Bad experience at Chapters Bookshop Parnell Street, Dublin 1.

Agent J

Just a quick look at the language you use in your posts so far says an awful lot about your view on retail staff.

Fineen wrote:

Do not have some fool thinking he's important giving out to the customers.

Fineen wrote:

Why didn't the stupid bit*h look ....

Fineen wrote:

For the rest of us they're all condescending fools working in Chapters.

You have complaints? Did you say it to them at the time?
You don't like them fine. Don't shop there. Name calling just makes you look childish.

I've used chapters for over 10 years at this point since they were in middle abbey street. Never had a problem & found them above & beyond helpful most of the time.

cloud493

I would agree with the chap above me. One bad experience doesn't spoil the whole thing. Just yesterday, I got a book from there for 13e, when its 23e everywhere else.

Ninap

I went in there with a brand new copy of a book I received as a present, but already had. It was in a Chapters bag, and had the chapters price sticker on it. I didn't have a receipt but was willing to take a credit note or a different book in exchange, but the tosser of a manager said he couldn't do it as I didn't have a receipt. He said he couldn't be sure what price had been paid for the book. I said I'd happily exchange for the cheapest price they have sold it, but no dice. They were still of course selling the book, so I couldn't understand his stubborn, unhelpful attitude. Bookshops and their customers are usually pretty civilized, and not into scamming, being rude or ripping people off, but this guy didn't get it and has lost a customer for good.

BookBunny

Finneen wrote: »

You must be posh and their staff like you? For the rest of us they're all condescending fools working in Chapters.

Kind of stating the obvious here but if I was posh I wouldn't be buying second hand books.

Toby Take a Bow

Finneen wrote: »

You must be posh and their staff like you? For the rest of us they're all condescending fools working in Chapters.

I'm pretty posh and the manager has no time for me.

To Ninap, that's shocking behaviour. I worked in a bookshop and we exchanged books (as long as they were in good condition and we had sold them within the last couple of months) with no questions asked. Even if they were in a bag of a rival bookshop. Even if they had an Eason sticker on it. The general thinking would be that if you give good service you stick in the mind of the customer and they return. I don't think that's the general thinking (on the part of the manager: I would say I disagree with some of the posters' attitudes regarding the general staff).

Finneen

Agent J wrote: »

You have complaints? Did you say it to them at the time?

No point, most of them avoid eye contact with the customers. The next time I'm in Chapters and that little, wrinkly old man on the 1st floor gives out to me for removing the DVD cases from the shelf I'm going to punch him in the face.

Toby Take a Bow

Finneen wrote: »

The next time I'm in Chapters and that little, wrinkly old man on the 1st floor gives out to me for removing the DVD cases from the shelf I'm going to punch him in the face.

You sound delightful.

ElleEm

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

Finneen wrote: »

The next time I'm in Chapters and that little, wrinkly old man on the 1st floor gives out to me for removing the DVD cases from the shelf I'm going to punch him in the face.

You sound delightful.

I LOLd!!!

cloud493

How do you buy a DVD without taking it off the shelf?

doomed

Chapters is my favourite book shop.

Its a bit eccentric but the value on remaindered books is excellent. Never had a bad experience there.

spanx

Finneen wrote: »

The next time I'm in Chapters .....

Maybe you shouldn't go in there again. Then you wouldn't be so upset.

Fuinseog

cloud493 wrote: »

How do you buy a DVD without taking it off the shelf?

cannot say I have had that experience but the second hand dvds are selling at 5 euro. in some cases you can get them cheaper new. most places would want to shift dvds as they are becoming outdated.

I think down stairs with its new books is better value than its second hand stock.

dukedalton

Grievous wrote: »

Haha, I know the guy you are all on about. I don't know him personally but I am going in to Chapters years.

It's wierd, because Chapters is one of my favourite bookstores ever (C'mon, no amount of ****ty staff could ruin how awesome their second hand section is).

I think I remember another member of the staff there saying to Mr Obnoxious about some guy leaving his CV in and he responded by saying "I asked him out on a date, and he said no, he clearly didn't want the job!).

Yes, rude and imposing and intimidating, but that moment made me laugh in a horrible bosses sort of way.

I've been going to Chapters for about 15 years. When I was a student I loved going to their downstairs, second-hand section in Abbey Street and having a good root around. I remember in late 2006/early 2007 I had just started going out with a girl (a fellow book-lover) and feeling excited bringing her for her first visit to my Mecca, only to be devastated by the "Closed" sign on the door- but then being amazed at the size of the new store on Parnell Street. Even though the second hand section was quite smaller than it is now, I remember thinking at the time it was the largest second hand bookstore I'd ever been in. Happy memories

I did bring a couple of books there to trade one time, but they wouldn't accept them, for a variety of reasons. To be honest, I think seeing as how their second hand prices are so low, you can't reasonably expect to get anything but rock bottom prices for them. At the end of the day, you are bringing them there because you want to get rid of them- they aren't necessarily going to be as desperate to have them.

