Bertie Ahern statement/resignation

dark crystal

Faolchu wrote: »

its a ministers pension and as he served as a minister then i would think he would be entitled to it regardless of being a party member or not because its related to his time in government ad not his time as a party member, i mean indos etc get ministers pensions if they hold ministerial positions.

Ah, ok thanks.

Was just thinking, sure why would Bertie give two ****es what this report says, when he still gets to live off the pigs back on a generous pension, making thousands from speeches etc.

He still has it made, no matter what findings this report came up with.

JerryHandbag

I'd love to know whats going on in Berties mind. Does he think that because of all the back-slapping over the Good Friday Agreement, or any other good that he might have done for people, that he can then turn around and undo all that 100 times over by being such a snake?

"Ah shur de peeple luv me so dey do, its ok if I act the cute hoor"

And by Christ, if its one thing Ireland does well, its cute hoors. Especially in the corridoors of power.

As for Pee Flynn, I can't look at his cocky head (especially on that Late Late show "performance") and not want to go into the corner and puke.

Greedy ****ing swines the lot of them

Johnny Bitte

And don't forget when the ****r kicks the bucket he'll get a nice big state funeral and everyone will come out to say what a grand chap he was and what he did for this country!!

steve9859

A British MP was jailed for using expenses to build a little wooden house for the ducks in his pond ffs.....and there is zero chance of Bertie seeing the inside of a jail cell. It's insane!!!

kryogen

I can't help liking Bertie tbh.

Nice chap, very good with people, far more charismatic and likable then most eejit Irish politicians.

The Tribunal didn't even call him a liar in the legal sense of the word, there is a difference between that and not accepting his account. Also, is there not more important things to be focusing on now at this time? Making him a scapegoat is fun and all that, but the system that he was part of is and was the problem, whatever he did or didn't do you can bet he was not alone.

Thanks for the great work on the Good Friday Agreement (among other things)Bertie, especially the dedication shown after the passing of your mother. People are very rarely black and white, and while I don't believe he is a saint, I won't demonising him either. Not the worst by a long shot.

dark crystal

steve9859 wrote: »

A British MP was jailed for using expenses to build a little wooden house for the ducks in his pond ffs.....and there is zero chance of Bertie seeing the inside of a jail cell. It's insane!!!

Yep, and the former Icelandic prime minister is on trial for presiding over the economic collapse of his country, yet Bertie will never see the inside of a courtroom.

Biggins

kryogen wrote: »

I can't help liking Bertie tbh.

Nice chap, very good with people, far more charismatic and likable then most eejit Irish politicians.

The Tribunal didn't even call him a liar in the legal sense of the word, there is a difference between that and not accepting his account. Also, is there not more important things to be focusing on now at this time? Making him a scapegoat is fun and all that, but the system that he was part of is and was the problem, whatever he did or didn't do you can bet he was not alone.

Thanks for the great work on the Good Friday Agreement Bertie, especially the dedication shown after the passing of your mother. People are very rarely black and white, and while I don't believe he is a saint, I won't demonising him either. Not the worst by a long shot.

That was an advertisement on behalf of Aherns supporters, Kathryn Byrne, from Dublin South East, and Louth senator Mary White. :pac:

cournioni

kryogen wrote: »

I can't help liking Bertie tbh.

Nice chap, very good with people, far more charismatic and likable then most eejit Irish politicians.

Here in lies the problem. Politics shouldn't be about niceness. It's about running the country and making the right decisions for the good of its people. Bertie it seems, did it to line his own pockets.

NakedNNettles

kryogen wrote: »

I can't help liking Bertie tbh.

Nice chap, very good with people, far more charismatic and likable then most eejit Irish politicians.

The Tribunal didn't even call him a liar in the legal sense of the word, there is a difference between that and not accepting his account. Also, is there not more important things to be focusing on now at this time? Making him a scapegoat is fun and all that, but the system that he was part of is and was the problem, whatever he did or didn't do you can bet he was not alone.

