Season 2 - Episode 1 **Have NOT Read The Books / No Spoilers Included**

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If you haven't read the books, and don't want to read specific spoilers from the books, post in here.

I'm starting this early in an attempt to trash out some rules before the episode airs. Sunday US HBO, Monday UK/IRL Sky Atlantic, people may see it before it airs here, don't read the thread if you don't want the episode spoiled. It's simple.

Speculation about what MAY happen is allowed, but I assume that book readers will be also reading this thread, and so will report any spilers, and appropriate action can be taken.

There's probably no need for spiler tags, as only stuff up to and including the current episode should be allowed.

But still, if you read this thread, don't bitch if someone mentions something from the episode and they don't spoiler it because it will be assumed that you've at least watched the latest episode if you are reading the thread about it.

iainconlon12

I REAAAALLY hope that Joffrey is killed instantly.

mikemac1

May Joffrey die a slow and painful death :mad:
Oh he has a face I just want to punch :mad:

Watched Season one today as a refresher, can't wait

Temptamperu

Why would you want Joffrey to die, Hes fecking class

mikemac1

Temptamperu wrote: »

Why would you want Joffrey to die, Hes fecking class

He's a ****

I've not read the books which is why I'm in this thread

May Episode One be Robb putting his head on his spike

But since we have more books [which I've not read] and more HBO seasons to get out of this then it's clear it won't happen

T-b0n3

Wish I had HBO right now...

RoyalMarine

uploaded to the "usual" places already...

downloading now! 1 minute remaining!

mikemac1

The American cousins are super fast tonight

T-b0n3

mikemac1 wrote: »

The American cousins are super fast tonight

It's taking sooooo long! The wait is killing me.

mikemac1

Aye, it's not so fast now

Go to bed and get up an hour before you head to work in the morning

T-b0n3

mikemac1 wrote: »

Aye, it's not so fast now

Go to bed and get up an hour before you head to work in the morning

Luckily for me I'm not in. So staying up is always an option

Professional Griefer

That was brilliant. Enjoyed that.

The direwolves and the dragons look amazing, and the locations and feel of the episode was unreal.

Might rewatch it again tomorrow, wrecked.

DarkDusk

Ix Deadmau5 wrote: »

That was brilliant. Enjoyed that.

The direwolves and the dragons look amazing, and the locations and feel of the episode was unreal.

Might rewatch it again tomorrow, wrecked.

I've just finished watching it, and I definitely agree! What I've noticed is how vast this season is beginning to become compared to the first one. The ending was quite suitable too, but nothing compared to the cliffhangers we've seen in season 1. I'd say I'll rewatch it again on Atlantic tonight also.

Roll on episode 2!

tvnutz

Great episode, love the feel of the show. It's so vast and looks great. Joffrey is was little shit. Killing all the bastard children,horrible!

Having to wait another week for the next episode is torture!

stesaurus

DarkDusk wrote: »

I've just finished watching it, and I definitely agree! What I've noticed is how vast this season is beginning to become compared to the first one. The ending was quite suitable too, but nothing compared to the cliffhangers we've seen in season 1. I'd say I'll rewatch it again on Atlantic tonight also.

Roll on episode 2!

For comparison let me know if you spot anything missing or cut from the Sky broadcast.
I usually record it from Sky but always wondered do they cut anything compared to HBO.

degrassinoel

just watched it myself there, great start to a promising season

Mycroft H

Baahhhh the usual places are all down. No 720p for me

blatantrereg

The end was a bit reminiscent of the first episode. The pet wolf that saved the boy's life [as far as I remember] was ordered killed then. In this a baby was.

It was very good overall. I'm pleased. I'd heard from someone who read the second book after watching the first series that the pacing slowed right down. That didn't come across at all in that episode anyway.

Wow. HBO are brave. Showing the near on-screen murder of a baby. Great episode, but I'm a bit confused as to why they're killing all the bastards?

titan18

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow. HBO are brave. Showing the near on-screen murder of a baby. Great episode, but I'm a bit confused as to why they're killing all the bastards?

Joffrey,Tommen and Myrcella all have golden hair, and none really look like a Baratheon. All Robert's bastards do, and are also an heir and can claim the throne if legitimized.

Temptamperu

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow. HBO are brave. Showing the near on-screen murder of a baby. Great episode, but I'm a bit confused as to why they're killing all the bastards?

HBO can be as brave as they want. They don't have advertisers so they can do what they want and funding wont get cut.
What an amazing start to the season and I love how they re-did the opening music which was amazing in the first season but now has more umph, as the man says.

blatantrereg

Deleted User wrote: »

Wow. HBO are brave. Showing the near on-screen murder of a baby. Great episode, but I'm a bit confused as to why they're killing all the bastards?

