Eircom eFibre VDSL/FTTC rollout – plans to reach 1.6m premises by mid 2016

Johnboy1951

Sam Russell wrote: »

My area was supposed to be Nov 2013, and now Apr 2014, but the box is not even had its concrete slab poured yet so it will not be April this year.

I wonder which is more frustrating ..... not being on the list at all (my area) or being on it and the time scale extending seemingly indefinitely :eek:

Sam Russell

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I wonder which is more frustrating ..... not being on the list at all (my area) or being on it and the time scale extending seemingly indefinitely :eek:

Difficult. The complete absense of a date or a date that is obviously a fiction and not going to happen. Not a lot of difference in my opinion.

VinLieger

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

I wonder which is more frustrating ..... not being on the list at all (my area) or being on it and the time scale extending seemingly indefinitely :eek:

Ill tell you whats worse. Being on the list, having your area down as accessible, being able to see the cabinet from my window but it still not being available in my house for some bizarre fvcking reason only known to eircom

jca

Sam Russell wrote: »

My area was supposed to be Nov 2013, and now Apr 2014, but the box is not even had its concrete slab poured yet so it will not be April this year.

The slab isn't poured. It arrives on the lorry as a pre-cast block, saves installation time I suppose.

red_bairn

VinLieger wrote: »

Ill tell you whats worse. Being on the list, having your area down as accessible, being able to see the cabinet from my window but it still not being available in my house for some bizarre fvcking reason only known to eircom

Probably have the same situation as our household. Direct fed.

degsie

This seems backwards to me. It would seem to be easier to upgrade directly connected lines in the exchange as it would involve only rack mounting the VDSL equipment and power would already be available in the exchange. Then it's just a matter of jumpering the copper pairs. Roadside installations involves a full crew to dig up pavements, install cabs, run power and migrate copper lines. Why would exchange installation be left till last?

Manc Red

If you are connected directly via the exchange, will you be connected to the closest cabinet when "Fibre" does come or will you be served via the exchange?

I'd imagine the majority of customers being served via the exchange are connected a couple of kilometers away thus the benefit of "Fibre" being nullified if the Fibre is going to served via the exchange.

Side note: I was told customers connected via the exchange will be connected to the closet cabinet when it does come. I'm not sure if it's true tho.

yomamasflavour

Manc Red wrote: »

If you are connected directly via the exchange, will you be connected to the closest cabinet when "Fibre" does come or will you be served via the exchange?

I'd imagine the majority of customers being served via the exchange are connected a couple of kilometers away thus the benefit of "Fibre" being nullified if the Fibre is going to served via the exchange.

Side note: I was told customers connected via the exchange will be connected to the closet cabinet when it does come. I'm not sure if it's true tho.

In the UK with BT's rollout, in a handful of places, to get around the exchange legal issues they installed a cabinet right next to the exchange and merely connected up the lines as if it was a standard cabinet connection.

Though they've only done this in a very small number of locations, and besides for the majority of lines connected to the exchange it would make no difference as they'd be longer lines than what vdsl can support.

The only solution I see is to start installing new lines for people. Which is something they don't seem to want to do. Also If you're going to go the bother of implementing such a program it wouldn't make any sense to do it for copper, you might as well just start rolling out fibre connections instead.

So I don't realistically see them doing anything for exchange connected users.

Manc Red

Is FTTH still in the pipeline for eircom?

degsie

Manc Red wrote: »

Is FTTH still in the pipeline for eircom?

Lets see....



No, getting nothing...

Gonzo

whats also frustrating is the places where they are sticking the cabinets, in my exchange, Dunshaughlin is only a small segment of the actual Dunshaughlin exchange area, they are only rolling out 10 cabinets, with 3 of them within 200meters of each other on the eastern side of the town and nothing for the semi rural areas beyond that where even 1 cabinet could serve the 60/70 houses there. Yet 1.5km south of dunshaughlin there is a cabinet being installed in the middle of nowhere with just a petal station and about 10 houses within 300 meteres of it. Really makes my blood boil.

yomamasflavour

Gonzo wrote: »

whats also frustrating is the places where they are sticking the cabinets, in my exchange, Dunshaughlin is only a small segment of the actual Dunshaughlin exchange area, they are only rolling out 10 cabinets, with 3 of them within 200meters of each other on the eastern side of the town and nothing for the semi rural areas beyond that where even 1 cabinet could serve the 60/70 houses there. Yet 1.5km south of dunshaughlin there is a cabinet being installed in the middle of nowhere with just a petal station and about 10 houses within 300 meteres of it. Really makes my blood boil.

