Are Kenny Dalglish and Liverpool Done?

Handsome Bob

blatantrereg wrote: »

Commentator mentioned in RTE highlights that Liverpool would be in the bottom three if the league had started on new year's day. [In fact he might have said absolute bottom].

Good thing for us so that the season starts in August, and the above is just an irrelevant observation.

kryogen

Joe10000 wrote: »

We have YNWA as our anthem for a reason. Kenny has done more for this club then any man alive and he knows what's best for the club more then you or me.

Are you off your meds?

The cult like following he has is brilliant you would have to admit no matter which side of the coin you happen to be on

willmunny1990

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Good thing for us so that the season starts in August, and the above is just an irrelevant observation.

It's a good indication of just how bad Pool have been since the turn of the year. if it was hodgson or anyone else they'd have been hounded out by now.

Father Damo

Oranage2 wrote: »

A massive mistake letting Roy go - Imagine what Hodgson would have done with 100 million.

Anyone who thinks otherwise hasnt a clue about....


It is a cliche here to say people "have no clue about football" in order to end a debate. So I will elaborate.

People who believe Hodgson would not have done better have no clue about football, life, business, reality, or how to tie their own shoe laces. The man is top, top class. The knives were out for him by September FFS.

I'm just intrigued to find out, if Liverpool's decline continues, will their fans remain as numerous and vocal as ever? Because as a United fan, I'm fairly certain there would be less of us about if United ever dropped out of the top four, let alone started descending into the middle of the table.

As a Liverpool fan I have not given two sh1ts as to how they are doing since Hodgson got shafted and Torres got forced out of a club that he loved. Pathetic board, pathetic fans brought it on. Dalglish is even worse than I imagined he would be.

Once they get a proper manager and sell off morons like Suarez they might be worth backing again. Until then I will be rooting for City,. Newcastle and Arsenal. My issue with Dalglish is not that he is a sh1te manager in the current era (which he is), it is his arrogance and handling of the Suarez incident. An arrogance I always thought was reserved for United and their fans. Lets be clear, there is zero difference between Liverpool and United these days, apart from results obviously. The attitude is the exact same.

kryogen

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Good thing for us so that the season starts in August, and the above is just an irrelevant observation.

I agree with you that as a stat in itself it is pointless, but it does illustrate that Liverpool have been showing relegation form for three and a half, nearly four months now, that is a good chunk of the season.

willowthewisp

MrMatisse wrote: »

Hard to believe they threw away a two goal lead against mighty QPR but this wigan display is terrible.

Its with a heavy heart I say, its time to sack Dalglish.

Cop on, it's "fans" like you that has the club where it is.

kryogen

willowthewisp wrote: »

Cop on, it's "fans" like you that has the club where it is.

Thats just not true.

del88

willowthewisp wrote: »

Cop on, it's "fans" like you that has the club where it is.

No....Its a succession of bad managers that have the club where it is....If anything the liverpool faithful have been too loyal over the years.

Leiva

del88 wrote: »

No....Its a succession of bad managers that have the club where it is....If anything the liverpool faithful have been too loyal over the years.

Faithful to who the managers ?

So we should become Chelsea then ? That's a really successful strategy hey , the seedy nature of a club that wins the double then sacks the manager next season , and buying a manager out of his current project for £14 million but then won't buy into his philosophy !

No thanks .

We are Liverpool and I hope to good God we don't change .

kingshankly

willowthewisp wrote: »

Cop on, it's "fans" like you that has the club where it is.

That's a rediculous statement every fan is entitled to their own opinion and yesterday was the straw that broke the camels back for me the club is a farce ATM and the ease in which Wigan kept us at bay yesterday was embarrassing.
I have been travelling to anfield for 25 years and I can't remember us being so bad at anfield (maybe with the exception of sounesses final year).
Teams use to fear coming up the anfield tunnell now the cant wait to get out for a handy point or three

OldmanMondeo

At the end of the season it should be reviewed. I hate the knee jerk reaction some fans take. Too many clubs have sacked managers without giving them time to develop the squad the way they want. AVB? And ever other manager between Jose and him.

After 6 years of winning nothing we have won 1 cup and have a 1 in four chance of winning another. However, We will miss on CL and had we not won the CC we would not be in Europe. Liverpool have a history of winning leagues and European Cups, this is what us fans have been used to and it is what we need to return to, but only if we do it right. Not splashing the cash like others, but developing for the long term.

