World Cup Night - Meydan

Huntley

RichieLawlor wrote: »

It would have defo been a better option,

It is impossible to tell whether that would definitely have been the better option.

RichieLawlor wrote: »

but it was a slow pace from early so he had plenty of time but he let the race unfold against him.

I wouldn't say he let the race unfold against him, rather that he decided to wait it out considering he was never going to be in a favourable position.

RichieLawlor wrote: »

A more experianced jock wouldnt have. SNA has won over further and he got outsprinted. Thats jockey error

Not necessarily, he had a poor draw and there was little pace. There is plenty of luck involved in winning races, and I think the horse just didn't get the run of the race today.

I have little interest in the flat but I would be extremely hesitant in referring to that as a "terrible ride". Different tactics could have yielded a different result but it is impossible to tell.

WHIP IT!

RichieLawlor wrote: »

SNA was closing at the finish, in a race that was in no way run to suit.

Your wrong.

And on ignore you go because my kid has more sense than you

As the young ones who hang round the street near my job would say: "Scarleh for ya!"

Hulk Hands

I do think the jockeys were the difference in that race, but it was OP's brilliance, rather than JOB's ineptness that was the difference. The slow pace didn't suit either horse. One jockey was perfectly ok in the saddle, while the other was superb

UrbanSea

Richie I have to disagree with you to the extreme in claiming JOB is shocking. He is a very good rider.

Nulty

Huntley wrote: »

I watched this race and there was nothing wrong with it. His draw meant he had to wait it out until the gap appeared, and when it did he went for it not giving up lengths by going around the outside.

What do you think the jockey should have done differently?

Bang on Huntley - Nothing wrong with the ride. Perfectly executed, just found one too good under the circumstances

Nulty

RichieLawlor wrote: »

When the race was so obviosly turning into a sprint from a mile out he let a confirmed speed horse and suspect stayer get 1st run on him. A more experienced jock would have gone for home and probably nicked it

That's bull****. Did you see last years race? How many top class experienced jockeys were in that race? Joseph knew what he had under him and executed the ride perfectly well, he was beaten by a better horse on the day. St Nick is ALWAYS ridden that way. Using that race to beat Josephs talents as a jockey screams of desperation.

Nulty

Huntley wrote: »

It is impossible to tell whether that would definitely have been the better option.



I wouldn't say he let the race unfold against him, rather that he decided to wait it out considering he was never going to be in a favourable position.



Not necessarily, he had a poor draw and there was little pace. There is plenty of luck involved in winning races, and I think the horse just didn't get the run of the race today.

I have little interest in the flat but I would be extremely hesitant in referring to that as a "terrible ride". Different tactics could have yielded a different result but it is impossible to tell.

I don't want to put words in your mouth but would "reluctant" be a better description of your thoughts? Its just hesitant suggests to me that you feel that way but don't want to say it. I'm complicating things as usual.

RichieLawlor

Nulty wrote: »

That's bull****. Did you see last years race? How many top class experienced jockeys were in that race? Joseph knew what he had under him and executed the ride perfectly well, he was beaten by a better horse on the day. St Nick is ALWAYS ridden that way. Using that race to beat Josephs talents as a jockey screams of desperation.

Going down by a diminishing nose in a falsely run race is not 'executing the ride perfectly'.

The best horse in the race finished 2nd.

longshotvalue

There is a fine line, but i think it was a very good ride, and the horse in front just stayed better than expected, St Nick will probably improve for the run and will win a few G1s this year. The sight of him powering down the straight was something else despite the fact that he just failed to get there

gcy1980

The simple question to ask is "Would Ryan Moore have won on St Nicholas Abbey?" And the simple answer is "More than likely"! The best jockeys in the world can get the second or third best horses in a race to win from time to time but they, 99.99% of the time, win on the best horse in the race. For me Joseph O Brien is not in this category!! And for the biggest breeding operation and stable in the world, that is not good enough. I didn't back him either. I have an aversion to backing horses when I'm worried about a jockey!

newuser89

joseph o brien is a great young jockey and will be a top jockey for years to come
no problems with his performances yesterday
stop talking through your pocket and get over it
he will be your best freind at royal ascot probably

gcy1980

I disagree with the assertion of him been a top jockey for years to come. Not on the flat anyway! Too much weight will be his problem.
Also if you can't see faults in his rides yesterday you really are missing something. Did you think that his ride on Await the Dawn was good?? I didn't back any of his horses,by the way. And he probably will be my best friend come Royal Ascot because anything that is strictly not a steering job, I'll be laying!

Nulty

gcy1980 wrote: »

The simple question to ask is "Would Ryan Moore have won on St Nicholas Abbey?" And the simple answer is "More than likely"! The best jockeys in the world can get the second or third best horses in a race to win from time to time but they, 99.99% of the time, win on the best horse in the race. For me Joseph O Brien is not in this category!! And for the biggest breeding operation and stable in the world, that is not good enough. I didn't back him either. I have an aversion to backing horses when I'm worried about a jockey!

I disagree, you assume because Ryan Moore is a more experienced jocked that he isn't constrained by instructions and running styles of his horses. I backed Sooraah in the Winter Derby ridden by Moore. Tell me that he is less responsible for riding the race the way he had to. Sooraah has a way of riding and so does St. Nick. Both horses were beaten by how their races were run.

Incidentally, why are we all slating O'Brien when we could actually be praising Peslier for riding a brilliant race. He did and that doesn't make O'briens ride bad.

convert

Please don't insult other posters. Next person who is rude or insulting will receive an infraction. C.

WHIP IT!

Nulty wrote: »

Incidentally, why are we all slating O'Brien when we could actually be praising Peslier for riding a brilliant race. He did and that doesn't make O'briens ride bad.

That's what annoys me most about the armchair jockeys... here we had a great horserace, thrilling finish, thoroughly enjoyable to watch... and all the talk afterward is the 'Down with this Sort of Thing' Brigade having a whinge...

Some people just shouldn't gamble.

BangBeater

WHIP IT! wrote: »

That's what annoys me most about the armchair jockeys... here we had a great horserace, thrilling finish, thoroughly enjoyable to watch... and all the talk afterward is the 'Down with this Sort of Thing' Brigade having a whinge...

Some people just shouldn't gamble.

Spot on.

hucklebuck

I think O Brien is a decent jockey but he wont be a top flat jockey for only one reason, his weight.

He stands 5 10 and has to do 9 stone, there is no way he can much muscle so will be a lot weaker than the smaller jockeys. I am 6 0 and I can get down to about 13st 7 before my muscles start to waste and this is my natural build not muscle I put on in the gym. One of my pals is 6 1 and looks very unhealthy and with little muscle and he is 11st 5.

Big Mc made a good point on ATR about raising the min weights like they have done here.

barney4001

2 horses shattered front legs and another 1 0r 2 injured on the turf not a good advertisement,was the course watered