Meath GAA discussion thread

Hammer Archer

Don't know how you can say we've very little coming through underage Lemlin. The previous two minor championships we've been knocked out by the eventual winners (and very unluckily so when we were beaten by Tipperary). Last year we beat the Ulster champions Tyrone and Mayo who knocked the reigning All Ireland champions out in the quarter finals. And remember this was all without Eamonn Wallace in the squad for the entire championship. I honestly don't think we have an amazing underage setup, but it's not to be sniffed at either.

And your anecdote doesn't really prove anything. Players are picked for underage county teams when many think they shouldn't and players aren't picked when many think they should (Wallace wasn't picked for the championship last season as he was unavailable during the league due to athletics).

We are very much in transition as a team, just like Cavan were in previous years (don't forget Cavan were pretty apalling in the championship before this season). I think we will improve next season and more younger players will be given experience. I think division 2 will help as it will be massively stronger than division 2 this year. Depending on the draw, I hope we can get to another Leinster final and/or hopefully make the last 8. I actually am feeling pretty optimistic about the future of this Meath team (the bench included) for the coming years.

Royal Legend

Lemlin wrote: »

In fairness, I was just comparing Meath to a few counties I've watched recently. I realise fully myself that the Dublin bench particularly will be hard to beat by any county. Nowhere has near their level of club football or population. Tyrone have had numerous underage teams come through. Galway I mentioned because I saw them at the weekend and thought their bench was strong. I wasn't comparing Cavan's bench to Tyrone or Dublin but my point is that Meath haven't even the bench of lesser counties like Cavan and Galway.

In relation to Cavan, I'm not referencing the London game at all for a start. You lads constantly mention missing Shane O'Rourke on this thread. Well Cavan are missing arguably our best and most influential player in Gearoid McKiernan and we've still made the last 8. Check the Kerry thread, one of the posters there mentioned Martin Reilly as a fine footballer. He wasn't even in the Cavan starting 15 at the start of this year and only got his chance because of an injury to Niall McDermott.

In reference to coming off the bench to kick points against Derry, Derry are a team just promoted to Division 1 and I'd argue they are better than any team Meath have beaten this year in championship football. My point is Cavan had on their bench two 19 year olds who came on and made a significant difference to the proceedings. I have yet to see any Meath sub who came on and made a difference against any team they played this year. That's why I think the bench and strength in depth is a big weakness.

As I pointed out, Dublin had Bastick who came on and helped their midfield. Meath had nothing on the bench except Paddy Gilsenan who did nothing but give the ball away IMO and Joe Sheridan who looks well past his best of two or three seasons ago. The other lads like Tormey weren't on the pitch that long but did nothing of note either. Against Tyrone, they were introducing Kyle Coney and Meath were introducing Bryan Farrell, who I said at the start of this year I wouldn't rate at all. Not to mention having Joe Sheridan on the field who was literally cheered off by his own supporters.

Meath have very little coming through in terms of underage. I watch club games myself and I know of at least one young lad who has played for the Meath minors and U21s who wouldn't lace the boots of my own club's best player yet my own club's best player in Cavan couldn't get onto the minor or U21s starting 15s.

IMO my point stands that Meath have 12 players who could put it up to any team but they are short after that.

Edit: Oh, and the Kerry poster mentions David Givney being a fine midfielder and how he is a massive fan. Givney couldn't get a game at midfield for Cavan in the league.

I think that maybe you are looking at this the wrong way Lemlin. Any county would do well to get one if not two decent senior players from an All Ireland winning minor or U21 team. There are plenty of lads in Meath who won major honours provincially and nationally who looked like the next great thing and then disappeared into obscurity. There are also plenty of examples of players that did not get a look in at underage and ended up as some of the best in the country at Senior, for example Henry Shefflin or John McDermott. Once your underage is competing is IMO the main thing, whether that be u21, minor, schools or colleges.
I wish Cavan all the best against Kerry, I think that if they have the belief that they may have the ability to cause a major shock, but they will need to be ultra defensive (Ulster Style ).

Hammer Archer

Meath player cleared of racial abuse charge.
Absolutely delighted! I didn't actually know the player in question had been named in the media but that is absolutely despicable. Strange that when the incident first flared up, Westmeath made it pretty clear that there was video evidence of the racism. By the looks of it, they were completely making it up.

Royal Legend

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Meath player cleared of racial abuse charge.
Absolutely delighted! I didn't actually know the player in question had been named in the media but that is absolutely despicable. Strange that when the incident first flared up, Westmeath made it pretty clear that there was video evidence of the racism. By the looks of it, they were completely making it up.