Happy Monday

del88 wrote: »

No....Its a succession of bad managers that have the club where it is....If anything the liverpool faithful have been too loyal over the years.

We were placed just 3 years back.
Top of the league and one of the top teams in the CL.
Shame Fenway didn't come a calling then.
To blame Rafa for any of this is madness.

Optimalprimerib

plasmaguy wrote: »

CSF wrote: »

I honestly can't believe Liverpool are throwing around having won the League Cup to a rebuttal to anything.

Another League only fan.

Success equals winning trophies, not finishing in top 4.

I'd rather have a load of trophies in my collection than top 4 league finishes.

I can see the likes of hazard chomping at the bit to move to Liverpool because of the worthless cup.

As sad as it is the CL is what is required if u really want to make strides in becoming a top side. It becomes easier to hold on to your best players and gives a better chance to sign the higher standard of player.

I'm not saying I agree with it, I would prefer that the cups would be seen as more important, but thats just the way it is at the moment

SlickRic

threads merged.

seriously, how anyone can argue the new one is justified because it's "more focused" is hilarious.

do it all in the one thread thanks.

Mr.Crinklewood

plasmaguy wrote: »

Ferguson was pretty average in the league for his first few seasons.

The only thing that saved him was the FA Cup win in 1990, and from there, the team really took off. Talented youngsters like Lee Sharpe and Ryan Giggs coming through also helped.

It takes time to lay foundations, and Dalglish knows the formula for Liverpool success going back to Paisley's time. I could be wrong, but the talented young Liverpool players of the 1990's came through the youth ranks while Dalglish was senior manager, or he probably put in place structures that helped. Benitez on the other hand had an appalling record of youth development.

Bringing in a mercenary manager like Chelsea do every year, with no allegiance to the club is not the solution imo, and would be extremely costly if it didn't work out.

In his first full season in charge he came second in the League, would not call this average.

Granted, the next few seasons were not that great. Success is however gauged different these seasons, these days if you do not win a major cup you are expected to qualify for the Champions League to be gauged as a success. Back then finishing down the league was not that important as there was no reward of European football due to the club ban.

Fair play to Liverpool for winning the League cup, i know we all slag if off, but it is still a cup...the FA Cup would be a huge bonus though.

If Liverpool were to win the cup double, and somehow introduce some young players with a bit of potential, then this season would not be too bad after all. If they are left with just the League cup, i`d be pretty disappointed if i were a Liverpool fan.

However given the choice of FA Cup / League cup double or Champions League qualification i would rather have the Champions League, purely as a carrot to dangle in front of potential signings.

Formatting a bit screwed..

P W D L F A W D L F A Pts
1. LIVERPOOL 40 15 5 0 49 9 11 7 2 38 15 90
2. Manchester United 40 14 5 1 41 17 9 7 4 30 21 81
3. Nottingham Forest 40 11 7 2 40 17 9 6 5 27 22 73
4. Everton 40 14 4 2 34 11 5 9 6 19 16 70
5. Queen's Park Rangers 40 12 4 4 30 14 7 6 7 18 24 67
6. Arsenal 40 11 4 5 35 16 7 8 5 23 23 66
7. Wimbledon 40 8 9 3 32 20 6 6 8 26 27 57
8. Newcastle United 40 9 6 5 32 23 5 8 7 23 30 56
9. Luton Town 40 11 6 3 40 21 3 5 12 17 37 53
10. Coventry City 40 6 8 6 23 25 7 6 7 23 28 53
11. Sheffield Wednesday 40 10 2 8 27 30 5 6 9 25 36 53
12. Southampton 40 6 8 6 27 26 6 6 8 22 27 50
13. Tottenham Hotspur 40 9 5 6 26 23 3 6 11 12 25 47
14. Norwich City 40 7 5 8 26 26 5 4 11 14 26 45
15. Derby County 40 6 7 7 18 17 4 6 10 17 28 43
16. West Ham United 40 6 9 5 23 21 3 6 11 17 31 42
17. Charlton Athletic 40 7 7 6 23 21 2 8 10 15 31 42
18. CHELSEA 40 7 11 2 24 17 2 4 14 26 51 42
19. PORTSMOUTH 40 4 8 8 21 27 3 6 11 15 39 35
20. WATFORD 40 4 5 11 15 24 3 6 11 12 27 32
21. OXFORD UNITED 40 5 7 8 24 34 1 6 13 20 46 31

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Comparing Dalglish to Fergie.
Saying that the Carling Cup is better than a top 4 finish.
Saying that Carroll & Suarez's poor season can be excused by injury and ill-discipline.
Babbling on again about net spend.


