Is Sinn Fein a Cult?

Gee Bag

Of course people should be remembered, but what other political party goes on and on and on about it? Everyone remembers it, only one party hijacks it emotionally for political gain.

Moreover, I don't think suicide should be admired.

Other than the IRSP I don't remember any other political party being activley involved in the hunger strike.

MisterEpicurus

Gee Bag wrote: »

Other than the IRSP I don't remember any other political party being activley involved in the hunger strike.

That's irrelevant, everyone can relate to a movement and figures such as himself given the importance of such an issue. Either way, I think its disgusting, and I repeat, I don't think anyone should admire suicide.

You can dress this suicide in political clothing all you want, but its essentially some fanatic killing himself for seemingly little reason. Even if it DID cause his dreams to come true, I still would never celebrate the suicide of another individual, or indeed celebrate it as a recommended form for sending a political message.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

That's irrelevant, .........

Nol, its entirely relevant. FG hold the various Michael Collins commemorations, FF, FG and SF go to Bodenstown yearly.

Zebra3

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

It's fairly common to hear criticisms of FF and FG and so forth, but I think the worst members of the Dail are actually Sinn Fein. I usually refer to them as 'The Cult of Sinn Fein'

Let's not forget how FF/FG (two sides of the same coin) handed huge powers within the state to the cult that is the Roman Catholic Church who preceeded to allow its members to rape and torture young children.

Even Ahern boasted about consulting the RC hierarchy and was happy enough to give them a bailout from the taxpayer for their crimes.

So you failed miserably with your attack on SF.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

- Methods of Psychological Manipulation for Joining: Well advertised, I don't need to expound further.

Yes, you do.

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

- Leaving: Usually members will never leave due to this psychological conditioning. And from my experience, they have a tendency to doubt the crimes of other Socialists or Communists. For example, I once heard that Stalin didn't really kill all those people, the figures are 'grossly exaggerated'. But this logic never seems to apply to anyone outside Socialism and Communism..

Anecdotes eh? Very convincing.

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

The manipulation of people pretending they are acting for the minorities in the country, the continued lies and lies...everything about it. ..

Vague guff.

MisterEpicurus

Nodin wrote: »

Nol, its entirely relevant. FG hold the various Michael Collins commemorations, FF, FG and SF go to Bodenstown yearly.

How can you possibly compare, without embarrassment, Michael Collins and a fanatic like Bobby 'Shifting' Sands?

How did Michael Collins suicide? What were the situations which led to Collins doing what he did, admirably in my opinion. I'm no pacifist by the way.

Exactly why the actions of, (and I reinforce the sentiment) the admiration of an individual who decided to suicide. 'Soldiers' (however defined) don't decide to suicide, they fight. The lazy and selfish thing to do is to say, "Ya, can't do it, so why not kill myself", horrendous at the very least. He should be remembered, but he's idolized almost. His action should be considered morally reprehensible.

Michael Collins is not even in the same league. It's like comparing the Premier League to a relegated team never to appear again.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

How can you possibly compare, without embarrassment, Michael Collins and a (......)like comparing the Premier League to a relegated team never to appear again.

You aren't very subtle, you know.

Gee Bag

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

That's irrelevant, everyone can relate to a movement and figures such as himself given the importance of such an issue. Either way, I think its disgusting, and I repeat, I don't think anyone should admire suicide.

You can dress this suicide in political clothing all you want, but its essentially some fanatic killing himself for seemingly little reason. Even if it DID cause his dreams to come true, I still would never celebrate the suicide of another individual, or indeed celebrate it as a recommended form for sending a political message.

The hunger strikes are commemerated by the two political parties whose members participated and died. How the hell is that irrelevent?

Do you not think it might look a bit silly if FF, FG, Labour etc all jumped on the commemeration band wagon.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on your opinions re. suicide

MisterEpicurus

Zebra3 wrote: »

Let's not forget how FF/FG (two sides of the same coin) handed huge powers within the state to the cult that is the Roman Catholic Church who preceeded to allow its members to rape and torture young children.

Even Ahern boasted about consulting the RC hierarchy and was happy enough to give them a bailout from the taxpayer for their crimes.

So you failed miserably with your attack on SF.

You've no idea how critical I am of that...but this thread is focussed on the cult of SF.

Zebra3

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

How can you possibly compare, without embarrassment, Michael Collins and a fanatic like Bobby 'Shifting' Sands?

Exactly.

Collins sold out to the Brits (typical Corkie).

Sands didn't.

MisterEpicurus

Zebra3 wrote: »

Exactly.

Collins sold out to the Brits (typical Corkie).

Sands didn't.

Well that comment doesn't even merit an extensive reply

0066ad

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

That's irrelevant, everyone can relate to a movement and figures such as himself given the importance of such an issue. Either way, I think its disgusting, and I repeat, I don't think anyone should admire suicide.

You can dress this suicide in political clothing all you want, but its essentially some fanatic killing himself for seemingly little reason. Even if it DID cause his dreams to come true, I still would never celebrate the suicide of another individual, or indeed celebrate it as a recommended form for sending a political message.