Thanks for the great work on the Good Friday Agreement (among other things)Bertie, especially the dedication shown after the passing of your mother. People are very rarely black and white, and while I don't believe he is a saint, I won't demonising him either. Not the worst by a long shot.

Nice to see a bit of honesty, I applaud you for that.

In the end it wasn't Bertie who destroyed the country, it was the people.

We all knew about these scams he was pulling long before the 2007 election yet like a bunch of lemmings, off to the polling a whole bunch of you went and placed a tick in the FF box.

A few of you would want to get off that high horse.

benway

toexpress wrote: »

Digging further into things is really rather pointless. We all knew for quite some time what Bertie Ahern and many of his friends and colleagues were.

Yeah, but could we prove it?

Bear in mind, also, that the Tribunal made a something like €200m (can't remember the exact figure) back in taxes and Revenue penalties owing to they payments that were revealed. In fact, we're apparently in profit from the last four Tribunals, even only counting direct payments as a result of their investigations.

It's fashionable to bash the Tribunal on cost, and yeah, it's not an ideal system, but it sees to me that the same media outlets who are obsessing about the cost were conveniently close to FF in their day.

Let's not get distracted here, we can look at finding a better procedure further down the line.

steve9859 wrote: »

there is zero chance of Bertie seeing the inside of a jail cell.

dark crystal wrote: »

Bertie will never see the inside of a courtroom.

Keep talking like that and it'll only encourage the fckers. It's up to us to demand that action is taken, and make it clear that it will be noted against the government parties if they fail to do so.

NakedNNettles wrote: »

In the end it wasn't Bertie who destroyed the country, it was the people.

Ah here. Nice try, chief. Seems that FF's party line is to try to play into the Irish people's latent self-loathing. No dice here.

Yes, people were fools to vote for them, and yes people didn't keep a close enough eye on them, but it was the culture of corruption, gombeenism and cute hoorism that Fianna Fáil oversaw, and encouraged, that destroyed the country. Can't blame us for that.

Ash.J.Williams

kryogen wrote: »

I can't help liking Bertie tbh.

Nice chap, very good with people, far more charismatic and likable then most eejit Irish politicians.

The Tribunal didn't even call him a liar in the legal sense of the word, there is a difference between that and not accepting his account. Also, is there not more important things to be focusing on now at this time? Making him a scapegoat is fun and all that, but the system that he was part of is and was the problem, whatever he did or didn't do you can bet he was not alone.

Thanks for the great work on the Good Friday Agreement (among other things)Bertie, especially the dedication shown after the passing of your mother. People are very rarely black and white, and while I don't believe he is a saint, I won't demonising him either. Not the worst by a long shot.

Ha did you see the video of him on tv last night "speaking" to a room full of people off foreign!!What a chancer...it was actually comical to watch, 60 grand or whatever to read a speech that was clearly written by someone else ( i take on board that all speechless are written by somone else, but the art is to convince the audience that it's yours)

Biggins

NakedNNettles wrote: »

We all knew about these scams he was pulling long before the 2007 election yet like a bunch of lemmings, off to the polling a whole bunch of you went and placed a tick in the FF box.

A few of you would want to get off that high horse.

Seeing as we ALL amazing knew - does that include yourself - and if not... its it not too much of a stretch to think that others like your innocent self, might not have known too?

Your post is completely stupid and frankly nationally insulting!

Sykk

Kensington wrote: »

I wouldn't give the shyster the attention - he needs to be shunned and completely ignored tbh.

Accept bribes, corruption to the highest level, run the country into the ground.. Don't talk to him after... That'll learn em!

kryogen

I disagree, his post is pretty good in terms of its main point, the people keep putting these politicians in power, Reynolds, Haughey, Bertie etc, yet they get angry when things don't change? there is a word for that you know.

How are the current government getting on with they're election promises? The system itself is flawed. Politicians lie and cheat when it suits the agenda they have, if it benefits them personally or professionally you can be sure they will do it. Morally right or wrong, similar to a lot of people I'm sure.

There is a saying, "people get the government they deserve".

