Ahern Resigns.

jetsonx

As some of you probably know de Bert is meant helping the Basque country solve their conflict.

But, this morning when i checked on google.es i only had to type in the name
"bertie ahern" when google.es thoughtfully came up with the word "corrupcion" beside his name.

So, that's it lads, Bertie cover has been blown not just in Ireland. Here is what the local paper had to say about him. (translation = Bertie is a corrupt f@cker)

http://www.eldiariomontanes.es/agencias/20120323/mas-actualidad/internacional/bertie-ahern-podria-expulsado-fianna_201203231557.html

later12

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

Hmm, he could always clear his name by allowing and co-operating with a full Garda investigation and let a jury deliberate over the evidence if needs be. Nothing to hide, right? . . .

There's no indication that he will not. In fact Ahern may yet pursue a judicial review or another form of High Court challenge himself, the latter of which would likely involve a re-examination of matters brought before the Flood and Mahon tribunals.

Yes I think Bertie Ahern is talking rubbish. Yes, the degree to which he sought to hide his finances from examination in the initial stages of the Tribunal's work was pretty disgraceful. Yes I think he lied. But he is correct about one thing. The tribunal is not infallible.

Irish people love to grumble about tribunals, and sometimes like to criticise those tribunal conclusions which do not appeal to their sense of fury in a way that is adequately theatrical. I always thought Michael Lowry was the guy who ought to have taken the Tribunal's work to the High Court. Particularly in light of the fact that another administrative body, the Revenue Commissioners, seemed to disagree with Moriarty by failure to consider any income accrued to Michael Lowry on foot of the awarding of the mobile phone license.

But that's not for here. Bertie talks a lot of guff, but he does make one important point that I think people may have overlooked without examining the substantive evidence in the Mahon report: tribunals are not infallible bodies.

Byron85

From Fintan O'Toole in today's Irish Times:

"Tom Gilmartin claimed that, in February 1989, Liam Lawlor took him to a meeting on the first floor of Leinster House. He was introduced to a phalanx of Fianna Fáil’s grand nobility: the sitting taoiseach Charles Haughey, his two successors, Albert Reynolds and Bertie Ahern, Brian Lenihan, Pádraig Flynn, Ray Burke, Séamus Brennan, Gerard Collins and Mary O’Rourke. (It is striking that of these nine politicians, four – Haughey, Ahern, Burke and Flynn – have since been shown to have been on the take.) Gilmartin claimed that, after this brief meeting, he was approached in the lobby outside the room by an unknown man who had been standing next to Liam Lawlor. The man asked him to put £5 million into a numbered Bank of Ireland offshore account in the Isle of Man. Gilmartin’s understanding was that this was the price he had to pay for planning permission for his shopping centre at Quarryvale."

It just keeps on getting more interesting, and i'm sure there's more to come given the size of the report. I downloaded a copy of it myself but haven't had a chance to even give it a cursory glance. College work takes precedence unfortunately.

It's sickening. Yet again Bertie jumped ship before he was made to walk the plank, all so he will be able to say that he resigned of his own accord, and no evidence of any corruption was ever proved against him.

Semantics. Pure semantics.

I sincerely hope the damning revelations keep trickling out year after year and he's made to squirm more and more for every stolen Euro of that massive pension of his. If there's any justice in this corrupt backwater of a country, the CAB will hang him out to dry, but I for one won't be holding my breath.

Run_to_da_hills

I wonder will all those that payed dearly for his costly international seminars be able to apply for a refund.

P. Flynn has deserted now too, according to radio news reports

Surprise surprise...

MadsL

BBC reporting Fianna Fail councillor, John Hannon, also resigned.

europa11

Deleted User wrote: »

P. Flynn has deserted now too, according to radio news reports

Surprise surprise...

Maybe "it didn't work out for him, he's not well...he's out of sorts" (I wish )

......barstewards are still drawing their pensions I'll bet :mad:. They have the morals of rats.

thecommietommy

P Flynn gone now, at least FF know when their beaten Pool aul Pádraig, he's had a tough life, what with the hassle of owning 3 houses and now this. Maybe we'll have a " dig out " for poor Padraig

http://www.rte.ie/news/

Mr.Micro

FF will not not be asking members of the executive to vote on Flynn or Ahern. Brush it under the carpet.... like it never happened. People will not be fooled by this little arrangement, where Ahern deludes himself further by playing the victim and the wronged party.

FF then deludes itself by not actually dealing with the issue and voting regardless of Ahern resigning. Same old FF then, and gutless to actually face up to its past. I suppose it saves one hypocrite accusing another hypocrite? What did we really expect from FF? It never was good with dealing with reality.

rodento

Sierra Oscar wrote: »

grizzly wrote: »

He says "The Mahon tribunal is not a court of law". He should been given a chance to clear his name if he is innocent of these allegations.

Hmm, he could always clear his name by allowing and co-operating with a full Garda investigation and let a jury deliberate over the evidence if needs be. Nothing to hide, right? . . .

Got to charge him with something first and let's be clear he was cleared of corruption charges

Mr.Micro

rodento wrote: »

Got to charge him with something first and let's be clear he was cleared of corruption charges

I am sure the Revenue would like to ask him about all that money, that he Ahern, does not even know where it came from. That would be a start, and any other sums since that may have dropped in his lap. He appears to be very lucky in finding sums of money.

later12

Mr.Micro wrote: »

FF will not not be asking members of the executive to vote on Flynn or Ahern. Brush it under the carpet

You mean they won't be expelling them because they have resigned?

If they voted to expel Ahern on Friday night, you'd then have people saying "ah but that's meaningless, he's already resigned".

If Ahern chose to fall on his sword, there's very little FF's National Executive can do about that, except be glad he's gone.

