicion that vested interests are intervening in a surreptitious manner to shape the law is fully justified. All the more so when it happens quietly in Castlebar.

Citizen_Kane

cee_jay wrote: »

I am from Limerick, and I emailed all my local TDs - Michael Noonan, Jan O'Sullivan, Kieran O'Donnell and Willie O'Dea.
The only one to respond to the email was Willie O'Dea, and I was glad he was at the debate in the Dail today raising objections to it.
So fair play to him.

Willie engaged with me as well via email and I sent him a big THANK YOU.

Good man!

Who would have thought?

nyarlothothep

Citizen_Kane wrote: »

The future is really bright and positive if only we could let it be. If all humanity puts their heads together via the internet we can solve all our problems. We don't even need the big corporations to facilitate with their terms and conditions.

There are already properly free technologies in place to replace Facebook and Google search .

All we need to do is stop eating the sweet candy we are given as 'services' and 'culture' and get our elected leaders to stop saying 'Yes sir, no sir, 3 bags full sir' to the corporations and financiers.

I'd love to see that happen except I don' think it ever will. The collective switch in people is hard to flip, it requires extreme circumstances for that to happen. I think these are the last days of the internet as a free democratic public realm. The assholes who seek to maintain the status quo for their own sense of self importance and power have the means to censor all opinions, free discourse etc, its been done elsewhere, it will be implemented in the West. In their minds they are fully justified in what they're doing, they think that posting links to youtube videos is stealing, they think this wonderful state capitalist world they've built on the backs of others should be preserved, that banks and bondholders should be bailed out because otherwise we'd have societal chaos. When in reality all these rationales are just forms of self denial, in truth they are greedy narcissistic psychological fck ups and they know it but they repress it with these forms of reasoning.
Or they're just people like Henry Kissinger who just doesn't give a fck.

The problem is people confuse their bluster, their domineering attitude and "charisma" with competence, intelligence, self awareness and responsibility. If someone looks presidential they're more likely to get elected even if the other less presidential looking guy has better policies and demonstrates qualities that would make him a better leader.

The human world is no different to the animal one or the world in general, it is chaos and a battleground between the haves and have nots with the haves generally getting their way until they become bloated and weak from the stagnation of having too much power for too long. Then it starts all over again, the only difference is technology and some improvement in civil rights in the certain places in the West. If there is any hope for the future it is just a glimmer.

wiseguy

Citizen_Kane wrote: »

Link to full article here.

Apart from the concerns about the substantive questions about legal consequences, there is a problem with method. When it takes a Freedom of Information request to discover that Enda Kenny held a private meeting last summer with the new head of the Motion Picture Association of America, former Democrat Senator Chris Dodd, then the suspicion that vested interests are intervening in a surreptitious manner to shape the law is fully justified. All the more so when it happens quietly in Castlebar.

Jesus wept that explains it, along with the government being sued by the music industry

they are being bounced into swift action by an industry that is afraid of technology and innovation

wiseguy

It seems Dodd also has a cottage here in County Galway


http://www.irishcentral.com/news/More-controversy-as-Sen-Chris-Dodds-new-appraisal-of-Irish-cottage-is-released-47996666.html

dahamsta

Citizen_Kane wrote: »

Other good examples of artists coining it from 'free' are:
Radiohead
Nine Inch Nails

LouisCK is the best recent example of this, because he published the numbers. He self-produced a comedy show at a cost of 250k and sold it on his own website for five bucks. In late December he posted a screenshot of his Paypal account with a balance of just over a million dollars. 250k went towards costs, 250k in bonuses to his staff, 280k to charity and 220k in his back pocket. I bought my copy after that, and I'm sure plenty more did too. You can read the details and see that screenshot here:

https://buy.louisck.net/news

Citizen_Kane

nyarlothothep wrote: »

I'd love to see that happen except I don' think it ever will. The collective switch in people is hard to flip, it requires extreme circumstances for that to happen. I think these are the last days of the internet as a free democratic public realm. The assholes who seek to maintain the status quo for their own sense of self importance and power have the means to censor all opinions, free discourse etc, its been done elsewhere, it will be implemented in the West. In their minds they are fully justified in what they're doing, they think that posting links to youtube videos is stealing, they think this wonderful state capitalist world they've built on the backs of others should be preserved, that banks and bondholders should be bailed out because otherwise we'd have societal chaos. When in reality all these rationales are just forms of self denial, in truth they are greedy narcissistic psychological fck ups and they know it but they repress it with these forms of reasoning.
Or they're just people like Henry Kissinger who just doesn't give a fck.