This thread is just full of the fcuking LOL. Dalglish has had a poor season, forget even about his transfers, what about his tactical performances? What about is squad/team selection? What, the fcuk, about how he treated the whole Suarez fiasco? He has damaged the club's reputation so much that it's a wonder that any Liverpool fan would want him for next season, but hey, if ye're happy, then I'm over the fcuking moon. One less club in the battle for the top 4 next season, along with all the LOLs that go along with him as manager.

SirDelboy18

When you spend that much money you should be finishing high above the likes Sunderland, Swansea, Norwich, Newcastle and Stoke. Simple as.

The Carling Cup cannot disguise this fact.

Was Birmingham's season a success last year? No. They failed in their primary goal of staying in the Premier League. Liverpool have failed in their primary goal of qualifying for the Champions League.

redzerdrog

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

When you spend that much money you should be finishing high above the likes Sunderland, Swansea, Norwich, Newcastle and Stoke. Simple as.
QUOTE]

I didnt realise the season had finished already:rolleyes:

SirDelboy18

redzerdrog wrote: »

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

When you spend that much money you should be finishing high above the likes Sunderland, Swansea, Norwich, Newcastle and Stoke. Simple as.
QUOTE]

I didnt realise the season had finished already:rolleyes:

Oh silly me. Because in the space of 8 games Liverpool are going to jump 20 or so points clear of all those teams.

In my post I said "finishing high above".

They are actually 5 points behind Newcastle, 2 ahead of Sunderland and 3 ahead of Norwich and Swansea. But yeah cool, I'm sure the table will look radically different come May.

eagle eye

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Oh silly me. Because in the space of 8 games Liverpool are going to jump 20 or so points clear of all those teams.

In my post I said "finishing high above".

They are actually 5 points behind Newcastle, 2 ahead of Sunderland and 3 ahead of Norwich and Swansea. But yeah cool, I'm sure the table will look radically different come May.

It amazes me how a different set of rules apply to a Liverpool legend and a former manager of another big club.

Villa Boas got the sack and everybody says how badly he was treated and how he was never given enough time to do his thing. Yet a lot of the same people say Dalglish, who has been in charge Liverpool for a couple of months more than Villa Boas was in charge at Chelsea, should be sacked.

Marty McFly

eagle eye wrote: »

It amazes me how a different set of rules apply to a Liverpool legend and a former manager of another big club.

Villa Boas got the sack and everybody says how badly he was treated and how he was never given enough time to do his thing. Yet a lot of the same people say Dalglish, who has been in charge Liverpool for a couple of months more than Villa Boas was in charge at Chelsea, should be sacked.

Yes but the difference between Boas and Dalglish is that Boas wasnt given the time to build his own team everyone knows the Chelsea squad is aging and needs new players, Dalglish wnet out and spent a fortune in the summer hes signed Carroll, Suarez, Henderson, Adams, Downing there his signings his players and he hasnt got it right at all.

Villa Boas when he was sacked was still in the Champions League and very much in contention for Champions League spots Liverpool are not.

PhlegmyMoses

eagle eye wrote: »

It amazes me how a different set of rules apply to a Liverpool legend and a former manager of another big club.

Villa Boas got the sack and everybody says how badly he was treated and how he was never given enough time to do his thing. Yet a lot of the same people say Dalglish, who has been in charge Liverpool for a couple of months more than Villa Boas was in charge at Chelsea, should be sacked.

Dalglish has done nothing to garner any good-will from neutrals, which means he will be under pressure the minute he starts to do badly. His handling of the Suarez situation was abysmal. Also, the way he deals with the press means he will never get the benefit of the doubt.

People will say it's the same tactic that Fergie uses but the difference between the two is that Fergie is whiter than white when it comes to results. The press have very little to slate him over. Had Fergie ended up out of the top 4 this year they would have been rubbing their hands with glee at the thought of taking him down a notch. This is what is happening to Dalglish now. It's why Hodgson got an easier time from the press - a man who understands that the press can break you - than Dalglish ever will.