Aidric

The findings can be surmised as inconclusive at best. The Tribunal resembles a 15 year ponzi scheme for barrister fees.

The saddest outcome of all is that no further proceedings will be taken under law, ie no prosecutions. This is the ultimate failure in all this. It seems the most action that will be taken is the expulsion of Mr Ahern and a few councilors from the Fianna Fail party. I doubt they're too nonplussed.

benway

Biggins wrote: »

Your post is completely stupid and frankly nationally insulting!

And seems to be a fair summary of FF's damage limitation strategy, if Prime Time and Vincent Browne last night were anything to go by.

They're fcked.

Aidric wrote: »

The findings can be surmised as inconclusive at best.

What, outright findings of corruption against Pee Flynn and 30 or so Councillors? Pull the other one.

kryogen

Sykk wrote: »

Accept bribes, corruption to the highest level, run the country into the ground.. Don't talk to him after... That'll learn em!

Accept bribes? You can believe that if you wish of course, but to state it as fact without proof is a bit silly.

Corruption to the highest level? meh, he wouldn't be alone up there if true.

Ran the country into the ground? Nope, how could he do that alone?

Chairman Meow

Latest update from Berties Brother:

He said the family was pleased that the Tribunal, which reported yesterday after 15 years, had found Bertie not guilty of political corruption and that he did not receive money from developer Owen O’Callaghan.

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mahon-tribunal/mahon-berties-brother-leaps-to-defence-attacks-martin-3059544.html

WHAT F*CKING PLANET ARE THESE PEOPLE LIVING ON

kryogen

benway wrote: »

And seems to be a fair summary of FF's damage limitation strategy, if Prime Time and Vincent Browne last night were anything to go by.

They're fcked.


What, outright findings of corruption against Pee Flynn and 30 or so Councillors? Pull the other one.

What else would you expect of FF but damage limitation? what else can they actually do like?

Id say he meant the findings in relation to B. Ahern (the guy who is going to be scapegoated) rather then the ones they actually found had been corrupt etc

kryogen

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Ha did you see the video of him on tv last night "speaking" to a room full of people off foreign!!What a chancer...it was actually comical to watch, 60 grand or whatever to read a speech that was clearly written by someone else ( i take on board that all speechless are written by somone else, but the art is to convince the audience that it's yours)

Yep, Bill Clinton is the master of that.

Think he charges more though.

NakedNNettles

NakedNNettles wrote: »

Nice to see a bit of honesty, I applaud you for that.

In the end it wasn't Bertie who destroyed the country, it was the people.

We all knew about these scams he was pulling long before the 2007 election yet like a bunch of lemmings, off to the polling a whole bunch of you went and placed a tick in the FF box.

A few of you would want to get off that high horse.

are you being serious ? a man whose corruption knows no bounds and has the complete brass neck to keep going is ok because he is a nice chap and passed one or two bits of legislation ?.

the people destroyed this country no not entirely they were lead from the top by the likes of ahern who contributed directly to the absolute mess we are all in now .
no repect for the man at all!

AngryBollix

It is abundantly clear (as if it wasn't already) that the FF party are scum. A barefaced shower of political prostitutes who should be disbanded immediately for assf*cking this country of ours to the point of oblivion. In blunt terms the FF party are the irish equivalent of the Nazi Party. At least the germans had the good sense to disband the party that ruined their country. Paddy will probably re-elect them in 10 years time if they are as stupid as I believe they are.

Bertie Ahern embodies the ethos of this political party perfectly. A shameless degenerate who has sullied an entire nations reputation with his immorality.

Here are some other names you might remember

Padraig Flynn

Charles Haughey

Liam Lawlor

Ray Burke

John O'Donoghue

Beverly Cooper Flynn

Names that spring immediately to mind and invoke notions of only one thing in my mind. Skullduggery.

It's time for the irish electorate to kill this political stone dead by obliterating them at the polls. Instead of 18 seats they should have 0 seats

Sparkyd2002

NakedNNettles wrote: »

Nice to see a bit of honesty, I applaud you for that.

