What do you think happens when you die?

Batsy

When we die we either go to heaven or hell, are reincarnated, or our souls get trapped on Earth and are what we commonly know as ghosts.

Wibbs

The out of body experience means little really, even if proven to be true. Lets imagine it can happen, it does not mean that experience could survive the death/destruction of the brain. I mean I can hear Turbidy coming out of my radio far from the source, but if I nuke Donnybrook it stops. *plots*...

The you remember nothing before you were born therefore nothing exists after is somewhat debatable. For a start before you were born there was no you constructed in this universe. The creation of you becomes a thing, a structure. That complexity changes things so it's at least possible this makes a difference.

Another option could be reincarnation of a sort. Not the religious one, but a possible scientific one. OK you are unique and that "you" springs from that uniqueness. However it's not static. You were conscious 10 years ago, you remember being si, but were a different quantum state. Whose to say in an enormous universe another consicous "you" springs up unconnected to this current you. Or indeed has happened before. Like I say there would be no connection at all nor any memory of it so it's not a rebirth, just another consciousness that self describes as "you".

It's also possible in the deep future that the human race or it's descendants become what would look like gods to us and can manipulate matter to an astonishing degree. They might choose to reincarnate you down the line. If so, make some important shíte happen in your life so they notice you in the timeline. Annnnd we're back to this being a possible simulation in a future impossible for us to comprehend.

zenno

Ghost Buster wrote: »

The highlighted words are all that is needed.
Claiming something and reckoning something does not make a fact. I have had a number of operations in my life and going under anaesthetic sounds exactly like the experiences of those who have died and been resuscitated. I didnt interpret them as returning from the dead as i knew i had been under anaesthetic. Had It been otherwise and I religious...who knows....

Look, pick it apart all you want, it doesn't bother me, I just added my opinions on this topic. You deal with it in your own thinking.

I have had a number of operations in my life and going under anaesthetic sounds exactly like the experiences of those who have died and been resuscitated

No it does not, and the reason being you were as you say under anesthetic "drugs" so it is nothing compared to what I was talking about.

nacho libre

i think if this earth is part of a never rending loop, whereby universes go in and out existence, the conscious person may become a slightly different person over billions and billions of years, that may be what eternal life is.

personally i like the idea of nothingness after death.

Missmiddleton

I'm gonna come back and troll the paranormal forum.

aquaman

Tigger wrote: »

inverterbrates

Yeah!

Like jellyfish

xflyer

Shane St. wrote: »

I really find it hard to imagine the nothingness. how can their be nothingness

I can. If you've ever been under general anaesthetic you'll know what nothingness is.

I went in for an operation once. One moment I was lying there waiting for the op to start then I was lying there hours later after the operation. Just like that. No gap, no sense of time passing, no consciousness, nothing. An on off switch.

Death will be the same. Nothing to fear but no reason to be in any hurry to get there.

MrStuffins

Batsy wrote: »

When we die we either go to heaven or hell, are reincarnated, or our souls get trapped on Earth and are what we commonly know as ghosts.

Link?

wp_rathead

Wibbs wrote: »

The out of body experience means little really, even if proven to be true. Lets imagine it can happen, it does not mean that experience could survive the death/destruction of the brain. I mean I can hear Turbidy coming out of my radio far from the source, but if I nuke Donnybrook it stops. *plots*...

The you remember nothing before you were born therefore nothing exists after is somewhat debatable. For a start before you were born there was no you constructed in this universe. The creation of you becomes a thing, a structure. That complexity changes things so it's at least possible this makes a difference.

Another option could be reincarnation of a sort. Not the religious one, but a possible scientific one. OK you are unique and that "you" springs from that uniqueness. However it's not static. You were conscious 10 years ago, you remember being si, but were a different quantum state. Whose to say in an enormous universe another consicous "you" springs up unconnected to this current you. Or indeed has happened before. Like I say there would be no connection at all nor any memory of it so it's not a rebirth, just another consciousness that self describes as "you".