If it was a clear case of lying about what happened, then the Westmeath player should be banned.
But, that will not happen, as the GAA will shilly shally over opening that particular can of worms.
The next step should be rules regarding making false accusations like this, as it is starting to become easy for players of a different colour or race to make serious accusations whether true or untrue and the only person that has to defend his actions is the accused.
By the way I am not saying racist comments do not happen, but already there is one low level inter county player who has made a name for himself from an incident that happened to him, (a disgusting racist incident) and seems IMO to play on this particular incident to further his career, which is average to say the least.

mattser

Lemlin wrote: »

In fairness, I was just comparing Meath to a few counties I've watched recently. I realise fully myself that the Dublin bench particularly will be hard to beat by any county. Nowhere has near their level of club football or population. Tyrone have had numerous underage teams come through. Galway I mentioned because I saw them at the weekend and thought their bench was strong. I wasn't comparing Cavan's bench to Tyrone or Dublin but my point is that Meath haven't even the bench of lesser counties like Cavan and Galway.

In relation to Cavan, I'm not referencing the London game at all for a start. You lads constantly mention missing Shane O'Rourke on this thread. Well Cavan are missing arguably our best and most influential player in Gearoid McKiernan and we've still made the last 8. Check the Kerry thread, one of the posters there mentioned Martin Reilly as a fine footballer. He wasn't even in the Cavan starting 15 at the start of this year and only got his chance because of an injury to Niall McDermott.

In reference to coming off the bench to kick points against Derry, Derry are a team just promoted to Division 1 and I'd argue they are better than any team Meath have beaten this year in championship football. My point is Cavan had on their bench two 19 year olds who came on and made a significant difference to the proceedings. I have yet to see any Meath sub who came on and made a difference against any team they played this year. That's why I think the bench and strength in depth is a big weakness.

As I pointed out, Dublin had Bastick who came on and helped their midfield. Meath had nothing on the bench except Paddy Gilsenan who did nothing but give the ball away IMO and Joe Sheridan who looks well past his best of two or three seasons ago. The other lads like Tormey weren't on the pitch that long but did nothing of note either. Against Tyrone, they were introducing Kyle Coney and Meath were introducing Bryan Farrell, who I said at the start of this year I wouldn't rate at all. Not to mention having Joe Sheridan on the field who was literally cheered off by his own supporters.

Meath have very little coming through in terms of underage. I watch club games myself and I know of at least one young lad who has played for the Meath minors and U21s who wouldn't lace the boots of my own club's best player yet my own club's best player in Cavan couldn't get onto the minor or U21s starting 15s.

IMO my point stands that Meath have 12 players who could put it up to any team but they are short after that.

Edit: Oh, and the Kerry poster mentions David Givney being a fine midfielder and how he is a massive fan. Givney couldn't get a game at midfield for Cavan in the league.

Good luck tomorrow. I've seen my county win five All Irelands. It's a great feeling.

rpurfield

Royal Legend wrote: »

I think that maybe you are looking at this the wrong way Lemlin. Any county would do well to get one if not two decent senior players from an All Ireland winning minor or U21 team. There are plenty of lads in Meath who won major honours provincially and nationally who looked like the next great thing and then disappeared into obscurity. There are also plenty of examples of players that did not get a look in at underage and ended up as some of the best in the country at Senior, for example Henry Shefflin or John McDermott. Once your underage is competing is IMO the main thing, whether that be u21, minor, schools or colleges.
I wish Cavan all the best against Kerry, I think that if they have the belief that they may have the ability to cause a major shock, but they will need to be ultra defensive (Ulster Style ).

exactly if you get maybe two or three minors in your club going on to good things at club level your doing well let alone county teams.i just hope mick does what seanie did over the years and scour every grade for the extra few players we need.

davegrohl48

Royal Legend wrote: »

If it was a clear case of lying about what happened, then the Westmeath player should be banned.
But, that will not happen, as the GAA will shilly shally over opening that particular can of worms.
The next step should be rules regarding making false accusations like this, as it is starting to become easy for players of a different colour or race to make serious accusations whether true or untrue and the only person that has to defend his actions is the accused.
By the way I am not saying racist comments do not happen, but already there is one low level inter county player who has made a name for himself from an incident that happened to him, (a disgusting racist incident) and seems IMO to play on this particular incident to further his career, which is average to say the least.

I agree that if it is found to be a totally baseless accusation from an official or player that action should be taken. The Meath player in question now has this hanging over him for the rest of his career.
The Meath player should also receive compensation from whatever person/group/media outlet was responsible for releasing his name.
For instance he goes for a job interview or a University interview and across the desk is a person from HR who knew about the incident and his name? I think his future career prospects and personal reputation have been massively impacted here.
Fully media press released should be the name of any player/official IF it is proven they deliberately lied about this incident.

