Mary I - does the I stand for Invisible?

wingnut

Mary I... where the odds are good but the goods are odd!

Poxyshamrock

I'd like to see Mary I's population increase to about 6000 in the next 10 years.

As it stands, the population is 3200, with upto 800 students not on campus for certain semesters.

Amazotheamazing

Irish Wolf wrote: »

I'm just curious, and as xsi has already posted, this probably isn't the place for this, but how do you propose this change would happen?

I don't see any massive problems in closing the teaching colleges, UL/DCU etc could either take over the existing facilities or build new ones. A big-ish task maybe, but hardly an impossible one. Afaik, they are all loosely affiliated with a university already. With all due respect to the current Arts faculty in UL, I've never heard anyone put it at a par as those offered in the other main universities.

The problem of course, is removing the Catholic Church from the primary and secondary education system, something that Quinn is already looking at. We'll have to see how those reports come back, tbh, it's a massive problem for Ireland.

Amazotheamazing

xsiborg wrote: »

well the Limerick Forum Charter states that:



this is a thread about encouraging a student population into the city centre, not a thread about ireland's educational system.

I think having a better UL is relevant to Limerick and to Limerick's city centre.

Irish Wolf

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Just to deal with your edit, the best thing for Limerick is for UL to be the best it can be. That means, imo, having a proper Arts faculty. We need to improve the links between UL and the city. Anyhow, the status quo of Mary I as is clearly isn't doing much for the city anyway, as per the OP.

The city needs to realise UL is the most positive agent for change in the midwest at the minute and see how it can be fully utilised. Imagine if we had a top quality Arts faculty attracting a different type of student to Limerick, it would help give another aspect to Limerick city.

I seem to be a curious cat tonight - what do you mean by the bolded statement above.

Irish Wolf

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I don't see any massive problems in closing the teaching colleges, UL/DCU etc could either take over the existing facilities or build new ones. A big-ish task maybe, but hardly an impossible one. Afaik, they are all loosely affiliated with a university already. With all due respect to the current Arts faculty in UL, I've never heard anyone put it at a par as those offered in the other main universities.

The problem of course, is removing the Catholic Church from the primary and secondary education system, something that Quinn is already looking at. We'll have to see how those reports come back, tbh, it's a massive problem for Ireland.

At a rough estimate, how much do you think it'd cost?

Amazotheamazing

Irish Wolf wrote: »

I seem to be a curious cat tonight - what do you mean by the bolded statement above.

Think it's self explanatory, the best students want to go to the best faculties. In Arts, neither UL are Mary I is up there with the Arts faculties of the other colleges, whereas UL is up there with the best (in Ireland) in other disciplines. There's a reason different universities have different rankings.

xsiborg

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Just to deal with your edit, the best thing for Limerick is for UL to be the best it can be. That means, imo, having a proper Arts faculty. We need to improve the links between UL and the city. Anyhow, the status quo of Mary I as is clearly isn't doing much for the city anyway, as per the OP.

isn't this the same as saying the status quo of UL isn't doing much for the city, and we need to improve links with Mary I?

the thing is, as has been pointed out by other posters already, the students in Mary I do not have as big a campus as a self contained unit like UL, which has the stables, the spar shop, the numerous coffee shops, etc, so students attending Mary I actually do MORE for the city centre than their counterparts in UL, as in they go to bobby byrnes, they go to fennessys, they get books in o mahonys, they drink in dolans, and most importantly- they pay for rental accomodation near Mary I.

you get the idea- they spend more money and time in the city than their UL counterparts.

now, move them all out to UL, that's a huge financial loss to the city, let alone that side of town, and then you are in an even worse position than originally stated in the OP.

i think it's better not to have all one's eggs in the one basket.

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

The city needs to realise UL is the most positive agent for change in the midwest at the minute and see how it can be fully utilised. Imagine if we had a top quality Arts faculty attracting a different type of student to Limerick, it would help give another aspect to Limerick city.

we have that already, it's called Mary I...

Amazotheamazing

Irish Wolf wrote: »

At a rough estimate, how much do you think it'd cost?

We'll have to see what the report says, but so far we've paid out over a billion of tax payer money to the victims of the Catholic Church, so add that to the fact that surely no price is too high to protect children from being raped and I'm sure we can strike some sort of deal with the Vatican.

Amazotheamazing

xsiborg wrote: »

isn't this the same as saying the status quo of UL isn't doing much for the city, and we need to improve links with Mary I?

the thing is, as has been pointed out by other posters already, the students in Mary I do not have as big a campus as a self contained unit like UL, which has the stables, the spar shop, the numerous coffee shops, etc, so students attending Mary I actually do MORE for the city centre than their counterparts in UL, as in they go to bobby byrnes, they go to fennessys, they get books in o mahonys, they drink in dolans, and most importantly- they pay for rental accomodation near Mary I.

you get the idea- they spend more money and time in the city than their UL counterparts.

now, move them all out to UL, that's a huge financial loss to the city, let alone that side of town, and then you are in an even worse position than originally stated in the OP.

i think it's better not to have all one's eggs in the one basket.



we have that already, it's called Mary I...

