Mahon Tribunal report - merge

Son Of A Vidic

fluorescence wrote: »

I still don't understand why there wasn't a normal court procedure for the bastards

But don't you see, this like everything else in this country, is merely an exercise in tokenism. Going the judicial route would have meant serving out genuine justice to the sleeveen scum. And fúck, they couldn't allow that now could they.

Gee Bag

Fianna Fail.......................




.....................Sure they're a great bunch of lads so they are.

donegal_road

€300,000,000 - €200,000 = €299,800,000

that tribunal was well worth the money now, wasn't it?


*runs off to get an application form for law school*

Faolchu

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKztnNY1q2U

hope he ends up eating his words

donegal_road

Fran1985 wrote: »

so would you rather it was all bad news or would like to see that at least someone, who is currently in power, is in the job to serve his constituants, and not just feather his own nest?

sorry, that has gone completely over my head, could you re-phrase please

Fluorescence

donegal_road wrote: »

sorry, that has gone completely over my head, could you re-phrase please

Basically, at least Pat Rabbitte isn't lining his own pockets.

shangri la

Keyzer wrote: »

I fail to see the point in these ridiculous tribunals - this one is going to cost between €250 million - €300 million.

No one will be prosecuted...

No one will be jailed...

No one will be sacked...

And to top it off, the overall cost of this thing is more than these crooks ever stole plus it has made millionaires of a lot of barristers...

thats everyones point. who are the solicitors/who chose them how did they drink E80k worth of tea?

Forget about Bertie / these fcukers really took the piss and at a minimum should have their license to practice law taken away.

Fluorescence

Tbf I'd probably drink 80k worth of tea over the course of a decade. :P

Frager

Where can I download a copy of the Mahon Report?

dirtyden

Frager wrote: »

Where can I download a copy of the Mahon Report?

I think it is linked on the RTE website

toexpress

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

id say bertie is really shitting himself:rolleyes:

Yeah he was so worried all along :rolleyes:

Does anyone else see the irony of the fact that hundreds of millions was spent on this while the country was booming, all of that time in fact. Bertie stuck his two fingers up at the judicial system and at each of us cost us a fortune and now he is sitting up pretty on a nice big pension while the rest of us try to find the money to pay the household charge, our tax bills, our TV Licence and as of May the 28th, if you are an AIB customer, bank charges.

The whole situation is one that is quite sick when you consider the fact that he has a nice comfy life for however long he might want one and yet those of us that are still working to try and get the country out of the dire situation that it is in are being hit with more and more new charges all the time.

Frankly hanging is to good for that man. I want to know why there is no prison time being served by some of these. Dunlop got his sentence, sent off to a nice cushy time in Arbour Hill Prison where he used it like a drop in centre and took time out whenever he wanted basically but no-one else will ever see the inside of a prison, not even it seems Arbour Hill.

The whole thing is sickening, truly sickening and yet we will still have to pay our tax bill this year the same as every other bugger year

tayto lover

Bertie was the man responsible for replacing the Harp with the Fiddle on Govt stationery.
If anything useful comes out of this at all it has to be the ending of political appointments in the Commissioner rank of the Garda. It was always rife for corruption as any of the political parties could dictate through their puppets which crimes were investigated and which were not.

benway

Doc Ruby wrote: »

They wrote the laws that way. Yes clowns as dangerously corrupt as Ahern and incompetent as Cowen were actually writing laws. And who's to object, the entire legal profession was getting paid off from your taxes.

That and the fact that these things would be pretty much impossible to investigate in the normal way, given their complexity, and their being investigated by the Gardaí behind closed doors, could give rise to a reasonable assumption of undue political influence - a Garda is going to think twice about giving the Taoiseach a going over, where a tribunal barrister, who knows he/she is set for life, will have no such worries.

Now that the investigation has been completed, there must be prosecutions. If there aren't, it will completely ruin any trust that may be left in the political establishment, and there's no way that it can be said that there aren't sufficient grounds, given the content of the report.

tayto lover

benway wrote: »

That and the fact that these things would be pretty much impossible to investigate in the normal way, given their complexity, and their being investigated by the Gardaí behind closed doors, could give rise to a reasonable assumption of undue political influence - a Garda is going to think twice about giving the Taoiseach a going over, where a tribunal barrister, who knows he/she is set for life, will have no such worries.