As for the comments about that certain individual, I know who you are talking about I remember being upstairs one time and hearing two other members of staff talking about him, questioning whether it was natural for someone to be so fussy (not the term they used, but "fussy" is the only polite word I can think of )

LiamMc

I have been trading with Chapters since the early 1990's, there are at least two strong personalities in their store. I am sure both of them feel they are entitled to their opinions.

If you need to trade then unfortunately the in house credit is the best value. There will be something a customer can eventually put it towards. One novel, map, travel guide to a place they are going to or uncherished Christmas Present.
The range is very good and only online have I bought specific books cheaper.

In 2001 the nombre un asked a French member of staff if a 1993 Michelin Map de Paris was too old. "yes, far too old" was the reply. If a business is denying Irish Tourists accurate information on Paris, where do we go from here.

The lift has been out of order, which an inconvenience.

Desmond_T

Here' a copy of a letter I have written to chapters, about my bad experience there last Friday (November 23rd, 2012):

To Whom It Concerns:

I wish to draw attention to your acceptance policy, and the implementation thereof, of secondhand books at your shop.

Last Friday (November 23rd) I went in to sell two hardback books for credit, in your upstairs department, and the woman behind the counter (whose name I did not ask for, but who I will hereinafter refer to as ‘Tweedy Bitch’, or TB for short), informed me: “These books are new, we only take secondhand books.” I was rather flummoxed at her logic, but managed to inquire: “I don’t understand: if I’ve owned them, then they are secondhand.” To which she replied, “No, I’m not taking them.”

So I make my way out, and it is only as I am halfway down the stairs that the penny drops: she thinks the books are stolen. I decide to go back to the counter to say my piece: “You think they’re stolen, don’t you?” To which Tweedy Bitch replies: “I didn’t say that.”

I then explain: “I’m a book reviewer, that’s where I get them from.” To which TB has the audacity to respond: “Why didn’t you say that?”, as though the onus is on me to prove the books were not stolen. So I retort: “You didn’t ask.”
This terminated our exchange, with no apology forthcoming.

The point is that TB presumed the books were stolen, yet would not give me an adequate explanation as to why she would not accept the books. Furthermore, she implied that it was up to me to prove the books are not stolen, even though I was completely unaware of her suspicions.

I am not accustomed to being treated like a common thief, nor as a receiver and seller of stolen goods. I have been reviewing books for nigh on twenty years, for a wide variety of Irish and international newspapers, magazines, and journals:

http://www.desmondtraynor.com/books.html

yet never before have I encountered such an obnoxious and condescending attitude in selling unwanted books, or books I have multiple copies of, which presumes an ulterior and illegal motive for selling newly or recently published books.

Suffice to say, I will not be buying or selling in Chapters ever again. My only regret is that I have done business there in the past, and spent money there (all of which seems to count for naught). In future, I will stick to favouring southside secondhand bookshops with my custom, such as The Secret Book and Record Shop, on Wicklow Street, with whom I enacted a much friendlier transaction later in the day, for the same books). A quick internet search shows that your (bad) reputation goes before you:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056533617

I will also be letting all my colleagues in the National Union of Journalists know about my negative and humiliating experience in chapters, which will hopefully do some more damage to your business, however slight.

Yours sincerely,

___________________
DESMOND TRAYNOR

ElleEm

I would encourage you to omit the nickname for the staff member from your letter.

Regardless of her attitude, noone will take a letter seriously where you resort to insulting a member of staff through name calling. There is no need.

cloud493

I'd agree with that. Name calling wont get you anywhere. Although I will add my business in chapters has decreased significantly recently.

Agent J

A Single thread on a single forum with people defending chapters itself doesn't really count as a bad reputation on the internet.

Naming calling & region snobbery is really unbecoming of a person & will get your complaint zero attention.

And the complaint is a bit silly really imho.

If they'd said they suspected the books were stolen you'd be up in arms at that.

hooplah

Agent J wrote: »

If they'd said they suspected the books were stolen you'd be up in arms at that.

Absolutely.

I have also bought what were obviously 'Advance reading copies' in the second hand setion before the books official release date so I'd imagine they would have no problem taking them if you had said you were a reviewer first.