You think Mary I, as an Arts faculty, is as good as, say, Trinity?

The places you're describing btw, are just different suburbs, Fennessy's is not the city centre,

xsiborg

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Think it's self explanatory, the best students want to go to the best faculties. In Arts, neither UL are Mary I is up there with the Arts faculties of the other colleges, whereas UL is up there with the best (in Ireland) in other disciplines. There's a reason different universities have different rankings.

im sorry Amazo, this is where i have to bow out until this thread gets back on topic, it's just that, well, when i read that post, it's a clear indication that you are talking through your mortarboard hat, metaphorically speaking, of course.

Amazotheamazing

xsiborg wrote: »

im sorry Amazo, this is where i have to bow out until this thread gets back on topic, it's just that, well, when i read that post, it's a clear indication that you are talking through your mortarboard hat, metaphorically speaking, of course.

If you want to show me rankings that say differently, I'll gladly apologise to the good students of Mary I.

Irish Wolf

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

We'll have to see what the report says, but so far we've paid out over a billion of tax payer money to the victims of the Catholic Church, so add that to the fact that surely no price is too high to protect children from being raped and I'm sure we can strike some sort of deal with the Vatican.

LOL - I was curious earlier if you were insinuating that just because some teachers were being trained in a Catholic run university that they would turn into "child rapists".

Same as xsi, I'm out of this.

Amazotheamazing

Irish Wolf wrote: »

LOL - I was curious earlier if you were insinuating that just because some teachers were being trained in a Catholic run university that they would turn into "child rapists".

Same as xsi, I'm out of this.

Where did I insinuate that? I said nothing even close to that.

Do you think the Catholic Church should still play a major role in the Irish education system? And though it's even further off topic, if yes, why?

Irish Wolf

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

Where did I insinuate that?

Do you think the Catholic Church should still play a major role in the Irish education system?

I said I was curious if you were insinuating it.

Yes, why not?

xsiborg

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

You think Mary I, as an Arts faculty, is as good as, say, Trinity?

The places you're describing btw, are just different suburbs, Fennessy's is not the city centre,

Amazo you're not just amazing, you are truly, spectacular!!

the places i described are suburbs?

o mahonys bookshop couldn't BE more city central! bobby byrnes is IN the city, as is dolans, hell it's just across the road from me!

and as for accomodation, i know a student teacher renting accomodation on o connell avenue, i also see all the students coming from their accomodation in the morning up along south circular road there as they go to mary i when im dropping my son off for school across the road!

suburbs? fennessys is only around the corner from Mary I!

far more city central than UL at least.

Amazotheamazing

Irish Wolf wrote: »

I said I was curious if you were insinuating it.

Yes, why not?

Well, I don't trust any institution that circumvented the law to protect rapists, but even if I felt they were fine, why should any religion play any role in education?

Amazotheamazing

xsiborg wrote: »

Amazo you're not just amazing, you are truly, spectacular!!

the places i described are suburbs?

o mahonys bookshop couldn't BE more city central! bobby byrnes is IN the city, as is dolans, hell it's just across the road from me!

and as for accomodation, i know a student teacher renting accomodation on o connell avenue, i also see all the students coming from their accomodation in the morning up along south circular road there as they go to mary i when im dropping my son off for school across the road!

suburbs? fennessys is only around the corner from Mary I!

far more city central than UL at least.

The city centre doesn't stretch a mile from Cruises street, if it did we could say the Parkway, Thomond Park or Ivans is in the city centre too.

Insect Overlord

Mod Note: Amazotheamazing, please stop posting in this thread. Your arguments are ridiculously far off the topic of the OP. If you have a gripe with the Catholic Church's role in the education system, the Limerick City Forum is not the place to vent about it.

xsiborg

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

If you want to show me rankings that say differently, I'll gladly apologise to the good students of Mary I.

i don't need rankings Amazo, i'd sooner believe in experience, my mother is a former student of Mary I, and when she qualified, she paid for her brother and sister to train as teachers too.

my mother has since retired from primary school teaching, which she taught for 30 years, and my uncle and his wife, are teachers in secondary schools down in Cork. my aunt then, and her husband- she's a professor in DCU, while her husband is a senior lecturer in UCD.

oh, and now while i think of it- my own brother is a lecturer in NUIG.

im NOT a teacher btw, just in case you were wondering.

Irish Wolf

.

Kess73

I'm a bit sorry that i missed last night's debate on this.

Whilst i tend to agree with amazo that religious bodies should have less direct influence over centres of education be they primary, secondary, or third level, what caught my eye in the debate was not that.

What caught my eye was the arguement that the moving Mary I ( and all involved with it) to a location that is even further from the city centre would be good for encouraging students into the city centre.