It was unnecessary really. In very questionable taste, and a little cheap. They could have handled it very differently and still made it clear what was being carried out.

tvnutz

blatantrereg wrote: »

It was unnecessary really. In very questionable taste, and a little cheap. They could have handled it very differently and still made it clear what was being carried out.

How exactly? It was showing how ruthless and insane Joffrey is,killing anyone that may have a claim to the throne. It was tough watching but necessary. I thought the whole montage was really well done and it brought us to Arya at the end,and we know now that she is in danger because she is with one of the bastard sons.

blatantrereg

tvnutz wrote: »

How exactly? It was showing how ruthless and insane Joffrey is,killing anyone that may have a claim to the throne. It was tough watching but necessary. I thought the whole montage was really well done and it brought us to Arya at the end,and we know now that she is in danger because she is with one of the bastard sons.

There would be plenty of more tasteful ways to make the situation just as clear. A scene showing the soldiers being ordered by a superior to go find and kill any of the dead king's bastard for example.

There was no need to show it. Sure there is more of an emotional impact in showing something like that - but it is a cheap way of achieving it.

don ramo

tvnutz wrote: »

Joffrey is was little shit. Killing all the bastard children,horrible!

somehow i dont think it was joffrey that ordered the bastards killed, id say tyrion myslef, he is hand of the king and would know of the bastards existence, and would probably know most of them if i recall right the last 2 hands tracked down a good few of them,

i was kinda hopeing to get some big white walker news in this episode, it should be interesting to see that fella whos builing and army way up north, id he gonna march south or does he know the white walkers are returning,

i wonder if the two barateons will joing forces with robb, realistically they have to if they want to get rid of the lannisters, but theyll have to let robb have the north,

a very solid opening to what will hopefully be and epic season,

god help us when its gets to season 5 the credits will take 6 minutes to show all the locations:D

which if anyone kept track of the caracters and places on the HBO site the size of the map has nearly quadrupled
http://viewers-guide.hbo.com/game-of-thrones/season2/#!/map/locations/

blatantrereg

don ramo wrote: »

somehow i dont think it was joffrey that ordered the bastards killed, id say tyrion myslef, he is hand of the king and would know of the bastards existence, and would probably know most of them if i recall right the last 2 hands tracked down a good few of them,
/

The scene where Joffrey talks to his mother about the old king sleeping around seemed to indicate that line of thinking on his part though. Also he would have been raging after being slapped, and especially not retaliating beyond a warning. Lastly, Tyrion doesn't strike me as a baby killing type of guy.

tvnutz

blatantrereg wrote: »

There would be plenty of more tasteful ways to make the situation just as clear. A scene showing the soldiers being ordered by a superior to go find and kill any of the dead king's bastard for example.

There was no need to show it. Sure there is more of an emotional impact in showing something like that - but it is a cheap way of achieving it.

That wouldn't have been effective. They didn't show the baby die,it was done off screen. Just someone giving an order would have been rubbish. I know it sounds strange that I am defending this, I don't want to see scenes of babies die on screen! And we didn't see that, but I thought it was brilliantly done and very effective.

I do reckon it was Joffrey,based on the conversation with his mother.

don ramo

blatantrereg wrote: »

The scene where Joffrey talks to his mother about the old king sleeping around seemed to indicate that line of thinking on his part though. Also he would have been raging after being slapped, and especially not retaliating beyond a warning. Lastly, Tyrion doesn't strike me as a baby killing type of guy.

buy he wouldnt have any information on who the kids would be, and the men never stated whos orders they were following, which to me would indicate it wasnt the king,

tyrion doesnt strike me as the type either but he is hand of the king and is still a linnister, and now that the lannisters are in power i would think he would want it to stay that way,

blatantrereg

tvnutz wrote: »

That wouldn't have been effective. They didn't show the baby die,it was done off screen. Just someone giving an order would have been rubbish. I know it sounds strange that I am defending this, I don't want to see scenes of babies die on screen! And we didn't see that, but I thought it was brilliantly done and very effective.

I do reckon it was Joffrey,based on the conversation with his mother.

It might have been effective if the acting of the soldiers was good - the guy who couldn't do it giving the same appalled look for example. In any case I'm sure the team behind the show could come up with better things than I could if they had a mind to.

I think there's enough in the show without needing cheap shots like that. Unabashed melodrama has been a feature from the start though and in general I like that in it. Not slagging it off - I really like the show, and I'm not going to stop watching or anything.

Anyway, it's just my opinion. Your opinion is different. Doubt either will change so let's leave it at that.

