Dublin Airport New Runway

Razor44

urajoke wrote: »

No tower is on hold.

Do we need one now, well they could build it now and have it ready for when the new runway was built, a very unirish thing to do.

Having extra space in the tower would be nice, would be useful as redundancy for when engineering need to take screens, compads for servicing or new tech installation.

The extra height would give us a better view of the apron but the downside is it might put us in LVOs more often as the tower might be sightless in low cloud conditions.

Did I here something about the iaa pulling approach etc back to shannon? Is that actually a runner?

urajoke

Razor44 wrote: »

Did I here something about the iaa pulling approach etc back to shannon? Is that actually a runner?

Not approach, Area sectors.

Put it this way someone sitting behind a desk thinks it is.

Razor44

urajoke wrote: »

Not approach, Area sectors.

Put it this way someone sitting behind a desk thinks it is.

Yeah I thought as much.....someone who doesnt actually see day to day what goes on

billie1b

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Afaik, both the tower and the runway are on hold

Didn't they announce 2 weeks ago that they would revisit their masterplan? Surely they can't have done that and decided to build a tower so soon.

There are a few DUB ATCs around here..do you guys know anything about this? And is there even a need for a new tower without the new runway?

They need a new tower as soon as possible as when aircraft are parked on stands 107R, 108L, 108R and up as far as 109R the tower cannot see the a/c's under normal weather conditions, let alone low vis procedures. it makes very hard for multiple pushbacks and taxi-ing at once. They never built the tower to full height, the original one is higher than the existing one at the moment, there was arguments about it for years

Peregrine

billie1b wrote: »

They never built the tower to full height, the original one is higher than the existing one at the moment, there was arguments about it for years

And there were still arguments when the new tower's was being planned 4 years ago. I think the proposed height is 86m, people were saying that's unacceptable because it can be seen from city centre

I mean what the hell? Good? What's wrong with that..

I'll never understand this country's hatred towards tall buildings..

aindriu80

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/sectors/transport-and-tourism/second-runway-at-dublin-airport-to-be-deferred-1.1455995

It looks like the new runway is not being built until 2019. That's quite a long finger. The runway costs €300 million and in the bigger scheme of things its not a lot. I guess they can't really push ahead when traffic fell from its peak.

urajoke

aindriu80 wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/business/sectors/transport-and-tourism/second-runway-at-dublin-airport-to-be-deferred-1.1455995

It looks like the new runway is not being built until 2019. That's quite a long finger. The runway costs €300 million and in the bigger scheme of things its not a lot. I guess they can't really push ahead when traffic fell from its peak.

Looks possible that this years passenger number will be around 20-20.5 million passengers. How much of that is down to the "Gathering" we won't know till the following year but both traffic and passenger figures are up at least 5% on last years figures based on numbers given for first 6months of the year.

Peregrine

They're going to revisit their 'Dublin Airport Masterplan', we'll have to wait and see what the new plan is.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056988515

basill

I don't think LHR tower can see any of us in lvps either. BUT they have an all singing all dancing ground movement radar. Remember doing a cat3 onto 27L a few years ago. After the landing rollout tower radioed to advise that n5w was 150 meters up on the rhs and to vacate there and follow the greens to our stand. Taxiing at around 10kts by now we just made out the edge lights and sure enough the greens appeared and we followed them all the way to stand and parked. Simples.

aindriu80

Those towers were never designed to see in adverse conditions and they did recommend using a ground radar system (Milian nearly had an accident in the fog). I guess they have the priorities right but the extra height with a new tower can only help manage the airport. Plus it acts as visual gateway to Ireland and is bound to pick up a few awards.

EchoIndia

aindriu80 wrote: »

Those towers were never designed to see in adverse conditions and they did recommend using a ground radar system (Milan nearly had an accident in the fog).

Milan did have an accident in fog, with 118 fatalities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linate_Airport_disaster

Peregrine

EchoIndia wrote: »

Milan did have an accident in fog, with 118 fatalities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linate_Airport_disaster

Yeah, I was going to say that but I wasn't sure if he was talking about Linate or Malpensa.


