Say No to Household and Septic Tank Charges

Pete M.

There will be a public meeting of those supporting an anti household and septic tank charge campaign at 8:30pm in the Coach House Hotel, Ballymote on the 23rd of February.

If you disagree with the implementation of these charges, please come along and meet other people who feel the same.

There were over 200 people in the Glasshouse last Thursday night. They came from all over the County. They all agreed that there should be an effort, from those of us opposed to them, to show our dissatisfaction, together.


The meeting is being organised by Campaign against Household and Water Charges www.nohouseholdtax.org

red sean

Pete, you would have a better chance of big attendance if the general population knew who was behind this link. http://www.nohouseholdtax.org/
It's just a credibility thing!

Pete M.

red sean wrote: »

Pete, you would have a better chance of big attendance if the general population knew who was behind this link. http://www.nohouseholdtax.org/
It's just a credibility thing!

No problem Redsean

At the last meeting the speakers were Sheamie O'Boyle, local community activist in Sligo Town, no party affiliations afaik, Declan Bree Ind. Socialist, and I'm sure you all know him at this stage, John Gallagher from the Sligo Farming Platform and Clare Daly the Socialist Party/United Left Alliance TD.

In addition to this, lots of ordinary people from around Sligo and Leitrim voiced their opinions too. And everyone who wanted to speak was given a chance and all agreed that these charges are unfair.

The campaign is also being supported by all the ULA TDs & affiliated parties (so yes all the lefties), as well as several independents and even some SF TDs have come out and said they wont pay. Even the bold Jimmy McGarry has said he thinks it unfair.

I personally have no party affiliations, but support the ULA.

For this campaign to be successful it needs the input, commitment and drive of ordinary people across the country pulling together to stand up against what we all think is an unfair & unjust tax.

Hope that clears that up, but if not let me know

Don't register. Don't pay

Geuze

How would people feel about a Site Value Tax instead?

Here is a presentation in favour of it:

http://www.ucd.ie/geary/static/podcasts/ieconf/presentations/RonanLyons.pdf

More info at:

http://smarttaxes.org/

sh1tstirrer

Geuze wrote: »

How would people feel about a Site Value Tax instead?

Here is a presentation in favour of it:

http://www.ucd.ie/geary/static/podcasts/ieconf/presentations/RonanLyons.pdf

More info at:

http://smarttaxes.org/

I would feel the exact same about it as I do about the household charge

Geuze

100 years of research, analysis and thinking have gone into designing better taxes, like a Land tax / Site Value Tax.

Most serious commentators / analysts agree with a SVT.

The Govt's own advisors, the Commission on Taxation, support a SVT.

I find it curious then that people would so easily and quickly dismiss these ideas.

Geuze

http://www.dit.ie/media/documents/built/spatialplanning/spatialinformationsciences/cpd/boundaryregulations/LVT%20in%20Ireland%20-%20Information%20Implementation%20Issues.pdf



"At present there are a number of countries that are making use of some form of land value taxation including a number of States in Australia and the USA, Estonia, Jamaica, New Zealand and Denmark.

Land tax in these countries is levied by the county and municipal authorities based on the assessed market value of the land for all kinds of private properties. The tax to be paid to the municipal councils is fixed as a part of the yearly total budgeting for each municipality. Publicly owned properties are, however, subject to a service tax, to cover the costs of public facilities such as roads, parking, fire brigades etc. In 2000, land taxes in Denmark accounted for about two percent of the total tax and duty revenue (The Danish Way, 2002)."

Are all these countries mad / crazy??

Obviously not, indeed we could learn a lot from the Danes, they have a successful economy, with low unemployment.

Pete M.

I was at an activists meeting tonight, around 20 people there.
We talked about how to get the word out about Ballymote meeting and the Rally on Saturday 25th in Sligo.
There will be lots more leafleting and getting on the local radio and along with the spread in the Champion, I reckon a lot more people will know about what's going on.

