This type of Installer will destroy the Aerial business

Peter Rhea

Is there any other location available on the property for that dish where the signal isn't actually blocked by a tree?

Nothing wrong with using a bit of ingenuity as long as the dish is mounted on a part of the tree that doesn't move in the wind.

Ronnie Raygun

Look at the cables though & I dread to think how they're routed to the house.

Peter Rhea

It's a balls of a job, my post was tongue-in-cheek, see how it echoes this entry in the ATV Cowboys' Locker.

Cesium Clock

spotted in Wicklow,
tree.jpg

St Senan

Spotted this in Gorey a while back

Cesium Clock

scaller wrote: »

Spotted this in Gorey a while back

where H becomes V and V becomes H

Cantona's Collars

scaller wrote: »

Spotted this in Gorey a while back

Think I saw that myself.Why oh why do installers have the bar facing upwards? It lets rain in to corrode the inside plus if they can't be bothered to tighten everything properly it ends up like what's in Scallers pics.At least it wasn't screwed into the fascia:pac:

Cesium Clock

zerks wrote: »

Think I saw that myself.Why oh why do installers have the bar facing upwards? It lets rain in to corrode the inside plus if they can't be bothered to tighten everything properly it ends up like what's in Scallers pics.At least it wasn't screwed into the fascia:pac:

its an installer who has been 'teached' by an installer who 'learn't' it himself, and the plague spreads.

scruffy66

Cesium Clock wrote: »

spotted in Wicklow,
tree.jpg

You have to hand it to this guy, necessity is the mother of all invention.

Good diy, he'll be up and down that tree on a regular basis thou.

watty

He needs stay wires.

Cantona's Collars

watty wrote: »

He needs stay wires.

Or a chainsaw.

aerial man

scaller wrote: »

Spotted this in Gorey a while back

I showed this to the father one day and he got a right laugh out of it. its sorted now.

It cant beat the sky dish that was mounted on an older analog dish down past tescos! Have you still got that photo scaller?

St Senan

aerial man wrote: »

I showed this to the father one day and he got a right laugh out of it. its sorted now.

It cant beat the sky dish that was mounted on an older analog dish down past tescos! Have you still got that photo scaller?

Yep it's here on this post http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=51100871&postcount=1

St Senan

Last year I priced these 3 Jobs. I was in that Park today and as you all can see the people got the Jobs done CHEAPER :eek::eek::eek::eek:

PogMoThoin

I've also been making a collection.

Here are some I collected in the last month. All by the same cheap bastard (who has a TV shop on the main street in a nearby town). I wouldn't mind his prices are ridiculously expensive, the least he could do is use proper f joiners and splitters. I showed the pics to the customers involved and they all insisted he was the only one ever did their TV work and the only one ever in the attics of these houses, all 3 were pensioners and 2 of the houses were bungalows in elderly housing schemes.

Sorry about the lighting, its a phone camera with no flash taking pics under head torch light.

IMG_20120224_103732.jpg

IMG_20120315_121326.jpg

IMG_20120316_132158.jpg

Digitaltv

How can anyone let cowboys drill/screw into there mobile home/caravan.
I would love to see the green mould inside after a few months.

Tony

Digitaltv wrote: »

How can anyone let cowboys drill/screw into there mobile home/caravan.
.

Ok lets not insult Cowboys

Extinction

Does anyone expect things to get any better? Its six months to switch over and there hasn't even been a decent advertising campaign yet and there is no real value put on installers by our national broadcaster. Saorview recognise the trade bodies but for some strange reason the installers who have shown themselves to be honest and professional can't be approved to sell the saorview boxes they have to provide as part of their buisness. The black market work in aerial installations is huge yet every registered installer I know is seeing very little work. Can someone tell me what advantage there is to being a member of any of the three trade bodies when the cowboy installers are getting away with poor workmanship?

Tony

Well you cannot really force customers to go with any particular installer however if you are a member of a trade body so are at least showing a commitment to uphold a certain level of quality so customers can make an informed choice .

Its just unfortunate that many people go with the cheapest initial price with no regard to workmanship which usually ends up costing much more in the long term when the job has to be put right.