It's also possible in the deep future that the human race or it's descendants become what would look like gods to us and can manipulate matter to an astonishing degree. They might choose to reincarnate you down the line. If so, make some important shíte happen in your life so they notice you in the timeline. Annnnd we're back to this being a possible simulation in a future impossible for us to comprehend.

Must-Nuke-Donnybrook

Kidchameleon

Zillah wrote: »

It is called lucid dreaming. Here's a test for you: Randomly pick three playing cards from a deck and without looking at them put them on top of the fridge face up. Go check out the fridge during your "astral travel" and tell me if you can read the cards correctly (you can't).

There are those that can. There have been countless scientific studies done on this. Google it my friend.

Ghost Buster

Kidchameleon wrote: »

There are those that can. There have been countless scientific studies done on this. Google it my friend.

Thats great news. So its a scientific fact?
There have also been studies into time travel and people previously thought of as nutters who claim to have time traveled. Where can i buy my time machine?
I'll start with ebay.

joseph brand

Don't think about it.

Thinking about what happens when you're dead is like thinking of your flight home, when you're on holidays. It'll depress you and it's absolutely pointless.

Enjoy your holiday, sample life's pleasures. Religious folks will try to deny you these things. F**k em. Snort a few lines off a hookers arse and feel great about it.

joseph brand

Batsy wrote: »

When we die we either go to heaven or hell, are reincarnated, or our souls get trapped on Earth and are what we commonly know as ghosts.

True story?
You must have read that in the weeklyworldnews.

This article may interest you:

http://weeklyworldnews.com/headlines/26535/alien-spaceships-to-attack-earth-in-2011/

:pac:

Deki

My soul (Spirit)will go to Heaven. My Earthly form will eventually rot, but thanks to modern embalming methods it will stay around longer than it needs too. Can I prove it? No, I accept it on faith. Can you disprove it?

KeithAFC

Deki wrote: »

My soul (Spirit)will go to Heaven. My Earthly form will eventually rot, but thanks to modern embalming methods it will stay around longer than it needs too. Can I prove it? No, I accept it on faith. Can you disprove it?

Can you disprove that I have an invisible dragon in my garage?

Deki

KeithAFC wrote: »

Can you disprove that I have an invisible dragon in my garage?

No, and I wouldn't even bother to try. You and your invisible friend stay happy:p

KeithAFC

Deki wrote: »

No, and I wouldn't even bother to try. You and your invisible friend stay happy:p

At the end of the day, it is faith without evidence. It isn't exactly the best way to go about things. But everyone is entitled to believe what they want I suppose.

MrStuffins

Deki wrote: »

My soul (Spirit)will go to Heaven. My Earthly form will eventually rot, but thanks to modern embalming methods it will stay around longer than it needs too. Can I prove it? No, I accept it on faith. Can you disprove it?

I have an invisible Unicorn in my back garden.

You can't disprove it, therefore it must be true!

Deki

Yes - you are absolutely right, belief in things not in evidence. It suits me and I'm sure you are satisfied with the things you believe too. No big deal.

re: Mr Stuffins- Sure if you say that's what you believe then I accept that is what you believe and you go right on believing it.

Doc Ruby

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u1EzU9sLQ6I

Now that's a song with an interesting history.

nozzferrahhtoo

philologos wrote: »

I believe when one dies, one will come before Jesus to be judged. If one has believed and trusted in Him, and transformed their lives to live for Him, they will be saved and live eternally. If one has rejected God and treated Him with contempt, they will be condemned eternally.

A truly horrific, totalitarian proposal which thankfully you present without even the first shred of evidence to suggest any of it is true.

philologos wrote: »

That is if we exclude the possibility of omnipotence, and indeed whether or not time constrains the hereafter & God in the same way as it constrains us.

It is not about rejecting possibilities. It is about not entertaining entirely unsubstantiated possibilities. Pointing out that you have, clearly, just made stuff up and there is no reason to believe it is a perfectly normal and advisable thing to do in this situation.

nozzferrahhtoo

TeddyTedson wrote: »

What do other people think?

