Coil Tire, Doughuisce Clamping

jd

Coill Tire wrote: »

I Why should I buy permits before family and friends can visit? .

Why not? Try living in many streets in Dublin and you'll find your visitors have to pay parking charges.
http://www.google.com/maps?ll=53.333519,-6.267024&spn=0.003626,0.009645&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.333475,-6.267025&panoid=flk64rB4anacP-DrNiE7Ng&cbp=12,105.08,,1,3.64

mathepac

Coill Tire wrote: »

... The OMC is obliged to send the agenda to all occupiers but they didn't. ....

No - their obligations are exclusively to management company members in good standing .i.e. paid up.

jd

Coill Tire wrote: »

I am not in arrears. If this is all about recovering charges, section 22 of the MUD Act considers charges as a simple contract debt which can be recovered in a court of competent jurisdiction. Whoever is in arrears will be liable for legal cost incurred in the process..

This is all very well, but if the management company is getting to the stage where it can't pay immediate bills that are falling due, parking restrictions work well in getting money in. Getting cases through the circuit court takes time.
http://www.courts.ie/__80256FFF005DDD92.nsf/0/467D312858AD4F99802579600048895F?Open

eg
County Registrar's List: 9th December 2011 Tax Rulings


Before County Registrar
At 2.30 pm
Aras Uí Dhalaigh
Ground Floor
Court 33

1 2008/08715 Temple Gardens Management Company Ltd - V - John Proctor And Tony Gibson

By the way, are there Duplexes and Apartments in this development? If there isn't money to pay for the block insurance this has implications for people#s mortgages

jd

Coill Tire wrote: »

The OMC is obliged to send the agenda to all occupiers .

To all owners, ie members of the MC.

Damie

jd wrote: »

Why not? Try living in many streets in Dublin and you'll find your visitors have to pay parking charges.
http://www.google.com/maps?ll=53.333519,-6.267024&spn=0.003626,0.009645&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.333475,-6.267025&panoid=flk64rB4anacP-DrNiE7Ng&cbp=12,105.08,,1,3.64

Whats living in Dublin go to do with this argument tho?

jd

Damie wrote: »

Whats living in Dublin go to do with this argument tho?

Just illustrating that there is not a "right" of free parking.

Damie

Not wanting to get involved in the debate really, but comparing to Dublin or anywhere else is pointless...that's all I wanted to say....im off to bed!

mathepac

jd wrote: »

To all owners, ie members of the MC.

No - see above - "their obligations are exclusively to management company members in good standing .i.e. paid up. "

jd

mathepac wrote: »

No - see above - "their obligations are exclusively to management company members in good standing .i.e. paid up. "

Yes, of course. I was differentiating between occupiers and owners.

Coill Tire

jd wrote: »

To all owners, ie members of the MC.

Section 23 of the MUD Act says

(a) unit owners,
(b) tenants of unit owners, and
(c) servants, agents and licensees of persons referred to in (a) and (b).

Coill Tire

jd wrote: »

This is all very well, but if the management company is getting to the stage where it can't pay immediate bills that are falling due, parking restrictions work well in getting money in. Getting cases through the circuit court takes time.
http://www.courts.ie/__80256FFF005DDD92.nsf/0/467D312858AD4F99802579600048895F?Open

By the way, are there Duplexes and Apartments in this development? If there isn't money to pay for the block insurance this has implications for people#s mortgages

That is not a license to take law into their hands. Things have to be done according to the rule of law and not infringe on the fundamental human rights of individuals, be it owner or tenant. Laws can only be made where there are statutory provisions for it.

Coill Tire

jd wrote: »

Why not? Try living in many streets in Dublin and you'll find your visitors have to pay parking charges.
http://www.google.com/maps?ll=53.333519,-6.267024&spn=0.003626,0.009645&t=m&z=17&layer=c&cbll=53.333475,-6.267025&panoid=flk64rB4anacP-DrNiE7Ng&cbp=12,105.08,,1,3.64

You've decided to go far by comparing Coill Tire with Dublin. Fine. I will prefer to compare Coill Tire with places much closer like An Fiodan, Tur Uisce, Fearann Ri, Roscam, Castan, etc., where visitors DON'T have to pay parking charges.

