Three could buy O2 ireland?

Kxiii

krudler wrote: »

That, you can throw all the free iphones and unlimited data at people all you want but when even after all that your market is a drop in the ocean compared to O2 and vodafone then it's down to people realising that there's more to a good network than a free phone and data. how many people jumped to 3 then went back to another network the minute their contract ended? loads.
Their appalling customer service record speaks for itself, there's not a hope corporate and business customers currently with O2 will put up with 3's call centre in India so the likelihood is that the business aspect may stay here out of the O2 Limerick or Dublin offices.

Threes Business customer care is based in Waterford, it just the consumer side thats dealt with through Mumbai.

krudler

Kxiii wrote: »

Threes Business customer care is based in Waterford, it just the consumer side thats dealt with through Mumbai.

Ah ok didnt realise that, any idea how big the workforce is?

SpaceTime

All this is total speculation.

For all we know, Hutchison Whampoa might just operate what is now O2 Ireland pretty much "as is" and wind up "3 Ireland" or use it as a budget brand, much like O2 use 48.

You have to remember that "3" is designed as a low cost market disruptor, not as an incumbent network so they might have no particular interest in off-shoring all of O2's call centre staff.

In short, we have no idea what they might do. Hutchison Whampoa run really good operations in other jurisdictions e.g. Hong Kong and they originally launched Orange in the UK (now France Telecom owned and FT actually re-branded itself Orange in the end)

I'd say it's most likely to stick with the "3" brand or some variant of it though as it has huge global marketing synergies and it also has spent a lot of money developing the brand in Ireland.

If anything, the Three brand is far too flashy for a small player like Three Ireland itself.

Telefonica seems to have let O2's branding deteriorate. It was very edgy and sophisticated during the MMO2 ownership when it was an independent entity.

O2 UK and O2 Germany may yet be floated or sold off too, so who knows what might happen. Telefonica's debt is absolutely astronomical.

Bear in mind that O2 Ireland is not in bad shape at all, the price it went for would indicate it's doing pretty well for a relatively small operator.

Kxiii

krudler wrote: »

Ah ok didnt realise that, any idea how big the workforce is?

I would reckon maybe 40 or so work on the business team between the different departments. Wouldn't think it would be anywhere as many as O2 have in limerick though.

wexfordman2

SpaceTime wrote: »

All this is total speculation.

For all we know, Hutchison Whampoa might just operate what is now O2 Ireland pretty much "as is" and wind up "3 Ireland" or use it as a budget brand, much like O2 use 48.

Except 48 is not a physical network, but o2 and 3 are! Also, yesterdays announcement said that the o2 brand would dissapear over time, so three will definately be retained as the main brand it would seem.

SpaceTime wrote: »

You have to remember that "3" is designed as a low cost market disruptor, not as an incumbent network so they might have no particular interest in off-shoring all of O2's call centre staff.

I beleive the ceo of 3 mentioned the possibility of an "opportunity" ofusingo2 cust care as part of an excercise in pulling cust care back in country!

SpaceTime wrote: »

I'd say it's most likely to stick with the "3" brand or some variant of it though as it has huge global marketing synergies and it also has spent a lot of money developing the brand in Ireland.

Pretty much gauranteed i would say.

SpaceTime wrote: »

Telefonica seems to have let O2's branding deteriorate. It was very edgy and sophisticated during the MMO2 ownership when it was an independent entity.

Yeah, but they always spoke about the value of the brand, it was huge to them.....but now not so much!

Stevek101

SpaceTime wrote: »

All this is total speculation.

For all we know, Hutchison Whampoa might just operate what is now O2 Ireland pretty much "as is" and wind up "3 Ireland" or use it as a budget brand, much like O2 use 48.

They've already said they'll merge the companies under the Three banner.

bk

Kxiii wrote: »

Threes Business customer care is based in Waterford, it just the consumer side thats dealt with through Mumbai.

However I would assume they are a small team and certainly wouldn't be big enough to handle the o2 corporate customers.

If anything they might close this team and instead hand support for 3's corporate customers over to the existing o2 support team which would be much larger and more experienced.

However I think they need to go further then that, o2's non corporate but contract customers are often small to medium business type of people and I believe they expect and demand a high level of customer care then they would get from the Indian call center.