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

You've no idea how critical I am of that...but this thread is focussed on the cult of SF.

It's focused on your opinion SF is a cult. Calling his death suicide, shame on you.

Brain Stroking

Sinn Fein are not a cult but are completely repugnant.

No suprises to see who on this thread are defending them

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Well that comment doesn't even merit an extensive reply

I'm fairly sure this one does, however.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76839486&postcount=56

Zebra3

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

You've no idea how critical I am of that...but this thread is focussed on the cult of SF.

Well, if SF is a cult (which let's face it, it isn't), it's nowhere near the cult of FF/FG and its decades long unwavering support for the child rapists of the Roman Catholic Church .

DB10

Does the OP believe he is turning people against SF.

He is not very good at doing so.

MisterEpicurus

Nodin wrote: »

I'm fairly sure this one does, however.
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=76839486&postcount=56

Na, the seeds of the thread were sewn a long time ago and since it has germinated discussion. Anyhow, one-word answers, designed to get people to 'Thank' his post (which is typical of AH), don't deserve a comprehensive reply. If he makes no effort, I certainly won't. Anyhow, I'm not looking for 'Thanks', and don't care if what I'm saying is against the status quo of the After Hours political opinion.

MisterEpicurus

DB10 wrote: »

Does the OP believe he is turning people against SF.

Not trying really, barely even attempting

MisterEpicurus

0066ad wrote: »

Calling his death suicide, shame on you.

No, shame on you for getting some sort of politically-derived erection from the suicide of another person.

K-9

Nodin wrote: »

..despite being left wing, anti-racist, pro-gay marriage.

Speaking to SF supporters here, many would be like that and actually read the policies, a chunk of the older voters think SF means a United Ireland, stricter immigration laws, less hand outs, black taxi drivers, that type of thing!

Can't really fault SF on it, FF and FG have their extreme element too.

DB10

Lets be honest the thread is pointless, you could just as easily say the same about Fianna Gael or Fianna Fail?

I suspect though you are very happy with these parties.

DB10

K-9 wrote: »

Speaking to SF supporters here, many would be like that and actually read the policies, a chunk of the older voters think SF means a United Ireland, stricter immigration laws, less hand outs, black taxi drivers, that type of thing!

Can't really fault SF on it, FF and FG have their extreme element too.

As far as I'm aware SF are not in favour of anything stricter on immigration, if anything more leniency ?

Although that doesn't seem to be anything different from any other party.

MisterEpicurus

DB10 wrote: »

Lets be honest the thread is pointless, you could just as easily say the same about Fianna Gael or Fianna Fail?

I suspect though you are very happy with these parties.

I've explicitly stated at least twice that FF/FG are disgusting in their own ways. As somebody else stated; two sides of the same coin.

In comparison, FF/FG is bacterial, SF are viral.

Zebra3

K-9 wrote: »

Can't really fault SF on it, FF and FG have their extreme element too.

All of FF/FG are extemists.

They have all heartily endosed shifting private debt onto the taxpayer.

Gee Bag

DB10 wrote: »

Does the OP believe he is turning people against SF.

He is not very good at doing so.

Very true. Firstly, I can't stand the Shinners.

The OP started with a daft theory (trolling attempt?) about SF being a cult, then meanders all over the place with his argument by using vague "sure, we all know......." comments rather than addressing points being raised.

Badgermonkey

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

In comparison, FF/FG is bacterial, SF are viral.

Oh Christ, I hope the PD's aren't latent.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Na, the seeds of the thread were sewn a long time ago and since it has germinated discussion. Anyhow, one-word answers, designed to get people to 'Thank' his post (which is typical of AH), don't deserve a comprehensive reply. If he makes no effort, I certainly won't. Anyhow, I'm not looking for 'Thanks', and don't care if what I'm saying is against the status quo of the After Hours political opinion.

So, you are just looking for attention and your OP is flame bait, of no substance.

MisterEpicurus

Gee Bag wrote: »

Very true. Firstly, I can't stand the Shinners.

The OP started with a daft theory (trolling attempt?) about SF being a cult, then meanders all over the place with his argument by using vague "sure, we all know......." comments rather than addressing points being raised.

Look, Sinn Fein obviously isn't a cult, I just think they exhibit properties of a cult, undesirable properties.

I've already attacked the idea that the death of Bobby Sands is simply using the threat of suicide. Not only does this insult people who are contemplating it, but it's disgusting in and of itself. To be hijacked by SF reveals the moral compass they use, probably purchased from a Soviet shop.

I've also said I do not support FF/FG etc. I recognize their links with violence in the past and abhor that as well, as well as the economic assisted suicide they participated in.

I've countered many other ideas, to say I didn't is silly. Ask anything, I'll answer it, pretty hard to go around everything.

My analogy at the start is that, only an analogy. Somewhat accurate, but that's about it.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Look, Sinn Fein obviously isn't a cult,
.

Yep.

MisterEpicurus

Nodin wrote: »

Yep.

But as I said, exhibit undesirable properties of a cult.

Chuck Stone

It actually might have made a good thread if it hadn't been so blatantly partisan (rather, politically neutral) and the language had been toned down.