Sgt Pepper 64

Daglish = great player, crap manager, should never have been appointed 2nd time round

EdenHazard

liverpool fans hahahahah, please keep dalglish its so funny watching this. form table since january would have them bottom

Dub13

I wouldn't trust some of our fans to walk through a puddle with me never mind a storm.

dreamers75

EdenHazard wrote: »

liverpool fans hahahahah, please keep dalglish its so funny watching this. form table since january would have them bottom

2nd last Wolves are bottom

http://www.soccerway.com/national/england/premier-league/2011-2012/regular-season/

Einhard

Dub13 wrote: »

I wouldn't trust some of our fans to walk through a puddle with me never mind a storm.

When sailing through a storm, it helsp to have faith in one's captain...

plasmaguy

Sgt Pepper 64 wrote: »

Daglish = great player, crap manager, should never have been appointed 2nd time round

Crap Manager?

This is a bit typical of the ignorance of younger Liverpool fans to be honest.

In his first time at pool, he won the double in his first season, scoring the league winning goal himself off the bench.

Won 3 leagues in 5 seasons, 2 FA Cups, a League Cup and more than likely would have won at least 1 European Cup if it wasn't for the ban.

If it wasn't for Hillsborough, he'd have been manager a lot longer, won more leagues without doubt, more cups and possibly a few European Cups.

Then went to Blackburn where he won another league and had a few runner ups spots.

Went to Newcastle and had them in the CL from what I remember.

To say he is a crap manager is farcical.

Also can't believe people think Benitez done any better. Benitez spent a sh*tload on the team, far more than Dalglish, and apart from a CL in his first season, with a team mostly inherited from Houlier, he won next to nothing.

Liverpool is a very tough team to manage, I think most people would agree with that, because of expectations of the fans and the history. The pressure on every manager is massive and sometimes they don't cope too well, such as Hodgson.

Seriously don't think sacking Dalglish will achieve anything though. Pool will probably end up with someone like AVB if it happened, as honestly, there's no good managers on the market out there at the moment, and if there is, it's because they were sacked somewhere else.

RasTa

Einhard wrote: »

When sailing through a storm, it helsp to have faith in one's captain...

Unless it's this guy

Oranage2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgvVyO-lseA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QgvVyO-lseA



Telling interview after the Wigan match by the king.

A lot of excuses and borderline delusion, seems to already have his eyes set on next season. But I picked out some key points.

Players are tired and not a big enough squad

Not having the bounce of the ball

Poor poor excuses IMO, he had money to spend to strengthen his squad. He must have had some idea how tough a season is.

Not fair having to bring on a 17yr old

Dalglish seems a bit mift by having to give a young player a chance and even says "not being the way forward for us".

Clearly shows Dalglish doesnt intend to develop or give young players a chance.

Stronger squad needed

Watched Wigan's last 2 games

So I wonder who was Kenny scouting from Wigan?

Perhaps

- Caldwell 26 million?
- Victor Moses 38 million?
- Ben Watson 18 million?

SirDelboy18

plasmaguy wrote: »

Crap Manager?

This is a bit typical of the ignorance of younger Liverpool fans to be honest.

In his first time at pool, he won the double in his first season, scoring the league winning goal himself off the bench.

Won 3 leagues in 5 seasons, 2 FA Cups, a League Cup and more than likely would have won at least 1 European Cup if it wasn't for the ban.

If it wasn't for Hillsborough, he'd have been manager a lot longer, won more leagues without doubt, more cups and possibly a few European Cups.

Then went to Blackburn where he won another league and had a few runner ups spots.

Went to Newcastle and had them in the CL from what I remember.

To say he is a crap manager is farcical.

Also can't believe people think Benitez done any better. Benitez spent a sh*tload on the team, far more than Dalglish, and apart from a CL in his first season, with a team mostly inherited from Houlier, he won next to nothing.

Liverpool is a very tough team to manage, I think most people would agree with that, because of expectations of the fans and the history. The pressure on every manager is massive and sometimes they don't cope too well, such as Hodgson.

Seriously don't think sacking Dalglish will achieve anything though. Pool will probably end up with someone like AVB if it happened, as honestly, there's no good managers on the market out there at the moment, and if there is, it's because they were sacked somewhere else.

He did well last time at Liverpool, no doubt about that, bearing in mind that he did inherit a good side. Don't even bother with the "would have won the EC but for the ban" stuff when Liverpool were responsible for the ban.

