LPG (autogas) Garages around Dublin?

SyntheticPaddy

So I'm thinking of buying a LPG converted car and was wondering if anyone knows of any garages around Dublin that sells LPG?

I've tried the Calorgas and the Flowgas websites. There seems to be one garage between them listed in Artane. However, I phoned around with no luck finding it.


Surely the nearest LPG pump can't be Drogheda?

djrichard

There is a new garage thats started up. They also do the conversions to LPG. They are MUCH MUCH cheaper than Flogas. I think they charge something like 69c per litre. They are a little outside of Dublin, in Kilcullen. I guess its worth it depending on where you actualy live!

Here is a link to their website.

http://www.vv-tech-lpg.com/index.html

Hope this helps.

SyntheticPaddy

Cheers djrichard I've heard about these guys, unfortunately they're out the M9 which is a bit far but I'll definitely be using them when I'm anywhere near that area.

I still can't believe there isn't a place that sells LPG in Dublin!

kerosene

Slightly off to[pic but how much does it cost to convert a car to lpg and what exactly has to be done.

voojeq

That depends on your type of car, if its an oldish one then its going to be around 500 euros, if its new type of engine then prices start at 1000 euro. Im not a mechanic myself but in my country one of my mates wanted to have this installed and the man said that it depends on type of (exhaust gases) collector in your car, if its plastic (installed in new cars) then youll have to prepare for at least a grand, if its metal ( installed in old cars) then its not going to cost that much.

Also ive found out that the reason why LPG is not so popular here and UK is that the governments will prolly hit you with nice bit of road tax for using cheaper fuel according to wikipedia, also someone mentioned that here previously.

dainius

There is a small filling station in jamestown b.pk, finglas, next to irish school of motoring(ism). They gona open more stations across dublin soon cos they sell Lpg conversion kits as well do conversion training. Just finished training yeasterday, first car to convert will be my own p407.

dainius

Conversion is around 1200-1300 euro and it will pay of for itself after 20k kms. After that its pure saving. The price of LPG is around 0.80-1.00 euro p/litre today, so do your maths

ted1

Price per litre may be cheaper but what's in calorific value? I believe its lower than petrol and diesel.

CiniO

ted1 wrote: »

Price per litre may be cheaper but what's in calorific value? I believe its lower than petrol and diesel.

That's why fuel consumption on LPG should be about 5% - 10% higher than on petrol, if it's 4th generation conversion (LPG injectors fitted), and adjusted properly.

SyntheticPaddy

dainius wrote: »

There is a small filling station in jamestown b.pk, finglas, next to irish school of motoring(ism). They gona open more stations across dublin soon cos they sell Lpg conversion kits as well do conversion training. Just finished training yeasterday, first car to convert will be my own p407.

Do you know how much these fellas are charging for a litre?

Matt Simis

voojeq wrote: »

Also ive found out that the reason why LPG is not so popular here and UK is that the governments will prolly hit you with nice bit of road tax for using cheaper fuel according to wikipedia, also someone mentioned that here previously.

Please dont post completely unsubstantiated facts.
Thats not true here (Motor Tax is on CC pre-2008 or CO2 from manufacturer 2008+) and Im fairly sure not true in the UK. LPG is taxed as a motor fuel in both countries, nothing to do with annual Road/Motor tax.

voojeq

Matt Simis wrote: »

Please dont post completely unsubstantiated facts.
Thats not true here (Motor Tax is on CC pre-2008 or CO2 from manufacturer 2008+) and Im fairly sure not true in the UK. LPG is taxed as a motor fuel in both countries, nothing to do with annual Road/Motor tax.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=68949610

I take it back then, lads were talking about NL here. My bad.

Matt Simis

voojeq wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=68949610

I take it back then, lads were talking about NL here. My bad.

Thats ok, I blame keithclancy, he needs to find a more local forum to talk taxes. :P

slimjimmc

SyntheticPaddy wrote: »

So I'm thinking of buying a LPG converted car and was wondering if anyone knows of any garages around Dublin that sells LPG?

I've tried the Calorgas and the Flowgas websites. There seems to be one garage between them listed in Artane. However, I phoned around with no luck finding it.


Surely the nearest LPG pump can't be Drogheda?

More outlets http://ilpga.ie/autogas-outlets.php#Dublin

l_aga

slimjimmc wrote: »

More outlets http://ilpga.ie/autogas-outlets.php#Dublin

This list is out of date unfortunately.
There is a map of LPG stations http://maps.google.pl/maps/ms?msid=211683993263980312898.0004b49a2322303a2048b&msa=0
being developed by Polish people.
Green - LPG stations confirmed (people tanked there)
Blue - locations found on the Internet - not confirmed yet.

Maybe you know any other locations we could add to this map?

Inbred

Does anybody know what's the story after having the stuff installed? I mean, like the NCT/tax/insurance. I fancy a jap petrol car and the LPG appeals (there's a filling station nearby here).

Del2005

Inbred wrote: »

Does anybody know what's the story after having the stuff installed? I mean, like the NCT/tax/insurance. I fancy a jap petrol car and the LPG appeals (there's a filling station nearby here).

No difference to tax or NCT. You must inform your insurance company of any modifications to the car.

mfceiling

Friend of mine bought a 2004 range rover a few weeks ago.

4.4 v8...top of the range with every extra you could imagine.

Got it converted for LPG but is worried about driving it down south because of the lack of places selling it.

He paid 10k sterling for it....serious wagon...took it for a spin, mental acceleration for something the size of a house!!