As Neil Tyson put it, when I die Flora and Fauna will take it's turn to dine upon me in much the same way as I spent my life dining upon it.

Miguel_Sanchez

After I die I normally just get off stage pretty quickly and have a pint.

/comedy

JackCharlton

40 Virgins all the image of Susan Bolye.....no suicide bombs so!:D

mongdesade

philologos wrote: »

I believe when one dies, one will come before Jesus to be judged. If one has believed and trusted in Him, and transformed their lives to live for Him, they will be saved and live eternally. If one has rejected God and treated Him with contempt, they will be condemned eternally.

Does this work for Buddhists, Hindus, Hare Krishna's etc. ?

Just asking like...

shizz

Deki wrote: »

Yes - you are absolutely right, belief in things not in evidence. It suits me and I'm sure you are satisfied with the things you believe too. No big deal.

re: Mr Stuffins- Sure if you say that's what you believe then I accept that is what you believe and you go right on believing it.

I really don't understand how it's ok to let people think that what they believe in is true solely because THEY believe it. Evidence is needed to back up a belief. It may suit you, and you may believe that your belief is helping you live a good life but that does not make it true.

Also. If you really believe in your belief and you think it is true, why is it ok to accept what other people believe? As they believe that their belief is more right than yours. All without evidence.

MrStuffins

Deki wrote: »

re: Mr Stuffins- Sure if you say that's what you believe then I accept that is what you believe and you go right on believing it.

Of course you'd have to accept that's what I believe. But it doesn't mean i'm not a deluded idiot!

That also changes as soon as I say "You can't disprove it" in order to try to add some sort of reality to my hypotesis. That would be stupid!

philologos

mongdesade wrote: »

philologos wrote: »

I believe when one dies, one will come before Jesus to be judged. If one has believed and trusted in Him, and transformed their lives to live for Him, they will be saved and live eternally. If one has rejected God and treated Him with contempt, they will be condemned eternally.

Does this work for Buddhists, Hindus, Hare Krishna's etc. ?

Just asking like...

What do you think? One needs to accept the Gospel to be saved.

OneArt

Zillah wrote: »

It is called lucid dreaming. Here's a test for you: Randomly pick three playing cards from a deck and without looking at them put them on top of the fridge face up. Go check out the fridge during your "astral travel" and tell me if you can read the cards correctly (you can't).

I know its called lucid dreaming. When I refer to "astral travel" I mean getting out of the body, and walking around the same room. This isn't to say that's no lucid dreaming either, but I'm distinguishing one from the other. Lucid dreams for me always start of as normal and then I realise I'm dreaming, it becomes more "real". With astral projection, you feel as though you're physically being ripped from the body.

Of course in the strict sense both are lucid dreaming, but I'm using astral traveling to speak of the different experiences.

Toby Take a Bow

philologos wrote: »

What do you think? One needs to accept the Gospel to be saved.

Burn in eternal flames?

Seriously, though, why does Jesus feel the need to punish those who reject him? It seems a little like the act of a little man with rage issues. And maybe a little hypocritical of him, considering his whole 'turn the other cheek' philosophy.

Cunning Stunt

I like to believe there is an afterlife. Afterall, I think it's just as amazing that we are here now, in this life, so why not.
Also with regard to loved ones I have lost - I would like to think I will meet them again someday.

flanders1979

Tom Cruise and John Travolta pick you up in a spaceship or the maggots and worms eat you just like your poor dead granny.

bwatson

philologos wrote: »

What do you think? One needs to accept the Gospel to be saved.

So, lets take the Japanese for example.

You are happy with a person from Japan being sentenced to eternal torture and suffering because by complete chance they happened to be born into a society with a set of cultural values and beliefs different from those in portrayed in the bible, and through no fault of their own were educated from the age of say three or four until adulthood to think and act in a way which differs from the way to other parts of the world?

You have no issue with such things? I think I'd prefer to take my chances with the other guys, they can't possibly be any worse than this god character.

Doc Ruby

bwatson wrote: »

So, lets take the Japanese for example.