Now that the investigation has been completed, there must be prosecutions. If there aren't, it will completely ruin any trust that may be left in the political establishment, and there's no way that it can be said that there aren't sufficient grounds, given the content of the report.

F.F. should be made contribute to the costs of the Tribunal too. It's their mess anyway.

Typhoon.

Frager wrote: »

Where can I download a copy of the Mahon Report?

http://www.planningtribunal.ie/asp/index.asp?ObjectID=310&Mode=0&RecordID=480

ohyesthefinest

Shocking.

SeaFields

For the last few hours i have listened to the media going on about how bertie is going to be kicked out of FF and that it is such a big deal. Am i the only one who thinks "who gives a fiddlers fcuk?!"

I couldn't give a rats ass if they kick him out of their corrupt party and go on as if everything is rosy in the political garden again. What would be somewhat satisfying is if the Gardai and Revenue were waiting to speak to him and if Inda came out and said they were taking his pension off him and off the others who lied to the tribunal and were otherwise corrupt. And that the state were going after everyone found of wrong doing to recoup costs for the taxpayer.

I suppose the legislation surrounding all of this is nicely worded so it cant happen tho

/rant :mad:

donegal_road

toexpress wrote: »

Yeah he was so worried all along :rolleyes:

Does anyone else see the irony of the fact that hundreds of millions was spent on this while the country was booming, all of that time in fact. Bertie stuck his two fingers up at the judicial system and at each of us cost us a fortune and now he is sitting up pretty on a nice big pension while the rest of us try to find the money to pay the household charge, our tax bills, our TV Licence and as of May the 28th, if you are an AIB customer, bank charges.

The tribunal wound up in 2008, I wonder was it because they realised that the economy had ground to a halt and they knew they weren't going to get away with milking the system like they had been. If the boom was still in full swing, the Mahon tribunal may well be still in progress.

thesimpsons

I'd really hope they are getting the arrest warrants ready and we'll see these guys charged by tomorrow. Couldn't give a fiddlers either about them being kicked out of FF, thats only a small incidential. Take away pensions and all benefits away, surrender passports, freeze their bank accounts, lock them up and throw away the key. How bloody dare they behave this way.

Rabidlamb

Between kiddy fiddling priests & corrupt politicians our Gardai didn't have a great run of it in the 80's.
What did they do, ring them up & ask them if they were doing anything illegal then take their word for it.
Love of jebus.

murphm45

Ii'm probably going to get banned for this but to tell you the truth i just don't care anymore, i'm sick to death of this.

Nothing, yes that right NOTHING but hot air will come of this.

Why? because they're all as bad as each other, they've all got their snouts in the trough and if anyone is brought to bear over this the gravy train will be derailed for everyone. i'm sure everyone has see the monstrous sh!t that was built over the last 10 years, and i'm honestly to believe that appauling yellow apartment built in/on a flood plain in the middle of nowhere where done without bag fulls of money changing hands for permission rezoning etc? Lads seriously where the f*ck do you think i landed in the last shower of rain?!

I would really love for something to come of this but unfortunately i know it won't. Even more unfortunately Ireland will remain a laughing stock of the developed (i'm using this conservatively) world until this is stamped out, i'd be surprised if this happened in my lifetime.

ilovesleep

murphm45 wrote: »

Ii'm probably going to get banned for this but to tell you the truth i just don't care anymore, i'm sick to death of this.

Nothing, yes that right NOTHING but hot air will come of this.

Why? because they're all as bad as each other, they've all got their snouts in the trough and if anyone is brought to bear over this the gravy train will be derailed for everyone. i'm sure everyone has see the monstrous sh!t that was built over the last 10 years, and i'm honestly to believe that appauling yellow apartment built in/on a flood plain in the middle of nowhere where done without bag fulls of money changing hands for permission rezoning etc? Lads seriously where the f*ck do you think i landed in the last shower of rain?!

I would really love for something to come of this but unfortunately i know it won't. Even more unfortunately Ireland will remain a laughing stock of the developed (i'm using this conservatively) world until this is stamped out, i'd be surprised if this happened in my lifetime.