Very interesting and thanks for posting the link to vv-tech.

I wonder how long it will stay at 69 C per litre ?

So that becomes 75 cent based on 10% efficiency loss ?

Still a great way of getting to work, there are a few cars converted for sale in Ireland that would really reduce our fuel bills.

But most of the cars are older and based the older tax system and only 1.4-1.6 L engines non turbo. Would be slow enough.

How long before tax is increased on lpg ?

Still nothing compares to Electricity for cheap motoring, if only the cars were cheaper!

fryup

does LPG cars lack.....power

Anan1

mfceiling wrote: »

Got it converted for LPG but is worried about driving it down south because of the lack of places selling it.

?? It'll run on petrol too, surely?

mullingar

Lpg has 26 MJ/litre
petrol has 35 MJ/litre

In layman's terms, you need 33% more lpg than petrol to get the same power.

If lpg is 70c/litre, petrol needs to be 0.93c/l to break even, but at 1.63/l today that's some saving!!!

mullingar

mullingar wrote: »

Lpg has 26 MJ/litre
petrol has 35 MJ/litre

In layman's terms, you need 33% more lpg than petrol to get the same power.

If lpg is 70c/litre, petrol needs to be 0.93c/l to break even, but at 1.63/l today that's some saving!!!

33% more for the same power, but how about the same mpg ?

I thought it was 10% less efficient than petrol, so you need 10% more to get the same distance ? making it about 75 c litre

mullingar

Deleted User wrote: »

33% more for the same power, but how about the same mpg ?

I thought it was 10% less efficient than petrol, so you need 10% more to get the same distance ? making it about 75 c litre

Simple maths: for the same power your MPG will go down by approximately 33% with lpg.

If you were getting 30 mpg with petrol, which is 9.4 l/100km, lpg will get 12.5 l/100km which is 22.5 mpg

Vertakill

mullingar wrote: »

Simple maths: for the same power your MPG will go down by approximately 33% with lpg

In practice, it's a lot less than 33%. I think 15% is more accurate based on my brother's experience over the past year using it.

mullingar

Possibly. There are a lot of other efficiencies and in-efficiencies that each fuel brings to engines. Eg Lpg runs cooler so less wasted thermal energy.

how much power did he lose?

Inbred

My father drove his last couple of cars on LPG, some 750k miles in total. 10l/100km petrol or 11l/100km LPG. His last car was written off, otherwise I'd get it off him. No power loss to speak of (1.4l 8v 75BHP).

Vertakill

mullingar wrote: »

Possibly. There are a lot of other efficiencies and in-efficiencies that each fuel brings to engines. Eg Lpg runs cooler so less wasted thermal energy.

how much power did he lose?

Little or none as far as I know. Well, the difference was negligible for him as the car has 330ish BHP.
I couldn't tell the difference when driving it if it was on petrol or gas and you can swap over at the flick of a switch without any stutter or anything.

Matt Simis

mullingar wrote: »

Possibly. There are a lot of other efficiencies and in-efficiencies that each fuel brings to engines. Eg Lpg runs cooler so less wasted thermal energy.
how much power did he lose?

You must be thinking of E85, as LPG runs hotter, not cooler than Petrol.
The 33% figure based on calorific value is very misleading as it ignores the fact the octane rating on LPG is 112 vs 95 or whatever on most petrol. This means that ignition advance could be set way more aggressively on LPG and on more modern (higher compression) engines, LPG becomes even more efficient (as that high octane resists knocking). Some theorise that torque is higher and more accessible on LPG but peak power is 5% lower.


I cannot tell any difference running my Audi S8 (340bhp stock, remapped, 4.2 V8) on LPG vs petrol. Fuel consumption seems only 10% worse, at worst (I tend to drive more frugally on expensive petrol, so its not a fair comparison).

mullingar

Matt Simis wrote: »

You must be thinking of E85, as LPG runs hotter, not cooler than Petrol.
The 33% figure based on calorific value is very misleading as it ignores the fact the octane rating on LPG is 112 vs 95 or whatever on most petrol. This means that ignition advance could be set way more aggressively on LPG and on more modern (higher compression) engines, LPG becomes even more efficient (as that high octane resists knocking). Some theorise that torque is higher and more accessible on LPG but peak power is 5% lower.


I cannot tell any difference running my Audi S8 (340bhp stock, remapped, 4.2 V8) on LPG vs petrol. Fuel consumption seems only 10% worse, at worst (I tend to drive more frugally on expensive petrol, so its not a fair comparison).

I know lpg does burn cooler than petrol as it's got a much lower calorific value so I did a quick Google and found this that shows it does burn colder

http://www.go-lpg.co.uk/VSR.html

Good website.

It also explains the overall loss is approx 15% when all loses/gains are included ( Inc power losses)

Matt Simis

mullingar wrote: »

I know lpg does burn cooler than petrol as it's got a much lower calorific value so I did a quick Google and found this that shows it does burn colder

http://www.go-lpg.co.uk/VSR.html

Good website.

It also explains the overall loss is approx 15% when all loses/gains are included ( Inc power losses)

Bad choice of reference site unfortunately.
Google deeper, that guy and that site are well known and not in a good way! What would the calorific value have to do with combustion temp vs petrol!? They burn different temps as they are different fuels and LPG burns more slowly.

http://www.teamgreenautogas.com.au/default.asp?id=FAQ#ans27
http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=6909&start=0
http://www.exceptionalenergy.com/en_GB/media-room/q-a

The difference in temp is actually minimal, but in car conversions its definitely hotter, not cooler.