He moved to Blackburn where he had Jack Warner's wallet to throw cash at every problem he encountered. He broke the transfer record many times. Most managers would have won a league with that sort of investment. He finished 2nd once by the way, not a few times with Blackburn.

With Newcastle he had them in 2nd, then the next season something like 12th or 13th, and got sacked after two games of the following season. Not a great success. This was for all intents and purposes his last managerial role, not taking into account the Celtic fiasco.

Football is a completely different game to when he last managed, 13 years had past from his departure at Newcastle to taking over from Woy. He hasn't been able to adapt to it. His previous managerial achievements aren't overly relevant considering his success was in a completely different era. An era when 4-4-2 was nearly part of a footballing bible, and so many other things which aren't as fundamental today. He has proven himself to be incapable of succeeding in this one.

plasmaguy

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

He did well last time at Liverpool, no doubt about that, bearing in mind that he did inherit a good side. Don't even bother with the "would have won the EC but for the ban" stuff when Liverpool were responsible for the ban.

He moved to Blackburn where he had Jack Warner's wallet to throw cash at every problem he encountered. He broke the transfer record many times. Most managers would have won a league with that sort of investment. He finished 2nd once by the way, not a few times with Blackburn.

With Newcastle he had them in 2nd, then the next season something like 12th or 13th, and got sacked after two games of the following season. Not a great success. This was for all intents and purposes his last managerial role, not taking into account the Celtic fiasco.

Football is a completely different game to when he last managed, 13 years had past from his departure at Newcastle to taking over from Woy. He hasn't been able to adapt to it. His previous managerial achievements aren't overly relevant considering his success was in a completely different era. An era when 4-4-2 was nearly part of a footballing bible, and so many other things which aren't as fundamental today. He has proven himself to be incapable of succeeding in this one.

The fact still remains, that Liverpool was the dominant force in English Football when he left first time around. After that the decline set in big time.

As for inheriting a good team, nonsense. He made a lot of really good signings such as John Barnes, Aldridge, Houghtan, Stauntan, Beardsely, McMahon and Rush (returning) and a couple of others who formed the backbone of a dominant team.

Dalglish is the only manager who could have consistantly matched Alex Ferguson in my view if both had equal resources. Still think he deserves one more transfer window and at least half of a new season to show what he can do.

But again saying he always was a bad manager is frankly daft, and it's just typical of what the same old usual whinging brigade among pool supporters would say, who seem to never tire of whinging, if here is anything to go by.

SirDelboy18

plasmaguy wrote: »

The fact still remains, that Liverpool was the dominant force in English Football when he left first time around. After that the decline set in big time.

As for inheriting a good team, nonsense. He made a lot of really good signings such as John Barnes, Aldridge, Houghtan, Stauntan, Beardsely, McMahon and Rush (returning) and a couple of others who formed the backbone of a dominant team.

Dalglish is the only manager who could have consistantly matched Alex Ferguson in my view if both had equal resources. Still think he deserves one more transfer window and at least half of a new season to show what he can do.

But again saying he always was a bad manager is frankly daft, and it's just typical of the same old usual whinging brigade among pool supporters would say, who seem to never tire of whinging.

Its nonsence that he inherited a good team? Considering they had just contested the European Cup final I doubt that.

Xavi6

This drivel sums up the Kenny apologists who will put the blame anywhere else but on his doorstep -

http://tomkinstimes.com/2012/03/in-depth-why-are-liverpool-struggling/

plasmaguy

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Its nonsence that he inherited a good team? Considering they had just contested the European Cup final I doubt that.

You doubt it?

Here's the transfers so.

http://liverpoolfc.wikia.com/wiki/Kenny_Dalglish/Transfers

He inherited an aging team but also lost good players to injury such as Beglin and Lawrenson. He cleared out all the old players who were past it, difficult thing to do that, given their reputations. Souness had also left a few years earlier. Even if they got to the European Final, which was far easier to do in those days, the team was in decline, with Everton their main opponents.

He managed to rebuild a new team and Europe aside, it was one of the most successful teams in Liverpool history.

To be honest I'm sick of reading idiots who say he was a poor manager first time around, inherited this and that, made bad signings. He was an outstanding manager first time around, no ifs, buts or maybe's about it.

His net spend this time around was 40 million pounds according to that website. It's nothing to be honest.