The problem is people confuse their bluster, their domineering attitude and "charisma" with competence, intelligence, self awareness and responsibility. If someone looks presidential they're more likely to get elected even if the other less presidential looking guy has better policies and demonstrates qualities that would make him a better leader.

The human world is no different to the animal one or the world in general, it is chaos and a battleground between the haves and have nots with the haves generally getting their way until they become bloated and weak from the stagnation of having too much power for too long. Then it starts all over again, the only difference is technology and some improvement in civil rights in the certain places in the West. If there is any hope for the future it is just a glimmer.

Sure - I agree with you except that the animal, natural world is a world of perfect harmony. We just don't see it and mistake it's savage control mechanisms as chaos. This is a fault in our perception mechanism.

It is not just Ireland with their heads in the sand. It is the whole world.

Fortunately there are people with their eyes open and they are putting in place very real infrastructural alternatives. All it's going to take is one clever person to figure out how to mass produce a red pill.

nyarlothothep

Citizen_Kane wrote: »

Sure - I agree with you except that the animal, natural world is a world of perfect harmony. We just don't see it and mistake it's savage control mechanisms as chaos. This is a fault in our perception mechanism.

It is not just Ireland with their heads in the sand. It is the whole world.

Fortunately there are people with their eyes open and they are putting in place very real infrastructural alternatives. All it's going to take is one clever person to figure out how to mass produce a red pill.

I think a lot of people have taken the red pill but can't do anything to change the conditions of the world they find themselves in. Why amn't I withdrawing from the system and developing alternatives to it, why aren't you, why isn't anyone else? Divide and conquer, we're all locked in a struggle for economic survival and the people at the top dictate the rules in addition to the cruelty of nature herself. We can post here on the internet, we can send emails to Sherlock, we can even stage blackouts but all they are going to do is laugh, write us off as fools and push through the legislation anyway. Action to take a more direct form, a mass adoption of BITCOIN as you mentioned would help.

wiseguy

So to summarize

60,000+ people petition, thousands contact their representatives, plenty of media attention (except for our resident RTE/Pravda propaganda machine)
And it all amounts to "**** you all, i am still going to sign this"

Yet when one rich US senator (who also happens to get paid few million a year by music industry for lobbying) wants an audience, he gets to meet Enda Kenny himself.
My faith in democracy and the political system has been completely shattered now

biolog.ie

To all Members of the EU Parliament:

As concerned global citizens, we call on you to stand for a free and open Internet and reject the ratification of the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement (ACTA), which would destroy it. The Internet is a crucial tool for people around the world to exchange ideas and promote democracy. We urge you to show true global leadership and protect our rights.

Sign the petition here:
http://www.avaaz.org/en/eu_save_the_internet_spread/?twi

nyarlothothep

wiseguy wrote: »

So to summarize

60,000+ people petition, thousands contact their representatives, plenty of media attention (except for our resident RTE/Pravda propaganda machine)
And it all amounts to "**** you all, i am still going to sign this"

Yet when one rich US senator (who also happens to get paid few million a year by music industry for lobbying) wants an audience, he gets to meet Enda Kenny himself.
My faith in democracy and the political system has been completely shattered now

The political system is transforming into ancient Rome, we now have a burgeoning slave class (interns), soon we won't have the right to post our opinions on the internet because they'll be "defamatory," we will be made to respect our "betters" (in reality middle aged/old men in silly costumes designed to connote "authority" to the gullible), we will be forced to serve their interests because there are no alternatives. The corporation (legislatively defined as an individual and exhibiting all the hallmarks of the psychopathic condition) is the truest expression of natural efficiency, it has no morals, no scruples and maximises profit in order to reproduce itself, it is might personified. This isn't a good thing and I think this is probably our future unless there is a mass swallowing of the red pill, which is unlikely in my opinion, but I hope it does.

Citizen_Kane

wiseguy wrote: »

It seems Dodd also has a cottage here in County Galway


http://www.irishcentral.com/news/More-controversy-as-Sen-Chris-Dodds-new-appraisal-of-Irish-cottage-is-released-47996666.html

Ireland was an unrestricted tax haven for resident artists. No wonder the big boys loved playing here and still have the governmental ear.

The only thing that puzzles me is:
Why no tent at the Galway races?