With regard to a Site Valuation Tax, politics/economics forum maybe?

With all due respect, I want this thread to be about the anti household tax campaign, not the pro site evaluation tax campaign

Son Of A Vidic

Geuze wrote: »

100 years of research, analysis and thinking have gone into designing better taxes, like a Land tax / Site Value Tax.

Most serious commentators / analysts agree with a SVT.

The Govt's own advisors, the Commission on Taxation, support a SVT.

100 years of research? Do you think we give a shít? Are you working for The Revenue Commissioners or something?

Geuze wrote: »

I find it curious then that people would so easily and quickly dismiss these ideas.

I find it curious that you are peddling such crap in this thread of all places. The cold reality is, we are being taxed in ever more imaginative ways, thanks to the German and French banks not taking their own losses like they should have. So no amount of bullshít will change that simple fact.

TheQ47

Geuze wrote: »

http://www.dit.ie/media/documents/built/spatialplanning/spatialinformationsciences/cpd/boundaryregulations/LVT%20in%20Ireland%20-%20Information%20Implementation%20Issues.pdf

"At present there are a number of countries that are making use of some form of land value taxation including a number of States in Australia and the USA, Estonia, Jamaica, New Zealand and Denmark.

Land tax in these countries is levied by the county and municipal authorities based on the assessed market value of the land for all kinds of private properties. The tax to be paid to the municipal councils is fixed as a part of the yearly total budgeting for each municipality. Publicly owned properties are, however, subject to a service tax, to cover the costs of public facilities such as roads, parking, fire brigades etc. In 2000, land taxes in Denmark accounted for about two percent of the total tax and duty revenue (The Danish Way, 2002)."

Are all these countries mad / crazy??

Obviously not, indeed we could learn a lot from the Danes, they have a successful economy, with low unemployment.

That's all well and good, but (to bring it back to the Household Tax the OP was about) Sligo County Council have already stated that they will not be getting the money raised from the HHT, in fact it will cost them money in collection, etc., and the money they get annually from central funds (i.e., Dept of Environment) has been cut again this year.

If there was a fair property/land tax here which was *all* sent back to the local council for provision of proper services, I for one would have a lot less problem paying it. It's the fact that this money is basically paying off the reckless bankers (and words that rhyme with bankers) who brought this country to the state it's in that I most object to.

IrishLad2012

Pete M. wrote: »

I was at an activists meeting tonight, around 20 people there.
We talked about how to get the word out about Ballymote meeting and the Rally on Saturday 25th in Sligo.
There will be lots more leafleting and getting on the local radio and along with the spread in the Champion, I reckon a lot more people will know about what's going on.

With regard to a Site Valuation Tax, politics/economics forum maybe?

With all due respect, I want this thread to be about the anti household tax campaign, not the pro site evaluation tax campaign

Their is definitely strength in numbers.Too many people rolling over in this country.What is the details for the Rally on Saturday,I would be more than happy to join you?

Pete M.

IrishLad2012 wrote: »

Their is definitely strength in numbers.Too many people rolling over in this country.What is the details for the Rally on Saturday,I would be more than happy to join you?

Good lad

The protest will take place at 1pm assembling at the GPO in Sligo Town.
It would be great if you could make it.

Haven't heard how the meeting went tonight but I'm sure it was well attended.
Still less than 10% of those required to pay have done, with less than 6 weeks to go...

mountainy man

I was at the meeting, there was a good turnout at a guess I'd say about 200 ish, which suprised me as Ballymote is very FF and FG , lots of farmers attended.

I too will be at the protest on saturday, spread the word folks:)

mountainy man

Good turnout at the protest in sligo, we gathered at the GPO and marched to john perry's offoce and back to the top of O'Connell st. where speaches were made. I'm not sure on numbers but somewhere between two and three hundred. It is a good start. Don't register don't pay!

Pete M.