From talking to people who work in bookshops there seems to be a fair amount of theft and attempted sales to other shops. It would seem good practice for Chapters to query sales that encourage theft from other bookshops.

CatFromHue

Desmond_T wrote: »

Here' a copy of a letter I have written to chapters, about my bad experience there last Friday (November 23rd, 2012):

To Whom It Concerns:

I wish to draw attention to your acceptance policy, and the implementation thereof, of secondhand books at your shop.

Last Friday (November 23rd) I went in to sell two hardback books for credit, in your upstairs department, and the woman behind the counter (whose name I did not ask for, but who I will hereinafter refer to as ‘Tweedy Bitch’, or TB for short), informed me: “These books are new, we only take secondhand books.” I was rather flummoxed at her logic, but managed to inquire: “I don’t understand: if I’ve owned them, then they are secondhand.” To which she replied, “No, I’m not taking them.”

So I make my way out, and it is only as I am halfway down the stairs that the penny drops: she thinks the books are stolen. I decide to go back to the counter to say my piece: “You think they’re stolen, don’t you?” To which Tweedy Bitch replies: “I didn’t say that.”

I then explain: “I’m a book reviewer, that’s where I get them from.” To which TB has the audacity to respond: “Why didn’t you say that?”, as though the onus is on me to prove the books were not stolen. So I retort: “You didn’t ask.”
This terminated our exchange, with no apology forthcoming.

The point is that TB presumed the books were stolen, yet would not give me an adequate explanation as to why she would not accept the books. Furthermore, she implied that it was up to me to prove the books are not stolen, even though I was completely unaware of her suspicions.

I am not accustomed to being treated like a common thief, nor as a receiver and seller of stolen goods. I have been reviewing books for nigh on twenty years, for a wide variety of Irish and international newspapers, magazines, and journals:

http://www.desmondtraynor.com/books.html

yet never before have I encountered such an obnoxious and condescending attitude in selling unwanted books, or books I have multiple copies of, which presumes an ulterior and illegal motive for selling newly or recently published books.

Suffice to say, I will not be buying or selling in Chapters ever again. My only regret is that I have done business there in the past, and spent money there (all of which seems to count for naught). In future, I will stick to favouring southside secondhand bookshops with my custom, such as The Secret Book and Record Shop, on Wicklow Street, with whom I enacted a much friendlier transaction later in the day, for the same books). A quick internet search shows that your (bad) reputation goes before you:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056533617

I will also be letting all my colleagues in the National Union of Journalists know about my negative and humiliating experience in chapters, which will hopefully do some more damage to your business, however slight.

Yours sincerely,

___________________
DESMOND TRAYNOR

You come out of this far worse then they do.

From your letter I fail to see how the staff were "obnoxious and condescending attitude" to you. It's your letter that is "obnoxious and condescending" if you ask me.

hyperborean

I have never had a bad experience in Chapters,


just say lioke,

dukedalton

Desmond_T wrote: »

I then explain: “I’m a book reviewer, that’s where I get them from.” To which TB has the audacity to respond: “Why didn’t you say that?”, as though the onus is on me to prove the books were not stolen.

With all due respect, if it's something you're trying to sell, the onus is on you to prove the goods are not stolen.

I don't think geographical snobbery or calling people names will get you anywhere either, to be honest.

Desmond_T

To dukedalton:

Indeed, I should have gone into the shop and said:

"Madam, I'd like to sell these books for credit. And by the way, they are NOT stolen."

The geographical snobbery and name-calling is intentionally offensive, in response to the offense caused to me.

Desmond_T

To hooplah:

They didn't query it. They presumed.

Desmond_T

cloud493 wrote: »

I'd agree with that. Name calling wont get you anywhere. Although I will add my business in chapters has decreased significantly recently.

Why is that, if I may ask?

Desmond_T

For your further delectation, if anyone is still interested, here is the response I got from manager Jarlath Gregory, and the comments I returned to him, in blue:

Dear Mr. Gregory,

Thank you for your reply to my complaint. Find my responses below.

Yours sincerely,

Desmond Traynor

From: Chapters Bookstore <ChaptersBookstore@chapters.ie>

Sent: Wednesday, 28 November 2012, 9:46:30
Subject: Second hand department

Dear Mr Traynor

Firstly, we are under no obligation to buy yours or anyone else's books at all, and each decision made in our second hand department as to which books to buy are made on a case by case basis.

Indeed you aren't. But your staff could still be civil to customers.

Secondly, at no point did my colleague suggest or imply that you had stolen anything.

Her "Why didn't you say that?" gives the lie to that assertion. As does, "These are new, we only take secondhand."