I think being politically indoctrinated, especially as a child, is an interesting discussion point and might make a good thread in the humanities (?) forum.

Alas, you fucked it up OP.. royally.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

But as I said, exhibit undesirable properties of a cult.

...if you use broad definitions and ignore specific contradictory facts. You can also apply that to any number of political parties in a number of different countries. That's because its a set of parameters set so loose as to have no meaning, backed up by anecdotal guff.

Zebra3

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Is Sinn Fein a Cult?

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Look, Sinn Fein obviously isn't a cult

Chuck Stone

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

I'll be shocked if anyone actually 'Thanks' that.

El Weirdo wrote: »

How does it feel to be tazered?

Lol, classic.

MisterEpicurus

Zebra3 wrote: »

Well the thread title is just for provocative purposes, an entrance description.

When I say they 'are not a cult', I essentially mean 'not considered or titled one by society'...

While accepting that, I find their innate nature 'cultish' and slightly freaky especially on international affairs and history.

SafeSurfer

Well using your Wiki criteria for definition.

Most politicians are sociopaths.

Sociopathy

It is characterized by at least 3 of the following:

Callous unconcern for the feelings of others

Gross and persistent attitude of irresponsibility and disregard for social norms, rules, and obligations.

Incapacity to maintain enduring relationships, though having no difficulty in establishing them

Very low tolerance to frustration and a low threshold for discharge of aggression, including violence.

Incapacity to experience guilt or to profit from experience, particularly punishment.

Markedly prone to blame others or to offer plausible rationalizations for the behavior that has brought the person into conflict with society

Other Defining Characteristics


Sense of entitlement;

Unremorseful;

Apathetic to others;

Unconscionable behavior;

Blameful of others;

Manipulative and conning;

Affectively cold;

Disparate understanding;

Socially irresponsible;

Disregardful of obligations;

Nonconforming to norms;

Irresponsible

Gee Bag

Look, Sinn Fein obviously isn't a cult, I just think they exhibit properties of a cult, undesirable properties.

Lads who follow Man Utd or Munster exhibit cult like behaviour. If the definition of 'cult like behaviour' is going to be applied this loosley then you could probably fit most of the human race in.

I've already attacked the idea that the death of Bobby Sands is simply using the threat of suicide. Not only does this insult people who are contemplating it, but it's disgusting in and of itself. To be hijacked by SF reveals the moral compass they use, probably purchased from a Soviet shop.

I have no idea how Bobby Sands deat is an insult to people contemplating suicide

What on earth is a soviet moral compass????

MisterEpicurus

Gee Bag wrote: »

What on earth is a soviet moral compass????

Well, if you take the Soviet example for how to treat people morally, it somewhat aligns with SF, so the metaphorical example of this 'compass' holds true in some respects. Scary, but true.

K-9

DB10 wrote: »

As far as I'm aware SF are not in favour of anything stricter on immigration, if anything more leniency ?

Although that doesn't seem to be anything different from any other party.

That's is why I posted what I did., they are lenient on immigration.

Zebra3 wrote: »

All of FF/FG are extemists.

They have all heartily endosed shifting private debt onto the taxpayer.

Sf will change all that of course. Big changes in the North too!

20 years time they'll be the new FF.

Chuck Stone

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Well using your Wiki criteria for definition.

Most politicians are sociopaths.

I'd be sympathetic to that idea.

Nodin

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Well the thread title is just for provocative purposes, .........

No!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MisterEpicurus

Can you not just agree with me and we can all be friends? ;-)

SafeSurfer

MisterEpicurus
Would you consider the Orange Order to be a cult?

MisterEpicurus

SafeSurfer wrote: »

MisterEpicurus
Would you consider the Orange Order to be a cult?

Yes...

In fact, deliberately provocative of SF and Catholics

Chuck Stone

SafeSurfer wrote: »

MisterEpicurus
Would you consider the Orange Order to be a cult?

I watched a progammmmmmeeeeee on TV and it was about the women's O.O. and it all seemed a bit cultish actually.

Loads of strange little rituals and stuff. Was interesting though.

K-9

Chuck Stone wrote: »

I watched a progammmmmmeeeeee on TV and it was about the women's O.O. and it all seemed a bit cultish actually.

Loads of strange little rituals and stuff. Was interesting though.

Protestant girls in a cult, sounds interesting in a Meaning of Life Way!

MisterEpicurus

We're all in a cult ;-)

Zebra3

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Well the thread title is just for provocative purposes, an entrance description.

Troll fail.

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

Well, if you take the Soviet example for how to treat people morally, it somewhat aligns with SF, so the metaphorical example of this 'compass' holds true in some respects. Scary, but true.

And no doubt aligns with FF/FG whom all have their snouts in the trough for themselves and their mates with their overpaid jobs and fat pensions while people die on trolleys in the corridors of hospitals.

saywhatyousee

MisterEpicurus wrote: »

We're all in a cult ;-)

True that!! I was born a snake handler and ill die a snake handler!!

Fratton Fred

I would have thought Borg would be a better description than Cult.