I was there too and even saw you there MM.

There were around 350 there I'd say and that's based on what others reckoned too.

There will be another meeting in Collooney on the 1st in the Teeling Centre and a meeting in Manorhamilton, more specifically about the septic tank charge, on the 28th.

And I reckon there'll be another march in Sligo in a couple of weeks.

There was a good sense of solidarity and people talking about the importance of sticking together and backing each other up.

Fair play to Marcus who kept on talking despite being told to keep quiet by the Gardai, who in fairness just sat back and watched after that.

Don't register. Don't pay.

Pete M.

Short notive I know, but for anyone in North Sligo, there is a public meeting of the Campaign Against the Household and Water Charges in the Parish Hall in Grange at 9:00pm this evening.

As far as I know the other meetings in Tubbercurry, Manorhamilton etc. have all been well attended.

Still only around 300,000 out of 1,600,000 have paid up.

So it's looking like there will be over a million households not paying by the deadline.

And remember even if you don't pay for 12 months, the penalty is only €42.

Don't register. Don't pay.

Son Of A Vidic

Pete M. wrote: »

And remember even if you don't pay for 12 months, the penalty is only €42.

Which I also will not be paying, so I'll just forward the fine onto Mrs Merkel.

wayoutwest

Pete M - I was wondering when I can expect my 42 euro fine as i'm looking at my spare coppers[1,2,5 cents] jar,and reckon that there is about E30's worth in it. What happens if I dont pay this fine when they ask for it?

Pete M.

wayoutwest wrote: »

Pete M - I was wondering when I can expect my 42 euro fine as i'm looking at my spare coppers[1,2,5 cents] jar,and reckon that there is about E30's worth in it. What happens if I dont pay this fine when they ask for it?

The €42 isn't a fine, but the late payment penalty after 12 months.

And you won't be receiving any bill through the door for it.

I think that they will have to wait 12 months anyway before bringing anyone to the District Court to impose a fine, as such, for non-payment.

But if by the 31st, there are still over a million households not registered, then they will have to re-consider.

The tax is unfair and does not enjoy anything approaching popular support.

And the desperate attempts to threaten and bully people into paying in the past few days are reprehensible.

Son Of A Vidic

Pete M. wrote: »

And the desperate attempts to threaten and bully people into paying in the past few days are reprehensible.

Pity they weren't so desperate to make the Banksters pay for their crimes.

bonzos

I think that the government will have to stop trying to entice to pay by telling us that the money will be spent at local level,please have a look at where YOUR hard earned after tax money will be spent....on our 25 county councillor's who are cleaning up on wages and expenses on what is a part time job


http://www.sligotoday.ie/details.php?id=10301

bonzos

I regularly work in a county council office and its sicking to see the waste of money....im usually at work at 8am and find offices with lights,computers and various other electrical equipment left turned on all night. Around 9-9.30 the "employees" show up,then its time for tea and a chat about how hard life is.....wasters!

Pete M.

bonzos wrote: »

I regularly work in a county council office and its sicking to see the waste of money....im usually at work at 8am and find offices with lights,computers and various other electrical equipment left turned on all night. Around 9-9.30 the "employees" show up,then its time for tea and a chat about how hard life is.....wasters!

Well, I also work in County Council offices and am one of those 'employees' as you call us.:cool:

I'll admit that, as an organisation, the Local Authority is massively inefficient and there are some who take the p1ss.

But it is unfair to say that everyone who works in the CoCo is lazy and apathetic and the comment is typical of how people turn against each other, rather than those that they should be turning against.

Ask any low - medium level worker in the local authority and many will say that they think the inefficiencies are the fault of pretty well paid management, because they haven't addressed them properly.

Ming, and many others, are right when they say we need wholesale reform of the local authority system in the Country, but that doesn't mean that you start by turning on those who work within the system.

It's like having a go at people on the dole or immigrants or travellers, anyone except those that we should all be having a go at...