J. Marston

Xavi6 wrote: »

This drivel sums up the Kenny apologists who will put the blame anywhere else but on his doorstep -

http://tomkinstimes.com/2012/03/in-depth-why-are-liverpool-struggling/

Net spend is a good guide...

Roar

Xavi6 wrote: »

This drivel sums up the Kenny apologists who will put the blame anywhere else but on his doorstep -

http://tomkinstimes.com/2012/03/in-depth-why-are-liverpool-struggling/

Contains such top class lines as

Swap the cup and league results in specific fixtures and things would look very different.

Rofltastic

Will I Amnt

Xavi6 wrote: »

This drivel sums up the Kenny apologists who will put the blame anywhere else but on his doorstep -

http://tomkinstimes.com/2012/03/in-depth-why-are-liverpool-struggling/

I get linked to that Tomkins fella all the time when my Liverpool supporting mates are trying to show me a "neutral" opinion on something. :rolleyes:
They could be in the Championshio and that lad would be blaming Hodgson or the FA.

Oranage2

Anybody else get the sense of irony that Kenny Dalglish 35million buy of Carroll actually funded Newcastle into being a better team than Liverpool?

counterlock

Will ye stop going on with this net spend nonsense - its a rubbish stat

SirDelboy18

counterlock wrote: »

Will ye stop going on with this net spend nonsense - its a rubbish stat

I agree.


Uniteds net spend since 2006 is around 55 million.
Arsenals net spend since 2006 is in negative figures.

plasmaguy

counterlock wrote: »

Will ye stop going on with this net spend nonsense - its a rubbish stat

Anyone who doesn't understand the concept or relevance of net spend to squad building or football management, doesn't know much about football.

If Mancini had to sell most of his players in the morning for a total of 500 million but was allowed spend 100 million to buy new players, I suppose someone like you would say, he's spent 100 million and it has produced nothing.

Of course it would produce nothing he's lost 500 million worth of players.

Focusing on gross spend is frankly stupid.

It's exactly the same as the difference between someone's gross salary and nett salary.

If for example I earned 50k gross, does that mean I actually have 50k to spend on something? Of course not, 20k of it will be gone on tax.

Focusing on gross spend is idiotic in the extreme and makes absolutely no sense, but people use it as a stick to beat a manager.

If Dalglish sold players worth 90 million and bought players worth 100 million, some people would still say he added 100 million to the squad and it didn't make much of a difference.

Nett spend is all that counts, every other club supporters understands that, except it seems Liverpool supporters.

SirDelboy18

plasmaguy wrote: »

Anyone who doesn't understand the concept or relevance of net spend to squad building or football management, doesn't know much about football.

If Mancini had to sell most of his players in the morning for a total of 500 million but was allowed spend 100 million to buy new players, I suppose someone like you would say, he's spent 100 million and it has produced nothing.

Of course it would produce nothing he's lost 500 million worth of players.

Focusing on gross spend is frankly stupid.

It's exactly the same as the difference between someone's gross salary and nett salary.

If for example I earned 50k gross, does that mean I actually have 50k to spend on something? Of course not, 20k of it will be gone on tax.

Focusing on gross spend is idiotic in the extreme and makes absolutely no sense, but people use it as a stick to beat a manager.

If Dalglish sold players worth 90 million and bought players worth 100 million, some people would still say he added 100 million to the squad and it didn't make much of a difference.

Nett spend is all that counts, every other club supporters understands that, except it seems Liverpool supporters.

No the problem is when people start using net spend to justify the high cost failures of purchased players as if to say " Well sure look at the net spend, it's grand that all of our signings are failures"

counterlock

Nonesene, nett spend is dictated by the market and demand.

It has no relevenace to what player x leaving, and what player y arriving, contribute to the club.

plasmaguy

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

No the problem is when people start using net spend to justify the high cost failures of purchased players as if to say " Well sure look at the net spend, it's grand that all of our signings are failures"

I certainly don't use net spend to justify anything. I just use it to say that focusing on gross spend makes no sense whatsoever. People seem to be claiming the value of the players playing for the club have gone up by 100 million. But it hasn't the value has gone up by 40 million.

Anyways, the problems at Liverpool go far deeper than just Dalglish. It's a badly run club in my view. The turnaround in players, managers and owners is something else. I think if Liverpool sack Dalglish, they will be as big of a laughing stock as Chelsea with all the chopping and changing.

