Paypal go to Dundalk

BlaasForRafa

Sully wrote: »

If they came to Waterford our unemployment rate would still be poor so.

It would be bloody well better than it is now wouldn't it.

And oh look, another 120 call centre jobs going to Louth http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/1025/yapstone-to-create-120-jobs-in-drogheda-business.html

Isn't it about time your buddies in FG throughout the south east lobbied for the IDA to restore the position of director for the South-east? Ever since that was taken from us and folded into the Cork office (about 10/12 years ago by FF) we've gotten feck all IDA sponsored jobs and you can say pretty much the same for Wexford, South Tipp, KK etc an all.

fuzzy dunlop

Sully wrote: »

If they came to Waterford our unemployment rate would still be poor so.

ffs!

Cabaal

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

we've gotten feck all IDA sponsored jobs and you can say pretty much the same for Wexford, South Tipp, KK etc an all.

Surely if your logic was correct the other places you've mentioned also wouldn't have new jobs coming to them like Waterford and they'd also have very high unemployment....I think this is a little bit more then the IDA

Kilkenny has had new jobs
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0723/envelope-supply-company-to-create-30-new-jobs-business.html

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0215/jobs-business.html

But then so has Waterford and anyone not from Waterford would see it the same as people in Waterford are seeing louth

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0113/breaking6.html

fuzzy dunlop

Cabaal wrote: »

Surely if your logic was correct the other places you've mentioned also wouldn't have new jobs coming to them like Waterford and they'd also have very high unemployment....I think this is a little bit more then the IDA

Kilkenny has had new jobs
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0723/envelope-supply-company-to-create-30-new-jobs-business.html

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0215/jobs-business.html

But then so has Waterford and anyone not from Waterford would see it the same as people in Waterford are seeing louth

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0113/breaking6.html[/QUOTE]

This is nonsense for the simple reason that all places are not equal in the geographic sense or infrastructure sense. You can't compare Waterford with "any old place".You have to compare like with like.Example you could compare the South East with the West or Co. Cork which which would show the South East faring dismally. The fact is that Louth and Waterford (counties) are broadly comparable yet for some reason pay pal can be attracted to Louth and we're expected to settle for an Action Plan.

Also the link you used for Waterford doesn't apply as it is not FDI which is what we are arguing for. If I'm not mistaken its an indigenous company nowhere in the same league as Pay Pal or numerous other jobs announced in the last year. Waterford and the South East are not remote and have strong Infratructure and Demographics. So why is it in the hapenny place when it comes to jobs? There has been no sufficient reason offered thus far.

BlaasForRafa

Cabaal wrote: »

Surely if your logic was correct the other places you've mentioned also wouldn't have new jobs coming to them like Waterford and they'd also have very high unemployment....I think this is a little bit more then the IDA

Kilkenny has had new jobs
http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0723/envelope-supply-company-to-create-30-new-jobs-business.html

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0215/jobs-business.html

But then so has Waterford and anyone not from Waterford would see it the same as people in Waterford are seeing louth

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0113/breaking6.html

An envelope supply company? Now theres high quality jobs, your point is proven so :rolleyes:

Sully

Don't think its the same company but I have worked with a big envelope supply company in Kilkenny. A lot of these companies do more than just supplying envelopes like Tesco. So I wouldn't mock such a company and the jobs they create!

fuzzy dunlop

Sully wrote: »

Don't think its the same company but I have worked with a big envelope supply company in Kilkenny. A lot of these companies do more than just supplying envelopes like Tesco. So I wouldn't mock such a company and the jobs they create!

Nobody is mocking anything. But the fact is they will be pretty limited in the diversity of skills they can employ.

wellboy76

Compare IDA jobs created in waterford and Galway in the last 2 years and confirm again how we're doing. Put sprinkles on turds you still have ****e.

Sully

wellboy76 wrote: »

Compare IDA jobs created in waterford and Galway in the last 2 years and confirm again how we're doing. Put sprinkles on turds you still have ****e.

How many of those jobs, in the past two years, were expansions?

I don't see why the IDA don't release the reasons for why a company choose a specification location. Such a report could help Waterford 'up its game'.

BlaasForRafa

Sully wrote: »

How many of those jobs, in the past two years, were expansions?

I don't see why the IDA don't release the reasons for why a company choose a specification location. Such a report could help Waterford 'up its game'.

Bioware alone have gone from zip to something like 600-700 by next year.

fuzzy dunlop

Sully wrote: »

How many of those jobs, in the past two years, were expansions?

I don't see why the IDA don't release the reasons for why a company choose a specification location. Such a report could help Waterford 'up its game'.