You are happy with a person from Japan being sentenced to eternal torture and suffering because by complete chance they happened to be born into a society with a set of cultural values and beliefs different from those in portrayed in the bible, and through no fault of their own were educated from the age of say three or four until adulthood to think and act in a way which differs from the way to other parts of the world?

Dont be silly, everyone knows Asians haven't got souls.

philologos

I'm not "happy" at all with the concept of people being condemned. I long for people to be saved and to know God through the saving death of Jesus Christ irrespective of what creed or culture they are from.

I don't believe belief is determined by culture. Christianity is found in every single culture. Indeed, more Christians live outside the Western world than in it. Christianity is also more available than it has ever been before. In nearby China, and South Korea for example, Christianity is growing considerably. I have no reason to believe that this couldn't happen in Japan. Indeed, I know of a number of missionaries that work in Japan for the very purpose of telling Japanese people about Jesus.

We're guilty of disobeying God's standard in His world, and as a result we're deserving of His rightful punishment. God in His mercy sent His Son Jesus into the world to take away our sin. I'm thankful for that and as a result hope that others come to know that. That's not a story of spite, that's a story of mercy and love. For those who reject it, it is a story of stubborn rejection.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

Burn in eternal flames?

Seriously, though, why does Jesus feel the need to punish those who reject him? It seems a little like the act of a little man with rage issues. And maybe a little hypocritical of him, considering his whole 'turn the other cheek' philosophy.

I don't think He feels the need at all. The very fact that you ask that question points to how much people in general underestimate their own sin, their rejection of God, and their wrongdoing throughout their lives. This was a clear realisation to me before I became a Christian.

We're guilty of sin, and as a result we deserve God's punishment for that. God has offered us mercy by sending Jesus into the world to take away our sin. By rejecting the means by which we can be forgiven, one must take the penalty for their own sin upon themselves.

shizz

philologos wrote: »

I'm not "happy" at all with the concept of people being condemned. I long for people to be saved and to know God through the saving death of Jesus Christ irrespective of what creed or culture they are from.

I don't believe belief is determined by culture. Christianity is found in every single culture. Indeed, more Christians live outside the Western world than in it. Christianity is also more available than it has ever been before. In nearby China, and South Korea for example, Christianity is growing considerably. I have no reason to believe that this couldn't happen in Japan. Indeed, I know of a number of missionaries that work in Japan for the very purpose of telling Japanese people about Jesus.

We're guilty of disobeying God's standard in His world, and as a result we're deserving of His rightful punishment. God in His mercy sent His Son Jesus into the world to take away our sin. I'm thankful for that and as a result hope that others come to know that. That's not a story of spite, that's a story of mercy and love. For those who reject it, it is a story of stubborn rejection.



I don't think He feels the need at all. The very fact that you ask that question points to how much people in general underestimate their own sin, their rejection of God, and their wrongdoing throughout their lives. This was a clear realisation to me before I became a Christian.

We're guilty of sin, and as a result we deserve God's punishment for that. God has offered us mercy by sending Jesus into the world to take away our sin. By rejecting the means by which we can be forgiven, one must take the penalty for their own sin upon themselves.

That's all it is. A story.

Deki

shizz wrote: »

I really don't understand how it's ok to let people think that what they believe in is true solely because THEY believe it. Evidence is needed to back up a belief. It may suit you, and you may believe that your belief is helping you live a good life but that does not make it true.
My Bible directs me to spread the "good news of the gospel" does not mean I should force it on you, does not mean I should argue with you - only share that I believe Christ bore the sins of all men from all times and willingly took on the burden of sin for all mankind. It's a done deal. I claim salvation through Him. You have free will and you believe what you want.

Also. If you really believe in your belief and you think it is true, why is it ok to accept what other people believe? As they believe that their belief is more right than yours. All without evidence.

Because men have free will. If I argue with you will you change your mind? I don't think you will, but I do believe that my God can change your mind. As just another human I can live as a reflection of the peace I find in my beliefs. I can pray and ask my God to cause you to seek salvation as I know it. I can not save you. I have to let God do His job.