Thirdly, to refer to my colleague in such a sexist and derogatory way is unacceptable.

If the description used was offensive, that was my intention, in retaliation to the offense caused to me. Also, since when is it sexist to refer to a woman as a 'bitch'? Is it also, therefore, sexist to call a man a 'bastard'?

We trust this will be the end of the matter.

Indeed it will, as I will never darken your doors again.

Yours sincerely

Jarlath

Agent J

Desmond_T wrote: »

The geographical snobbery and name-calling is intentionally offensive, in response to the offense caused to me.

Wow. If a child did that they would be rightly repremanded. An Adult doing it is something else.

Remember it's your perception of such not objective fact & based on the handful of responses here few other see it your way.

Chapters response is bang on with it's response. My only minor quibble with it is that this

"Thirdly, to refer to my colleague in such a sexist and derogatory way is unacceptable. "

Should have been the first point & probably only point. You give your complaint zero creditablity when you resort to quite literally childish tactics of name calling however justified you think you might be.

You are digging yourself a bigger hole here. Take a step back & really look at this situation objectively. I strongly suggest you let it go.

dukedalton

Desmond_T wrote: »

To dukedalton:

Indeed, I should have gone into the shop and said:

"Madam, I'd like to sell these books for credit. And by the way, they are NOT stolen."

The geographical snobbery and name-calling is intentionally offensive, in response to the offense caused to me.

I find it best to not go around being intentionally offensive to people. Generally makes life a bit easier. And by being intentionally offensive, you have lost any moral high ground you might have had, and as a result got the polite PFO letter you quote above.

Andy-Pandy

I'm sure they are gutted you wont be back. Serious attitude there Desmond.

Desmond_T

cloud493 wrote: »

I'd agree with that. Name calling wont get you anywhere. Although I will add my business in chapters has decreased significantly recently.

Agent J wrote: »

Wow. If a child did that they would be rightly repremanded. An Adult doing it is something else.

Remember it's your perception of such not objective fact & based on the handful of responses here few other see it your way.

Chapters response is bang on with it's response. My only minor quibble with it is that this

"Thirdly, to refer to my colleague in such a sexist and derogatory way is unacceptable. "

Should have been the first point & probably only point. You give your complaint zero creditablity when you resort to quite literally childish tactics of name calling however justified you think you might be.

You are digging yourself a bigger hole here. Take a step back & really look at this situation objectively. I strongly suggest you let it go.

I have.

ixoy

Desmond_T wrote: »

I have.

Well, by providing the link to this thread in your mail, you at least will let Chapters see all these negative responses to your letter. You must really believe it's a well written piece, and that everyone else's opinion on it is unfounded, in that case.

Desmond_T

ixoy wrote: »

Well, by providing the link to this thread in your mail, you at least will let Chapters see all these negative responses to your letter. You must really believe it's a well written piece, and that everyone else's opinion on it is unfounded, in that case.

I have nothing to hide.

cloud493

But you weren't going to get anywhere with that attitude. My reason for not shopping there anymore is like you, I have received extreme amounts of discourtesy from their employees, so I go on amazon for my books now. Still not the right way to protest it.

Desmond_T

cloud493 wrote: »

But you weren't going to get anywhere with that attitude. My reason for not shopping there anymore is like you, I have received extreme amounts of discourtesy from their employees, so I go on amazon for my books now. Still not the right way to protest it.

So, how do suggest I protest it? Like you, I am protesting with my feet. I am just drawing attention to the fact, beforehand. What's the right way to go about it, in your opinion? You are not protesting it at all, except with your buying power. Ultimately, I don't care that much. I'm just letting other people know what they're like...I guess in the vague hope that they won't shop there either.

cloud493

With buying power. Simple as. If they piss enough people off, they'll be their own downfall.

Desmond_T

cloud493 wrote: »

With buying power. Simple as. If they piss enough people off, they'll be their own downfall.

Cool. So let other people know that they are pissing you off.

cloud493

I am. I'm posting about it here

BostonB

I assume they make a judgement call on the person and/or the books. I expect they can't win though, some people will be offended if they tell them directly, that they/and their books are suspicions, or they simply turn them away with some other reason, as in this case.

Desmond_T

cloud493 wrote: »

I am. I'm posting about it here

Only after my more extreme response encouraged you to do so. Looks like my more extreme reaction was the right way to go about it.

Desmond_T

BostonB wrote: »

I assume they make a judgement call on the person and/or the books. I expect they can't win though, some people will be offended if they tell them directly, that they/and their books are suspicions, or they simply turn them away with some other reason, as in this case.

??? The human touch?