Adolf Hipster

I would reckon it was the queen, not tyrion or joffrey.

blatantrereg

don ramo wrote: »

buy he wouldnt have any information on who the kids would be

Do you know that or is it an assumption? My impression was that the bastards were acknowledged as such - that they weren't such a secret he wouldn't be easily able to find out.

How would Tyrion know more about it? He is a Lannister - surely less privvy to the old king's doings than the boy he thought his son.

edit:

Adolf Hipster wrote: »

I would reckon it was the queen, not tyrion or joffrey.

Yeah that would make sense. The point about knowledge supports it too - I think if anyone knew their identities, she would.

don ramo

blatantrereg wrote: »

Do you know that or is it an assumption? My impression was that the bastards were acknowledged as such - that they weren't such a secret he wouldn't be easily able to find out.

fair enough they are fairly aknowleged but why would joffrey be looking into such things for,

How would Tyrion know more about it? He is a Lannister - surely less privvy to the old king's doings than the boy he thought his son.

tyrion is a big believer that knowledge is power and he knew his sister and brother were ****ing, and he most likely knew the king was screwing around also, it could easily be joffreys mother, i just think tyrion come across as to much of a likeble person that he must have some evil in him, he is a lannister afterall:D,

Richard Dower

Who was yer one with the cracking set of boobs at the end?....lol, riding school indeed. Solid opener, the dragons looked class....quality CGI and the direwolves looked ace!
Great to have the show back, it's was an opener....a setup for things to come, not too much happened tbh, but it's good to have all the faces and new faces.

Needs moere boobs though! 4/5

Professional Griefer

Richard Dower wrote: »

Who was yer one with the cracking set of boobs at the end?....lol, riding school indeed. Solid opener, the dragons looked class....quality CGI and the direwolves looked ace!
Great to have the show back, it's was an opener....a setup for things to come, not too much happened tbh, but it's good to have all the faces and new faces.

Needs moere boobs though! 4/5

So much moar is needed. Gonna re-watch the episode after the match tonight, was so late last night when I caught it.

Also, the thread you made, about going too far, is that thread a have read books spoilers thread, or a have not read book spoilers?

Adolf Hipster

All I have to say about that first episode is epic! So much going on. Loved the wolves they're huge!

Winter is coming.

Adolf Hipster wrote: »

I would reckon it was the queen, not tyrion or joffrey.

Me 2, really don't think it would be Tyrion myself.

don ramo

Any chance of getting a poll added????

pixelburp

A solid opening, cleverly framed by the passing of the comet, which helped forgive the otherwise whistlestop tour of the main players (along with the new arrivals). I had forgotten what a wide cast there was. To the writers credit though, it took no time to recall the state of affairs.

If I were to criticise anything though, it would be that Joffrey continues to stick out like a sore thumb among the more three dimensional characters around him. His inherent evilness is so far beyond the pale as to be simply laughable. I mean yes, the baby-killing was gruesome & arguably unnecessary and graphic, but as a dramatic device it was utterly pantomime-level stuff. That he even behaves so despicably with everyone just makes the whole thing ludicrous.

Plus: although he was just another cameo in a string of cameos, I got the distinct impression Tyrion would be a larger force this time around; it's only natural the writers would take their cues from audience responses in certain quarters & given how popular Tyion was last season, I wouldn't be surprised if indeed he became the central figure - the show sorely needs it.

BluesBerry

AAAAHhhhhhh xbox live kept signing me out when I sat down to watch it on alantic tonight:mad::mad::mad::mad::mad::mad: IT NEVER DOES THAT EVERRRRR!!!! I am downloading it now 5 mins to go , then I can read this thread

gandalf

Just watched it there what a great start to the new season. That one scene

with babies being slaughtered

has traumatised the missus. Can't wait for next week.

ixoy

pixelburp wrote: »

If I were to criticise anything though, it would be that Joffrey continues to stick out like a sore thumb among the more three dimensional characters around him.

Product of his upbringing: Mother never said no and now, when she needs to, she can't for fear of losing her head. Spoiled rich brat - sort of like a D4 head given the power to execute.

it's only natural the writers would take their cues from audience responses in certain quarters & given how popular Tyion was last season, I wouldn't be surprised if indeed he became the central figure - the show sorely needs it.

They're limited with the source material they have though - they're not going to invent plot arcs for him that aren't there. The cues are all from GRRM's work.

pixelburp

ixoy wrote: »

Product of his upbringing: Mother never said no and now, when she needs to, she can't for fear of losing her head. Spoiled rich brat - sort of like a D4 head given the power to execute.

Fair enough, I get that, but it wouldn't be a stretch to give the little creep some humanity. It seems like every scene he's in, he finds new ways to become a moustache-twirling villain...