When are people going to realise that it is the job of us the Irish people to hold these people accountable. If this sh1t went on in France they would be out protesting in mass upon their streets demanding for change. So many people just shrugged their shoulders today at this.

Our politicial system is corrupted to the core. FG too. Enda Kenny issued stern words to the vatican last summer and that's all it was - words. Followed up with no action. And we won't push for the change that is needed.

benway

ilovesleep wrote: »

When are people going to realise that it is job of us the Irish people to hold these people accountable. If this sh1t went on in France they would be out protesting in mass upon their streets demanding for change. So many people just shrugged their shoulders today at this.

Nailed it.

What's driving me mad even more than the political and business classes who operate like this, are the "yerrah I'd have done the same myself, fair play to you bass" apologists, and the "nothing will ever change" defeatists. The former are a lost cause, as for the latter, we get that you're hard bitten men and women of the world, worn down by years of disappointments, but maybe try quitting your moaning and doing something about it - it's up to us to demand action.

We probably won't see prosecutions for at least another year in the best case scenario, but we won't see them at all if we don't make it clear that we expect this kind of corruption to be dealt with harshly.

Going on and on about how it's going to be brushed under the rug will only give the powers that be a further incentive to do exactly that.

Frank Black

ilovesleep wrote: »

If this sh1t went on in France they would be out protesting in mass upon their streets demanding for change. So many people just shrugged their shoulders today at this.

A Gallic shrug.

tayto lover

ilovesleep wrote: »

When are people going to realise that it is the job of us the Irish people to hold these people accountable. If this sh1t went on in France they would be out protesting in mass upon their streets demanding for change. So many people just shrugged their shoulders today at this.

Our politicial system is corrupted to the core. FG too. Enda Kenny issued stern words to the vatican last summer and that's all it was - words. Followed up with no action. And we won't push for the change that is needed.

Enda is every bit as two-faced as these are. Didn't he go on t.v. not so long ago to tell us that we were not responsible for the state of the nation and a month later went and blamed us all in Davros.
He also said he would have a Referendum to get rid of the Seanad within 100 days and then went back on that too.
They are all the same.

muracan

Fianna Fail were always corrupt....what happened the money Dev collected in America, what founded the Irish Press??

Bertie and co. should have CAB on their backs.
Their pensions should be cancelled and their assets seized.
If a law can be brought in to make me pay 100 euro household charge one surely can be passed to sort out the corrupt politicians!

.

ilovesleep

Just last weekend we were parading around our towns, villages and cities celebrating being Irish. And what to we have to be proud of?

Decades of corruption and abuse from those in power:
The catholic church
The politicial field

While people emerigrate and commit suicide to escape from this while the rest of us pick up the pieces, work like paupers for those on the gravy train, turn on each other and allow not only this corruption to continue but the major discrimination that is happening in society.

May I just remind you all as an example of January just gone. Revenue got onto the backs of OAPs for some OAPs didn't declare all their income. Here with the report we have some politicians with dodgy expenses and transactions and they have been protected with a tribunal. This is discrimination. One law for us but it doesn't apply to those in the politicial field. This has to change.

ilovesleep

tayto lover wrote: »

Enda is every bit as two-faced as these are. Didn't he go on t.v. not so long ago to tell us that we were not responsible for the state of the nation and a month later went and blamed us all in Davros.
He also said he would have a Referendum to get rid of the Seanad within 100 days and then went back on that too.
They are all the same.

Where's our president I wonder? Another finiancial waste.

benway

ilovesleep wrote: »

they have been protected with a tribunal.

This is not true. There's nothing to prevent prosecutions against these same people, based on these same events. No double jeopardy for tribunal investigations. In fact, most of the investigative work has been done now, it's just a case of the DPP putting together the formal prosecutions in many cases. Certainly those where there has been a finding of corruption, they should be relatively straightforward.

But, again, if people don't raise their expectations of the political class, it won't help matters.

squod

benway wrote: »

This is not true. There's nothing to prevent prosecutions against these same people, based on these same events. No double jeopardy for tribunal investigations, and it doesn't In fact, most of the investigative work has been done now, it's just a case of the DPP putting together the formal prosecutions in many cases. Certainly those where there has been a finding of corruption, they should be relatively straightforward.