It doesn't matter if they are expansions or not.The fact that there is not similar expansions here just highlights an existing industrial and commercial deficit particularly in IDA jobs. I also don't see Waterford "upping its game" as an issue. This is a political problem.

Sully

fuzzy dunlop wrote: »

It doesn't matter if they are expansions or not.The fact that there is not similar expansions here just highlights an existing industrial and commercial deficit particularly in IDA jobs. I also don't see Waterford "upping its game" as an issue. This is a political problem.

Yes it does matter. You are giving the IDA to much credit to suggest they got these extra jobs. Its easy enough when the company is here alright to expand but you wont get them expanding outside of where they are located.

I also firmly believe its not all politics. Some companies have already stated why they setup in certain areas. So yes, such a report would very much be useful for Waterford to hit back and say "Well we have X, Y and Z" and put political pressure if its politics and the IDA being located elsewhere that is causing Waterford to be ignored.

Black Suir

Its not just the bloody city and the county that Phil Hogan should be mergin, but the whole bloody south east and even North and East Cork. Maybe that way if all the TD's from the area were to work together and not just for their own back garden area of the region, Waterford and its hinterland would get something. I am sure that despite the noise that some would make, if all TD's from the area were to work together and a major announcement job wise was made for maybe Clonmel or New Ross for example, or even Fermoy or Youghal, that there would be many people from Waterford city and county would travel to these towns if they were to get work. I know the latter two are a bit far from the city but am sure people from the west of the county would gladly drive daily for the work.

fuzzy dunlop

Sully wrote: »

Yes it does matter. You are giving the IDA to much credit to suggest they got these extra jobs. Its easy enough when the company is here alright to expand but you wont get them expanding outside of where they are located.

I also firmly believe its not all politics. Some companies have already stated why they setup in certain areas. So yes, such a report would very much be useful for Waterford to hit back and say "Well we have X, Y and Z" and put political pressure if its politics and the IDA being located elsewhere that is causing Waterford to be ignored.

A company cannot expand without major liason from the IDA. This is a fact. The IDA aren't just involved in turning sods and off they go on their merry way. It's the IDA's mandate to atract companies here and assist them while they are here and keep them here as long as possible. We don't need another [EMAIL="f@cking"]f@cking[/EMAIL] report which will just be another hand washing exercise by the government.

wellboy76

Sully wrote: »

How many of those jobs, in the past two years, were expansions?

I don't see why the IDA don't release the reasons for why a company choose a specification location. Such a report could help Waterford 'up its game'.

How can waterford up its game when the Ida, your lot and labour couldn't even find us on a map?

Sully

wellboy76 wrote: »

How can waterford up its game when the Ida, your lot and labour couldn't even find us on a map?

Your assuming that's the only problem.

shinzon

Sully wrote: »

Your assuming that's the only problem.

Dilapidated 1960's buildings that are repurposed and the persistant perception of the militant unionism thats prevalent in waterford would put off any prospective investor from opening up here, companies want shiny and new and no trouble TBH.

Shin

Wanderer2010

shinzon wrote: »

Dilapidated 1960's buildings that are repurposed and the persistant perception of the militant unionism thats prevalent in waterford would put off any prospective investor from opening up here, companies want shiny and new and no trouble TBH.

Shin

Yeah im going to have to agree with you on the militant unionism, its a very Waterford trait to have a workforce that is steeped in entitlement and when any small thing goes wrong or workers are unhappy, they run straight to their union rep and threaten strike. Witness the closures of Waterford Crystal and IVAX the last few years; yes, terrible for the city no doubt but the extent to which workers wanted every last drop from the company (IVAX, anyway) was unreal "Oh Im here 4 years im entitled to a huge payoff and if you dont give it to me I will ruin this place".

New companies dont want the hassle of dragging an old union along with its workplace and all the associated work to rule, strikes and hassle that comes with it. Even nowadays I still hear Waterford people banging on about old companies that closed down and votes over strike action, people being bitter about it, I havent seen that anywhere else..

hardybuck

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Yeah im going to have to agree with you on the militant unionism, its a very Waterford trait to have a workforce that is steeped in entitlement and when any small thing goes wrong or workers are unhappy, they run straight to their union rep and threaten strike. Witness the closures of Waterford Crystal and IVAX the last few years; yes, terrible for the city no doubt but the extent to which workers wanted every last drop from the company (IVAX, anyway) was unreal "Oh Im here 4 years im entitled to a huge payoff and if you dont give it to me I will ruin this place".

New companies dont want the hassle of dragging an old union along with its workplace and all the associated work to rule, strikes and hassle that comes with it. Even nowadays I still hear Waterford people banging on about old companies that closed down and votes over strike action, people being bitter about it, I havent seen that anywhere else..