What you have to do is demonstrate the benefits of going with an installer that has a solid reputation.

byte

scaller wrote: »

Last year I priced these 3 Jobs. I was in that Park today and as you all can see the people got the Jobs done CHEAPER :eek::eek::eek::eek:

Jesus Christ! :eek:

PressTheButton

Showing total disregard for health & safety, this guy even forgot to bring the aerial with him:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9EICyaEJq0&list=UUCtG6glU2Mzlcyit6j61gIg&index=1&feature=plcp :eek:

St Senan

I just spotted this last week.

Sorry for quality of the picture it was taken 50kmh.

Anyhow the group B is under the dish and pointing directly into the roof.:eek::eek:

What sort of installer would put this over some ones front door. :eek::eek:

byte

scaller wrote: »

I just spotted this last week.

Sorry for quality of the picture it was taken 50kmh.

Anyhow the group B is under the dish and pointing directly into the roof.:eek::eek:

What sort of installer would put this over some ones front door. :eek::eek:

That is one monumental f***-up of an install! That also looks like one of those rather light and bendy/flimsy 1.5" cranked mast welded to one section of a T&K. If it is, there isn't a hope it'll last long. Sneezing near it would probably sway it, causing breakup on satellite!

St Senan

The Guy who put this on that persons chimney can not call himself an Aerial rigger or Installer. This has all been predicted since before last May and its only going to get worse before ASO. Its guys like this that is going to ruin this business.

s_gr

scaller wrote: »

The Guy who put this on that persons chimney can not call himself an Aerial rigger or Installer. This has all been predicted since before last May and its only going to get worse before ASO. Its guys like this that is going to ruin this business.

I dont mean to be smart but i cant see the issue with the last photo if the signal is up to spec then what is the problem? No need to install 10ft pole if not needed i would reckon?

Tony

s_gr wrote: »

I dont mean to be smart but i cant see the issue with the last photo if the signal is up to spec then what is the problem? No need to install 10ft pole if not needed i would reckon?

It looks like its been drilled on to the chimney instead of a lashing kit (which the dish seems to have) and it should be facing downwards , if the top of the bracket gets water ingress it will eventually rust and break at the elbow. Its also more stable when mounted facing down.

s_gr

Tony wrote: »

It looks like its been drilled on to the chimney instead of a lashing kit (which the dish seems to have) and it should be facing downwards , if the top of the bracket gets water ingress it will eventually rust and break at the elbow. Its also more stable when mounted facing down.

Well the same could be said for loads dishes fitted to date by both sky and independents judging by whats on view everyday.

St Senan

The guy who installed that probably made a big deal out of putting that up as Tony has said he drilled four 10 or 12 mm holes into the face of the chimney he has the used a Dish mounting bracket upside down to mount the aerial on
(WATER and RUST) http://images.esellerpro.com/2237/I/300/8/SK47-4.jpg Anyhow it would have made more sense to mount that in the attic less than 2 feet below it.

Tony

s_gr wrote: »

Well the same could be said for loads dishes fitted to date by both sky and independents judging by whats on view everyday.

Indeed yes

NewHillel

scaller wrote: »

The guy who installed that probably made a big deal out of putting that up

Have you anything to justify that comment?

scaller wrote: »

as Tony has said he drilled four 10 or 12 mm holes into the face of the chimney

Did he damage the flue, or otherwise impact the structure of the chimney?

scaller wrote: »

he has the used a Dish mounting bracket

So? It's a nice neat solution.

scaller wrote: »

...Dish mounting bracket upside down to mount the aerial on

Common practice, unfortunately.

scaller wrote: »

Anyhow it would have made more sense to mount that in the attic less than 2 feet below it.

Why?
(If this is to avoid drilling holes for coax cable through external walls, then I agree 100%. However this approach does increase installation costs and some installers are unwilling/unable to route cables internally.)

Tony

Whether he did or not is irrelevant, its bad practice, especially in this case where it looks like a lashing kit is already in place.

NewHillel wrote: »

Did he damage the flue, or otherwise impact the structure of the chimney?

Cantona's Collars

@Newhillel, tell all that about incorrect chimney mounts to the person that got that aerial put up when the whole lot falls down.I've seen an eejit attempting to drill into a chimney that was fibreglass,how did he think the bolts were going to hold?