"Yes, this throne room isn't quite EVIL enough!. Get rid of these flowers. Now, time for my 9am baby killing!"

ixoy wrote: »

They're limited with the source material they have though - they're not going to invent plot arcs for him that aren't there. The cues are all from GRRM's work.

well I'm in this thread because I haven't read the books - so naturally can't comment too much on what they're working with - but limitations doesn't mean the writers can't shuffle around the emphasis certain characters get. Downplay one arc, whilst giving more screentime to another.

Mind you, as one of the few characters I don't want to push down stairs, I suppose it's only natural I latched onto Tyrion's scenes that bit more. Plus his mistress is quite a dish

krudler

"you love your children, its your one redeeming feature, that and your cheekbones"

one episode in and already some quality lines from Tyrion

also Joffrey needs to die in the most painful way imaginable, maybe Rob's direwolf will eat his face

5starpool

The show writers do have a precedent of portraying a character differently in the series than in the book from season 1.

God that was great, sooooooo good to have it back. Is this another 10 episode season?

Tenger

pixelburp wrote: »

.........If I were to criticise anything though, it would be that Joffrey continues to stick out like a sore thumb among the more three dimensional characters around him. His inherent evilness is so far beyond the pale as to be simply laughable. I mean yes, the baby-killing was gruesome & arguably unnecessary and graphic, but as a dramatic device it was utterly pantomime-level stuff. That he even behaves so despicably with everyone just makes the whole thing ludicrous.

Plus: although he was just another cameo in a string of cameos, I got the distinct impression Tyrion would be a larger force this time around; it's only natural the writers would take their cues from audience responses in certain quarters & given how popular Tyion was last season, I wouldn't be surprised if indeed he became the central figure - the show sorely needs it.

Well in the books Joffrey is still a pantomime villain, he is petty little sadist who never had a positive influence on his actions and has suddenly been handed unlimited power. He has misconceptions on what being a king is, he has never been trained in the role.
(imagine Draco Malfoy in Harry Potter with no-one brave enough to stop him whilest being a better wizard than Harry)

I would guess that the writers already knew Tyrion would be a fan favourite, he already is as a result of the books. He gets all the best lines there too.
Based solely on the books Jon, Arya and Tyrion are my favourite parts.

SIBHCHEVIE

I reckon it's the queen too, she knows now her secret is out so she needs to get rid of all the evidence. Joefry is far too full of himself and he basically said No one has a right to the throne only him so I don't think he'd even be bothered tracking the bastard kids down. He doesn't see them as a threat.

Bring on next week cant wait.

mikemac1

Adolf Hipster wrote: »

I would reckon it was the queen, not tyrion or joffrey.

I'd agree with this too, the Queen sending the order to send out the death squads



Joffrey is so far gone when the builder on the ladder paused after the slap I was nearly expecting him to be arrested and executed.

Anachrony

don ramo wrote: »

buy he wouldnt have any information on who the kids would be, and the men never stated whos orders they were following, which to me would indicate it wasnt the king,

Whoever it was wouldn't have needed prior information on who the bastards were. They showed the guards beating and threatening people to extract the information from them. Whoever commanded those guards would have just charged them with using all their manpower to figure out who the kids were by any means necessary. There would be various household staff who would have a good idea what Robert was up to and could get them started in the right direction.

The only reason that Ned and the prior Hand took so long finding the bastards was that they were trying to be exceptionally discreet and not alert everyone else to what they were searching for. At this point that's out the window which makes it much easier.

I think Cersei is the prime suspect. Joffrey isn't smart enough and Tyrion isn't hateful enough.

Simi

Surely it was Cersei? I can't see why anyone would think otherwise. Despite being stereotypically evil I don't think Joffrey would be capable of ordering the deaths of his half-siblings. Then again maybe I'm wrong, maybe he's a psychopath.

Anyway Tyrion just got there and know's nothing of the former King's bastard children so it can't have been him, not to mention it would be completely out of character from the Tyrion we have seen up until now.

Great season opener. I'm already counting down the days until next week!

don ramo

Deleted User wrote: »

God that was great, sooooooo good to have it back. Is this another 10 episode season?

yeah it is unfortunately

LadyHeart

Tenger wrote: »

I would guess that the writers already knew Tyrion would be a fan favourite, he already is as a result of the books. He gets all the best lines there too.
Based solely on the books Jon, Arya and Tyrion are my favourite parts.

They're my favourite as well and also Dany!

But yeah it had to be Cersei, Joffrey doesn't believe that he isn't Roberts son so he has no reason to be worried about any half-sibling bastards but Cersei knows the truth therefor must get rid of the bastards.

I must be a horrible person because I wasn't too horrified by the killing of the baby, you don't see anything but I suppose because I read the books I was forewarned.


All in all, good start I don't know how they're gonna fit it all in to 10 eps though!