Often new companies arriving in simply won't recognise unions at all...

jad2007

When Mary Coughlan visited Waterford in 2010 protestors tried to get into the hotel she was speaking at. She was stuck for three hours until Gardai managed to get her out.

Afterwards she told members of Waterford City Council that she would never come to Waterford again.

Last week we had a minister who had the same experience as he was trying to unveil flood defences.

Now leaving politics out of it regradless of peoples political opinion Waterford has a militant reputation.

Now lets just say the head of Google was coming to Waterford to look at a potential site, he would be met by a minister and what would happen. He would see a protest.

The second problem is we have no one lobbying on behalf of Waterford. Our politicians would rather debate the speed limit on the ring road.

Waterford suffers from a lack of political leadership on a shocking scale.

Wanderer2010

jad2007 wrote: »

When Mary Coughlan visited Waterford in 2010 protestors tried to get into the hotel she was speaking at. She was stuck for three hours until Gardai managed to get her out.

Afterwards she told members of Waterford City Council that she would never come to Waterford again.

Last week we had a minister who had the same experience as he was trying to unveil flood defences.

Now leaving politics out of it regradless of peoples political opinion Waterford has a militant reputation.

Hold your horses there pal, these "protestors" who tried to talk to Mary Coughlan were actually workers of Waterford Crystal who had just been made redundant and told their pensions, some of which were being paid into for 40 years, were worth nothing as the receiver who took over claimed they had no money to pay this out. Are you saying you wouldnt be very frustrated and angry at this situation? Bear in mind as well that Mary Coughlan took months to respond to the complaints from Waterford Crystal workers and then when she finally came to visit, she didnt even mention their plight and was dismissive to reporters afterwards. These same workers are STILL chasing their hard earned pensions through the highest court in the land.

The same would have happened if it was Cork, Dublin, Galway or anywhere where workers were told their pensions mean nothing after 40 years, that has nothing to do with Waterford as a city. Yes, I can see we have a militant reputation at times but the Mary Coughlan event was a different kettle of fish altogether.

jad2007

Fair enough the Mary Coughlan example is probably not the best one to choose,

Currently ever time a minister visits there is protests, now that is not unique to Waterford im sure at the moment but it contributes to the militant reputation of the City.

Take a more recent example, last week the Councillors who were against the merger of city and county were advising people to bombard the taoiseach's office with phone calls and emails about the matter. Now considering that submissions for that report closed last year all it acheived was adding to the militancy issue.

Sadly i think we are caught in a downward spiral as more jobs close people are getting angrier ( understandably ) and as we get more militant it gets harder to attract investment here. Unfortunately I dont see how we can break this cycle.

When Mary Roche was interviewed on Ian Noctor she was asked about the fact that Frank O'Regan ( Head of B& L ) was on the panel that wrote the merger report she stated that " If Frank is for the merger Ill never speak to him again". Its that type of attitude that gets us this reputation.

Wanderer2010

I cant recall there being many Minsiters visiting us recently? That could be supporting your point but I do know that when Phil Hogan visited he was protested regarding household charge but he has had that reaction everywhere in the country. Did Enda Kenny get a hard time when he visited Dawn Meats for that big expansion a few months ago? Maybe its our lack of ability to ask the right questions and the right time though, because here was the Taoiseach right on our doorstep and we could have asked him how the Jobs for South East was going, what plans were there for more investment in Ireland etc but what did we ask him? "Whats your favourite burger?"- I mean, Christ :rolleyes:

There are a lot of factors that may be adding to Waterford being isolated of late but it would be hard to get full agreement on all of them. Certainly the militant is one, but a lack of political will and backbone is definitely another.

mikemac1

Not all bad news, I wonder if you realize how much attention Governor Schweitzer brought to Waterford.

He was over in March
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0enXd7eMX7M

Talked about Waterford on RTÉ and talked about Ireland at the Democratic convention

One of the lowest unemployment rates of any of the 50 states, Montana is doing well.

He's a rising star, you'll hear more of his name in future and his State has lots of job creation.
Not just oil and gas and coal as that's what people assume

Could Waterford leaders focus of some sort of link
At least WIT could look at linking up

I don't know exactly what to do but maybe something could come up of it?

No other town or city or county in Ireland has a Governor talking about them

Max Powers

re: the protest when TD Hayes was turning sod on flood works.
These socialist workers who were protesting at a good news story are simply idiots. Fair enough protest at household charge but not when something positive is happening. These afterall are the same idiots who had a previus protest right outside Waterford Crytal during the summer. I saw tourists that wouldnt go near the place because of them. I spoke to someone who was down there and they had their placards in front of peoples faces and were basically trying to cause a physical confrontation, at least the council people and other down there had the intelligence to ignore it (a confrontation would possibly make national news).