And btw, you won't get too much stuff left on in my office overnight :P

As for the link you posted, it is disturbing how much some of them have claimed, but not shocking. This has been going on for years. But yes, it absolutely needs sorting out.

And tomorrow, at tea-break (which I know you begrudge us, but hey :cool:) I will continue to vocally reiterate my stance against the Household Tax :pac:

Buford T Justice

Jimmy Devins FF topping the pole in that article there

Quelle suprise.

bonzos

Pete M. wrote: »

Well, I also work in County Council offices and am one of those 'employees' as you call us.:cool:

I'll admit that, as an organisation, the Local Authority is massively inefficient and there are some who take the p1ss.

But it is unfair to say that everyone who works in the CoCo is lazy and apathetic and the comment is typical of how people turn against each other, rather than those that they should be turning against.

Ask any low - medium level worker in the local authority and many will say that they think the inefficiencies are the fault of pretty well paid management, because they haven't addressed them properly.

Ming, and many others, are right when they say we need wholesale reform of the local authority system in the Country, but that doesn't mean that you start by turning on those who work within the system.

It's like having a go at people on the dole or immigrants or travellers, anyone except those that we should all be having a go at...

And btw, you won't get too much stuff left on in my office overnight :P

As for the link you posted, it is disturbing how much some of them have claimed, but not shocking. This has been going on for years. But yes, it absolutely needs sorting out.

And tomorrow, at tea-break (which I know you begrudge us, but hey :cool:) I will continue to vocally reiterate my stance against the Household Tax :pac:

I dont begrudge anyone a tea break and I am well aware that plenty of people at the lower levels on our coco's do alot of the donkey work and get no thanks for it....I just find it sickening when I am being asked to fork out more money that I know will be wasted.

bonzos

Buford T Justice wrote: »

Jimmy Devins FF topping the pole in that article there

Quelle suprise.

Jude Devins not Jimmy....Jimmy is/was on a bigger gravytrain:D

Buford T Justice

bonzos wrote: »

Jude Devins not Jimmy....Jimmy is/was on a bigger gravytrain:D

bonzos

A little off topic but can anyone explain to me how Tony McLoughlin manage to claim the exact same expenses (to the cent) in a 4 week month as in a 5 week month?im not saying he is milking the system....but come on:rolleyes:!

blackiebest

Good Man Pete M. This is great.

I was working for the St. Patricks parade in Dublin and before kick off, I spent about an hour approaching every Gardá and Army uniform I could see and who would listen. They all listened.
I truthfully informed them it was my honest opinion that they are obliged, IMO, to defend our freedom and should, IMO, arrest each and every member of Daíl Éireann, hold them in Collins Barracks for 30 days, take control of our country and allow a free and fair non party election of a dictator, (I nominate Michael O'Leary or Mary Robinson) for a period of five years.
Total control should be handed to a competent Irish person to recover our freedom!

*Rant over*

Sorry so off-topic, DO NOT PAY THOSE EEJITS ANYTHING. THEY ARE INCAPABLE OF NOT WASTING MONEY!

Buford T Justice

Have to say, I paid it yesterday.

Not because I wanted to, or I agree with it or anything like that, because I don't I think its daylight robbery, just like shopping in Supervalu.

Anyway, the reason I paid it is simple. Weather we like it or not, this charge is coming in, in one way or another. If people don't volunteer to pay it they will look to tax either wages or social welfare. One or the other. We can kick up a stink as much as we like about this charge, but rest assured if history of this and the last government is anything to go by then they aren't going to take a blind bit of heed of anyone and press ahead regardless.

I mean what are they going to do, change their mind and refund the 500K odd people that have paid it? Methinks not.

Figure I'll pay it now and save myself the late payment fees.

bonzos

I will pay it when the travellers in Sligo who drive the new range rover and new bmw 5 series pay......I think that's fair dont you?