New traffic calming at junction King's Inns Street with Bolton Street

AlekSmart

BostonB wrote: »

I asked a simple question are their any metrics for the placement of these things. The answer seems to be no. It done on best guess. Personally thats too woolly for the money being spent.

Then there that PR wet dream of a document like that. Which is very short on data, and long on blather. There seems to be a disconnect between the aspirational objectives, and the execution of them.

Classic example is the dire cycle lane infrastructure which seems to have no input from anyone with any experience of cycling requirements or common sense for that matter. Or how awkward it can be to cycle the main routes through and around the city. With bus only and tram only lanes forcing circular routes on cyclists.

+1 BostonB.

As a Bus Driver all,not some,but ALL of my business is with the kerb,yet virtually the entirety of Dublin's cycling provision entails placing cyclists between my vehicle and this kerb.

Even in locations where it is patently obvious that safer alternatives exist,the planners persist with the dangerous nonsense that large vehicles of up to 18 tonnes in weight and up to 12 metre's long can somehow safely mix-it with cyclists.

If anybody has the stamina,go take a peep at the outbound stop/shelter opposite the Goat Pub in Goatstown (11 Route,Stop 3018).

Here we have the cycle lane deliberately placed between the Bus and Kerb/Shelter,whilst ample space exists to allow the cyclist to transit BEHIND a repositioned Shelter and it's occupants to connect with the segrated cycle lane which carries on from that point.

It's only a single example where if there had been any meaningful interaction between Bus Driver and Planner we might have had a reality check which could have emiminated yet another point of conflict.

It would appear that the Self-Regard of these Planning Professionals is of such import that no dealings with the great-unwashed can be contemplated.

galwaycyclist

BostonB wrote: »

I asked a simple question are their any metrics for the placement of these things. The answer seems to be no. It done on best guess. Personally thats too woolly for the money being spent.

I am not offering this comment in defence of the specific installation above.

Historically the system was arguably the same as the system the Garda have for deciding they might enforce the speed limits. Its called the "somebody has to die first" principle. It goes like this "Unless people are actually getting killed then there is no need to make the roads safer".

It is this system that has contributed to roads that are inherently hostile for cyclists and pedestrians. It has lead directly to the "creation" of unecessary traffic because, to give one example, parents feel obliged to drive their childen everywhere. It is this system that is responsible, in part, for the length of time people find themselves stuck in traffic every morning.

There is also another system which is "we will only do these things at places where it wont affect traffic flow". This system has the same effect cited above.

In such circumstances I find "best guess" a much more attractive system for placement - its the designs I tend to have a problem with.

BostonB

Well its the same problem with the speed limits. They do it on safe roads. Leaving people to speed on the dangerous ones. Its just easier to catch people on the easier roads. This would be fine if they did enough to change the culture of dangerous driving. But they don't do it enough to change the culture. So with limited resources, they should target the most critical (dangerous) roads first. But they don't. Ultimately there should be figures to prove that something works. Less accidents less severe accidents. And the figure should not be confused by other issues, cars are safer, or the newer roads are safer etc.

Like wise with these calming features. Fair enough if they saturate the place enough to change the culture. Perhaps they are having that effect and I'm just not aware of it. But what I do see is they put in badly designed features which make the problem worse, or in quiet locations where its not needed. Leaving lots of much busier major junctions alone.My cycle route to and from work hasn't improved one bit since I started a few years back. It might even be worse because they made some roads bus only.

Having said that this specific feature is for pedestrians primarily. Which is fine. I haven't been watching if its consistent with other just pedestrian installations.