unfair dismissal

MizMix

Hi,

Looking for some advice and sorry in advance for my rambling post- lack of sleep this week. This week I was told I was being made redundant...actually the roles of my entire team (8 of us) are being made redundant. Everyone else in my team is moving into similar roles elsewhere in the business (except me-7months pregnant and another guy who lives in the UK so couldn't take a new role anyway). My boss told me 'off the record' I wouldn't be considered for one of the new jobs as I'm pregnant and they need this to happen right away- btw he's not making the decisions anymore, he's just tasked with the firing basically before he exits the company. 2 of my other colleagues within the team do the same job as me- they are both moving into other roles. I think when he realised he shouldn't have said what he said about it being down to my pregnancy he then tried to say those roles have a sales element- however I have sales experience from previous roles. I am technically more qualified than the others. Also the sales element is just made up! There has been no process- these roles are being created around people. I have not been given an opportunity to apply- everyone else is just walking into new roles.

So my direct boss is trying to get me a good deal- garden leave, paid what I would have gotten on maternity and stat redundancy (in a lump sum so I benefit from a fair bit tax free). He is trying to get an ex gratia/goodwill amount but not sure he can get sign off. I met with HR later in the week and made it clear it was unfair selection (they agreed- again they have no control over these decisions at the moment) and that while I would be happy to walk away provided I got a goodwill amount but if they don't sign off I won't be so happy to walk away....even though I will benefit from a lump sum (less tax etc) it isn't costing the company anymore. The bulk of this lump sum is my maternity pay and the redundancy amount is much less- particularly if I only get statutory it is just over a months salary.

I am not sleeping and so stressed over the uncertainty ahead (I am the sole earner as my husband was made redundant at xmas with no redundancy entitlements). I had planned on buying a house this year which won't happen now and we will now most likely need to move closer to dublin as it's unlikely I will get a job in my area where we live....anyway I digress, I know lots of people loose their jobs everyday but I am just so annoyed that they can get away with this. Basically my question is should I take this further? They are still paying me my maternity and stat redundancy at the very least so financially I won't be affected for a minimum of 7 - 12 months. But the principle is still there that this is wrong and I will need to start looking for another job very soon after I have the baby. There have never been any issues with my performance. I would also be concerned if I did take this further would my reputation with future employers be affected? It's not in my nature to fight these things but I just think these guys making the decisions are so ruthless (they know nothing about the business or me) and they don't even think they should have to have any sort of fair process in place.

Any advice would be great as I'm just so confused, stressed and tried at the moment.

not even wrong

My boss told me 'off the record' I wouldn't be considered for one of the new jobs as I'm pregnant

This is incredibly illegal and I'm amazed that your boss would come out and say it straight up like that.

So my direct boss is trying to get me a good deal- garden leave, paid what I would have gotten on maternity and stat redundancy (in a lump sum so I benefit from a fair bit tax free).

So let me get this straight, they're offering you the amount that you are legally entitled to anyway and they're pretending that it's a "good deal"?

Talk to a solicitor.

MizMix

I know I couldn't believe it either- he's also leaving the company (within a few months) and very disgruntled and I think he was trying to make sure I knew this was not his decision. But as casual as he is with me (we've worked together in 2 jobs) I was still shocked he actually said it.

I suppose technically before maternity you can be let go without receiving the company maternity package providing they give enough notice. However as the rest of the team are being kept on they can't do this.

Thanks for the reply.

Mrs OBumble

If you think you're stressed now, then you will get a lot more stressed if you try to fight it, and so don't get immediate the payout you might get otherwise.

You need to think through what you want to achieve - and what you realistically can achieve. What level of payout will make you happy enough to leave well enough alone.

Imagine if the decision was reversed, and you were offered one of the other roles - remember it will be a new role, so you will be on probation again - and your start-date was delayed due to being on maternity leave. Is that what you really want? Or do you want money, to buy you off?

Getting some independent legal advice might help you think through things, and someone experience can probably tell you what sort of settlements people often get in these sorts of cases.