The vdsl cabinet install locations are a legacy issue.

They have to install the cabinets next to splitter cabinets that have possibly been in place for a decade or more.

My village has the same issue, 4 of the 5 cabinets that are being put in are all clustered together within 250 metres of each other, and they're all right next to the exchange.

So, essentialy this rollout will make no difference to anyone *(in my area) not already serviced by a decent adsl connection.

jca

yomamasflavour wrote: »

The vdsl cabinet install locations are a legacy issue.

They have to install the cabinets next to splitter cabinets that have possibly been in place for a decade or more.

My village has the same issue, 4 of the 5 cabinets that are being put in are all clustered together within 250 metres of each other, and they're all right next to the exchange.

So, essentialy this rollout will make no difference to anyone not already serviced by a decent adsl connection.

That isn't really true. There are many people connected to a cabinet who were getting terrible speeds via adsl and since the cabinet became part of the fibre network are now enjoying a great connection.

jd

yomamasflavour wrote: »

So, essentialy this rollout will make no difference to anyone not already serviced by a decent adsl connection.

That's not true. There are quite a few of people who are in suburban/semi-rural areas that have had speeds improved from 2/3 meg to >40meg

gerryk

jca wrote: »

That isn't really true. There are many people connected to a cabinet who were getting terrible speeds via adsl and since the cabinet became part of the fibre network are now enjoying a great connection.

It's those of us that have no cabinet nearby, and no plans for a cabinet in the future, that are proper ****ed.

seanp_25

Just got bumped up on Magnet in Cork City after calling support.

Pre-vectoring, 67Mb/s: http://www.speedtest.net/result/3429886988.png

2.4	Line Rate (Down / Up)	71678 Kbps / 20479 Kbps
2.5	Noise Margin (Down / Up)	17.3 dB / 8.6 dB
2.6	Attenuation (Down / Up)	4.6 dB / 1.4 dB
2.7	Power (Down / Up)	14.1 dBm / -21.5 dBm

Last week, the noise margin jumped from 17.3dB to 23dB, so I guess vectoring was turned on then. After moving to 100MB profile:

Post-upgrade, 94MB/s: http://www.speedtest.net/result/3429909432.png

2.4	Line Rate (Down / Up)	102396 Kbps / 20478 Kbps
2.5	Noise Margin (Down / Up)	18.6 dB / 10.2 dB
2.6	Attenuation (Down / Up)	4.6 dB / 1.3 dB
2.7	Power (Down / Up)	14.1 dBm / -21.4 dBm

yomamasflavour

jca wrote: »

That isn't really true. There are many people connected to a cabinet who were getting terrible speeds via adsl and since the cabinet became part of the fibre network are now enjoying a great connection.

jd wrote: »

That's not true. There are quite a few of people who are in suburban/semi-rural areas that have had speeds improved from 2/3 meg to >40meg

I was talking about my area.

In my vilage the new vdsl cabs are all very close together and very close to the exchange.

For people in the exchange area that weren't previously able to get broadband this will make no difference,

Gonzo

jca wrote: »

That isn't really true. There are many people connected to a cabinet who were getting terrible speeds via adsl and since the cabinet became part of the fibre network are now enjoying a great connection.

In larger towns this would be true, places like Drogheda, Navan and other such towns have fibre cabinets in urban areas up to 5km from the central exchange, but there are quite a few places similar to where I live such as Dunshaughlin, a relatively small town where the cabinets are being installed all clustered together over a small area rarely more than 500meters from the exchange itself while the areas just beyond that even 1 to 3km away from the centre of the town is completely ignored where only 2 or 3 extra cabinets spread slightly outside the town would make a world of difference to quite a few people including myself. Im fairly certain that at least 2 of the cabinets in Dunshaughlin are going to waste as the other cabinets less than a 2 minute walk away could easily serve such locations anyway.

dxhound2005

Gonzo wrote: »

In larger towns this would be true, places like Drogheda, Navan and other such towns have fibre cabinets in urban areas up to 5km from the central exchange, but there are quite a few places similar to where I live such as Dunshaughlin, a relatively small town where the cabinets are being installed all clustered together over a small area rarely more than 500meters from the exchange itself while the areas just beyond that even 1 to 3km away from the centre of the town is completely ignored where only 2 or 3 extra cabinets spread slightly outside the town would make a world of difference to quite a few people including myself. Im fairly certain that at least 2 of the cabinets in Dunshaughlin are going to waste as the other cabinets less than a 2 minute walk away could easily serve such locations anyway.