It's the "ah sure,it'll do" attitude that these guys have towards installs and complete lack of professionalism or pride in their work is the problem and your defending it doesn't help matters.

NewHillel

zerks wrote: »

@Newhillel, tell all that about incorrect chimney mounts to the person that got that aerial put up when the whole lot falls down.I've seen an eejit attempting to drill into a chimney that was fibreglass,how did he think the bolts were going to hold?

It's the "ah sure,it'll do" attitude that these guys have towards installs and complete lack of professionalism or pride in their work is the problem and your defending it doesn't help matters.

I am not defending bad practice.

However, ...

1. This installation was singled out as a particularly bad practice. I have seen much worse, undertaken by well known companies.

2. There is nothing inherently wrong in drilling a chimney. It depends on whether the chimney can support the load (including wind loading) and whether it is possible to safely drill without damaging the structure, or the flue. (Of course there are many chimneys that shouldn't be drilled under any circumstances...)

3. Times are tough, for many people, right now. That is not sufficient to start a witch hunt, without very strong justification. If I were the installer in question my solicitor would be writing to Boards.ie.

NewHillel

Tony wrote: »

Whether he did or not is irrelevant, its bad practice

Reference?
(While civil engineering is not my speciality, I cannot see any engineering justification for that position.)

Tony wrote: »

especially in this case where it looks like a lashing kit is already in place.

Why is that relevant?

Tony

NewHillel wrote: »

Reference?
(While civil engineering is not my speciality, I cannot see any engineering justification for that position.)

CAI code of practice and in 18 years of experience I have seen many chimneys damaged this way.

NewHillel wrote: »

Why is that relevant?

Very obviously because it could have been used by the addition of another cradle bracket . Forgive my bluntness but I don't see the point of debating this further with you as it seems you are hell bent on defending what is clearly a badly thought out and executed install.

jeckle

Has it been established that the installation was carried out by an ''installer''? It could well have been a DIY job done by the houseowner, in which case he might not call himself an installer at all.

Maybe the thread should be renamed to something like ''how NOT to mount an ariel''

St Senan

Its not a DIY Job the Installation was done by a guy who Advertise himself as an Installer on flyers stuck up in the local shop near that house and is calling himself a Saorview installer. There are a few more Aerials mounted on Sky dish brackets in the same Area done by him. the Next time i am in the Area I will take more pics.

NewHillel

scaller wrote: »

Its not a DIY Job the Installation was done by a guy who Advertise himself as an Installer on flyers stuck up in the local shop near that house and is calling himself a Saorview installer. There are a few more Aerials mounted on Sky dish brackets in the same Area done by him. the Next time i am in the Area I will take more pics.

So, you have a vested interest in undermining a competitor. I would reasonably have expected that you would have stated this.

Care to answer the questions I raised?

Tony

NewHillel wrote: »

So, you have a vested interest in undermining a competitor.

Thats an outragoeus comment to make you should consider withdrawing it.

NewHillel

Tony wrote: »

CAI code of practice and in 18 years of experience I have seen many chimneys damaged this way.

From my very limited visibility of its work, I have immense admiration for the expertise of the CAI and its general approach. I am not a member, and do not have access to its current installation code. I can understand why they would discourage drilling a chimney, as the potential to do serious damage is very substantial. On that same basis, I would not recommend anyone to drill a chimney.

However, we are not talking generalities,in this instance - we are talking about a very specific installation. In this instance it is the responsibility of the OP to illustrate why in this very particular case it is a bad installation - hence my posts. I am neither defending it, nor supporting it. I am correctly pointing out that, of itself, drilling a chimney is not necessary a bad installation.

I am frankly appalled that Boards.ie allow continuous posts attacking clearly identifiable companies where there is obvious, if often hidden, vested interests involved.

Tony

NewHillel wrote: »

I am frankly appalled that Boards.ie allow continuous posts attacking clearly identifiable companies where there is obvious, if often hidden, vested interests involved.

Sorry but it seems to me that this is nothing short of trolling.