Each new manager clears out a load of players from the previous manager and brings in his own players, and it takes time for them to gel, ineitably leading to bad results, and then the fans want him gone, and then in comes a new manager, and the cycle continues. Becomes a joke after a while.

bucketybuck

plasmaguy wrote: »

Nett spend is all that counts, every other club supporters understands that, except it seems Liverpool supporters.

Nett spend only counts because it helps Liverpool fans to gloss over the fact that your godlike manager completely ****ed up on his transfer dealings. Thats the long and short of it, and thats why the words "nett spend" would never have been heard from any supporters two years ago.

plasmaguy

bucketybuck wrote: »

Nett spend only counts because it helps Liverpool fans to gloss over the fact that your godlike manager completely ****ed up on his transfer dealings. Thats the long and short of it, and thats why the words "nett spend" would never have been heard from any supporters two years ago.

I'm not a Liverpool supporter sonny, sorry to dissapoint you. I just don't agree with the choppping and changing, fire and hire, mentality in football.

SirDelboy18

plasmaguy wrote: »

I think if Liverpool sack Dalglish, they will be as big of a laughing stock as Chelsea with all the chopping and changing.

No they won't.

Abramovich got rid of Mourinho on the back of 2 leagues and an F.A Cup. He then fired Avram Grant days after losing a Champions League final on penalties.

He fired Ancelotti despite him winning the league and F.A Cup. He fired Villas Boas after paying 13 million to hire him, pledging his support to his project, and then sacking him when things got a bit rough, incurring a large loss also.

Thats before taking into account the influence he has had on the club with the likes of Shevchenko, Torres.

I don't see how Liverpool could in any way be compared to Chelsea.

Dalglish hasn't worked out. It was a good idea, no doubt about it. After a time of such instability it was a great move to appoint a club legend. But there comes a time when a sacking is necessary. He has dealt atrociously with the press, he has spent huge sums of money on bad signings and he has Liverpool nowhere near the Champions League places. He has no success bar the Carling Cup which most people don't care about anyway, and it certainly doesn't compensate for poor league form.

plasmaguy

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

No they won't.

Abramovich got rid of Mourinho on the back of 2 leagues and an F.A Cup. He then fired Avram Grant days after losing a Champions League final on penalties.

He fired Ancelotti despite him winning the league and F.A Cup. He fired Villas Boas after paying 13 million to hire him, pledging his support to his project, and then sacking him when things got a bit rough, incurring a large loss also.

Thats before taking into account the influence he has had on the club with the likes of Shevchenko, Torres.

I don't see how Liverpool could in any way be compared to Chelsea.

Dalglish hasn't worked out. It was a good idea, no doubt about it. After a time of such instability it was a great move to appoint a club legend. But there comes a time when a sacking is necessary. He has dealt atrociously with the press, he has spent huge sums of money on bad signings and he has Liverpool nowhere near the Champions League places. He has no success bar the Carling Cup which most people don't care about anyway, and it certainly doesn't compensate for poor league form.

Couple of points.

Dalglish is 7th in the League. If he was 17th, yes by all means he should be gone.

Ferguson after a good first full season, finishing second, it went downhill rapidly, the next season it was 11th, the season after, it was 6th I think, and the season after was no better. At that stage he was looking a major failure and had nothing to show after spending a lot of cash.

Arsenal, Newcastle and all those other teams are doing well because they were knocked out of all the cups early.

It was the same in Benitez time, he focused an awful lot on doing well in the Champions League and the EPL almost was an afterthought.

It seems to be very difficult these days to go all out on all fronts. Look at the disasters Man Utd and Man City have been in everything but the League this season, even they can't go all out on all fronts.

I just have this gut instinct that if pool fire Dalglish now, they will seriously regret it next year, when the new manager could well be worse, in fact more than likely will be worse. You will more than likely end up with a mercenary foreign manager, who you sign up on a 5 year contract at 5 million a year, and if they get sacked you have to pay the full contract.

But anyways, what do I care, I don't support pool, I suppose I should be laughing really at the fans who want Dalglish out, which I am anyways. Unfortunately, Liverpool don't seem to be able to choose a good manager these days, and most of them seem to turn out as flops eventually, and I don't see Dalglish's replacement being much better.

CL7

EdenHazard wrote: »

the senile old moron

Wow, what a classless thing to say.