I thought the idea was to put a fibre cabinet beside a copper one. Are you served by an existing copper cabinet, or are you connected directly to the exchange?

Gonzo

dxhound2005 wrote: »

I thought the idea was to put a fibre cabinet beside a copper one. Are you served by an existing copper cabinet, or are you connected directly to the exchange?

I am fed directly to the exchange with 3km line length, there are no copper cabinets anywhere outside of Dunshaughlin town itself ( nearest one to me is about 2km to my west). There are a few white cabinets in and around the town and in each housing estate, these are the places where the fibre cabinets are being situated but some of these cabinets are no more than 250 meters apart and fibre is good up to 1km ( in terms of speed beyond 24meg) so I don't see why they are installing 3 of them close together when 1 could do and put 2 elsewhere that really needs them. Everyone in the town of Dunshaughlin can get 12-24meg depending on dsl anyway yet those of us close by on 4-10meg will not benefit whatsoever.

ED E

Gonzo wrote: »

I am fed directly to the exchange, there are no copper cabinets anywhere outside of Dunshaughlin town itself, at least I can't see any. There are a few white cabinets in and around the town and in each housing estate, these are the places where the fibre cabinets are being situated but some of these cabinets are no more than 250 meters apart and fibre is good up to 1km ( in terms of speed beyond 24meg) so I don't see why they are installing 3 of them close together when 1 could do and put 2 elsewhere that really needs them. Everyone in the town of Dunshaughlin can get 12-24meg depending on dsl anyway yet those of us close by on 4-10meg will not benefit whatsoever.

They're putting them close to the current cabs. If they only put one in and there are three copper cabs then only a third of the locality could get VDSL. They aren't choosing where to put them now, that decision was made 30+ years ago.

Sounds like the rest of the lines may be direct fed of on underground cabs. In that kind of situation youd need new cabs and a lot of lines work to get VDSL to the rest. Its more likely you'll get FTTH in a few years.

AlanS181824

What happens when this rollout is finished? Will Eircom begin preparing for an FTTH rollout?

OneEightSeven

AlanS181824 wrote: »

What happens when this rollout is finished? Will Eircom begin preparing for an FTTH rollout?

They'll most likely do that sooner because of competition from ESB and UPC. Also, whenever there's a new housing estate, Eircom will need a cabinet for it, so they will always be building cabinets and lying down fibre in the future.

Impetus

It seems to be that the main issue to bear in mind is that it would be extremely unwise if UPC had a de-facto monopoly. You would end up with a situation as is the case in many parts of the US where many households are paying $150 to $200 a month to the local cable monopoly, for what by European standards is a crappy service. By crappy I mean quality of service and contention ratio issues - rather than speeds which are just marketing hype for idiots.

In many countries you have just two pipelines to compete. Cable and xDSL. xDSL is dead and there are many companies selling VDSL2 kit to xDSLers (like eircom) (like they sold ADSL2+ kit a few years ago) grabbing a few hundred million in the process, and delivering only an incremental increase in performance for the money. Back in the day eircom spent zillions installing modems to provide "flat rate" dial up internet. As old fashioned telcos try and stretch their copper pair shelf life for another few years. Each generation means a large new investment. Telcos would be far better off grasping the nettle, and installing future proof fibre - uninstalling the expensive copper / switched network completely.

Many people with slow PCs that have a lot of old software and spinning disk drives (rather than SSDs) mightn't notice how slow their page fills are, especially when doing an inquiry online while talking on the phone etc. For me this is the biggest problem with UPC when I am in Ireland, aside from a future concern about another monopoly developing (like The Post Office was in the dim and distant past). I remember in one year The Dept of P & T monopoly had a 40% price increase! And the idiot population paid up. Because they had no choice.

The only sustainable country-wide solution is an open fibre optic network available to all types of ISPs and content suppliers and telcos, working to a common standard, and available to everybody.