If customer care quality suffers, these customers will flee to Vodafone in a shot.

So I think 3 will maintain at least some of their o2 Irish customer care staff to deal with contract customers. Pay as you go support will probably all head to India.

However one thing to remember is the core reason why three's cs is so rubbish is because three's network is rubbish. Most people call three's CS to complain about bad network coverage and limited backhaul. Three know very well the limitations of their service, the CS staff aren't actually there to fix anything, they can't, they are there to try and make you think they are doing something so you don't move away.

With them now owning the o2 network and far greater amounts of spectrum, hopefully these network and backhaul issues will be mostly resolved and people won't actually have to use customer service as much any more.

krudler

Stevek101 wrote: »

They've already said they'll merge the companies under the Three banner.

Yeah O2 as a brand in Ireland will be gone, that includes the sponsorship deals, the O2 arena etc. all changing.

RangeR

Stevek101 wrote: »

They've already said they'll merge the companies under the Three banner.

Yup. It's exceptionally unlikely that O2/Telefonica would allow Three to keep the O2 name.

Kxiii

bk wrote: »

However I would assume they are a small team and certainly wouldn't be big enough to handle the o2 corporate customers.

If anything they might close this team and instead hand support for 3's corporate customers over to the existing o2 support team which would be much larger and more experienced.

However I think they need to go further then that, o2's non corporate but contract customers are often small to medium business type of people and I believe they expect and demand a high level of customer care then they would get from the Indian call center.

If customer care quality suffers, these customers will flee to Vodafone in a shot.

So I think 3 will maintain at least some of their o2 Irish customer care staff to deal with contract customers. Pay as you go support will probably all head to India.

However one thing to remember is the core reason why three's cs is so rubbish is because three's network is rubbish. Most people call three's CS to complain about bad network coverage and limited backhaul. Three know very well the limitations of their service, the CS staff aren't actually there to fix anything, they can't, they are there to try and make you think they are doing something so you don't move away.

With them now owning the o2 network and far greater amounts of spectrum, hopefully these network and backhaul issues will be mostly resolved and people won't actually have to use customer service as much any more.

Yes the business team would be a lot smaller than what O2 have.

They might close it they might not these are things that no one knows for sure at the minute

All of Threes Business customers are dealt with through Waterford. From single line sole traders to multinational corporate clients. It's only consumer that's dealt with in Mumbai.

jimmynokia

wexfordman2 wrote: »

Putting out press releases can hardly be called keeping it quiet!!

Put it this way, it was small print. The fact is it happened NOT Many knew about it, it I posted the article on the said networks forum and got the head chewed off me, and they asked how did I find it. It was then deleted.

cookie1977

jimmynokia wrote: »

Put it this way, it was small print. The fact is it happened NOT Many knew about it, it I posted the article on the said networks forum and got the head chewed off me, and they asked how did I find it. It was then deleted.

Really? It was on the comreg site in full detail not to mention all the private correspondence between the networks and comreg (particularly over the type of auction) with any commercially sensitive info redacted. Where did you post that it was deleted or that you were warned/questioned?

cookie1977

RangeR wrote: »

Yup. It's exceptionally unlikely that O2/Telefonica would allow Three to keep the O2 name.

That's a complete guaranteed no no. Telefonica would never allow that alright.

drunkmonkey

Kxiii wrote: »

All of Threes Business customers are dealt with through Waterford. From single line sole traders to multinational corporate clients. .

Only the customer care and telesales are in Waterford, they still have a team of account managers and reps that service businesses face to face working out of Dublin.

SpaceTime

They really should rename themselves "4" at this stage or even "5":D

3G is soooo last decade!

Let's be aspirational and just call it "X"

Kxiii

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Only the customer care and telesales are in Waterford, they still have a team of account managers and reps that service businesses face to face working out of Dublin.

Yeh, I meant just customer care.

What I was referring to was Bk's assumption that SMEs would be dealt with through India.

jimmynokia

cookie1977 wrote: »

Really? It was on the comreg site in full detail not to mention all the private correspondence between the networks and comreg (particularly over the type of auction) with any commercially sensitive info redacted. Where did you post that it was deleted or that you were warned/questioned?