Citizen_Kane

nyarlothothep wrote: »

I think a lot of people have taken the red pill but can't do anything to change the conditions of the world they find themselves in. Why amn't I withdrawing from the system and developing alternatives to it, why aren't you, why isn't anyone else? Divide and conquer, we're all locked in a struggle for economic survival and the people at the top dictate the rules in addition to the cruelty of nature herself. We can post here on the internet, we can send emails to Sherlock, we can even stage blackouts but all they are going to do is laugh, write us off as fools and push through the legislation anyway. Action to take a more direct form, a mass adoption of BITCOIN as you mentioned would help.

I am.

I may be bankrupt soon, but I am.

Why don't you?

hillaryclinton

Minister Sherlock supports call for more skilled graduates in language and technology to maintain Ireland’s world leadership position in multi-billion euro localisation sector

Seán Sherlock T.D., Minister for Research and Innovation today (24 January 2012) launched a guide which urges secondary students to consider language and technology at third level for a potential career in the localisation sector.

The Guide, produced by the Centre for Next Generation Localisation, an academia-industry research consortium supported by the Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation through Science Foundation Ireland, says that Ireland needs to significantly increase its supply of language and technology graduates if the country is to maintain its leadership position in the multi-million euro localisation and global services sector.

Speaking at today’s launch, Minister Sherlock said that localisation, the process of adapting and personalising digital products, services and content to the needs of global users was an area of growth in Ireland and that opportunities exist for future graduates to build a career in this rapidly growing field.

Minister Sherlock stated “Many of the world’s largest software and web companies co-ordinate their localisation activities in Ireland and the sector contributes an estimated €680 million annually to the Irish economy.”

The Minister added “It is imperative that we highlight the opportunities available to our young people in this sector. We need to encourage and foster their development to ensure that we are teaching the right skills at third-level so employers who are already here, or who are considering a presence here, have a strong supply of high-calibre graduates to help them grow their businesses.”

The CNGL consortium comprises four Irish universities and includes Irish-based multinationals Microsoft, IBM and Symantec, as well as SMEs such as Alchemy Software Development, VistaTEC, Welocalize, and Applied Language Solutions.

The guide highlights the range of career opportunities available in this sector. The guide includes profiles of individuals who have graduated from Irish universities in a range of disciplines who now hold leading roles across the Localisation industry and also lists the University courses across computing, languages, and business that would provide a foundation for a career in this high-growth area.

“At present there are approximately 16,000 people working directly in the localisation sector in Ireland”, explains Dr Páraic Sheridan, Associate Director at CNGL. “Localisation is critical to so many industries, including software, games, financial services and medical devices, in bringing their products to foreign markets, so it really is vital to Ireland’s export-led recovery. It is also an area where Ireland is widely recognised as a world leader in innovation and sees continued growth in jobs, not just in traditional product and service localisation but also in the areas of global multilingual customer care and support.”

By launching a localisation careers guide, CNGL hopes to put localisation firmly on the radars of students, guidance counsellors and parents and to help ensure an adequate number of language, technology and linguistics graduates to support the sector’s continued success.

Dr Fred Hollowood, Research Director at Symantec Corporation’s Shared Engineering Services group in Blanchardstown supports CNGL’s call for students to consider studies in localisation-related fields. “Localisation enables Symantec to deliver products and offer customer support to customers in 40 countries in 22 languages out of our Dublin offices”, says Hollowood. “Although still a relatively young industry, localisation is expanding at a rapid pace. It is ideal for students who have an interest in language and technology, who are interested in the difference between the cultures of the world, and who are seeking a career in a fast growing sector.”

Director-General of Science Foundation Ireland (SFI), Professor Mark Ferguson, welcomed the publication of the guide. “A key goal of Science Foundation Ireland is to ensure that Ireland has a pipeline of skilled graduates who can pursue next generation science careers. This guide to careers in the localisation industry reinforces the fact that science offers a diverse range of roles that are rewarding, in strong supply and central to our economic growth”, says Professor Ferguson.

CNGL’s new localisation careers guide is being distributed to all secondary schools in Ireland this week. It features profiles from industry professionals, insights into the variety of job roles on offer, and details of relevant third level courses.

wiseguy

Bigger the fool who listens to Sean Sherlock
Students if you want to become rich become a lobbyist or a solicitor


Following government advice is a road to ruin, just look at all those people who followed government encouragement and went into construction, or bought houses on huge mortgage, they sure are sorry now as to listen to the government of the day.