Why does it bother you that I hold these beliefs?

philologos

shizz wrote: »

That's all it is. A story.

As opposed to the story that the universe created itself? Or the story that right and wrong are just whatever we feel like? Or the story that there is no ultimate rhyme, or reason to this existence? - I think Christianity makes a heck of a lot more sense than atheism to be honest with you.

Sar_Bear

I respect everyones opinion, but I personally think there is something, some form of "heaven".
Maybe not the pearly gates and fluffy clouds stuff we've been told all our lives, but some form of after life, a peaceful place where we are reunited with loved ones who have gone before us.

I'd find life pointless if I didn't believe in something. It's tough to comprehend the whole nothing happens" thing. I personally would be a lot less happy if I went through life thinking I'm here for such a short time and then it's all over, with nothing left, nowhere to go... Just nothing.

Like I said, I respect everyone's opinion on the subject, and I know some people will be looking at this and think I'm an idiot but hey, that's what I believe

Toby Take a Bow

philologos wrote: »

I don't believe belief is determined by culture. Christianity is found in every single culture. Indeed, more Christians live outside the Western world than in it. Christianity is also more available than it has ever been before. In nearby China, and South Korea for example, Christianity is growing considerably. I have no reason to believe that this couldn't happen in Japan. Indeed, I know of a number of missionaries that work in Japan for the very purpose of telling Japanese people about Jesus.

It's not quite true to say that Christianity is found in every single culture, though, is it? Take an extreme example: tribes that they're taking photographs of that have had no contact with the 'outside' world. What're the chances that Jesus has made himself known to them through the gospel as revealed to Matthew, Mark, Luke or John? Zero. Even if we don't go for the extreme example, you've got a cultural difference in the means in which the gospel presents itself, despite its evangelical nature. An example of this is the slow rate of its message being accepted by Asian cultures. And let's just ignore all the countless people who are dead now (presumably burning in eternal damnation) who never heard the gospel during their lifetime.

philologos wrote: »

We're guilty of disobeying God's standard in His world, and as a result we're deserving of His rightful punishment. God in His mercy sent His Son Jesus into the world to take away our sin. I'm thankful for that and as a result hope that others come to know that. That's not a story of spite, that's a story of mercy and love. For those who reject it, it is a story of stubborn rejection.

A greater story of mercy and love would be to go that extra step, to forgive a person despite their sin and, more so, despite their complete failure to accept Jesus. What greater story of mercy and forgiveness could there be?

philologos wrote: »

I don't think He feels the need at all. The very fact that you ask that question points to how much people in general underestimate their own sin, their rejection of God, and their wrongdoing throughout their lives. This was a clear realisation to me before I became a Christian.

We're guilty of sin, and as a result we deserve God's punishment for that. God has offered us mercy by sending Jesus into the world to take away our sin. By rejecting the means by which we can be forgiven, one must take the penalty for their own sin upon themselves.

I would be hesitant to judge how other people are underestimating their sin. The ultimate sin, I presume, is rejecting Jesus? And because of this, we deserve God's punishment? Yet 'he feels no need to punish us at all'? Like I've said, it seems like a particularly childish act. If I attempt to save a person and that person rejects my attempts, am I going to 'punish' him for this act? Or forgive? Which is the better act, and an act more fitting of a god?

forfuxsake

philologos wrote: »

I'm not "happy" at all with the concept of people being condemned. I long for people to be saved and to know God through the saving death of Jesus Christ irrespective of what creed or culture they are from.

I don't believe belief is determined by culture. Christianity is found in every single culture. Indeed, more Christians live outside the Western world than in it. Christianity is also more available than it has ever been before. In nearby China, and South Korea for example, Christianity is growing considerably. I have no reason to believe that this couldn't happen in Japan. Indeed, I know of a number of missionaries that work in Japan for the very purpose of telling Japanese people about Jesus.

We're guilty of disobeying God's standard in His world, and as a result we're deserving of His rightful punishment. God in His mercy sent His Son Jesus into the world to take away our sin. I'm thankful for that and as a result hope that others come to know that. That's not a story of spite, that's a story of mercy and love. For those who reject it, it is a story of stubborn rejection.