I mean, it's a bit like berating Fine Gael for having the cheek to allow Tom Hand to die before passing a motion against him following on from the Mahon report.

EchoO

later12 wrote: »

Bertie talks a lot of guff, but he does make one important point that I think people may have overlooked without examining the substantive evidence in the Mahon report: tribunals are not infallible bodies.

No man-made entity is infallible. That's why we have such terms as "beyond reasonable doubt", or in the case of the tribunal - "in the balance of probability"(at least I think is). So the tribunal concluded in the balance of probability Bertie was lying through his teeth. Given the evidence he gave, I think that is the only conclusion they could of reached. At let's not forget - Bertie set up the Mahon Tribunal.

Mr.Micro

later12 wrote: »

You mean they won't be expelling them because they have resigned?

If they voted to expel Ahern on Friday night, you'd then have people saying "ah but that's meaningless, he's already resigned".

If Ahern chose to fall on his sword, there's very little FF's National Executive can do about that, except be glad he's gone.

I mean, it's a bit like berating Fine Gael for having the cheek to allow Tom Hand to die before passing a motion against him following on from the Mahon report.

They will not even be discussing the matter. Spineless. All nice and tidy now so they can all carry on deluded.

later12

Mr.Micro wrote: »

They will not even be discussing the matter. Spineless. All nice and tidy now so they can all carry on deluded.

What do you mean they "will not even be discussing the matter"?

I'm sure it will come up when the National Executive assemble later this week.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0326/breaking7.html

Fianna Fáil party whip Seán Ó Fearghaíl confirmed the national executive meeting would go ahead regardless of whether or not further resignations were received. “It’s a matter of indifference to me whether he resigns voluntarily or whether we move to expel him on Friday. We are not going to have people within the Fianna Fáil party against whom these type of findings have been made.”

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0326/mahon.html

Fianna Fáil Justice spokesman Dara Calleary said the agenda of Friday's meeting will be unaffected by today's announcements.

Sierra Oscar

The motions will go ahead regardless.

Wider Road

Mr.Micro wrote: »

FF will not not be asking members of the executive to vote on Flynn or Ahern. Brush it under the carpet.... like it never happened. People will not be fooled by this little arrangement, where Ahern deludes himself further by playing the victim and the wronged party.

FF then deludes itself by not actually dealing with the issue and voting regardless of Ahern resigning. Same old FF then, and gutless to actually face up to its past. I suppose it saves one hypocrite accusing another hypocrite? What did we really expect from FF? It never was good with dealing with reality.

Your predictions have proven to be incorrect over the last few days, yet you keep on predicting further outcomes.
Why?
Is it because you think that on the law of averages you will get one right?

guitarzero

I think its time we vote in someone more convincing and believable, that way next time we can actually be surprised instead of this patting ourselves of the back for sussing this stuttering, shifty eyed coward.

gerryo777

Where did ahern run to avoid the fallout after he resigned?

NIGERIA FFS!

To give a speech on how to control their banks during economic growth, I kid you not!

You couldn't make this stuff up!

john reilly

gerryo777 wrote: »

Where did ahern run to avoid the fallout after he resigned?

NIGERIA FFS!

To give a speech on how to control their banks during economic growth, I kid you not!

You couldn't make this stuff up!

just making sure the next batch of immigrants will be voting right

Mr.Micro

Wider Road wrote: »

Your predictions have proven to be incorrect over the last few days, yet you keep on predicting further outcomes.
Why?
Is it because you think that on the law of averages you will get one right?

My predictions were based on logic. I gave FF too much credit, in thinking that a) it would face up to its problems head on, so as to clear the air for public perception as much as anything b) I should have known that Ahern, Flynn etc would bail rather than face the music., just like the former did, when his secretary was left in the hot seat about his finances. So no real agenda to deal with then, and a nice cozy little arrangement. Lesson learned, do not apply logic or scruples when it comes to FF as ones predictions may come to naught.

If I recall correctly, I correctly predicted that FF would not expel Ahern.... it did not.

K-9

Mr.Micro wrote: »

If I recall correctly, I correctly predicted that FF would not expel Ahern.... it did not.

How can you expel somebody who has resigned? That's like an employer sacking an employee after they've left!

Heather21

FF should go.

Hotblack Desiato

It will go if people stop voting for it.

But then again, Michael Lowry is still a TD and has no trouble gaining re-election.

Wider Road

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Wider Road wrote: »

Your predictions have proven to be incorrect over the last few days, yet you keep on predicting further outcomes.
Why?
Is it because you think that on the law of averages you will get one right?

My predictions were based on logic. I gave FF too much credit, in thinking that a) it would face up to its problems head on, so as to clear the air for public perception as much as anything b) I should have known that Ahern, Flynn etc would bail rather than face the music., just like the former did, when his secretary was left in the hot seat about his finances. So no real agenda to deal with then, and a nice cozy little arrangement. Lesson learned, do not apply logic or scruples when it comes to FF as ones predictions may come to naught.

If I recall correctly, I correctly predicted that FF would not expel Ahern.... it did not.

As the saying goes, "If you're explaining, you're losing".
Stop digging!

Mr.Micro

K-9 wrote: »

How can you expel somebody who has resigned? That's like an employer sacking an employee after they've left!

It was never going to come to that, nice staged and convenient for all. As I said FF were never going to expel Ahern.

Mr.Micro

Wider Road wrote: »

As the saying goes, "If you're explaining, you're losing".
Stop digging!

Whatever.....I was right.

Wider Road

Mr.Micro wrote: »

Wider Road wrote: »

As the saying goes, "If you're explaining, you're losing".
Stop digging!

Whatever.....I was right.

No, you were not right.
Still digging I see!