Dr.MickKiller

Lemlin wrote: »

Are that lot as good as the benches of counties like Cavan, Galway, Dublin and Tyrone? I don't think so.

I think Cavan really have to start using their bench if they want to make it over the line against Kerry.

Lemlin

Dr.MickKiller wrote: »

I think Cavan really have to start using their bench if they want to make it over the line against Kerry.

I'll take your bait. The Cavan team that started against Kerry today:

O'Mara - 23
Corr - 27
Dunne - 24
Clarke - 20
McLoughlin - 20
Clarke - 27
Flanagan - 25
O'Reilly - 24
Givney - 24
Mackey - 25
McVetty - 19
Flanagan - 21
Reilly - 26
Dunne - 24
Keating - 24

Subs:

McDermott - 23
Argue - 19
Tierney - 21
McEnroe - 24
Brady - 21

Subs that didn't play:

Gilsenan - 20
Minagh - 23
Murray - 23
McKeever - 29
McCutcheon - unsure
Brady - 23

Some of those may not be exactly right but I'm sure you get the picture.

And next year's U21s are actually the first set that would have won their age grade at minor.

We've plenty of strength in depth coming through.

Dr.MickKiller

Lemlin wrote: »

I'll take your bait. The Cavan team that started against Kerry today:

O'Mara - 23
Corr - 27
Dunne - 24
Clarke - 20
McLoughlin - 20
Clarke - 27
Flanagan - 25
O'Reilly - 24
Givney - 24
Mackey - 25
McVetty - 19
Flanagan - 21
Reilly - 26
Dunne - 24
Keating - 24

Subs:

McDermott - 23
Argue - 19
Tierney - 21
McEnroe - 24
Brady - 21

Subs that didn't play:

Gilsenan - 20
Minagh - 23
Murray - 23
McKeever - 29
McCutcheon - unsure
Brady - 23

Some of those may not be exactly right but I'm sure you get the picture.

And next year's U21s are actually the first set that would have won their age grade at minor.

We've plenty of strength in depth coming through.

Not sure I get the picture. You were saying Cavan had a great subs bench, better than Meath. Today I saw a very poor team, against a pretty poor Kerry team in the second half. They only scored 3 points in the second half and yet they never looked liked losing. Do you still think you have a great bench?

Lemlin

Dr.MickKiller wrote: »

Not sure I get the picture. You were saying Cavan had a great subs bench, better than Meath. Today I saw a very poor team, against a pretty poor Kerry team in the second half. They only scored 3 points in the second half and yet they never looked liked losing. Do you still think you have a great bench?

Were you in Navan in March? While I don't want to make this another Cavan vs Meath argument our lads held your boys to one point in the entire first half and beat ye comprehensively.

How many All Ireland medals and All Stars do that "pretty poor" Kerry team have?

I've been to three Meath games this Summer plus that league game. My opinion is not biased and it is that Meath have poor strength in depth.

Otherwise they wouldn't be starting Joe Sheridan or bringing on Bryan Farrell. Sheridan was terrible when he came on against Dublin yet was rewarded with a starting spot against Tyrone! Can you explain for me how that one works?

Like I said, Cavan have subs that can come on and contribute to the game e.g. McDermott and Argue today. I haven't seen one Meath sub do that all Summer. That's my point.

Edit: Oh, and our juniors won Leinster last year and made the final the two years previous to that, beating Meath juniors two of those three years.

scatman carruthers

Tis a pty we didn't have Meath instead of Donegal today they would have provided a stiffer test

Dr.MickKiller

Lemlin wrote: »

Were you in Navan in March? While I don't want to make this another Cavan vs Meath argument our lads held your boys to one point in the entire first half and beat ye comprehensively.

How many All Ireland medals and All Stars do that "pretty poor" Kerry team have?

I've been to three Meath games this Summer plus that league game. My opinion is not biased and it is that Meath have poor strength in depth.

Otherwise they wouldn't be starting Joe Sheridan or bringing on Bryan Farrell. Sheridan was terrible when he came on against Dublin yet was rewarded with a starting spot against Tyrone! Can you explain for me how that one works?

Like I said, Cavan have subs that can come on and contribute to the game e.g. McDermott and Argue today. I haven't seen one Meath sub do that all Summer. That's my point.

Ok, grand. If that's what you take from this championship, then great! You have a great subs bench and you are fantastic.

Lemlin

Dr.MickKiller wrote: »

Ok, grand. If that's what you take from this championship, then great! You have a great subs bench and you are fantastic.