But yep, Milan Linate had that horrible accident 12 years ago. Thick fog, no ground radar and poor guidance signs. A Citation got lost and taxied onto a runway while an MD-80 was on its takeoff run.

Razor44

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Yeah, I was going to say that but I wasn't sure if he was talking about Linate or Malpensa.


But yep, Milan Linate had that horrible accident 12 years ago. Thick fog, no ground radar and poor guidance signs. A Citation got lost and taxied onto a runway while an MD-80 was on its takeoff run.

Also no runway incursion system active at the time.

aindriu80

EchoIndia wrote: »

Milan did have an accident in fog, with 118 fatalities.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linate_Airport_disaster

Like I said, those towers were never designed for fog. At least we got the priorities right and have a ground radar. The extra height can only help manage things in Dublin in general and it would look quite impressive IMHO.

whadafook

Obviously I'm ignorant but why does what is essentially a couple of kilometers road so expensive?

Shamrock231

whadafook wrote: »

Obviously I'm ignorant but why does what is essentially a couple of kilometers road so expensive?

Very deep foundations, expensive precision navigational equipment, taxiways to support it, certification and calibration as well as a number of changes to the current set up at Dublin. More than just slapping down a bit of Tarmac...

Peregrine

whadafook wrote: »

Obviously I'm ignorant but why does what is essentially a couple of kilometers road so expensive?

You know the way some roads say 'Vehicles over 3 tonne are not allowed'?

Your average 777 weighs well over 300 tonnes at takeoff, how many times can a road withstand that? A runway has foundations many inches deep, they have to last decades. Then there's the cost of building everthing around it and navigation instruments.

Also try slamming them into a road at 140 knots a couple of times too.

urajoke

Dublin has ground radar and its now as good as Heathrow etc. Aircraft tags, alarms for runway incursions, etc etc. it has been trialled to be used via an APP for iPads via 4G on rescue vehicles (before anyone asks NO it won't be available to the public EVER).

Runways are NOT just straight roads as has been said before, precision materials used, graded, grooved, drained, lit, painted, NAV aided, access etc etc etc etc etc.

aindriu80

seeing that they are twining dublin and beijing airports they can build a new runway for bigger jets
http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/china-air-link-in-pipeline-as-dublin-and-beijing-airports-become-twins-29461501.html

jamo2oo9

aindriu80 wrote: »

seeing that they are twining dublin and beijing airports they can build a new runway for bigger jets
http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/china-air-link-in-pipeline-as-dublin-and-beijing-airports-become-twins-29461501.html

It's possible that China could finance the airport development but the DAA will still have to finance some of it too. Will be interesting to see what will happen for the future of the airport and how it will stand for the Chinese.

andy_g

aindriu80 wrote: »

seeing that they are twining dublin and beijing airports they can build a new runway for bigger jets
http://www.independent.ie/business/irish/china-air-link-in-pipeline-as-dublin-and-beijing-airports-become-twins-29461501.html

Ryanair cheap flights to Asia :O

Ok i'll get my coat

Peregrine

andy_g wrote: »

Ryanair cheap flights to Asia :O

Now I understand everything

Mick is playing them like puppets! :pac:

andy_g

Nimrod 7 wrote: »

Now I understand everything

Mick is playing them like puppets! :pac:

Or forcing the government to setup Asia flights.

On the plus side this could generate pax numbers and cash flow for the new runway so wouldnt be a bad thing.

Ryanair 747 anyone?

jamo2oo9

andy_g wrote: »

Or forcing the government to setup Asia flights.

On the plus side this could generate pax numbers and cash flow for the new runway so wouldnt be a bad thing.

Ryanair 747 anyone?

But flights can't fly to Asia unless a longer runway is built. Chinese would have to lend some dosh to us for it to begin.

andy_g

jamo2oo9 wrote: »

But flights can't fly to Asia unless a longer runway is built. Chinese would have to lend some dosh to us for it to begin.

As someone mentioned earlier if its the same distance give or take to SFO then maybe it could happen.

jamo2oo9

There's a 100 km difference between the two with Beijing being the further destination. Is that possible?

andy_g

may well be depending on A/C type