When you have off road parking in Dublin you don't pay parking charges and most streets in Dublin are public roads. Units in Coill Tire are not on public roads and most have off road parking space.

jd

Coill Tire wrote: »

Section 23 of the MUD Act says

(a) unit owners,
(b) tenants of unit owners, and
(c) servants, agents and licensees of persons referred to in (a) and (b).

That section does not refer to sending the AGM to tenants etc. |Only the owners of units have the right to attend an AGM/EGM and voting is on the basis 1 vote per unit.

An owners’ management company may, as respects the
multi-unit development for which that company has responsibility,
make house rules as respects the development or part of the development relating to the effective operation and maintenance of the
development and with the objective of enhancing the quiet and
peaceable occupation of units generally in the development, and such
house rules shall be binding on—
(a) unit owners,
(b) tenants of unit owners, and
(c) servants, agents and licensees of persons referred to in
paragraphs (a) and (b). etc etc

Coill Tire

jd wrote: »

That section does not refer to sending the AGM to tenants etc. |Only the owners of units have the right to attend an AGM/EGM and voting is on the basis 1 vote per unit.

Nobody is talking about right to attend AGM. But the decisions made at the AGM must put all occupants of units into consideration. You've said it all. 1 vote per unit.

Below is section 23, subsection 1 & 7

23.—(1) An owners’ management company may, as respects the multi-unit development for which that company has responsibility, make house rules as respects the development or part of the development relating to the effective operation and maintenance of the development and with the objective of enhancing the quiet and peaceable occupation of units generally in the development, and such house rules shall be binding on—

(a) unit owners,
(b) tenants of unit owners, and
(c) servants, agents and licensees of persons referred to in
paragraphs (a) and (b).


(7) Following the approval of rules under this section the owners’ management company shall furnish a copy of the rules to each unit owner and shall also send a copy to each unit in the development.

mathepac

Coill Tire wrote: »

Section 23 of the MUD Act says

(a) unit owners,
(b) tenants of unit owners, and
(c) servants, agents and licensees of persons referred to in (a) and (b).

2 Application a) Applies to all Muds b) A reference to fair and equitable apportionment of the costs and expenses of the Mud shall mean that account is taken of all relevant matters including the respective level of use of any common areas by the owners of different classes of units

23 House Rules a) House rules consistent with the provisions of the relevant leases and title documents may be made, and if so made, are binding on unit owners and tenants, their servants, agents and licensees. b) House rules must be circulated beforehand and approved by the owners in general meeting c) Copies must be circulated to each owner and a copy distributed to each unit. d) A copy must be appended to every letting and licence agreement. e) The OMC is entitled to recover the cost of remedying any breach as a simple contract debt Reproduced above are summaries of sections 2 and 23 of the MUD Act 2011.

Section 2 deals exclusively with Applicability of the the MUD Act. I am unsure as to how Section 23 is relevant to this discussion of maintenance and parking restrictions and charges as it refers exclusively to house rules, unless I am completely wrong.

Coill Tire

mathepac wrote: »

2 Application a) Applies to all Muds b) A reference to fair and equitable apportionment of the costs and expenses of the Mud shall mean that account is taken of all relevant matters including the respective level of use of any common areas by the owners of different classes of units

23 House Rules a) House rules consistent with the provisions of the relevant leases and title documents may be made, and if so made, are binding on unit owners and tenants, their servants, agents and licensees. b) House rules must be circulated beforehand and approved by the owners in general meeting c) Copies must be circulated to each owner and a copy distributed to each unit. d) A copy must be appended to every letting and licence agreement. e) The OMC is entitled to recover the cost of remedying any breach as a simple contract debt Reproduced above are summaries of sections 2 and 23 of the MUD Act 2011.

