Ah I feel relief.....

benway

MungBean wrote: »

You can see why I'm not confident right ?

Honestly, and don't take this the wrong way - it's not aimed at you in particular, and it's not meant to be an insult or anything - I think that people are so used to thinking that the system is soft - sections of the media wilfully spin it that way - that it's hard to believe that it can come down hard on people. But it can.

People find it difficult to understand that the law treats different crimes differently - murders, manslaughters, a lot of people just think that they're putting a value in years on the victim's life. That's not how it works.

Gangland criminals, arguments that go out of control, crimes of passion - you can see that maybe some of them didn't intend to do the harm that they did - not saying that they wouldn't still need to be punished. Or if they did it intentionally, that it wasn't totally senseless, that there is some hope that they might have some humanity left in them, when they're a few years away from the situation, that some of them aren't totally lost. The point of the system isn't just to punish, it's also to salvage those who can be saved. And the genuinely crazy - a friend's brother was killed by a guy who had lost it completely, but even his family realise that the guy can't be held fully responsible, he's too far gone.

This is different, for me. This is worst of the worst. Attacking a guy like that for no possible reason, killing him just to do it? This is surely why the DPP pressed for murder rather than accept his plea - I've seen a few bad cases, but I'm shocked by this one.

While he's inside, the shrinks will try to get inside his head, and see if there's anything there that can be saved, but I don't see them being any less shocked than I am. Even if he co-operates fully, given what he's done, it'll be twenty years before he gets a recommendation. And I can't see any Minister signing off on his release while people still remember this case, and while he's still in the physical condition to do the same again.

This guy is going to be inside for a long, long time, I'm certain of it.

gurramok

benway wrote: »

The average served by prisoners who received a recommendation from the Parole Board from 2004-2008 is over 17 years, and even at that the Minister still has a veto.

I doubt very much whether this guy is going to see the outside of a prison by the time he's fifty.

Jayzus, you have one hell of a faith in the justice system.

So this fella jailed at age 21 will be jailed for 29 years? Somehow I just don't believe it will reach 29, understand?

Babybuff

cloptrop wrote: »

They have girlfriends?
Id say its their cousins or sisters or something.

same difference?

benway

gurramok wrote: »

Jayzus, you have one hell of a faith in the justice system.

So this fella jailed at age 21 will be jailed for 29 years? Somehow I just don't believe it will reach 29, understand?

Nah, I just have an idea how it works in reality - I honestly think that this guy could easily come close to full term life, for the reasons in my previous post.

I understand that you don't believe he'll spend that long inside, but I don't understand what your reasoning is?

gurramok

benway wrote: »

Nah, I just have an idea how it works in reality - I honestly think that this guy could easily come close to full term life, for the reasons in my previous post.

I understand that you don't believe he'll spend that long inside, but I don't understand what your reasoning is?

The record of early release in this country. 29 years is quite unique yes? Some murderers might reach 20 years if we're lucky.

MungBean

benway wrote: »

Honestly, and don't take this the wrong way - it's not aimed at you in particular, and it's not meant to be an insult or anything - I think that people are so used to thinking that the system is soft - sections of the media wilfully spin it that way - that it's hard to believe that it can come down hard on people. But it can.

People find it difficult to understand that the law treats different crimes differently - murders, manslaughters, a lot of people just think that they're putting a value in years on the victim's life. That's not how it works.

Gangland criminals, arguments that go out of control, crimes of passion - you can see that maybe some of them didn't intend to do the harm that they did - not saying that they wouldn't still need to be punished. Or if they did it intentionally, that it wasn't totally senseless, that there is some hope that they might have some humanity left in them, when they're a few years away from the situation, that some of them aren't totally lost. The point of the system isn't just to punish, it's also to salvage those who can be saved. And the genuinely crazy - a friend's brother was killed by a guy who had lost it completely, but even his family realise that the guy can't be held fully responsible, he's too far gone.

This is different, for me. This is worst of the worst. Attacking a guy like that for no possible reason, killing him just to do it? This is surely why the DPP pressed for murder rather than accept his plea - I've seen a few bad cases, but I'm shocked by this one.

While he's inside, the shrinks will try to get inside his head, and see if there's anything there that can be saved, but I don't see them being any less shocked than I am. Even if he co-operates fully, given what he's done, it'll be twenty years before he gets a recommendation. And I can't see any Minister signing off on his release while people still remember this case, and while he's still in the physical condition to do the same again.

This guy is going to be inside for a long, long time, I'm certain of it.