Manc Red

OneEightSeven wrote: »

They'll most likely do that sooner because of competition from ESB and UPC. Also, whenever there's a new housing estate, Eircom will need a cabinet for it, so they will always be building cabinets and lying down fibre in the future.

Does eircom now future proof new houses with FTTH cabling then?

I've yet to see or hear of eircom doing this.

Impetus

Manc Red wrote: »

Does eircom now future proof new houses with FTTH cabling then?

I've yet to see or hear of eircom doing this.

A fibre platform should be an item of national infrastructure - like the roads. There is only one road network, but it is used by dozens of brands of cars, trucks, buses, etc. The mark of a mature platform. When email started first, subscribers to MCI mail could only send emails to other MCI subscribers...

The industry needs to agree standards and to do that the government must make the decision. The physical installation and maintenance of a fiber network could be outsourced to one or more entities. Financed by a portion of the monthly fee paid for by the service. With the option of the householder making a capital contribution for the cost of bringing fibre to their door, in return for lower monthly costs.

Eircom is an irrelevant entity peddling obsolete technology based on the copper pair.

PS Netflix is using the new H.265 CODEC for 4kTV. Anyone investing in a 4K UHD TV should ensure that the TV supports this CODEC. And that their broadband provider will be operating in a competitive environment where they won't get away with traffic shaping etc. Broadcast TV is also obsolete, as it is far more convenient to watch a programme when one wants to, on demand. TV stations should be websites that stream content. like live.twit.tv and similar

red_bairn

Manc Red wrote: »

Does eircom now future proof new houses with FTTH cabling then?

I've yet to see or hear of eircom doing this.

Sandyford and Dundrum. Already done.

Danny Boy

Impetus wrote: »

A fibre platform should be an item of national infrastructure - like the roads. There is only one road network, but it is used by dozens of brands of cars, trucks, buses, etc. The mark of a mature platform. When email started first, subscribers to MCI mail could only send emails to other MCI subscribers...

The industry needs to agree standards and to do that the government must make the decision. The physical installation and maintenance of a fiber network could be outsourced to one or more entities. Financed by a portion of the monthly fee paid for by the service. With the option of the householder making a capital contribution for the cost of bringing fibre to their door, in return for lower monthly costs.

Eircom is an irrelevant entity peddling obsolete technology based on the copper pair.

In total they have more fibre than the rest combined,
http://www.eircomwholesale.ie/Our_Network/

crawler

red_bairn wrote: »

Sandyford and Dundrum. Already done.

....Badly

jca

Impetus wrote: »

It seems to be that the main issue to bear in mind is that it would be extremely unwise if UPC had a de-facto monopoly. You would end up with a situation as is the case in many parts of the US where many households are paying $150 to $200 a month to the local cable monopoly, for what by European standards is a crappy service. By crappy I mean quality of service and contention ratio issues - rather than speeds which are just marketing hype for idiots.

In many countries you have just two pipelines to compete. Cable and xDSL. xDSL is dead and there are many companies selling VDSL2 kit to xDSLers (like eircom) (like they sold ADSL2+ kit a few years ago) grabbing a few hundred million in the process, and delivering only an incremental increase in performance for the money. Back in the day eircom spent zillions installing modems to provide "flat rate" dial up internet. As old fashioned telcos try and stretch their copper pair shelf life for another few years. Each generation means a large new investment. Telcos would be far better off grasping the nettle, and installing future proof fibre - uninstalling the expensive copper / switched network completely.

Many people with slow PCs that have a lot of old software and spinning disk drives (rather than SSDs) mightn't notice how slow their page fills are, especially when doing an inquiry online while talking on the phone etc. For me this is the biggest problem with UPC when I am in Ireland, aside from a future concern about another monopoly developing (like The Post Office was in the dim and distant past). I remember in one year The Dept of P & T monopoly had a 40% price increase! And the idiot population paid up. Because they had no choice.

The only sustainable country-wide solution is an open fibre optic network available to all types of ISPs and content suppliers and telcos, working to a common standard, and available to everybody.

There's no chance of UPC ever becoming a de-facto monopoly they're only interested in the cities and very large towns. I'd hardly call my speed jumping from 8 meg to 48 meg for €35 pm(€50 after 6 months) an "incremental" increase. I'd sooner enjoy 48 meg than stay with 8 meg and wait for "some" telecoms company to arrive and give me ftth. It ain't going to happen.