In the end it wasn't Bertie who destroyed the country, it was the people.

We all knew about these scams he was pulling long before the 2007 election yet like a bunch of lemmings, off to the polling a whole bunch of you went and placed a tick in the FF box.

A few of you would want to get off that high horse.

Still think he will be remembered fondly for the peace Process. Yes he is the epitomy of all that was(still is maybe)wrong with irish Political system but he's nota an evil guy and deep down i think we all know there are far worse. Michael Lowry still tops the polls ffs and I bet if Bertie ran in the morning as an independant so would he! I am glad we finally got the truth about the corruption that was endemic in FF and politics in general. there are still plenty of Charlie H worshipping shysters in FF btw. When it comes to rating politicians for arrogance and corruption though P Flynn will top the poll in my opinion along with Michael Lowry. It all makes Cowen look like a saint now!

kryogen

Chairman Meow wrote: »

Latest update from Berties Brother:



http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mahon-tribunal/mahon-berties-brother-leaps-to-defence-attacks-martin-3059544.html

WHAT F*CKING PLANET ARE THESE PEOPLE LIVING ON

Well, to be fair, they live on planet Earth, as the Tribunal did not find that he had received payments from O Callaghan

Phill Ewinn

Biggins wrote: »

Seeing as we ALL amazing knew - does that include yourself - and if not... its it not too much of a stretch to think that others like your innocent self, might not have known too?

Your post is completely stupid and frankly nationally insulting!

Unless you were living under a rock in siberia you would have know. It's the same with Cowens Anglo bailout. Should we wait fifteen years to arrest him and his mates too??

kryogen

AngryBollix wrote: »

It is abundantly clear (as if it wasn't already) that the FF party are scum. A barefaced shower of political prostitutes who should be disbanded immediately for assf*cking this country of ours to the point of oblivion. In blunt terms the FF party are the irish Nazi Party. At least the germans had the good sense to disband the party that ruined their country. Paddy will probably re-elect them in 10 years time if they are as stupid as I believe they are.

Bertie Ahern embodies the ethos of this political party perfectly. A shameless degenerate who has sullied an entire nations reputation with his immorality.

Here are some other names you might remember

Padraig Flynn

Charles Haughey

Liam Lawlor

Ray Burke

John O'Donoghue

Beverly Cooper Flynn

Names that spring immediately to mind and invoke notions of only one thing in my mind. Skullduggery.

It's time for the irish electorate to kill this political stone dead by obliterating them at the polls. Instead of 18 seats they should have 0 seats

Whatever point you were trying to make was lost when you said FF were the same as the Nazis tbh

AngryBollix

Chairman Meow wrote: »

Latest update from Berties Brother:



http://www.independent.ie/national-news/mahon-tribunal/mahon-berties-brother-leaps-to-defence-attacks-martin-3059544.html

WHAT F*CKING PLANET ARE THESE PEOPLE LIVING ON

FF invented the jockey bollocks

AngryBollix

kryogen wrote: »

Whatever point you were trying to make was lost when you said FF were the same as the Nazis tbh

They're the equivalent of the Nazi Party. The party that destroyed Germany. While the crimes are not on the same scale the end result was similar

Biggins

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

Unless you were living under a rock in siberia you would have know.

Suspecting something and KNOWING something is completely different.

Would all these amazing people that did know, please explain why they had not gone to the Gardi with this amazing got information?

The rest of us who are accused of also 'knowing' will still be waiting for the excuses of those that DID know and why their in-action to inform the proper authorties, I suspect.

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

Should we wait fifteen years to arrest him and his mates too??

Aaa.. no?

kryogen

AngryBollix wrote: »

They're the equivalent of the Nazi Party. The party that destroyed Germany. While the crimes are not on the same scale the end result was similar

But they end result was not similar, not at all!

I love boards.ie

---

I share your sentiment of not liking FF though, or FG, or SF or Labour for that matter.