Digitaltv

newhillel are you in the aerial satellite business ? as you seem to know it all, you always seem to be cutting down installers, and the information they post on this forum.

Cesium Clock

NewHillel wrote: »

However, we are not talking generalities,in this instance - we are talking about a very specific installation. In this instance it is the responsibility of the OP to illustrate why in this very particular case it is a bad installation - hence my posts. I am neither defending it, nor supporting it. I am correctly pointing out that, of itself, drilling a chimney is not necessary a bad installation.

.

drilling a chimney is a complete no no, apart from the health and safety aspects of using a drill on a roof, the vibrations from a drill can cause damage that may not be apparent immediatley but may cause serious structural faults in the future.

as it has been pionted out in many posts its a bad install.

sky dish bracket. for use with a sky dish on a wall.
lashing kit, for use on chimneys.

the sky bracket is upside down, water will settle at the bend, rust then failure.
water will run thru the bracket and stain the chimney on exit.

the picture relates to the title of the thread.

hope this clears things up for you.

MiCr0

Any one who starts sniping at other users is going to get banned.
This thread is for discussion on badly installed aerials.

NewHillel - you have made lots of generic statements here about people undermining competition. Do you also have any interest in this business?

Everone else - No personal comments or discussing other users. Topic only or don't post.

This is the only warning.

NewHillel

MiCr0 wrote: »

NewHillel - you have made lots of generic statements here about people undermining competition.

The key is generic - I have taken great care to be non-specific. This contrasts to multiple posts clearly identifying individuals and businesses. Many of the criticisms do not stand up to scrutiny and could be extremely damaging. There is even a suggestion that a series of pictures, relating to a particular business, will be taken. This can only be taken, on a public forum, as targeting the business concerned. It is entirely relevant to point out that the individual who proposes to take those pictures is operating in the same area.

MiCr0 wrote: »

Do you also have any interest in this business?

I have a professional interest arising from my background, qualifications and early career responsibilities. I have no commercial interests, in this area, of any kind. Neither am I connected, in any way whatsoever, with any of the three Trade Associations recognised by Saorview. (Many years ago I dealt with the CAI, in a professional capacity.)

Cesium Clock

NewHillel wrote: »

Many of the criticisms do not stand up to scrutiny and could be extremely damaging. )

as you are not an aerial rigger your definition of 'do not stand up to scrutiny' is totally irrelavant.

hopefully the criticisms will be 'extremely damaging' as the installs highlighted are 'extremely damaging' to the aerial and satellite trade, of which you are not a part.

cast_iron

Cesium Clock wrote: »

drilling a chimney is a complete no no, apart from the health and safety aspects of using a drill on a roof, the vibrations from a drill can cause damage that may not be apparent immediatley but may cause serious structural faults in the future.

I broadly agree. I don't think anyone is disagreeing actually.
That's not to say any damage was done in the picture above. However, I'd say it's fair game to point out bad practice (which is what people are doing here).

the sky bracket is upside down, water will settle at the bend, rust then failure.
water will run thru the bracket and stain the chimney on exit.

Maybe there are a bit different these days, but they used to be designed in a way where water could not settle on the bend - as the pipe part of the bracket would not quite be 90 degrees. Because of that, all the water would run out the spout, with no settling point at the bend.
Are they different these days?

Tony

Apart from the water issue is still makes more sense to face the bracket downwards as there is less tendancy for it to move . Not that big a deal on an aerial but on a dish its a different story.

NewHillel

Cesium Clock wrote: »

as you are not an aerial rigger your definition of 'do not stand up to scrutiny' is totally irrelavant.

It is not a 'definition' it is simply an informed opinion. I am not an Architect or Civil Engineer so I'm not in a position to specify what constitutes 'best practice', in attaching fitments to structures. Ideally, the trade would be regulated and formal definitions, covering this jurisdiction, would be in place. As it is not, I readily accept that the CAI Code of Practice is a good reference point in relation to aerial installs.

(To be clear, I am not recommending that anyone drill a chimney. If done incorrectly, or on an unsuitable structure, it could cause serious structural damage.)

cast_iron

Tony wrote: »

Apart from the water issue is still makes more sense to face the bracket downwards as there is less tendancy for it to move .

How so, Tony?