Section 2 deals exclusively with Applicability of the the MUD Act. I am unsure as to how Section 23 is relevant to this discussion of maintenance and parking restrictions and charges as it refers exclusively to house rules, unless I am completely wrong.

Yes you are wrong. I received the AGM notice yesterday, and parking restriction is listed under house rules.

Sponge Bob

Grand, so you go to the AGM and vote so. Tell us how it goes afterwards.

Coill Tire

Sponge Bob wrote: »

Grand, so you go to the AGM and vote so. Tell us how it goes afterwards.

According to the MUD Act, section 23 subsection 6,

The notice of the meeting to consider the making of house rules under this section shall be accompanied by a draft of the proposed rules.

The OMC did not attach any draft proposal with the AGM notice, as such, I don't see how any change or review of the existing house rule can be made.
For now, as far as house rules are concerned, no consideration or voting can take place.

Coill Tire

mathepac wrote: »

2 Application a) Applies to all Muds b) A reference to fair and equitable apportionment of the costs and expenses of the Mud shall mean that account is taken of all relevant matters including the respective level of use of any common areas by the owners of different classes of units

23 House Rules a) House rules consistent with the provisions of the relevant leases and title documents may be made, and if so made, are binding on unit owners and tenants, their servants, agents and licensees. b) House rules must be circulated beforehand and approved by the owners in general meeting c) Copies must be circulated to each owner and a copy distributed to each unit. d) A copy must be appended to every letting and licence agreement. e) The OMC is entitled to recover the cost of remedying any breach as a simple contract debt Reproduced above are summaries of sections 2 and 23 of the MUD Act 2011.

Section 2 deals exclusively with Applicability of the the MUD Act. I am unsure as to how Section 23 is relevant to this discussion of maintenance and parking restrictions and charges as it refers exclusively to house rules, unless I am completely wrong.

mathepac, apologies for my previous response to your comment as it was not correct. I mistakenly referred to something different from parking restriction. I hope my apology is accepted.

Going back to the issue, there is no provision in the MUD Act that gives powers to the OMC to take hard line stance on the collection of charges. Parking restriction is a hard line stance proposed by the managing agent and which is punishment without statutory law or provision and it is a deprivation of the civil liberty of affected people. The statutory provision for the recovery of charges is in Section 22 of the MUD Act.

Article 1 of Protocol 4 of European Convention on Human Rights states that - No one shall be deprived of his liberty merely on the ground of inability to fulfil a contractual obligation.

Coill Tire

The issue of car clamping on private estates on 4fm today.

mathepac

To avoid the possibility of being clamped, I used the txt service a week or so ago and it worked seamlessly., txting again 24hrs later to renew my vows, so to speak. It worked well, costing only the price of the two txts.

My hosts had a spare windscreen parking permit, I just wanted to test the system.

FR.Ted Crilly

HardyEustace wrote: »

And given they are bringin it in for Coill Tire, will it just push illegal parking to An fiodan?

True i saw this happen look at all the cars parked on the entrance to Coill Tire from An Fiodan they just park and walk to there homes sheer cheek

Coill Tire

FR.Ted Crilly wrote: »

True i saw this happen look at all the cars parked on the entrance to Coill Tire from An Fiodan they just park and walk to there homes sheer cheek

This is what happens when a management company decides to follow an illegal route to force people to pay their arrears. 25% of the arrears owed the management company is from the estate developer but they are untouchable because they've gone into administration. Another 25% of arrears owed the MC is from an individual who doesn't leave in the estate and would not be affected in any way by the parking enforcement.

Only ordinary individuals - probably also in administration - are touchable and are now being forced to park their cars away from their 'homes' and to make matters worse, their neighbours are accusing them for illegal parking on empty parking spaces. What a world!

Robbo

Coill Tire wrote: »

This is what happens when a management company decides to follow an illegal route to force people to pay their arrears. 25% of the arrears owed the management company is from the estate developer but they are untouchable because they've gone into administration. Another 25% of arrears owed the MC is from an individual who doesn't leave in the estate and would not be affected in any way by the parking enforcement.