Sarcasm. It's called the lowest form of wit for a reason.

It's also used as a deflector by those who simply don't have a response for a better presented opinion.

saltandpepper10

Lemlin wrote: »

Sarcasm. It's called the lowest form of wit for a reason.

It's also used as a deflector by those who simply don't have a response for a better presented opinion.

lemlin dont let the critisism get you down too much,you are seem to be an extremly knolagable gaa man on matters meath and cavan and beyond,cavan will be very disappointed with there efforts today i would say and the myth about ulster being so strong has been blown out of the water this w/end donegal scored 6 points v dublin in11 semi killed mayo with goals early in 12 and where supposed to be best sinse sliced bread with mcgunness getting job with celtic.imo any gaa team can win on a given day but if anyone plays dubs they would win 8 outa 10 times over the last 5 seasons:)

Dr.MickKiller

Lemlin wrote: »

Sarcasm. It's called the lowest form of wit for a reason.

It's also used as a deflector by those who simply don't have a response for a better presented opinion.

I'm not being sarcastic. This is the only thing you want to hear, right? I have made my point, you don't want to hear it, fair enough.

Lemlin

Dr.MickKiller wrote: »

I'm not being sarcastic. This is the only thing you want to hear, right? I have made my point, you don't want to hear it, fair enough.

Is that the point where you said that a Kerry team which included Cooper, Galvin, the two O'Sullivans, the two O'Ses and Donaghey was "very poor"?

Have you any actual point to make about the Cavan bench today other than basically saying 'you lost to Kerry ergo your bench must be crap'.

Read back a few pages on this thread. The lads took great heart from running Dublin close yet ye still lost by seven points. Cavan lost to Kerry by six today yet you're writing off our team and bench based on that.

Dr.MickKiller

Lemlin wrote: »

Is that the point where you said that a Kerry team which included Cooper, Galvin, the two O'Sullivans, the two O'Ses and Donaghey was "very poor"?

Yes, three points in the second half is very poor.

Lemlin wrote: »

Have you any actual point to make about the Cavan bench today other than basically saying 'you lost to Kerry ergo your bench must be crap'.

You made a big claim about Cavan football and their bench and I called you up on it. Cavan did nothing today, didn't look anywhere close to winning today, it never looked like a contest after 10 minutes.

Lemlin wrote: »

Read back a few pages on this thread. The lads took great heart from running Dublin close yet ye still lost by seven points. Cavan lost to Kerry by six today yet you're writing off our team and bench based on that.

See above. Essentially I am very happy with how Meath played this championship, are you happy with how Cavan played? If you are, grand but you made quite a few big statements on a Meath GAA thread and you don't have a whole lot to back it up with.

Anyhow, this is not what this thread is for, if you wish to PM me, fine.

Lemlin

Dr.MickKiller wrote: »

Yes, three points in the second half is very poor.

You made a big claim about Cavan football and their bench and I called you up on it. Cavan did nothing today, didn't look anywhere close to winning today, it never looked like a contest after 10 minutes.

See above. Essentially I am very happy with how Meath played this championship, are you happy with how Cavan played? If you are, grand but you made quite a few big statements on a Meath GAA thread and you don't have a whole lot to back it up with.

Anyhow, this is not what this thread is for, if you wish to PM me, fine.

So your point essentially does boil down to 'you lost to Kerry ergo your bench is poor'.

I'm not even going to debate Kerry being very poor. Those lads have more Player of the Year awards, All Stars and All Ireland medals then any team currently playing and alot which played in the past. If your point relies on calling those lads "poor", you're already on shaky ground. They're also the only team to have made the quarter finals every year since their introduction.

Of course I'm happy with how Cavan played. For all your gusto about Meath, who did they beat this year? Wexford and Wicklow.

Cavan beat Armagh, Fermanagh x 2, ran Monaghan who defeated the All Ireland champions to a point (not to mention a Monaghan team who comprehensively beat Meath twice in the league), and beat a promoted to Division 1 Derry in their own back yard.

Cavan didn't do themselves justice today and played poorly. Anyone can see that. We've a raft of young players coming through though and will be back. Nerves got to our lads. It was a big occasion and a big day. Unlike Leinster teams, we don't get to play in Croke Park for the majority of our Championship games.

What "big claim" did I make about Cavan football? I said we had a better bench than Meath. The fact that Joe Sheridan, who has been woeful all year for Meath, started against Dublin proved that for me more than anything else. The lad was clapped off the field by his own supporters. To be replaced by Bryan Farrell, another lad who I pointed out at the start of the year is useless IMO. The majority of Meath posters agreed with me.