Phill Ewinn

AngryBollix wrote: »

It is abundantly clear (as if it wasn't already) that the FF party are scum. A barefaced shower of political prostitutes who should be disbanded immediately for assf*cking this country of ours to the point of oblivion. In blunt terms the FF party are the irish Nazi Party. At least the germans had the good sense to disband the party that ruined their country. Paddy will probably re-elect them in 10 years time if they are as stupid as I believe they are.

Bertie Ahern embodies the ethos of this political party perfectly. A shameless degenerate who has sullied an entire nations reputation with his immorality.

Here are some other names you might remember

Padraig Flynn

Charles Haughey

Liam Lawlor

Ray Burke

John O'Donoghue

Beverly Cooper Flynn

Names that spring immediately to mind and invoke notions of only one thing in my mind. Skullduggery.

It's time for the irish electorate to kill this political stone dead by obliterating them at the polls. Instead of 18 seats they should have 0 seats

Notice your not including any of todays lot. What will it take to convince you of what Noonan is up to? A tribuneral, a court case, a breaking news story in the Times??

It's worse now than it ever was.

Wild Bill

Aherne lied through his teeth that he would give a referendum on NATO's imperialist "Partnership for Peace" after the 1997 election.

Frankly, compared to that lie, the rest is small beer.

He is thus not only a liar but, by collaboration (and the Shannon renditions) up to his neck in the blood of innocent millions in Iraq, Afghanistan and throughout the Middle East.

Nothing bad could be said of this man that isn't a thousand times deserved. :cool:

benway

kryogen wrote: »

What else would you expect of FF but damage limitation? what else can they actually do like?

Id say he meant the findings in relation to B. Ahern (the guy who is going to be scapegoated) rather then the ones they actually found had been corrupt etc

Scapegoated? We all know that the party ran a network of corruption, gombeenism and cute hoorism at least since the Haughey era. Bertie was the party leader, and we know he was also up to his neck in it. Get away out of that with your scapegoating.

The party could hold their hands up, accept that this way of doing business is wrong and that it has wrought untold damage on this country, and the likes of Micheál Martin and DJ Willie O'Dee J, who defended Bertie at the time, could step down.

The way they're going on, it's abundantly clear that they regret nothing, and they'd do the same tomorrow, given the chance.
The way

AngryBollix

Phill Ewinn wrote: »

Notice your not including any of todays lot. What will it take to convince you of what Noonan is up to? A tribuneral, a court case, a breaking news story in the Times??

It's worse now than it ever was.

Did Michael Noonan create this mess or did consecutive FF led governments create this mess?

I'm not here to applaud the present government

kryogen

benway wrote: »

Scapegoated? We all know that the party ran a network of corruption, gombeenism and cute hoorism at least since the Haughey era. Bertie was the party leader, and we know he was also up to his neck in it. Get away out of that with your scapegoating.

The party could hold their hands up, accept that this way of doing business is wrong and that it has wrought untold damage on this country, and the likes of Micheál Martin and DJ Willie O'Dee J, who defended Bertie at the time, could step down.

The way they're going on, it's abundantly clear that they regret nothing, and they'd do the same tomorrow, given the chance.
The way

According to Biggins the majority of the Irish electorate was unaware of these things


Yes scapegoated, who else do you hear being talked about? who else has a thread on them due to the tribunal here?

Do you understand the term scapegoat? Ahern is the biggest name attached to this case and the focus will be on him, he will sell the most papers and get the most ratings, does not matter a bit that the Tribunal was unable to say he was corrupt.

The last part I agree, they regret nothing and would do it all again if given the chance.

Orando Broom

kryogen wrote: »

What else would you expect of FF but damage limitation? what else can they actually do like?

Id say he meant the findings in relation to B. Ahern (the guy who is going to be scapegoated) rather then the ones they actually found had been corrupt etc

Not sure if serious.