As regards Waterford, idiots like these are everywhere and probably doing the same things across the country. I confronted them in red square about maybe not protesting in front of our main tourist attraction and he said after much fumbling that thats the way to get councils attention, says it all, too stupid to recognise they are hurting everyone even if they think that they are in the right.

fuzzy dunlop

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Yeah im going to have to agree with you on the militant unionism, its a very Waterford trait to have a workforce that is steeped in entitlement and when any small thing goes wrong or workers are unhappy, they run straight to their union rep and threaten strike. Witness the closures of Waterford Crystal and IVAX the last few years; yes, terrible for the city no doubt but the extent to which workers wanted every last drop from the company (IVAX, anyway) was unreal "Oh Im here 4 years im entitled to a huge payoff and if you dont give it to me I will ruin this place".

New companies dont want the hassle of dragging an old union along with its workplace and all the associated work to rule, strikes and hassle that comes with it. Even nowadays I still hear Waterford people banging on about old companies that closed down and votes over strike action, people being bitter about it, I havent seen that anywhere else..

Waterford Crystal went bust due to mismanagement and the economic crisis.It had nothing to do with militant trade unionism. Waterford industrrial militancy is a straw man arguement that is over used and does not justify the neglect that is going on. Yes there was periods of industrial unrest in the 80's in particular but this was not abnormal.The idea that Waterford is unique is not borne out by facts. Work days lost to strikes in Waterford are probably on the avaerage.Cork (Ford) and Limerick(Ferenca) have also had major casualties to industrrial action. There has been more unrest in Cork and l places like Green Isle in Naas during this recession and they are not engaged in this type of navel gazing.Galway gets more FDI from the US than anywhere in Europe practically and there able to erect a staue to Che Guevara and hardly anyone finds it the least bit ironic. There was a Soviet in Limerick ffs and it didn't stop the Shannon Free Zone being developed. Waterford seems to be the only place in Ireland that is expected to suffers consequences for demonstrating its political freedoms. I wonder why that is?

jad2007

The biggest factor that contributes to a lack of investment in Waterford in my opinion is shockingly poor political representation. Other factors contribute like a poor reputation on a national level and a general air of negativity. Is there a bias towards the west at the moment probably,

The biggest problem by far IMHO is the woeful quality of local politicians. I would advise everyone on here to attend at least one city council meeting and you will see what I mean. With a few exceptions our councillors are shocking.

Traditionally the route towards governement has been serve your time as councillor and then run for the Dail, what we need is more young intelligent people willing to get involved in local politics on all sides in every party and let us pick the best.

When we see these job announcements all over the country we need to start asking ourselves who is lobbying on behalf of Waterford ?

In all fairness if we had a head of a multinational arrive in Waterford tomorrow who would we even introduce him to ? There isnt five local politicians that I could think of that could hold a intelligent conversation with around the issue of FDI.

Max Powers

jad2007 wrote: »

The biggest factor that contributes to a lack of investment in Waterford in my opinion is shockingly poor political representation. Other factors contribute like a poor reputation on a national level and a general air of negativity. Is there a bias towards the west at the moment probably,

The biggest problem by far IMHO is the woeful quality of local politicians. I would advise everyone on here to attend at least one city council meeting and you will see what I mean. With a few exceptions our councillors are shocking.

Traditionally the route towards governement has been serve your time as councillor and then run for the Dail, what we need is more young intelligent people willing to get involved in local politics on all sides in every party and let us pick the best.

When we see these job announcements all over the country we need to start asking ourselves who is lobbying on behalf of Waterford ?

In all fairness if we had a head of a multinational arrive in Waterford tomorrow who would we even introduce him to ? There isnt five local politicians that I could think of that could hold a intelligent conversation with around the issue of FDI.

+1. COmplete bunch of useless idiots, councillors are gas bags and our TDs havent done anything positive as far as I can see on jobs, proper investment...stuff thats really important. That flood relief work is a positive alright but small feed when you think of the IDA FDI jobs being announced across the country.

Wanderer2010

^ Em, hate to state the obvious here but who votes these idiots in year after year after year? Us, thats who. Certainly when FF ruled, we had Brendan Kennealy in every year but what exactly did he do for this city? And now it seems we will puff our chest out in public but still pick the devil we know behind it all..

As for the militant unionism, theres no doubt Waterford still carries this rep with it and closures at IVAX exposed some of the most vile worker revolts of recent years. I know Cork and Dublin etc have had closures but every reputation has an element of truth in it and it may be stopping any investment into this region, and I agree that our local politicians arent exactly a strong group :rolleyes:

comeraghs

Mary Roche is about the only Waterford politician I could support at the moment.