As I said, I'm offering an unbiased opinion. I've been to three of your four championship games this year and my opinion is that Meath have 12 players who would match any team in Ireland yet after that your panel struggles. That's what I have seen from the games I have attended.

Have a look at the age of the Cavan panel above. Those lads have already reached the last 8 of the All Ireland series and they all have plenty of years ahead of them. The oldest player is 27 and the majority of them are under 25. There's also the players from our Ulster minor winning team of 2011 yet to come through.

Now I"m not guaranteeing success for them but I think there's a damn good chance of it and I think if Meath supporters can be "very happy" with how ye did when you have two victories to Cavan's five, we've every right to be delighted with how our boys have performed.

And even the comments by Dunne after the game today show the winning mentality of these lads - yes, they've done well but they want a cup and medals to show for it. That mentality straight after losing a game is great to see.

So, as someone said earlier, one swallow doesn't make a Summer but one bad result doesn't make a team terrible either.

Lemlin

From the Independent's review of the game:

Cavan got a decent return out of all the substitutes they introduced in the second half. Argue was physical and combative around midfield, Brady laid off some neat passes while Niall McDermott pointed two early frees and availed of a drop-kicked Mackey pass on 49 minutes to bring the deficit back to six, 0-12 to 0-6.

Still it's been a productive championship for Cavan, stretching seven games and giving many of their promising young players experience of a busy summer.

mattser

Too much talk of Cavan here. Getting seriously boring.

Lemlin

mattser wrote: »

Too much talk of Cavan here. Getting seriously boring.

I agree. A poster brought up a point I made and I was replying. Anyway, I spoke to a few Dunboyne lads Inknow and this young Kerry lad is doing serious business as the lads here said.

Apparently he was in the Kerry panel but moved up to Dunboyne for work.

Al_Coholic

Lemlin wrote: »

I agree. A poster brought up a point I made and I was replying. Anyway, I spoke to a few Dunboyne lads Inknow and this young Kerry lad is doing serious business as the lads here said.

Apparently he was in the Kerry panel but moved up to Dunboyne for work.

the Meath management team surely have to ask him to come into the squad.
i havent seen him play myself but some in my family have and said he is playing extremely well.

Lemlin

Al_Coholic wrote: »

the Meath management team surely have to ask him to come into the squad.
i havent seen him play myself but some in my family have and said he is playing extremely well.

The Dunboyne lads I asked about him reckon he is practically winning games on his own. I think one said he scored 9 of their 11 points in one recent game.

Dunboyne are senior so would be nice for Meath to actually have a starting forward playing senior football in the county!

Hammer Archer

Bit of a lull given the footballers are out, but the minor hurlers are up against Kildare in the All Ireland Minor hurling B Championship quarter final on Saturday at 3pm.
Haven't seen the squad list but best of luck to them.

Hammer Archer

Minor hurlers made it to the All Ireland B Semi Final after beating Kildare 4-16 to 1-14.
They'll play Kerry in the semi final.

klong

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Minor hurlers made it to the All Ireland B Semi Final after beating Kildare 4-16 to 1-14.
They'll play Kerry in the semi final.

Looked like a serious "game of two halves" looking at the half time and full time scores.

Anyway, well done lads.

Hammer Archer

Hmmm thought the minor hurlers were up against Kerry. They beat Donegal 4-18 to 2-8 in the All Ireland semi final.
Now they play Kerry in the final.

Looks like it's between Nobber and Oldcastle for relegation in the senior. Rathkenny remain unbeaten after drawing with Skryne.

Hammer Archer

Shane O'Rourke supposedly did very well for Simonstown in their win against Blackhall Gaels yesterday. Let's hope he can stay injury free for the foreseeable future and make it back to the Meath panel next season. Geaney also got 7 points for Dunboyne against Dunshaughlin.

In an unrelated game, Drumbaragh beat Duleek/Bellewstown by 11-20 to 0-02 in the Junior championship :eek:

Lemlin

Hammer Archer wrote: »

Shane O'Rourke supposedly did very well for Simonstown in their win against Blackhall Gaels yesterday. Let's hope he can stay injury free for the foreseeable future and make it back to the Meath panel next season. Geaney also got 7 points for Dunboyne against Dunshaughlin.

In an unrelated game, Drumbaragh beat Duleek/Bellewstown by 11-20 to 0-02 in the Junior championship :eek:

Geaney's brother actually came on against Cavan in the last game and is in the Kerry panel.

I don't know how true it is but I'm hearing he's not interested in joining the Meath panel. I have a good few friends up round there and that's what they reckon they've heard anyway.

Would be great to see O'Rourke back fighting fit. Has he a younger brother also coming through the ranks?