No offence taken by that at all, and I understand different crimes have to be treated differently. But I see very little evidence of the system cracking down hard on these types of people who commit these crimes. That guy I spoke about serving 5 for putting someone in a coma also attacked him for no other reason than to beat the shít of him and stamped on his head until he could stamp no more, its what he has done his entire life. He's life revolves around attacking people and serving time for attacking people. Everyone to a man in this town knew before and and knows it now that he wont stop. He'll do his time get out and put someone else in the hospital, perhaps even kill them. Maybe he killed that guy while out on his Christmas break. Yet he'll stand up in front of the judge every single time and throw out his old sob story and every fcukin judge without fail takes it into account. And even when in prison he can get out on holidays.

The system is a fcukin joke and nothing else so excuse me if I dont have much faith in it.

benway

mungbean wrote:

That guy I spoke about serving 5

Who?

gurramok wrote: »

The record of early release in this country. 29 years is quite unique yes? Some murderers might reach 20 years if we're lucky.

Average is 17 years before the parole board makes a recommendation. According to the last board report I saw, the mMinister refused to release two of them, despite the board having recommended them. This case is much worse than average.

Malcolm McArthur served thirty years before phased release, even if there was a political element to his case. The longest that I know of is forty five years. I can honestly see this guy getting close to that mark.

MungBean

benway wrote: »

Average is 17 years before the parole board makes a recommendation. According to the last board report I saw, the mMinister refused to release two of them, despite the board having recommended them. This case is much worse than average.

Malcolm McArthur served thirty years before phased release, even if there was a political element to his case. The longest that I know of is forty five years. I can honestly see this guy getting close to that mark.

Ennis (77) has spent 45 years behind bars, much of it at his own request, as he has declined to apply for parole.

Sounds like that was an odd one.

MungBean

benway wrote: »

Who?

This disgusting little bastard

benway

MungBean wrote: »

Sounds like that was an odd one.

Apparently he got institutionalised and couldn't handle life on the outside, did his first 20 years back in the days before temporary release and treatment programmes,

The other longest serving are Evans and Shaw, well over thirty years at this stage, not sure if they're both still alive:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/murderous-sex-predator-in-coma-on-life-support-1591625.html

MungBean

benway wrote: »

Apparently he got institutionalised and couldn't handle life on the outside, did his first 20 years back in the days before temporary release and treatment programmes,

The other longest serving are Evans and Shaw, well over thirty years at this stage, not sure if they're both still alive:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/murderous-sex-predator-in-coma-on-life-support-1591625.html

Grim reading.

Snake Plisken

There are a lot of these scumbags around seriously there should be some sort of physical punishment to these animals, up to and including death!

woodoo

I do struggle to understand how these rotten people do these things. Its very difficult to comprehend. He should be looking at 40 years.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0316/1224313396006.html

cloptrop

****in hell thats sick reading , went to Tesco for something to eat afterwards , covered in blood.

qwert2

I really feel this thread needs bumping up. I may be wrong but there's been very little attention given to this on boards. This has to be one of the most sickening crimes committed in Ireland. Lukasz Rzeszutko was a gentle man from Poland who was savagely beaten to death by 3 scumbags. It's heart breaking.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0326/rzeszutkol.html

It could have been anyone. I feel there's a lack of public/media empathy sometimes when the victim doesn't fit a certain criteria. I'm sure you know what I mean

Millicent

qwert2 wrote: »

I really feel this thread needs bumping up. I may be wrong but there's been very little attention given to this on boards. This has to be one of the most sickening crimes committed in Ireland. Lukasz Rzeszutko was a gentle man from Poland who was savagely beaten to death by 3 scumbags. It's heart breaking.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0326/rzeszutkol.html

It could have been anyone. I feel there's a lack of public/media empathy sometimes when the victim doesn't fit a certain criteria. I'm sure you know what I mean

There's another big enough thread on it here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056587794

Everyone in the thread is disgusted by the murder, to be fair.

qwert2

Thanks. Didn't catch that.

Adrift

Depressing stuff altogether. The worst thing about it all is poor Lukasz was on his way to put in a shift at work, minding his own business, only to be killed by utter scumbags who have contributed absolutely nothing to society. With a million prior convictions between them, hangng around waiting to give a hiding to the next poor bastard that happens to pass by.

In Ireland, people like Martin Morgan, Stephen Byrne and Edward Byrne are protected. The softly softly approach is adopted as can clearly be seen by glancing at the lads criminal records. Cases like this are unfortunately not a rarity,I'd nearly go as far as saying this kind of behaviour is rampant in certain areas. Something has to change though, that masnalughter plea is a joke, a cop out. Stephen Byrne was given a 6 year sentence for this in order to give him "hope". Something Stephen didn't give Lukasz...............