Bord Gais New Health and Safety

Dave_D

I recently got a 'cold call' from Bord Gais saying my gas boiler was due a yearly service. There were two prices involved. One of them had a parts guarantee for three months, and one had a guarantee for a year. I opted for the year, and got a date for the RGI engineer to come out. I was told if I wasn't in at that time, I would be charged for his visit - about €30. When the engineer came I was in at the time, I showed him to the boiler in my attic. He said 'nope, can't service that!!!!'. Apparently the RGII have new health and safety regulations stating that you need a 'Stira' ladder into the attic (I have an aluminium ladder that pulls down), you need to have floor boards in the attic (I have them in attic), and you need to have lights so they can work on the boiler (there's a light up there too). The engineer wouldn't even go up to the boiler, stating that if an inspector was to come around at the moment he was up there, he would lose his RGI license and thus...job.
About a week later I got a bill for €30 for his visit, even though he said I wouldn't be charged since it wasn't my fault. After a number of phone calls later Bord Gais have waived that bill.
When we got the boiler installed, it was RGI guys that installed it. Now they are unable to service it? I dont want to move the boiler because it's a small house, and it wouldnt fit anywhere else. Also, if they are unable to go into the attic, they couldn't move it anyway right???
Anyone else have this problem? Do I just leave the boiler unserviced now, and wait for a problem to occur? If the boiler HAS to be moved, what are the chances Bord Gais will foot the bill for it, since they installed it up there?

foggy_lad

Get another company out to service your boiler, you dont have to get the crowd that Bord Gais recommend! Sounds like the company Bord Gais use are on a money spinner.

dudara

Moved to Plumbing & Heating

dudara

Joey the lips

ring any rgii registered plumber and tell him/her where the boiler is without going into detail of previous calls.

Just make sure they have a light etc.

www.rgii.ie


It sounds to me the chap just could not be bothered for the money board gais would pay.

DoneDL

The rules in the UK for installation in a loft were light to work on the appliance, a walkway to the appliance and a hand rail. When the boiler was installed this should have been put in place. Consider that most lofts now have 14 inches of insulation how is an engineer supposed to navigate to and from the appliance safely carrying tools, hoover and test gear.

Sorrry Dave D, misread your post if there is light and flooring then try calling an independant to service the boiler. If you phone the manufacturer they will have a list of engineers that have done training with them. On the bright side an independant RGII will probably be more thorough.

Dave_D

When the guy in Bord Gais was on the phone to me telling me about the new regulations, I asked him if I could get a 'third party' to service the boiler, as long as he/she is RGI licensed, and forget about the Bord Gais paid RGI guys. I was told anyone with RGI license is under the same health and saftey regulations.

@DoneDL - In my case the top of the ladder is literally 3 feet from the boiler. There is plenty of room to put tools etc. You can even touch the boiler standing on the ladder. The only thing I dont have is a handrail on the ladder.

I'm not sure how long the boiler has been installed - maybe 10 years. It has been serviced every year, and never once has an engineer complained about it being awkward to work on.

DoneDL

If the BG engineer had done the work and an assessor folowed up on it, the assessor would most likely have made a compaint against the engineer, I would say that most RGII would consider your set up as perfectly safe to work in.

Dave_D

But as far as I know the assessor is from the RGII, not Bord Gais. This means that anyone with an RGI license could be caught out by the new rules. So any independant guy would also be afraid to do the service.

I will ring a guy that installed a new gas fire for me earlier this year. I will see if he can service it, or get his take on things.

Joey the lips

Joey the lips wrote: »

It sounds to me the chap just could not be bothered for the money board gais would pay.

He would be sacked on the spot and I'm not joking, the perception of gas safety is very important to Sierra and BG, they have teams of inhouse inspectors checking if boiler servicing gloves are warn, if bump hats are warn, if dust sheets are down, if slip mats are under the steps/tool box etc..... But they don't test for soundness;)

DoneDL wrote: »

I would say that most RGII would consider your set up as perfectly safe to work in.

That wouldn't make the situation right and as a lot of RGI only have a few weeks training, so i wouldnt rely on their Heath and safety assessment skillset(I'm such a bitch).

Attic installations only become a problem when a RGI gets hurt, insurance company's would take a similar view to BG. I have known gas fitters to lose the odd finger from ladders and some who have fallen from a ladder getting in to lofts causing themselves long term injurys, so it does happen.

Dave_D

Dave_D wrote: »

But as far as I know the assessor is from the RGII, not Bord Gais. This means that anyone with an RGI license could be caught out by the new rules. So any independant guy would also be afraid to do the service.

I will ring a guy that installed a new gas fire for me earlier this year. I will see if he can service it, or get his take on things.

A self employed RGI wouldn't be under the pressure a BG RGI would be under, if it's boarded, lit with decent access to the boiler then I personaly wouldn't see it as a problem.

Micky Dolenz

The day I stop jumping up into attics is the day I retire.

antoinolachtnai

Does the OP's ladder have a handrail? If that is the criterion? A lot of those attic ladders have this. The engineer's complaint according to the OP was that it wasn't a Stira-type ladder. In my mind, a Stira is a 'folding attic stairs' rather than a ladder. This is a whole other level of requirement.

DoneDL

gary71 wrote: »

A self employed RGI wouldn't be under the pressure a BG RGI would be under, if it's boarded, lit with decent access to the boiler then I personaly wouldn't see it as a problem.

The whole point of any tradeperson doing a health and safety course is to enable them to assess risk and work safely. I would doubt that any organisation would ever be in a position to question the decision of someone that has a proven ability to assess the risk to themselves and/or the people around them. I doubt very much that the HSA would be holding the coat tails of any organisation which would question that decision.

JohnnieK

So. BG have a monopoly on the market and now there in cahoots with STIRA (as seen on the late late) :D:D:D. They will insist on a Stiramatic next.

I have two customers with boilers in the loft and luckily they are fine. Plenty of floorboards, lights one has a fold down door the other is a slide down ladder and I feel safe going up and down in both.

DoneDL

DoneDL wrote: »

The whole point of any tradeperson doing a health and safety course is to enable them to assess risk and work safely.

Your public liability requires a method statement, large contractors Opw etc...
are now looking for method statements, a method statement locks you in to best working practise and if your working practises are outside what you've agreed even the silly things then you may have problems if you ever have to claim(god forbid).
Method statements tend to be generic and written by people who may know how to read a manual but who's only real experience with gas is that which parts their cheeks.

DoneDL wrote: »

I would doubt that any organisation would ever be in a position to question the decision of someone that has a proven ability to assess the risk to themselves and/or the people around them.

Any RGI that works for BG will not last long if they don't adhere to a very strict method statement which includes where you parked your van, is it locked, all animals and children locked away especially the ones that bite:) (my favourites are the wearing special gloves at all times so you don't cut your pinkys and wearing a bump hat incase you bump your head if a boiler is in a cupboard)

As a independent RGI your protected from a lot of stillness it's only when it goes pear shaped that plonkers with clipboards turn up trying to find away of not paying out by changing a accident in to not following good practise.