Desmond_T

BostonB wrote: »

I assume they make a judgement call on the person and/or the books. I expect they can't win though, some people will be offended if they tell them directly, that they/and their books are suspicions, or they simply turn them away with some other reason, as in this case.

Guess I don't like being grouped as one of those punters they arbitrarily classify as 'suspicious'.

cloud493

Desmond_T wrote: »

Only after my more extreme response encouraged you to do so. Looks like my more extreme reaction was the right way to go about it.

Not at all. If you go back a few pages, before you posted, I'd already said something

Toby Take a Bow

Desmond_T wrote: »

I will hereinafter refer to as ‘Tweedy Bitch’, or TB for short)

You sound like a child, and Chapters' response to your email was spot on (and this is sad to say, as I've had many a bad experience in Chapters). I can't believe you make a living from reviewing books given your lazy way with words.

Desmond_T wrote: »

I will stick to favouring southside secondhand bookshops with my custom, such as The Secret Book and Record Shop, on Wicklow Street, with whom I enacted a much friendlier transaction later in the day, for the same books).

And snobbery. I'm surprised that you would put your name to the letter, as it shows you in a really, really bad light.

I'd also say (not naming names, of course) that, during my bookselling days, if a particular bunch of books went 'missing' in the bookshop that I worked, I could nearly always be certain that they'd end up in a certain south-side second hand bookshop. So maybe Chapters were right to be suspicious of someone wanting to sell brand-new books in perfect condition.

ixoy

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

And snobbery. I'm surprised that you would put your name to the letter, as it shows you in a really, really bad light.

Poor form to also include the name of the manager who responded to you as well. He's a nice chap too (I know him and no, he's not the person everyone else is talking about in this thread) - shows far more courtesy than you've afforded the staff to be honest.

Trisha XxX

Okocim wrote: »

I am all for seeing as many good second hand bookstores and 2nd hand music shops as possible but based on personal experience I would advise avoidng Chapters on Parnell Street like the plague. Real rip off merchants if you ever go in to trade in DVD's, CD's or books. The staff are very condescending and have a ''superior'' attitude problem. Very poor cash exchange rates for books and CD's and misleading and inaccurate and contradictory quotes given. Was quoted a cash exchange figure which was less for combined CD and books then if the two were brought in seperately!! ie the total cash exchange amount i would have received would have been more if I had brought the books in on one day seperately and the CD'S in the next day...the excuse was ''we can only use one receipt docket'' shady practices at work. I'd rather give them away for free to a charity shop then be treated with contempt like that. Will never go into Chapters again. At least Dick Turpin wore a mask!!!

Personally I love Chapters, I think their selection of both new and second hand books are amazing, I never thought the prices were bad. But I never traded anything their so i wouldnt know about that, and I agree with the comment about the staff not overly enthusiastic or friendly.

Grievous

Why are people ganging up on Desmond T? The Thread is about someone's bad experience at Chapters and he also had a bad experience.

Also, I'v spoke to people who have worked there before and who currently work there and they do NOT have glowing reviews for the we-won't-say-his-name manager who works on the help-desk downstairs.

I have witnessed his tone and snobbishness with my own eyes. The worst was seeing some man falsely accused of stealing from the shop and being made an absolute show of in front of lots of people. Oh yeah, turned out the guy did not steal anything.

Still, the second hand prices on the books upstairs are reasonable. I'm sure Desmond's letter has elements of transference in it due to his suspect treatment in the shop.

The buying/selling department upstairs is just not consistent. I tried to sell some books to one seller and they rejected half of them, I came back 2 hours later when I knew a different buyer would be on the till and I presented the same books and he bought them. It's not cool carrying a heavy bag of second hand books around town trying to sell them with no chance of making any money on them.

BostonB

Desmond_T wrote: »

??? The human touch?

Desmond_T wrote: »

Guess I don't like being grouped as one of those punters they arbitrarily classify as 'suspicious'.

The human touch isn't name calling, then posting it on the internet, the people readily identified. Simply because you don't like a stores policy.

BostonB

Grievous wrote: »

Why are people ganging up on Desmond T? The Thread is about someone's bad experience at Chapters and he also had a bad experience....

Its not "ganging up" its simply a number of people disagree with him.

cloud493

I don't think anyones ganging up, its been agreed he has some valid points.The way he presented those points however, wasn't going to get him anywhere.

Grievous

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

You sound like a child, and Chapters' response to your email was spot on (and this is sad to say, as I've had many a bad experience in Chapters). I can't believe you make a living from reviewing books given your lazy way with words.


And snobbery.

Is this not name-calling, or ganging up?