But, again, if people don't raise their expectations of the political class, it won't help matters.

Yeah. Live the bleedin' high life for thirty years and maybe spend a few months in jail. Maybe.

tayto lover

benway wrote: »

This is not true. There's nothing to prevent prosecutions against these same people, based on these same events. No double jeopardy for tribunal investigations. In fact, most of the investigative work has been done now, it's just a case of the DPP putting together the formal prosecutions in many cases. Certainly those where there has been a finding of corruption, they should be relatively straightforward.

But, again, if people don't raise their expectations of the political class, it won't help matters.

Really ?? The D.P.P. is a political appointment.
The Garda Commissioners are political appointees.

Sure I heard the late Brian Lenihan Snr on the Late Late Show years ago telling the story of a gang of politicians in a pub late one night well after hours. A Garda went in and began taking names as was his duty to do so. Lenihan made a big laugh of telling the audience that he asked the Garda if he wanted "a pint or a transfer?" The audience roared laughing.
#We get what we deserve. Political corruption is not a new thing. They have an arrogance about them that they believe puts them above the law.

benway

tayto lover wrote: »

Really ?? The D.P.P. is a political appointment.
The Garda Commissioners are political appointees.

Sure I heard the late Brian Lenihan Snr on the Late Late Show years ago telling the story of a gang of politicians in a pub late one night well after hours. A Garda went in and began taking names as was his duty to do so. Lenihan made a big laugh of telling the audience that he asked the Garda if he wanted "a pint or a transfer?" The audience roared laughing.
#We get what we deserve. Political corruption is not a new thing. They have an arrogance about them that they believe puts them above the law.

This is exactly the point. It has to end now. People need to make it clear that we won't take it any more, that we're watching, and voting accordingly.

Another story, I met a guy who worked in Anglo in December 2008 when the story of Seanín's loans to himself was coming out:

"Seán is more than entitled to it, sure wasn't Charlie at it?"

This has to stop.

Skid

According to the RTE 9 o'clock news, Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin will seek the expulsion of Bertie Ahern and Padraig Flynn from the party.

Imagine being so disgraced even Fianna Fáil don't want you as member

Rabidlamb

2125 Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin will seek the expulsion of Bertie Ahern and Padraig Flynn from the party.

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0322/mahon.html

Orando Broom

Go into any college and you have a cabal of fools tripping over themselves to get elected for student this and student that. These are the fücktards that will be the next generation of corrupt twats who are only chomping at the bit to repeat the mistakes of their predecessors.

With regards protests as long as you have the Shinners, Trustafarians and a shower of English hippies using every form of public display of dissatisfaction to further their own dickheaded agendas then you'll never, ever get the ordinary Irishman on the street. Ever.

billybudd

Rabidlamb wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0322/mahon.html

Yes because he hadnt a iota of what was going on.


More waste of money! why he couldnt have been tried for tax evasion/bribery in a court of law is the real shame these tribunals are just nonsense, nonsense that costs alot of money.

SirDelboy18

billybudd wrote: »

Yes because he hadnt a iota of what was going on.


More waste of money! why he couldnt have been tried for tax evasion/bribery in a court of law is the real shame these tribunals are just nonsense, nonsense that costs alot of money.

Well Bertie never liked Micheal, screwed him over, and I'd say the feeling is mutual now. I'd doubt Micheal had too many dealings with Bertie beyond what was necessary.

Callipo

The law society et al made their money.

Bring on the NAMA tribunal. Once they have banked their cash.....obviously.

ascanbe

The ironic thing about all this is that the report, such as it is, after 15 years and tons of public money spent, has emerged to a chorus of indignation, promises of change/'it must never happen again' from our politicians/govt at a time when these very same politicians are, at very best, showing little interest of any kind in there being a true investigation into what happened in our banks and in the relationship between certain politicians and these banks.
'History repeats itself, first as tragedy, then as farce'.
Judging by our current position and this circus, it looks like we're doing the tragedy and farce at the same time.

Dyr

Skid wrote: »

According to the RTE 9 o'clock news, Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin will seek the expulsion of Bertie Ahern and Padraig Flynn from the party.