I don't think He feels the need at all. The very fact that you ask that question points to how much people in general underestimate their own sin, their rejection of God, and their wrongdoing throughout their lives. This was a clear realisation to me before I became a Christian.

We're guilty of sin, and as a result we deserve God's punishment for that. God has offered us mercy by sending Jesus into the world to take away our sin. By rejecting the means by which we can be forgiven, one must take the penalty for their own sin upon themselves.

What I always took from this diarrhoea was that if somebody had no exposure to Jesus Christ then they would not be judged as they had not rejected him. I felt it was therefore extremely dangerous to expose anybody to his teachings less they reject them and face eternal damnation. Fully aware that by hiding the truth from non-believers I would be condemning my soul, I nevertheless believed that as most people reject Christianity then the kind thing was to save those souls by not telling them.

philologos

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

It's not quite true to say that Christianity is found in every single culture, though, is it? Take an extreme example: tribes that they're taking photographs of that have had no contact with the 'outside' world. What're the chances that Jesus has made himself known to them through the gospel as revealed to Matthew, Mark, Luke or John? Zero. Even if we don't go for the extreme example, you've got a cultural difference in the means in which the gospel presents itself, despite its evangelical nature. An example of this is the slow rate of its message being accepted by Asian cultures. And let's just ignore all the countless people who are dead now (presumably burning in eternal damnation) who never heard the gospel during their lifetime.

I concede that to you. It is however found in the vast majority of cultures on the face of the earth. It will be found in more as the Bible is translated into more tribal languages as is being worked on.

The Biblical text is silent as to what will happen to those who have never heard Jesus, so I'm going to leave that to God's better judgement. However, it is IMO key that people know the truth about Him, and come to know Him. I believe that God has our best interests at heart and it would be criminal not to tell people about Him if knowing God is central to life itself.

I don't know what you mean by "slow". Firstly, I don't anticipate everyone who hears about Jesus to accept Him. All that is required of Christians is that they go into the world and tell people about Jesus. If people don't accept Jesus, that ultimately is their decision.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

A greater story of mercy and love would be to go that extra step, to forgive a person despite their sin and, more so, despite their complete failure to accept Jesus. What greater story of mercy and forgiveness could there be?

God has offered all forgiveness. They have to accept it. Unless you're saying that you want God to force all people to come into relationship with Him? Is that what you would really desire?

I doubt it. God has done more than enough for man. Man unfortunately, still chooses to turn their back on Him even when He has offered them salvation. If one hates God, how can one reasonably ever enter into a relationship with Him and be saved?

I find that most of the time when people claim that God is at fault it is because they are not willing to accept that they are at fault concerning Him.

Toby Take a Bow wrote: »

I would be hesitant to judge how other people are underestimating their sin. The ultimate sin, I presume, is rejecting Jesus? And because of this, we deserve God's punishment? Yet 'he feels no need to punish us at all'? Like I've said, it seems like a particularly childish act. If I attempt to save a person and that person rejects my attempts, am I going to 'punish' him for this act? Or forgive? Which is the better act, and an act more fitting of a god?

I'm only reading what you're saying. It is through acknowledging that one has sinned before God that one can truly understand the significance of what Jesus did for us on the cross and come to know new life through it.

It's not childish to offer sin a punishment. Much as it isn't childish for the Government to offer you a sentence for a crime. God created the world, and as a result has a right to lay down ethical standards for us to follow. Should we reject them we deserve to be punished. God would have been well within His right as a just judge not to provide any way through which we can be forgiven, yet through His mercy He sent Jesus to rescue us from our sin.

It is up to us to decide. I realised that I was wrong and that He was right a few years ago and it changed everything.

shizz

philologos wrote: »

As opposed to the story that the universe created itself? Or the story that right and wrong are just whatever we feel like? Or the story that there is no ultimate rhyme, or reason to this existence? - I think Christianity makes a heck of a lot more sense than atheism to be honest with you.