Moving Mary I would have a negative impact, imho, on a lot of businesses in and around the South Circular road/Henry street area, and the same students that spend money in that area now would be spending their money in Castletroy and surrounding areas instead. Plus they would not be renting in large numbers in the areas nearish to the South Circular road anymore.

I really am struggling to see how moving thousands of students from a location that is close to the city centre to another location that is a few miles further out would somehow encourage those same students to come into the city centre more.

Mary I is fine where it is in my eyes. Sure a lot of us might bitch about students from time to time, but the simply fact that there are three to four thousand people using the site on the South Circular road means there is extra life in the area be it from a financial POV for the local shops, landlords etc., or just from there being extra activity through numbers.

Of course Mary I might be better is some* students were not there
















*One student.:mad: The same snobby one who did not wave when I beeped my car horn at him on Wednesday.

source

Kess73 wrote: »

I'm a bit sorry that i missed last night's debate on this.

Whilst i tend to agree with amazo that religious bodies should have less direct influence over centres of education be they primary, secondary, or third level, what caught my eye in the debate was not that.

What caught my eye was the arguement that the moving Mary I ( and all involved with it) to a location that is even further from the city centre would be good for encouraging students into the city centre.

Moving Mary I would have a negative impact, imho, on a lot of businesses in and around the South Circular road/Henry street area, and the same students that spend money in that area now would be spending their money in Castletroy and surrounding areas instead. Plus they would not be renting in large numbers in the areas nearish to the South Circular road anymore.

I really am struggling to see how moving thousands of students from a location that is close to the city centre to another location that is a few miles further out would somehow encourage those same students to come into the city centre more.

Mary I is fine where it is in my eyes. Sure a lot of us might bitch about students from time to time, but the simply fact that there are three to four thousand people using the site on the South Circular road means there is extra life in the area be it from a financial POV for the local shops, landlords etc., or just from there being extra activity through numbers.

Of course Mary I might be better is some* students were not there
















*One student.:mad: The same snobby one who did not wave when I beeped my car horn at him on Wednesday.

I live just off South Circular and agree 100% with kess here, While I might bitch about the students every now and again, on the whole I'm glad of the constant stream of people around the area.

Insect Overlord

Insect Overlord wrote: »

One of the very stupidest posts I've read on this forum in quite a while

Edit: a) Apologies to Amazo. My reply here last night was blunt, way below standard, and failed to address either of the points being made.

b) Mary Immaculate College and UL are not one and the same. "Concentrating" the whole student population in one area because of that misconception wouldn't be logical. Other posters have made good points to that regard later in this thread.

c) If anyone wants to seriously debate the role of the Catholic Church in Irish education, I'd recommend the Humanities forum.

d) If anyone wants to debate a general reform of Limerick's 3rd Level institutions, start a new thread about it.

Just to highlight that I've edited one of my earlier posts in this thread. ^

RonMexico

Having read through this thread the level of ignorance directed towards Mary I is truly breathtaking. As is the complete lack of understanding of the economic contribution it makes to the city.

Mod EDIT: <snip>

siobhanod93

Could anybody tell me when first semester begins in August/ September for the Primary Teaching degree for first years?

Poxyshamrock

siobhanod93 wrote: »

Could anybody tell me when first semester begins in August/ September for the Primary Teaching degree for first years?

First week in September usually with orientation the last week in August.

RAMADAN

Amazotheamazing wrote: »

I don't see any massive problems in closing the teaching colleges, UL/DCU etc could either take over the existing facilities or build new ones. A big-ish task maybe, but hardly an impossible one. Afaik, they are all loosely affiliated with a university already. With all due respect to the current Arts faculty in UL, I've never heard anyone put it at a par as those offered in the other main universities.

The problem of course, is removing the Catholic Church from the primary and secondary education system, something that Quinn is already looking at. We'll have to see how those reports come back, tbh, it's a massive problem for Ireland.

Ignorance is bliss. If one was to take your own posts as typical of the different type of student UL might attract, then stuff it. Firstly, the state does not own Mary I or St. Pat's. Secondly you clearly have no awareness of the legal or logistic issues that would arise in moving Mary I Arts to UL. Thirdly, do you have any idea of building costs? The new facilities you mention would come to about 30 million per institution.

Insect Overlord

Well, they finally have their own forum now, so that's a step in a positive direction!
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=1500

stakerwallace

boomkatalog wrote: »

I went to Mary I, finished last year and spent a lot of time in the city.

I didn't wear a banner saying 'Mary I!' or anything, nor did my friends, so how would you know we were out and about?

Its a bit of a trek to town alright seeing as we're just as close to Dooradoyle, town is more for heading out or specific shops.

Have to say my first two years there were so full of life (and craic and alcohol and amazing memories) before the workload started to pile up, and I know my friends would all say the same. Its got a lot more going on then people give it credit for, we just don't have the same buzz as UL because its much smalled and there's no bar on campus (never was a big fan of scotts, seems to be pretty dead most of the time).

Mary I have a stake and say in the old Franciscan Church in Henry Street and perhaps they should consider using it for a downtown campus.