But keep in mind that sometimes the best option for you might be to accept that unfair, illegal things happen and take the payout anyway.

Good luck.

Sala

I disagree with JustMary. I understand your reasoning about taking a large payout if offered but from other cases it appears that the applicant receives a lot more by taking a case anyway.

OP check out http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/dismissal/unfair_dismissal.html

A quick google shows that there have been a number of awards made in recent years for selecting pregnant employees for redundancy. It all appears to hinge on the fact that there was no transparent method of selection (i.e. who stays) and the employer could not show that the selection of the redundant employee was not due to her being pregnant. Accepting redundancy money does not appear mean you are barred from taking a case, but I would not sign anything they give you that says by taking the package you are agreeing not to make any further claims.

I think you need to talk to someone. Maybe go to your local FLAC to get some initial advice, and bring anything you have in writing with you

MizMix

JustMary wrote: »

Imagine if the decision was reversed, and you were offered one of the other roles - remember it will be a new role, so you will be on probation again - and your start-date was delayed due to being on maternity leave. Is that what you really want? Or do you want money, to buy you off?

Thanks justmary- this is something I've thought about- I wouldn't want to remain in the company particularly after this. It's very much bittersweet- while I'm glad to be leaving on one hand, on the other hand I'm angry and frustrated at the lack of process and how it's such a clear cut case of unfair dismissal.

But yes I agree I do need to think about what my 'walk away' amount is. TBH when I thought I was getting a goodwill amount (approx 3 months salary) I was quite happy to walk away (at 7 months pregnant I could do without getting myself anymore worked up). But the fact that they are saying this may not to be signed off on is what made me think perhaps I should take it further- I'm going to get some advice today but I will wait until I get word back from HR on my final package.

MizMix

Sala wrote: »

Accepting redundancy money does not appear mean you are barred from taking a case, but I would not sign anything they give you that says by taking the package you are agreeing not to make any further claims.

I think you need to talk to someone. Maybe go to your local FLAC to get some initial advice, and bring anything you have in writing with you

Good advice thanks

MizMix

Bumping this up- can anyone recommend a good employment law solicitor? I'm based in Dundalk but main office is north dublin. Over a month later and they come back to me with my package (so I'm working March now too). Yes they are paying my maternity (sure I'm 8 months pregnant) but on top of this, my measly statutory red and notice pay they are only offering 5k ex gratia. Originally they said they'd push for 10k. Only thing on top of this I said I wanted was my bonus that everyone else in my team will get. No joy either. They emailed me yesterday stating 'without prejudice' and they want me to go down the route of a compromise agreement. I said I wasn't happy with anything less than what we discussed a month ago and that I needed to consult with a solicitor.

To avoid crazy legal fee's should I bother trying to negotiate directly or is it best to leave it to a solicitor at this stage? I got advise from a guy in Dublin a month back but I couldn't afford his fee's (he's a partner, sits on labour court etc) so need someone more affordable.

Eoin

MizMix wrote: »

Bumping this up- can anyone recommend a good employment law solicitor? I'm based in Dundalk but main office is north dublin.

If anyone does, please do it by PM, thanks.

MizMix

PS just to stress I still don't want to go down the route of a tribunal. I just need someone good to possibly negotiate on my behalf (for the original amount discussed plus my bonus) and someone to look after the compromise agreement/sign off etc.

AMCCORK

MizMix wrote: »

PS just to stress I still don't want to go down the route of a tribunal. I just need someone good to possibly negotiate on my behalf (for the original amount discussed plus my bonus) and someone to look after the compromise agreement/sign off etc.

Just a thought you can't be made redundant while on mat leave. Go on mat leave now and relax and enjoy your baby for six months. At the end of your maternity leave you are entitled to return to a position on the same level. If they have redeployed everyone else on your team they would have a very hard time proving that the reason they don't have a job for you has nothing to do with your maternity leave and you will be in a stronger position to fight them not eight months pregnant etc!