Not everyone goes to comregs site for information, to ad to the fact they are useless when it comes to actually needing them.
Where did I post the info? As I said one of the networks forums.

cookie1977

jimmynokia wrote: »

Not everyone goes to comregs site for information, to ad to the fact they are useless when it comes to actually needing them.
Where did I post the info? As I said one of the networks forums.

That's so ridiculous that they gave out that you posted public info

vicM

I wonder what will happen to Tesco mobile..it was steadily gaining a foothold. I think they were actually starting to get customers three ironically

jimmynokia

cookie1977 wrote: »

That's so ridiculous that they gave out that you posted public info

Tell me about it,think it had to do with network issues at the time and one person mentioned it,that post also was removed,as the poster asked why did the network themselves not tell the public,which he was right to ask.

bk

Kxiii wrote: »

Yeh, I meant just customer care.

What I was referring to was Bk's assumption that SMEs would be dealt with through India.

Fair enough, but I'm actually thinking wider then that.

To be honest, high end private customers on contracts spending more then €60 per month expect a higher level of customer care.

cookie1977

vicM wrote: »

I wonder what will happen to Tesco mobile..it was steadily gaining a foothold. I think they were actually starting to get customers three ironically

They'll continue on as normal no change just under the new network that's all.

ballooba

Kensington wrote: »

They're going to want to see return on their investments, over €1bn at this rate, and they'll want to see that soon.

Is that in addition to or including the €850 Million they're spending now? €150 Million to gain 5% market share would reconcile with €850 Million to gain 35% market share. I'd be surprised though given the high cost environment when 3 entered the market.

vicM

cookie1977 wrote: »

They'll continue on as normal no change just under the new network that's all.

I wonder for how long though, isn't lycamobile also piggybacking off O2

SpaceTime

AFAIK, O2 and Vodafone were declared as having significant market power in the mobile sector like eircom in the fixed line sector and as such they've got to hosy MVNOs

Three hosts Blueface mobile though as an MVNO

wexfordman2

jimmynokia wrote: »

Not everyone goes to comregs site for information, to ad to the fact they are useless when it comes to actually needing them.
Where did I post the info? As I said one of the networks forums.

With regards the spectrum auction, it was a public auction, details were available to anyone who wanted to get them once the auction was awarded, and it was plastered all over the news for a couple of days afterwards.

On the mosaic/netshare no state secret with that either, in fact both networks lauded the benefits they would derive from it, it was no secret, but I think the general public didn't quite understand the concept. I know most people I spoke to about it thought it was a merger, which it was not.

I just don't get your point about either of them being kept quiet it was quite the opposite, especially with the spectrum auction, going on about how much of a windfall it was for the state etc

cookie1977

vicM wrote: »

I wonder for how long though, isn't lycamobile also piggybacking off O2

Yes. They'll all continue with their existing contract and when they expire they'll be renegotiated. There's no reason for 3 to dump them as it makes 3/O2 money. Tesco mobile are making big inroads in Ireland so they won't want to loose that hold. If 3/O2 decided not to renew then I'm sure another network would step in.

TheUsual

Roaming charges will be brought down by European regulator, but I don't see data costs being brought down by this merger.

One less player in the mobile market means less pressure to bring down data charges.
The money that 3 Ireland are spending on buying out O2 Ireland will be passed onto us as profits to pay for the purchase.

jimmynokia

wexfordman2 wrote: »

With regards the spectrum auction, it was a public auction, details were available to anyone who wanted to get them once the auction was awarded, and it was plastered all over the news for a couple of days afterwards.

On the mosaic/netshare no state secret with that either, in fact both networks lauded the benefits they would derive from it, it was no secret, but I think the general public didn't quite understand the concept. I know most people I spoke to about it thought it was a merger, which it was not.

I just don't get your point about either of them being kept quiet it was quite the opposite, especially with the spectrum auction, going on about how much of a windfall it was for the state etc

I'm not talking about the sale of the spectrum AT ALL.

wexfordman2

jimmynokia wrote: »

I'm not talking about the sale of the spectrum AT ALL.

Well that's what you mentioned, and the mosaic project, neither of which were state secrets by any means