Imagine being so disgraced even Fianna Fáil don't want you as member

tbh honest it should be other way around, Bertie and Pee Flynn should be appointed leader and deputy leader and anyone in fianna f**l who disagrees with their shenanigans should be asked to leave the party.

Bertie and PeeWee are the embodiment of everything that fianna f**l and their supporters aspire to. Filthy Traitorous f**ks to a man

Dyr

Spacedog wrote: »

Take Ray Burke, convicted of corruption, yet when someone mentions his terrible Corrib Gas giveaway deal on Politics, most people (including mods), will defend this corruption as normal operating procedure in the energy industry.

Same with the few people with the balls to say something in the Ocuppy Camps, according to boards users they are stinkin hippies who don't know their place.

If you guys have a better idea, I'd like to hear it?

In all fairness complaining trying to debate cronyism in a boards politics forum is like trying to highlight tax evasion in a caymen islands bank. :pac:

Callipo

Spacedog wrote: »

What is needed is an agency like the CAB that is outside the remit of the government to investigate, prepare bring cases before a jury, no need for drawn out show trials, present the charges, interview the witnesses and the defendant, and let a jury of normal people decide. if it's good enough for murder cases, it's good enough for this.

We have some real problems with corruption here, but more than this we have a problem of impotently accepting corruption.

Take Ray Burke, convicted of corruption, yet when someone mentions his terrible Corrib Gas giveaway deal on Politics, most people (including mods), will defend this corruption as normal operating procedure in the energy industry.

Same with the few people with the balls to say something in the Ocuppy Camps, according to boards users they are stinkin hippies who don't know their place.

If you guys have a better idea, I'd like to hear it?

It is intrinsic in our ways. Mods circling the wagon is not too dissimilar to politicans. Protect the greater good. What ever that is considered...at the time.

Capt'n Midnight

Skid wrote: »

According to the RTE 9 o'clock news, Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin will seek the expulsion of Bertie Ahern and Padraig Flynn from the party.

Imagine being so disgraced even Fianna Fáil don't want you as member

That means nothing FF have expelled people before, but all is forgiven if you can get re-elected.

How many FF TD's disassociated themselves from the party at the last election ?

"Independent" Fianna Fáil has been used as a title too.


Bottom line , Bertie isn't going to win a seat for FF so there is no downside for the party.

McTigs

Miriam Lord lays it down well in todays Times

A bit ridiculous Martin being all upset and horrified now.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0323/1224313769154.html

kippy

Getting expelled from a party - boo hoo- what other punishment could be any worse?

The political class, particularly FF, are making this out to be the ultimate punishment.
What point at all is there in expelling Pee Flynn, Bertie and a few more from the party? They are all retired, sitting on their fat pensions, board memberships and lucrative private speaking jobs?

Some good points were mentioned yesterday by one of the female politicians in the Dail (could have been Roisin Shortall) stating that while it had proved to be difficult enough to trace cash donations, there are and were far bigger links between business and politics when you see "retired" politicians end up on the boards of private organisations. How do they make these boards? Is it a favour in return for some thing done in the past?? Who knows, impossible to track, but ultimately these are for private gain.


FF also saying that their ex-ministers (who made fun of the tribunal) were never named in the report so this makes it "okay".

Frager

Thanks to Dirty Den, Typhoon, benway, Capt'n Midnight and McTigs who pointed me to the RTE site.
Unfortunately when about one third of the report has downloaded I get a messagae saying that the file is damaged and cannot be opened.

Frager

Unfortunately when about one third of the report has downloaded I get a message saying that the file is damaged and cannot be opened.

kippy

Frager wrote: »

Unfortunately when about one third of the report has downloaded I get a message saying that the file is damaged and cannot be opened.

Try download it again from here:
http://www.insideview.ie/irisheyes/2012/03/download-mahon-report.html

ejmaztec

Frager wrote: »

Unfortunately when about one third of the report has downloaded I get a message saying that the file is damaged and cannot be opened.

Jaysus, even the file's corrupted.:mad:

Born to Die

FF and 40 years of corruption that would put the Mafia to shame. At least the Mafia have the decency to shoot each other.