Only ordinary individuals - probably also in administration - are touchable and are now being forced to park their cars away from their 'homes' and to make matters worse, their neighbours are accusing them for illegal parking on empty parking spaces. What a world!

There is no administration in Irish Company Law. I presume the builder you're referring to is McInerney's who are in receivership after a failed tilt at examinership.

Your beef is with the management agent. Attend the AGM if it's soon or call an EGM and threaten to arrange a coup (there has been a new entrant into the Galway market for management agents recently) if the clamping regime isn't relaxed. At the very least, it'll give the residents some shared sense of purpose.

Coill Tire

Robbo wrote: »

There is no administration in Irish Company Law. I presume the builder you're referring to is McInerney's who are in receivership after a failed tilt at examinership.

Your beef is with the management agent. Attend the AGM if it's soon or call an EGM and threaten to arrange a coup (there has been a new entrant into the Galway market for management agents recently) if the clamping regime isn't relaxed. At the very least, it'll give the residents some shared sense of purpose.

Agents of the clamping company have been harassing people with clamping warnings but they can not clamp any car due to a Court Injunction issued 01/03/2012 which forbids clamping in Coill Tire. The Defendant filed a motion asking the Circuit Court to strike out the injunction but the Plaintiff has entered an opposition to the motion. Hearing was to be held on Friday 8th of June but the solicitor for the Defendant did not show up hence hearing has been adjourned till later this month.

Until the Court decides otherwise, people can park their cars without fear of being clamped.

mathepac

Coill Tire wrote: »

Agents of the clamping company have been harassing people with clamping warnings ...

If this is true the agents may be in contempt of court. Can you have someone check the injunction wording?

Coill Tire

mathepac wrote: »

If this is true the agents may be in contempt of court. Can you have someone check the injunction wording?

Yes it is true, I have a copy of the Injunction. This is a link to the Court diary -

http://www.courts.ie/legaldiary.nsf/0/A726E55A2B61CE8980257A0F0055AE7A?OpenDocument

It's number 34 on the list.

Wording of the Injunction

The Defendant, Winters Property Management, be forbidden (whether by its servants, agents, officers or otherwise) from implementing parking enforcement in Coill Tire, Doughiska, Galway, pending further order of this Court.......

dannyd20

Coill Tire wrote: »

Yes it is true, I have a copy of the Injunction. This is a link to the Court diary -

http://www.courts.ie/legaldiary.nsf/0/A726E55A2B61CE8980257A0F0055AE7A?OpenDocument

It's number 34 on the list.

Wording of the Injunction

The Defendant, Winters Property Management, be forbidden (whether by its servants, agents, officers or otherwise) from implementing parking enforcement in Coill Tire, Doughiska, Galway, pending further order of this Court.......

Don't think it is stopping the clampers cos I drove past a clamped car in Coill Tire yesterday. The apcoa van was nearby.

Where did you get the wording of the injunction?

Coill Tire

dannyd20 wrote: »

Don't think it is stopping the clampers cos I drove past a clamped car in Coill Tire yesterday. The apcoa van was nearby.

Where did you get the wording of the injunction?

I have a copy of the Injunction. You can also confirm the record number (286/12) at the Circuit Court Office.

Do you know the owner of the car that was clamped or can you remember the exact location of the clamping? The Injunction is still active - at the least - until the next Court Date . A Motion of contempt can only be raised if one can get evidence of payment made to release a clamped car in Coill Tire.

mathepac

Coill Tire wrote: »

... The Defendant, Winters Property Management, be forbidden (whether by its servants, agents, officers or otherwise) from implementing parking enforcement in Coill Tire, Doughiska, Galway, pending further order of this Court.......

"Harassing" would-be parkers sounds like "implementing parking enforcement" to me but I'm a lay-person, as is the litigant. Any law lecturers or junior barristers in the locality?