Possible troll alert.....

http://forums.watchuseek.com/attachments/f2/522232d1317010357-newbie-question-about-new-watch-not-sure-if-serious.jpg

Wild Bill

If you were a cynic you might suggest that the publication of this Tale of the Already Known was designed to take eyes off the spectacle of Big Phil and his illegitimate Regime crashing and burning over the house tax

Ain't working though - even the Indo today gave equal billing to Phil's lack of a mandate for extortion.

Maybe the truth is catching up on the Pols quicker than it was back in the Boom?

ghostchant

Biggins wrote: »

Suspecting something and KNOWING something is completely different.

Suspecting a party of wholesale corruption and voting them in isn't particularly smart either.

DipStick McSwindler

This post has been deleted.

Biggins

ghostchant wrote: »

Suspecting a party of wholesale corruption and voting them in isn't particularly smart either.

...Indeed, which is why some of us didn't.

Orando Broom

Wild Bill wrote: »

If you were a cynic you might suggest that the publication of this Tale of the Already Known was designed to take eyes off the spectacle of Big Phil and his illegitimate Regime crashing and burning over the house tax

Ain't working though - even the Indo today gave equal billing to Phil's lack of a mandate for extortion.

Maybe the truth is catching up on the Pols quicker than it was back in the Boom?

It is extremely difficult to be a cute hoor in the digital information age. Their archaic cons and scams are being found out almost as soon as they are implemented. Even with a scatter gun approach of stuff being disseminated that may or may not be factually accurate it leaves very few hiding places for them to operate within.

benway

kryogen wrote: »

Do you understand the term scapegoat?

A scapegoat is generally a peripheral figure taking the heat for the whole operation, not the ringleader of the whole circus.

The only reason there isn't a direct finding of corruption against Bertie is that only cash lodgements to accounts controlled by him were found, so it's impossible to trace the money. I'm in no doubt but that these were only the tip of the iceberg, he did most of his business in cash, the cute fckin' hoor, we can only guess at how much he received.

I'm afraid that poor Bertie deserves no sympathy.

wexie

AngryBollix wrote: »

They're the equivalent of the Nazi Party. The party that destroyed Germany. While the crimes are not on the same scale the end result was similar

Really? are there bombers over Dublin? I'd have thought that would have been on the news?

Guess FF are censoring the media right?

take everything

Wonderful summation by Miriam Lord in the IT today.
www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0323/1224313769154.html

SeaFields

take everything wrote: »

Wonderful summation by Miriam Lord in the IT today.
irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0323/1224313769154.html

I've seen that linked in a few threads today and by friends on Facebook. Great piece of how many are feeling today.

Orando Broom

Were he to be found guilty on any charge, no matter how small I'd like to see the following happen.

Bertie stripped of all his accumulated wealth from his years in politics, all the perks and what not. Jailing him burdens the state further. Reclaim all monies he earned dishonestly and sanction him financially for bringing the office of Taoiseach into disrepute. Get every shilling back off him. No more pensions or phones or Garda protection. No Council of State shindigs, nothing only pariah status.

Capone him, get him on something.

thecommietommy

I'm fed up with the people of this country, Bertie only told the truth, I totally agree with his only regret few months ago, " I'm only sorry that Stadium Ireland wasn't built ". Good on ya Bertie, yahoo ya boy ya.

Ash.J.Williams

thecommietommy wrote: »

I'm fed up with the people of this country, Bertie only told the truth, I totally agree with his only regret few months ago, " I'm only sorry that Stadium Ireland wasn't built ". Good on ya Bertie, yahoo ya boy ya.

here here...and of course if only the lads in the bank told him what they were up to

thecommietommy

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

here here...and of course if only the lads in the bank told him what they were up to

Yes, Bertie for President !!!! Lets build the Bertie bowl in his honour and not been so begrudging to this great man. Yahoo for Bertie, God Bless Fianna Fail !!!!!

tayto lover

While we are all reading about the filth, posting here and shaking our heads in disgust you can bet your life that somewhere in the country some little underhand **** of a politician is stuffing money into his arse pocket after doing a little "favour" for his friend and saying to himself "nobody will know, sure I am only following in the footsteps of the last shower".
It is endemic in Irish political life.