But evidence from physics has shown that the Universe can come from nothing. If you stop for a moment and ponder how something can come from nothing than you are stuck with explaining the existence of a god before there was a universe.

No. Right and wrong are not just whatever we feel like. Knowing the difference between the two is what gives us our morality. Religious people talk about heaven and hell like the only reason to be morally right is so you can get into heaven and avoid hell. Which is a load of rubbish.

There may well be a reason to our existence, as in some event outside of our universe created it but the only thing that will discover that reason is the scientific method. Not a 2,000 year old book.

Yes of course you think Christianity makes a lot more sense to you. If it didn't you wouldn't be a Christian.

Atheism isn't a belief. It's simply the lack of believing in one more god than you do.

I for one think the story of our universe, that is told by science and backed up by evidence is far more wonderful than the story told by a book written in a world far less civilised and knowledgeable than ours today. The fact that we know so much about the universe is not because the knowledge was handed down to us through the heavens but because we have discovered it.

forfuxsake

philologos wrote: »

I concede that to you. It is however found in the vast majority of cultures on the face of the earth. It will be found in more as the Bible is translated into more tribal languages as is being worked on.

The Biblical text is silent as to what will happen to those who have never heard Jesus, so I'm going to leave that to God's better judgement. However, it is IMO key that people know the truth about Him, and come to know Him. I believe that God has our best interests at heart and it would be criminal not to tell people about Him if knowing God is central to life itself.

I don't know what you mean by "slow". Firstly, I don't anticipate everyone who hears about Jesus to accept Him. All that is required of Christians is that they go into the world and tell people about Jesus. If people don't accept Jesus, that ultimately is their decision.



God has offered all forgiveness. They have to accept it. Unless you're saying that you want God to force all people to come into relationship with Him? Is that what you would really desire?

I doubt it. God has done more than enough for man. Man unfortunately, still chooses to turn their back on Him even when He has offered them salvation. If one hates God, how can one reasonably ever enter into a relationship with Him and be saved?

I find that most of the time when people claim that God is at fault it is because they are not willing to accept that they are at fault concerning Him.



I'm only reading what you're saying. It is through acknowledging that one has sinned before God that one can truly understand the significance of what Jesus did for us on the cross and come to know new life through it.

It's not childish to offer sin a punishment. Much as it isn't childish for the Government to offer you a sentence for a crime. God created the world, and as a result has a right to lay down ethical standards for us to follow. Should we reject them we deserve to be punished. God would have been well within His right as a just judge not to provide any way through which we can be forgiven, yet through His mercy He sent Jesus to rescue us from our sin.

It is up to us to decide. I realised that I was wrong and that He was right a few years ago and it changed everything.

better not to tell them though, you might end up condemning them. Extremely selfish, dude.

Where To

If there is a heaven there better not be as many tl;dr posts in it as there have been in the last couple of pages :mad:

shizz

Where To wrote: »

If there is a heaven there better not be as many tl;dr posts in it as there have been in the last couple of pages :mad:

Well the bible for one...

The King of Moo

Where To wrote: »

If there is a heaven there better not be as many tl;dr posts in it as there have been in the last couple of pages :mad:

Heaven is made up entirely of short, witty second posts.

philologos

forfuxsake wrote: »

better not to tell them though, you might end up condemning them. Extremely selfish, dude.

Where did I say that? - I'm hugely supportive of telling all people about Jesus and indeed support such missionary efforts.

shizz

philologos wrote: »

Where did I say that? - I'm hugely supportive of telling all people about Jesus and indeed support such missionary efforts.

His point was that by telling them and giving them the chance to decide could end up condemning them if they reject your ideology. Where as you leave them alone and they don't know about Jesus, how can they be rejecting him?

philologos

shizz wrote: »

His point was that by telling them and giving them the chance to decide could end up condemning them if they reject your ideology. Where as you leave them alone and they don't know about Jesus, how can they be rejecting him?

The Biblical text is silent in respect to it. That doesn't mean anything either way. Ultimately, I think it is better to know ones true purpose and know and trust God, than not to know any of this.